Anyone fucking HATE when they pull this stupid shit of "if you kill him, you'll be as bad as him...

Anyone fucking HATE when they pull this stupid shit of "if you kill him, you'll be as bad as him." So prevalent in animation, even when the villain was a complete bastard that needed death.

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I fucking second this. Fuck that shit, if the villain is a total piece of shit, they deserve it.

>posts one of the few examples where this is used extremely well

presumably you dont want to be the villian, so you dont kill him

...

it wasn't. There was no practical reason to spare envy.

But that example is damn near perfect. He was letting his emotions take him down a terrible dark path. He wasn't killing someone he was torturing them to death in the most painful way possible

>Wanting to kill one ugly little lizard monster.
>Bad

What cartoon is that from?

>Cuck Mustang out of killing envy for revenge
>Everyone cheers when Ed is murdering father after Al "died"

but no

Hawkeye said she was gonna kill him anyway.
It was just that Mustang was going full retard right there and he was expected to be the just, level headed leader of the country in the future. They just wanted him to get a grip on himself and show that he's actually worthy of leading the country, instead of just giving into his whims.

Japanese cartoon called Full Metal Alchemist Brotherhood.

God damn, I hated this fucking episode. Envy's sob story elicited exactly zero sympathy from me and his death went on for so fucking long. Sloth was a way more sympathetic character and he just got "Dying's a drag." Why should Envy, literally the worst and most sociopathic of the seven, get that much fucking death exposition?

nor was there a reason to spare pic related

because his human forms a QT trap and popular in japan

>Anime discussion on Sup Forums

Because Envy is a narrative device that points you to what Father's entire motivation was. He's thematic exposition.

Sloth and Greed are the furthest from Father, Wrath was his opposite, with Envy and Pride being the expression of his motivations and desires.

Gluttony and Lust were nothing really important mostly due to Arakawa shuffling them around too early.

> Full Metal Alchemist Brotherhood

This must come up in every FMA thread ever but do I watch Brotherhood or original recipe?

It wasn't about not killing Envy, it was about the fact that Mustang was torturing it.

But we can't show gruesome deaths in children's show OP.

Both have their strengths but if you'll only watch one then Brotherhood.

>but its ok when its Akira

well there was but purely for Aang's sake. And really there was no point in killing him either. It's not like they don't have technology that's adept at keeping powerful benders in check. So once he had him beat there's no real point in executing him.

The problem wasn't killing Envy, the problem was the professional military guy completely losing his shit and torturing an already subdued enemy.

Well Ozai was a complete fucking irredeemable monster and I'm sure people wished he died.

i liked how in JLU it was less

>no, superman! killing is wrong!

and more

>killing darkseid isn't worth it if you go down with him

Personal: Aang's wanted to uphold his beliefs.
Political: Reuniting the world would have been far more difficult with a godking martyr fueling a rebellion.

Anybody love when little kids in anime just kill bad guys and give no fucks?

This. Envy deserved it, but he also got off on corrupting and breaking people so it would have been a pyyrhic victory.

Driving the little shit to sucide was satisfying though.

Both, in release order. Not just because the first one sets expectations for how the second goes, but because each respective series tells half of the manga's entire story correctly. 2003 tells the first half before veering off because the manga wasn't finished at the time, and Brotherhood tells the second half because they didn't have enough time in the series to get to the ending without skimming over a few things at the beginning.

What, having actual morals is bullshit? Good guys who kill aren't actual good guys.

All the Boss deaths in Full Metal were satisfying

youtube.com/watch?v=bTxgJqgbuNk

I like how Father starts to just ignore Ed beating him up after a while.

Was there a reason he stopped fighting back and started monologuing about getting his ass kicked? It's been a while since I watched the show.

More worshiped him. A whole damn nation. A honorable death nearly killing the Avatar would have been inspiring and made him a martyr.

Stripping him of power physically and figuratively, even if the means we're contrived, works better. Don't fuck with the Avatar or lose your bending.

To this day, I'm still torn if letting Dominator live at the end of Wander Over Yonder was a good move or bad move. I mean they've established numberous times throughout most of the season that she is beyond redemption.

Because that shit made no sense.

Indeed. I'm torn between Lust, Envy and Wrath's.

Watch the first part of original then go to brotherhood.

Brotherhood is better imo. Some people like the opening sections of original better but the fanfiction is just too off the charts for my taste

The problem with this mentality is that the villains are considered irredeemeable. There's no such thing. Given enough time even fucking Wolverine, who was an animal who knew only killing, because a little kids' hero.

It's fine to have an anti-hero in a story. It's not really fine to consider that a killing hero "does nothing wrong" in there, and even less fine to try to apply this bullshit to real life.

It's almost always completely retarded. Especially since letting the bad guy live usually directly leads to innocent people dying in the future. ESPECIALLY since they usually killed a fuck ton of mooks to catch the bad guy in the first place. I find it insane and morally repugnant.

Yeah it's pretty bullshit.

In the most recent issue of "the wicked + the divine" they try to pull that. But Laura is better than that.

Lust
>HOW MANY TIMES AM I GOING TO HAVE TO KILL YOU BEFORE YOU DIE?!

