It's time to settle the debate once and for all

It's time to settle the debate once and for all.

Did Alfred dream this part?

yes earlier in the movie he said he has a dream where he sees dubs guy at a cafe and they don't say anything to each other

Certainly, then, Nolan at least nods to the possibility that we could view this ending as a fantasy of Alfred’s. And yet, other than this stylistic echo, it surely makes no narrative sense to view the ending in this way.

This is for the simple reason that the film has expended considerable effort in its last few minutes establishing that Bruce was not piloting ‘The Bat’ when it flew the nuclear bomb away from Gotham: a scene with Fox and some mechanics lets us know that, contrary to what we had assumed, the vehicle’s autopilot had been repaired; Commissioner Gordon receives information leading him to discover a newly-repaired Bat-signal; a brief exchange between the executors of Bruce’s will tells us that the necklace Selina previously stole (and Bruce subsequently recovered) is now missing from the Wayne estate’s manifest; and we see Blake following instructions that take him to the Bat Cave. All of these things strongly suggest precisely what the Florence scene apparently confirms: that Bruce survived, laid these paper trails for those close to him, and retired into anonymity with Selina.

Given this hard narrative data, the comparatively slight stylistic provisions laid by Nolan - which flirt with the Inception-like idea that the final scene is a fantasy - seem rather opportunistic. They appear simply to be a sort of tantalizing bait for a certain kind of viewer (such as Kermode, apparently) - one who will leap upon the smallest chance to ‘save’ a supposedly too-happy ending by claiming that it is potentially ironic, or ambiguous, or ‘subversive’ (a critical tendency). Whereas in Inception such a final act of potential misdirection at least makes some sense in terms of the plot that has preceded it, The Dark Knight Rises has established no such precedent: most of what follows the bomb blast creates the suggestion that Bruce has survived, and Alfred’s POV in the café seals it.

Also why was his drink so small? Who has such a small drink?

hes drinking balsamic vinegar

He's just a really big guy.

british tea?

>Batman quits being Batman twice in one movie

Fucks sake these people don't get the character

It was hamfisted as fuck to have Batman carrying a bomb on his ass into the ocean. The cinematic equivalent to a lobotomy.

This was Nolan Batman though. Pussy was a prime motivation for him being Batman, and he was on a quest for 3 movies to convince someone else to be Batman.
He accomplishes both by the end of the 3rd movie.
>not recognizing nolan's dark and gritty homage

its an espresso

what the

You revved the engine a bit too hard. Nolan hasn't made a good movie since TDK and even that one gets overrated to hell and back when it all boils down a comic book version of Heat. I'll take the original, thanks.

the fuck? how hard is this to understand?

Alfred told Bruce about his yearly tradition of going to Italy on vacation, and while on this break he imagines seeing Bruce retired and living a peaceful and happy life.

Bruce remembers this and as Alfred keeps up with his tradition and goes to Italy on vacation again, Bruce shows Alfred that he is alive and ok, and is living a peaceful and happy life.

The batpod's autopilot being functional is even mentioned in case you morons are too dense to realize Bruce is still alive.

He says in the film that it was Fernet Branca. I hate this movie, but remember this well, because this is all the Argies drank when I visited Buenos Aires and it's a FUCKING AWFUL DRINK. Argies, what the fuck.

>Opens with him not being batman with bad knees
> becomes batman
> Gets back broken
> Works to become batman again, punched in the back and knee is no longer a problem
> Then decides it's time to stop being batman.

Sheesh, 3 hours to get back to where we started. Shouldn't even be called The Dark Knight Rises. Should be called The Dark Knight Flip Flops.

no /thread

I thought batman was in love with talia, not catwoman. Isn't this the case in the comics?

Batman wasn't say " no autopilot" He was actually saying "no, autopilot"

Bravo nolan

you dumbo, Bruce was living a miserable and lonely life before he returned as Batman. in the end he's happy and has a wife/girlfriend

Talia raped him in the comics

You can get all the pussy you want when you Batman, nigga.

Yes op, Alfred dreamed Bruce Wayne editing the security patch for Lucious, fixing the bat signal for Gordon, and giving the batcave to Robin.Nolan literally spoons feeds you it's not a dream

Guys guys guys
What if. Hold on. Now what if. What if BRUCE WAYNE is the mask?

>fixing the bat signal for Gordon
i thought the city fixed the Bat signal, in appreciation of what Batman did.

Here's my question, did he quit being Batman literally at the end of TDK when he sacrificed Batman's reputation for Harvey Dent and ran from the cops? (Because they can't chase Batman if he never dresses up as Batman.) Or did he continue on a while before quitting?

he continued on until his knees gave out

She raped him in the movie too

It's left ambiguous who fixed it. That's what Nolan does. He leaves things ambiguous.

