Eve and the apple

the bible says:
4 “You will not certainly die,” the serpent said to the woman. 5 “For God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”
Usually it is interpreted that god became angry because adam and eve went against his rule to not eat the apple, and that the knowledge of evil means that the evil came unto the world, and thus god banished them from the garden eden.
however i believe that the part "knowing good and evil" really means that she became aware of the evils that are already going on in the world, and that the paradise was more something like a set of mind just like the saying "ignoring is bliss" being unaware of all the bad things makes you think there are only good things making you live in paradies.
also there is this part
"For God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God"
for this i have to explain a bit more. in some old cultures, (especially the sumerians) the mythology states the gods coming to earth, distributing it among themselves and rule over the parts, creating the humans and giving them technology and civilizations in order to make the human work to fullfill the gods desires. now to make someone blindly follow your order they shouldnt be too clever or they wont be easy to manipulate.
which leads us back to the bible. according to it the only difference between man and god is the knowledge which when achived will prevent you from being manipulated and decide your own fate, do you become a generous god using your knowledge for everyones advantage, or do you use you knowledge to manipulate others to your own adventage only.
So maybe adam and eve were the first decendends (symbolic for all the people living under that god) of one of the sumerian gods (for adam and eve of course the only god) who learned too much and could see through the manipulation and gained free will being able to see through all the tricks.
(To be continued)

There are multiple cultures claiming they were visited by blond haired, blue eyed and white skinned (or at least 2 of those attributes) people who gave them technology and helping them found a civilization.
are those the sumerian gods? or maybe are the people of adam and eve (since the sumerian gods allegedly distributed the earth and everyone raigned over one part, but there were at times reports of multiple of those people) who shared their new found knowledge?
do you think my interpretations are right?
Is everyone who gathered knowledge (and if so which knowledge?) a god?
Are adam and eve just the first decendents of one of the sumerian gods?
Are the Gods (or the god) actual living beings, or just a metaphor?
If they are actual living beings, where do they come from?
what do you think?

>the bible says

im not trying to make anyone a believer, i just try to make sense of what the book says, and see if you can link it to other important legend or events

what the fuck do blond hair and blue eyes have to do with it? are you a Nordicist?

you do realize the Aryans were mostly dark eyed and dark haired, and that light hair/eyes became prevalent because of sexual selection in Europe later on, right?

>he's not using the concordant literal
Shit thread

i dont want to make this a "whites are superior" thread or anything. its just that there are tales of people who happen to fit that discription being a driving force in creating a civilization and advancing the technology. i dont even know if those are the same as todays blond haired white skinned blue eyed people. i just tried to look if those two tales might be fitting together

THE APPLE IS THE REDPILL
WHAT THE FUCK I LOVE THE "SERPENT" NOW?

>And the voice which I heard from heaven spake unto me again, and said, Go and take the LITTLE BOOK which is open in the hand of the angel which standeth upon the sea and upon the earth.
>And I went unto the angel, and said unto him, GIVE ME THE LITTLE BOOK. And he said unto me, TAKE IT, AND EAT IT UP; AND IT SHALL MAKE THY BELLY BITTER, BUT IT SHALL BE IN THY MOUTH AS SWEET AS HONEY.
>And I took the little book out of the angel's hand, and ate it up; and it was in my mouth sweet as honey: and as soon as I had eaten it, my belly was bitter.
>And he said unto me, THOU MUST PROPHECY AGAIN BEFORE MANY PEOPLES, AND NATIONS, AND TONGUES, AND KINGS.

You are getting there, kraut, just a bit further.

God is nothing short of the perfection of humanity as a whole. It is repeated time and time again that we are formed in "Gods" likeness. God is the ideal state of humanity; all knowing, all seeing, and complete understanding of our universe.

We, and all of life leading up to us, IS God. Our cumulative knowledge will reach the point of a complete understanding of our universe, and it is at that moment that there is no longer any difference between Humanity and God.

thats what i have been talking about with a friend for some time that the bible always says that we all are just like god, meaning basically that we all are gods or at least have the potential to be it

where is that from?

shamless bumb because i dont want to have written all that in vain

Rev. 10: 8-11

Isn't Gnosticism something along these lines? Serpent was the good guy, tree of knowledge was actually magic mushrooms, Jew's and Christians are false religions yadda yadda yadda?