Kindergarten morals aren't actual morals, retard.

Watch the original series up to the episode where it rains on a sunny day (you'll know when you get there) and then start Brotherhood.

>tfw Lust had very little screentime in Brohood

>Father never resurrected her

Only when they kill 100s of nameless guys along the way.

Storm troopers in star wars

Soldiers in lord of the rings etc

>unsanctioned, revenge-induced murder is okay because the other guy had it coming
Don't cut yourself with that edge, boy.

So what does Sup Forums think of Dante and

2003 Hohenheim or Brotherhood Hohenheim?

Not beyond redemption. She refuses to be redeemed, but if she tried she could actually do it. Thing is, as long as she has power she sees no reason to try and be better. When they stripped her of her minions, her spaceship and her powersuit they opened a gate towards her redemption. Maybe traveling alone through the galaxy will make her reconsider it. Besides, WOY also works under the logic that there is no inherent evil, just misguided people too stubborn to change.

Bro Hohenheim was better.
Dante's second body was my waifu. I was actually kind of disappointed they killed the actual girl. I sorta liked her personality from what I remember.

We're talking about war criminals and mass-murderers here. People who in real life are always killed without hesitation. Not sure if you understand that. You don't seem to be very intelligent.

So it's okay to kill enemy soldiers who are just doing their jobs but it's not okay to kill insane monsters who have killed hundreds or thousands of random people? What are you basing your insane retardation off of?

>implying there's plenty of those lyring around.
I don't think you're the one who understands. You just want to see edgy heroes murdering others for your own fantasy and picture the idea that the bad guys kill without any remorse for your own wish fulfillment.

Lyra was a cute addition. I was actually expecting her to be one of Ed's fangirls when I was watching through the series.

Creative team totally shipped Rose and Ed hard.

Why was Kimblee such an edgelord?

>insane monsters who have killed hundreds or thousands of people
No such thing.

>What was the holocaust

>>implying there's plenty of those lyring around.

Wh... what? We're talking about fictional stories here. There are however many are present in a given story. Literally every antagonist being discussed in this thread is either a war criminal or mass-murderer. Are you on drugs?

And yeah, there are actually an insane amount of war criminals and mass-murderers in real life if you're willing to look around third world countries for them. How old are you?

Because Wrath wasn't.

When's the last time that even happened in a cartoon or comic?

Watch the first one until you start to get bored and then drop it.

Then watch Brotherhood.

Then read the manga to get the full story. Or just read the manga and don't watch the anime at all.

...

I think we can safely say that the "no kill" crowd is composed of literal children who need to be spanked and sent to bed. Mods, please permaban the next child who argues against killing villains. Underage posters are not allowed here.

What do you think this thread is about? What do you think is happening right now?

youtube.com/watch?v=F5xrkNeO2QI

Is this you?

Technically, Mustang was also a mass-murderer and war criminal.

In which case it is even more ridiculous for him to try to take the high road now. That's ridiculously disrespectful to the innocents he killed, to use them as an excuse to let a monster go free.

Mobile Suit Gundam 0079 had the Amuro ruthlessly chasing down routed enemy units and butchering them, not because he's a bloodthirsty monster, but simply because he's and extremely pragmatic fighter that understands that they'll be a threat to himself and his allies in the future if they got away. By the final battle, he understood that immediately taking out the political and military leaders responsible for the whole war in the first place was far more important than trying to cut a swath through their underlings.

I can't recall another anime (or any) protagonist having the same sense of practicality while being fairly morally upright and not up their own ass about it the entire time.

It would have messed up the story's flow and everything, but I really wish Father had brought all the dead Homonculi back after absorbing Truth. It would've been neat to see their reactions to his new body and powers. Greed was dumbstruck and Pride didn't seem to care.

But of course, Father had to be the generic "villain who doesn't actually care about his henchmen" instead of a little more interesting one.

That's mostly just because Amuro made it up with being autistic in other areas. He was a tactical genius to the point of blurring the line between his expertise and strategy, but he was in the position to manage the political fallout of his actions and blew it sky high. He's really, really bad with people, and pretty much any other scenario when he's not in his cockpit.

Recently finished Brotherhood.
Final fight gave me bad X-Men Apocalypse flashbacks.
>if we punch his god force field enough, everything will work out somehow

Its outdated thinking from the senial baby boomers that are still in the comic business.

Juust read the manga.

I've never heard of a time when it WASN'T a good idea to kill your enemy when you had him on the ropes. If you kill him, he will never, ever trouble you again. (Unless the setting has undead or something.) Everything that he is or could be, poof.

It's like in Avatar, where they went out of the way to stop Zuko from killing Azula. Like, clearly the obvious solution to that was Zuko simply wearing her down and eventually killing her once her insanity got the better out of her. Same with Aang killing the Fire Lord.

But no, both of 'em had all kinds of bullshit.

Yeah, the manga is the best.
I don't feel like the comedy was adapted well in Brotherhood, the shifts in tone were really jarring.