Well he fell from a pretty big height at the end of TDK. Isn't it plausible that's what broke his knees?

Is Alfred gonna be Robin's bitch? I mean butlers are like property right, so he's gonna serve him like a proper slave right?

not really, isn't the bat signal reveal DURING the reveal of the Batman statue in city hall? or did Bruce manage to sculpt himself as well?

his knees didn't break, the joints wore out completely. that happens from extreme overuse.

I would figure he quit being Batman after Dent died so Dent could fully become a martyr and not distract from the plan

that makes no sense. that would mean he had only been Batman for about a year in total until his return in Rises.

It's not ambiguous, why does everyone need to be explicitly told what is going on? Why would they include that scene in the montage of Bruce leaving clues he is alive if the city fixed it? Why would Oldman act surprised and relived when he notices it's fixed? It's basic subtly, it's not even that deep

Ssssssssssmokin'!

But how the hell did Bruce time it so perfectly? What are the chances that he would be at the exact cafe Alfred was in, at the exact perfect moment, clearly not specifically waiting for him but just ordering food at the same time?

because he's the goddamn Batman

obviously Alfred goes at the same time every year.

Well, he IS Batman.

I think it was 4 years and regardless why would Bruce keep being Batman when he went out of his way to protect Dent? His death was the catalyst to finally get rid of all the corruption in the police department, why would Batman still fight cry when the cops want to arrest and kill him and their is no major crime until Bane comes?

I find it kind of absurd that the Joker didn't escape from jail at all in those 4 years. He sure is weak in the TDK universe.

you know Heath died, right? they didn't bring Joker into it out of respect for Ledger
how do you think it was four when it's obvious Dark Knight is 1 year from Begins

Ledger's dead, you want Jared Leto's Joker in Nolan's universe?

this

fernet takes like jaeger if jaeger was 300% mintier

Because I recall reading about it somewhere something like that was stated in some media tie-in media

Nolan went out of his way to tell the audience, who he must assume are idiots, that Bruce is alive.

He could have ended the scene on Alfred's reaction but he didn't because he didn't want people to misinterpret the scene, and people still did.

There's scenes all over the movie that attempt to feed audience like idiots.

Did you forget what Bruce was referring to when he last spoke to Gordon? Well here's a flashback, you morons.

Did you not get the reference that Blake is Robin? No, his actual birth name is REALLY ROBIN, you fucking idiots.

Sincerely, Nolan.

speaking of Nolan, did the British survive WW2? Dunkirk explained nothing.

Reminds me of a Youtuber who went through everything you would have to do to actually become Bat-man (spoiler alert: it's fucking impossible no matter how much money you have).

So it's kinda funny Nolan took real-life logic and applied it to Bruce Wayne's knees. I'm not saying it's not believable. In fact, it's entirely believable. It's just odd he applied it to his knees.

It's like if in the Flash TV or new movie, there's a plot point that he has to stop being the Flash because all that high speed running has completely destroyed his arch support causing severe foot pain. Is it believable? Entirely, but it would be so odd...

Uh... Nolan?

If he had zero cartilage left he'd be unable to walk and would need surgery and months of PT, not a magic knee brace

>He could have ended the scene on Alfred's reaction but he didn't because he didn't want people to misinterpret the scene, and people still did.


>who's he toasting to?

>is it God?

B R A V O N O L A N

Yes, the greatest British war film is about the British Army struggling to run away from a superior enemy

Batman has killed people in every Nolan movie. He killed Ras in BB, Dent in TDK,and he killed Talia in TDKR

Nice.

>No, Harvey. I'll let you shoot this innocent child so to teach you a lesson on how every life is sacred even yours and if I kill you I'll be just as bad as the Joker. If not worse. So please go on. Blow his brains out. I'll wait.

Batfags have such ocd about the no kill rule. Maybe Nolan should never have put Batman in this situation, but then the whole no kill rule is meaningless since Batman has his own angels in the outfield that will never put him in a situation where it matters. It's just an empty platitude he whips out to look superior to others.

Kermode seriously does suck.

Well Bravo Nolan showed the coin landed on the no kill side after Batman murdered Dent

how could he afford travelling to europe when he was a BROKE ASS WHITE TRASH

Ras is immortal you fucking nugget

>batcave below an orphanage
what could POSSIBLY go wrong

He dressed up as an immigrant and got in for free without being checked.

It's deliberately open to interpretation. The spectator can choose which it is.