What annoys me most about you is that you didn't mention the only important part in the book of Genesis.

It says the immortality is locked in a flaming sword. It is locked in our DNA.

Yes and no. Gnosticism means the creator is evil they are the demiurge, but you are taking a later version of the bible which would mean a theistic satanist which really does not exist and make sense, as the good guy would not want you to burn. Saying the creator is evil and fuck god, is most ancient, and not satanism.

"For I came not to bring peace, but a sword"

>Jewish scriptures
I AM not a Jew though, user.

could the book be another red pill, tasting sweet in your mouth because you are excited and happy of getting new knowledge, but once ingested you realize the horrible truth it leads up to making it bitter in the end.

>And he said unto me, THOU MUST PROPHECY AGAIN BEFORE MANY PEOPLES, AND NATIONS, AND TONGUES, AND KINGS.
it says the guy to spread the information even if it is bitter, but when everyone knows you can change it. the angel (or even the serpent), i believe represents everyone in the knowledge of those things, and like them should spread it since even if it is a bitter truth its the only way to ever overcome it and change for a better.
we are morpheus in the matrix, the dreamer (the god of dreams in the greek mythology)that dreams of finding the chosen one (ones?) that frees the people

Or, how about this: maybe perceiving evils in the world is what causes the evils themselves to exist? Maybe it is all about a matter of perspective and that having that blissful ignorance is indeed what creates good?

Adam and Eve were angels. When they 'ate the apple' they fell. Humans are fallen angels.

im sorry, but i cant cover all of the bible, i have to make some cuts x)

I need to read more about it... I went to a Graham Hancock talk a couple years ago and he talked about Gnosticism a bit and it was all very interesting... On that note I'm surprised Graham Hancock never gets a mention on here, he does some amazing research on getting to the bottom of what was actually happening in ancient human history...

I think it means that, by eating the fruit of the tree of knowledge, one then understands the differerence between good and evil, between right and wrong. It is also perhaps what defines a fully-human being, as differentiated from animals who do not possess this knowledge.

indeed it is one interpretation as well, but the human is always descriped to being just like god, and wouldnt be god be able to know of the evil, to know the other might just try to screw you over, that you have no reason to trust him, but still to do so? isnt being able to do that creating good as well?

but why would gaining knowledge making them become fallen angeld? because god became angry?

This story is older than Christianity. It was adopted and altered like it always is.
The apple does not represent knowledge, it represents free will. Which is the one thing that separates God and the angels.
By acquiring free will the angels are no longer welcome in God's kingdom and have to make their own. It's not out of anger. It's just the way it is.
We will never be allowed back into the old kingdom, we have to create or own. Free Will gives us the power to do this, but we keep fucking up and making poor choices.

but didnt create god us with free will according to the bible? if we didnt already have free will how could they go against gods word and eat the apple? or is that an error in translation over the years that the contradiction happened? if so any source to another version of it?

We were always meant to "eat the apple." We just were never ready.
I think it's about time we got ready.

God is omnipotent. He can create his own destiny just by changing his perception.

Genesis 3

22 And the Lord God said, “The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever.” 23 So the Lord God banished him from the Garden of Eden to work the ground from which he had been taken.


OT god is a punk who is afraid of being usurped. Jesus 4ever.

Free will is the ability to reprogram yourself.
Imagine you were a computer program. You need a programmer to write you. Now imagine you could program yourself. That is free will.
Humans were created and given a program. The apple represents the coding that allows us to modify our own programming. It's not actually a piece of fruit that we ate..

it neither was in interpretation. it was just that they gained critical information, wether its because they simply gained knowledge, or maybe just the ability to think for themself (i mean god says dont eat the apple, they dont eat it, god comes along, says "eat the apple" she eats the apple. no own thinking there) leading to learning the bitter truths banishing you from paradies


but what is the fruit of tree of life? if the fruit of the tree of wisdom has a symbolic meaning, there should one be for the fruit of the tree of life as well. or is it just the generic fountain of youth you get occasionally in stories?

I dunno about free will. I do think the apple represents knowledge. When Adam and eve became aware of themselves and we're ashamed of their nakedness this knowledge tainted them. Before this knowledge they were innocent. Being self aware one can contimplate violence, greed, or just sin in general. Before we were animals but now we are something else. After all can you really call a mouse or lion evil?