Read manga

In other words, you don't have an example and are shitposting. Otherwise you could tell me a recent example of heroes gunning down soilders only to not kill the main bad guy in comics or cartoons. Key word is 'recent' to help you understand better.

Why do people continually say this? It makes perfect sense in the context of the show. His transformation into a god was interrupted but he still attained immesnse powet but his philospher stone cant contain it. They exhaust his energy enough that he needs a new philosphers stone to contain that power then greed turns his body to charcoal.
It was the failed transformation that screwed him over not the fight itself.

Yeah it's false morality. Sure, it's better to subject the person to the legal system if you can and do things the right way, but hell even our own police officers don't do that if things get out of hand.

If someone is harming people, that person has declared themselves anti-life and anti-man and they need to be disposed of so no further harm will come to innocents. It's not fair for everyone to live in a world where they are constantly under threat because someone didn't feel comfortable taking the threat out.

A true hero understands these priorities. Submit them to the law if you can but if that doesn't work, death is the only other option and it's still justified.

But why is it that heroes' job to do something they're uncomfortable with? They already took it upon themselves to neutralize them, they're not required to execute them so they feel better.

Sometimes it's true.
Most of the time the moral is retarded however because the villain is a mass murdering psychopath and ending them as justice/prevention of future deaths is the only justified thing to do.

>but he was in the position to manage the political fallout of his actions and blew it sky high. He's really, really bad with people

When exactly did he blow it?

He was very socially awkward and not much of a people person, but not to the point where it totally compromised his decisions and made things worse for everyone else where it mattered.

He knew he wouldn't have killed it anyway, he would've kept regenerating so there's no reason to hold back and not kill him however many times.

>Father's Pride was completely childlike
FMA truly is manga kino

I preferred the original. Brotherhood is good but the ending is "too satisfying", it's a Hollywood/Shonen ending where they just all team up to beat the big overpowered bad guy, kill him and go home.

The other has a more comfy melancholic ending waxing poetic and want for more, but leaves you off just perfectly satisfied with how they left it.

How about "everyone deserves a fair trial?" Even the bad guys.

> Good guys who kill aren't actual good guys.
What are you in gradeschool? That sort of black and white morality only works in children cartoons, have some moral ambiguity.

>Wrath's
>lived a long fulfilling life as king and actually found happiness with a woman he lived
>dies an old man after fucking everyone's shit up
>cucked Lan Fan out of revenge by dying before she could finish him
I mean, if you're a Wrath fan like me,
sure.

>When a villain gets away because two heroes are trying to prevent each other from taking a life, without knowing that both of them have already been forced to kill someone by this point.

C'mon man, I'm sure some people are deserving of redemption if they can find it but if you've gone school shooter and murdered countless people for sadistic selfish reasons you cannot "Aboohohoo mercy" your way out of it when justice comes down. Others would be in their full right to kill you then and there.

Of course taking the high ground and offering forgiveness is noble. If that nobility and saint-like mercy is worth risking you killing more people, it's not necessarily worth it.

Better villain than father IMO. He wanted immortality and seemed to have more clear motives than Father who just, wanted to become god or something? Dante did cool without all the overpowered bullshit.

Depends if it's in the heat of the moment or if there's not time to spare them. If they get down on their knees and unarm themselves, it's possible they'll get a trial.
If they attack you and don't give you a fair chance to help them they're fair game.
Repentance is everything.

Because the people who constantly argue about superheroes killing always seem to think they're supposed to be the entire justice system rather than supporting it. It's simpler, and law enforcement is mostly a joke in comics. And it gets worse when they try to argue it's not realistic it doesn't work the way they think it should

>That scene where the heroes are begging MC to kill the Villain and put an end to it already
>The MC outright refuses

Code geass. he was only up his ass most the time but not the entire ride

It's stupid to bring these up in relation to capeshit.
Because we rarely see actual trials in capeshit. There's never any intention of keeping any villain dead or in jail from a meta point of view ironically you're more likely to stay dead if you're a relatively minor threat. Truly reforming them is rare as well. So basically killing or not killing isn't a matter of morality, just a matter of character quirks.
I mean it's not like there aren't a handful of serial killers in real life who claim they've seen the errors of their ways. I mean they're not getting out of jail but they claim to be nicer dudes.

Well in that case he was completely justified in refusing, because Garou was all bark and no bite. No one else could beat him, but he wasn't a real monster and didn't actually want to kill anyone.

>If they attack you and don't give you a fair chance to help them they're fair game.
Obviously. In this case it's self defense and not "breaking in and killing someone with a team" like they did to Osama bin Laden. Good thing the guys who did it all died at the same time so that nobody could ask questions, right?

In terms of media though, I think it's not right for certain characters to kill due to their power level, such as Superman. Maybe Batman?

He did rip a few guys arms off

Nonlethally!

theyll get robo arms

Christ, the edge is real.

No, because i fucking hate ''muh special snowflake kids being superior to experienced adults'' bullshit.
unless it's HxH, cause they did that shit right.

>TFW all this talk of Envy when Mustang burned the fuck out of the better waifu earlier and no one gives a shit.
Lust was so much wasted potential in Brotherhood. I actually like her character better in the earlier series, at least she had some development in that.