I think we all know who should have replaced Ledger.

Who cares? Regardless, it's a shit ending to what could have been a good concise trilogy. TDKR was a bloated mess full of expositional dialogue trying to wrap up a story with very little to do with previous installments.

>Batman quits being Batman after 6 months of Batmanning, leaving the city to rot for a few years while the Harvey Dent Act is pushed through

He's in Florence and that's a (somewhat) popular bitter in Italy.
t. Italianon

Realistically there is no way he could have kept up that life style for more than six months.

why would he drink Fernet Branca instead of italian Grappa?

If you couldnt immediately tell this would happen when they first mentioned the auto pilot, you are a brainlet. Shitty writing.

It's as bad as the ending of TDK where Gordon has to explain to his son why Batman is running away

>Batman has to beat every single pickpocket in Gotham into submission and partial paralysis, literally ending crime, not just turn the tide and inspire people to stand up to corruption and make the city on a literal shithole

Go back to bed, Alex Ross. Don't you have photos of your fat friends to trace?

Does anyone have the CIA edit?

Realistically, there's a lot wrong with the Dark Knight universe, but Batman being unable to Batman is the least of it's worries.

>He gives up on his parents dream, basically Batman's entire reason for doing what he does, when he takes a little bump on the knee
Stop being an apologist.

Not in the Nolan universe you comic spaz

How do you know? We never saw his corpse in Batman Begins.

It wasn't that bad, it concluded the story that Bruce couldn't let Batman go out of his life that is stated in TDKR by Rachel. In TDKR he fakes he kills Batman and fakes his death, starts a new life with Selina which signifies Bruce moved on from Batman and Rachel

We see his ghost in TDKR, that is the closest you will get to immortality in Nolan's interpretation

>ghost
It was obviously just Bruce's imagination.

shit's really good for you senpai

>BB: Bruce comes back, becomes a vigilante to fight corruption in Gotham
>TDK: Bruce wants a Gotham that no longer needs Batman but Bruce may always need to be Batman, his only real motivation to stop being Batman is so he can be with Rachel but she ends up dying, taking the only thing in his life that wasn't Batman
>TDKR: Bruce has been mourning Rachel for like 7 years, is no longer Batman and is absolutely miserable. He finally comes out of retirement and finds purpose again, but being Batman isn't a good thing because he has a deathwish. The theme of the movie is about the consequences of deception, even if the motivation is that of good. Alfred reveals Rachel was never going to be with him, Bane reveals Dent went on a murder rampage. Bruce realizes in the cave he has no fear of death because the only thing he was living for was being Batman. He finally moves on from Rachel and Batman, and Gotham is able to handle the truth of Harvey Dent. Bruce and Gotham no longer need Batman

It's his salad dressing but because he's a dumb American he drinks it instead of putting it on his salad

He's British though. I can't tell if you know that but regardless this is a real shitty troll attempt

Ott A. Kounth?

>He sure is weak in the TDK universe.

Or the actually have locks on the doors, unlike in comicbooks.

In the original script it was CIA instead of Bruce.

No it wasn't. Agent Wilson reappears later under the mantle of "Deathstroke." Seriously, look it up. Tell me what Deathstroke's name is.

...

Your feel when you realize Nolan left both CIA's and Bane's deaths vague so as to respect the tradition of comic books where characters do not necessarily die permanently and could potentially still be out there. Probably also why Talia just looked like she fell asleep.

>Your feel when you realize Nolan left both CIA's and Bane's deaths vague
Being this level of retarded

Go make a snyder thread, idiot.

Just gonna create a thread with that as the OP post. Later though, so I don't have to interrupt it with sleep.

>Bruce gives the entire batcave to some rookie hothead cop with zero martial training
What was he thinking?

He didn't care. He wanted to give up the Batman life so he gave it to the only person who had any interest in it.

I thought it was stupid how Bane said he more or less grew up in hell. Then when Bruce is sent there, you see that it's not that bad. He basically had TV, he was being nursed back to health and he had a crowd cheering him on as he tried to escape. A regular American prison would have been a worse punishment than that mediocre place.

Also in the Dark Knight, it's established that the people of Gotham are good when both the civilians and prisoners don't blow each other up. Yet when Bane comes in, everyone starts looting and being assholes.

why would Alfred dream he was with Selena? When he left the story Bruce was romancing Miranda Tate.

...

Say this aloud and try to bang ONE argie chick, go ahead I double dare you

This scene would have been so much better if they didn't actually show Bruce. Just show something catching Alfred's eye and have him smile.

Nolan knows the audience is stupid, people are actually debating if it was a dream only because Nolan made Inception