This sounds like something you should post on /x/. I'm not even joking, they care more about the metaphysical and probably won't call you a faggot in the process.

>didn't know your scooter had internet

>won't call you a faggot in the process.
Yes they will and
>they care more about the metaphysical
No they don't
They're obsessed with the physical

i did, barely got any answers. also it fits pol since its about the start of civilizations which created politics, so understanding the creation better might help understand politics better

in the nordic mythology, there is no concept of good and evil. they just have actions that are appropiate and not according to their morallity and situation they are in.thats a concept you can use on animals as well,

There is no such thing as good and evil.
When you have to program yourself you need to decide for yourself what to program yourself to do. Good and Evil are concepts our minds create to help steer us the right direction in deciding how to program ourselves.
We can choose to be carnivores, herbivores, omnivores, cannibals, whatever we want. Obviously some choices are better than others so we call the ones in our interest good and the ones that aren't evil.
Basically whatever is in our interest our minds associate it as being good and whatever isn't our mind associates it with being evil.

As we gain more knowledge and understanding of the universe around us we begin to see that some things are actually good for us that we previously considered evil and vice versa.

As a being that is unable to program itself, ie. animals, angels, there is no good or evil. There are only instructions and orders. You do what you are programmed to do. Nothing else matters.

this basically. i just dont think that animals are that much bound to their "programming" if it were the same species would all behave the same, but each of them have a mind of their own even if those are simpler minds.
just got another idea. maybe the reason we had to leave paradies because you can either have knowledge, or free will. animals seem to have free will, but few knowledge. the angels seem to know of a lot but have no free will. we all know knowledge is power and with the free will we are able to use that knowledge for evil things, for corruption, lies, manipulation destroying our own paradies

There is a very distinct line between animals and people. Good and bad action according what you said the Nordic philosophy (I'm not accustomed to) but I'm sure it doesn't account for malice or intent. To use law for example the action may be completely different from the intention. When we gained knowledge or became aware (redpilled) we in turn became dangerous because with it we could plan whereas an animal couldnt. An animal doesn't have greed. Animals (carnivores) kill only when hungry or threatened. Man can be motivated by many means usually selfish ones. I agree with the other poster who said we weren't suppose to attain this knowledge when we did. We weren't ready

Take this as an example. Assume you taught a monkey how to shave people. Like a barber. The monkey will perform the task as it was trained. The monkey cannot contimplate murder as it doesn't have the knowledge to does so. It may do so on accident via a miscalculation or misplaced razor but it never intended harm. A person on the other hand can contimplate murder for whatever reasoning they can convince themselves of. Because of this I think God cast us out. We could hurt him or at least attempt to. The garden of eden was full of other creatures was it not? I don't remember reading in Genesis that the other animals were cast out. I could be wrong. This is what makes sense to me though

So Plato walks into a Harlem Barber Shop...

well, as i sad i believe the paradies to be a state of your mind. you dont know there is any bad thing so everything is fine. you are in paradise. now the animals didnt "eat" the fruit, they didnt get the knowledge or the abillity to think and thus remained in the stat of mind that they are in the paradies because they dont know of evil.

however thanks for the remark with the own will and that they, just because of that, may cause harm to the heaven and its inhabitants and so he threw them out. that never made sense to me previously since its always said that he is agenerous god and only wants our best. never made sense to me to then throw them out of paradise but no there is a good reasoning =)

>Dont tred intensifies

ah also as far as i know some apes are known that if there is one individuum that always screws the others over, steals their stuff, eats their food, is aggressive and so on, that then the others will gather up to murder that one chimpanzee like the humans did in the good old times (only we got more style with our torches and pitchforks xD)

I see what ur saying Hans. Only if you believe heaven to be a state of absolute enlightment I think you give us way to much credit. Temptation is the thing we were warned of that will forever leave us here in pergatory. Great thread btw. Was getting bored of all the shit threads being recycled lately.

Everything this German has posted is pretty much exactly what Zionist Jews believe. They believe it is there duty to make the world into GOD.

I'm surprised no American read this and thought "God got mad when they covered their junk, hence, the Naked Baptist Church.

>Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
>I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.

>Temptation is the thing we were warned of that will forever leave us here in pergatory
but since we are all potential gods, dont you think we are powerfull enough to overcome that temptation? i know it takes a lot of spiritually maturing for that, but then when we accomplished that our paradise would once again be restored dont you think?

>Great thread btw. Was getting bored of all the shit threads
thanks, me too. just too much propaganda of both, shillary and drumpf. or "which country is the whitest and why it is x". the other day i had a beatufifull discussion here that started at cern, and escalated to philosophy, how we think the universe is constructed, different realities and so on. hoped i can relieve that again xD
>They believe it is there duty to make the world into GOD.
well, they make a pretty shitty job to say the least x)
however i havent looked into that yet, but if that is true and they believe the same i at least think the way to accomplish that is different. while they try to steer it from behind according to how they think is right, i believe it cant be accomplished by a single group of people. if we can create a paradise its a process every single one must go through which can only happen if you give people as many informations as possible so they can find out what is wrong and fix it together

are you actually into these stories and have some thoughts on the verses you post, or are you just throwing them in here in hope i give and interpretation? xD

>all potential gods on a personal level no. Absolutely not. You and I will be fertilizer and not gods. Humanity as a whole maybe. Just look at our history. 1500 years we hacked each other to death with steel and in the past 500 we've gotten a little bit better at it. We still have thousands of years more before we grow tired of it, if we don't anililate ourselves first that is. Only after we had our fill of war can we think about omniscience

Did you just make this connection?

the thing is i believe we are held stupid on purpose so we are easily to controll (instead of eating the apple/red pill and free our selves). they give us reality tv, biased news, faked statistics and generally stuff that makes you not think about stuff, so that it just fits our pretty world. if everyone would just start thinking himself instead of letting others think we would already be a giant leap closer to paradise.
dont forget its the same forces making hack each other to death the last few centuries that keeps the people stupid/unthinking. the common man doesnt want it but is tricked into believing it serves a greater and better cause. and thats again where you see humanities potential (even if a dark side of it), for the greater good he is able to do the most horrible things he himself maybe will never recovering from. wether it is murdering someone else or dying while you try to make the world a better place. all just because they want a better world. of course it doesnt make it something good, but without the manipulations it wouldnt be as bad as it is now at least

It actually might not take that long. Just look at all that new-age philosophy making the rounds. Now, I won't deny that much of it is just, well, crap, or people trying out a new fad to feel better about themselves being "better" than others. Still, there are some very good ideas sprouting because of it.
Well, that also might be a biased view, as I personally have profited from filtering / watering down some of these philosophies / or reading from people who did similiar. (Mostly boiling off any mysticism and socio-cultural bs they imparted into their beliefs. Some good stuff out there.)

Well, we are living in the information age - and some of that information, is about becoming a "better", more "conscious" person. If it will gather a great enough following to actually change society, is not something we ourselves might see - but the potential is there.

some of it, some a friend of mine made. we talked a lot about this stuff and i tried i share some of our ideas

Shut the fuck up, faggot.

You should read the rest of the Bible. Jesus lays things out in a way that will confirm your findings.

>Deliver the poor and needy: rid them out of the hand of the wicked. 5They know not, neither will they understand; they walk on in darkness: all the foundations of the earth are out of course. 6I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High. 7But ye shall die like men, and fall like one of the princes. 8Arise, O God, judge the earth: for thou shalt inherit all nations.

I did find your reasoning interesting. That "God" might have been a framework to describe the educated/slave dynamic at the time is pretty interesting. But philosophically, you are on point.

we have all this awesome technology, with which you have gathered almost all knowledge of humankind and people just use it to look on catpictures on the internet. thats always shows me that its still a 50:50 for eternal damnation or getting ultimate freedom

That's what the American was sayin. The zionst belief behind globalization is to make everyone the same so we stop fighting. This will never work. We may be told we are the same but we will find divides in ourselves. Society that is. Also why the rush?. Let nature take its course. If we are worthy we will be rewarded if not who cares because we're dead. We are kept dumb and to many of us are too far gone. You should read "the republic" by Plato if you haven't already. This is almost a manefesto for the "ideal" society.

I can explain it even more simply

I want to be poor in a world where people are rich. If any government takes that away from me, I will burn everything down and escape.

thus, either communism can't happen, or just fucking try it, bitch.

This is why the Bible is the biggest red pill.

the thing is its pretty big and i cant keep myy focus on something for that long if i force myself. i always look up what interests me in the moment and then try to make sense of it. but indeed it would probably a good read

also the quotes you posted i would say what i have postet about us being morpheus ourself in
>8Arise, O God, judge the earth
that part sounds for me like it means that when we finally became god, became aware of everything we should fix the thinks that is wrong and create paradise

> for thou shalt inherit all nations.
that i would interpret as that when we became gods there should be noone to govern the people (we inherit the nations, thus its people, and everyone governs over himself basically) and that everything belongs to everyone. there are no pitossessions as something belongs to you just as much as the one next to you, but since the earth has enough ressources for everyone, and since in such an ideal world people would work for the greater good and thus produce stuff just for others there should be always enough so you dont have to take something dear to someone in order to fullfill your wishes.
at least thats also something about how i view the paradis.

>I did find your reasoning interesting. That "God" might have been a framework to describe the educated/slave dynamic at the time is pretty interesting. But philosophically, you are on point.
thanks really, i always appreciate critical input, wether postive or negative so i know how far of the course i am xD

It seems to be human is to be polarized. If conformity is pushed it turns into an orwellian nightmare were if the ruling ideology is a little bit flawed we cannot achieve true enlightenment. Really don't know how or if we can achieve godliness Most people are to preoccupied with distractions to care however

this is something i would expect to come from the keyboard of a black person

we wuz tier

We are not necessarily all morpheus. Morpheus was a believer, yes, but only on the surface level. He trusted what the oracle told him, what the "Bible" says.

Neo became the one throughout the course of the film, ultimately when he rejected his own death.

Also to add: we fight over the dumbest shit. Look at soccer riots. You like red team. You not blue. Smack. And you think we can govern ourselves?

That's a good analogy. A soccer game looks the way it does because it is an imbalance.

What if when the ball is kicked off, everyone just ignored it and stayed where they were? It's the same game, but there's no life in it.

but the bible/oracle said is to go out and spread the knowledge/thinking, the apple/book/redpill. the difference is matrix says that there is a single chosen one, the bible says that everyone shall know about it in order to be freed. but in both cases the result is morpheus/us going around and tell people about it.

True, I was just assuming you thought there could be only one "the one" in our world, which is false.

Can one be rational and emotional? I don't think so. Which one is omniscience or is it mastering both? As soon as you achieve the higest degree of one the other fades. Like an oxymoron

It is both, one after another, like a flickering light

i believe there can be "the one" but not in the way that he appears and frees everyone singlehandedly. it will be "the one" who makes some really criticall information public which will make the people realize shit is going down hill. it will maybe be someone knowing just what we all know, but has a platform and actually reaches people who wake up. you cant be freed if you dont even know you are imprisoned, and "the one" is the one who will make them realise they are in prison. if he appears that is. maybe it will just become gradually more and more people becoming aware until the tide turnes. maybe we will just keep going and go down miserably. i dont know

You misunderstand, it isn't worldly information neo held that made him powerful.

I can't guide you further. But turn your intellect toward the atom and the holographic nature of reality.

If we achieve rationality we realize our emotions prevent logic and we do away with them like the book "the giver" where emotions were eliminated. If we achieve full emotion first we run the risk of the soccer example where we justify irrationality (violence) for our emotions. Maybe we have to do both at once?

ok, since you said "neo rejected his death" i had something on the edge of a mind (another one of my thoughts that was fitting) now that you say it isnt the information that made him powerfull, and the holographic nature of reality it even feels more fitting (copied it from another thread i had it posted in)

what is the universe? the universe is everything we can observe right? and what we observe is the reality. now everyone observes different stuff. maybe because he just lives in a different part of the world. maybe because he has different informations. maybe different conclusion based on the same informations the others have. that means everyone lives in his own universe/reality. spinning this thought further everything you believe in is real because you observed it in some way or another. when there is some noise in the bushes at night one might think its a cat and just walks on. the next guy heres that sound an believes it is surely a monster and runs away. now there is one reality with a cat, and one with a monster. is one more right than the other if you havent actually looked what is in the bushes?
also how can it be that there are different perceptions of reality be real if they contradict each other? multiverse theory. there are allegedly hundreds and thousands of universes all similar to ours, but with tiny difference (like in one universe there is a cat in the bush, in another there is a monster).

(to be continued)

A source of unrelenting energy would give us a leap in the right direction. Science is more than likely our best shot. Only our intentions (emotion) ruin everything. It's what turned the power of the atom frI'm heaven into hell

(part 2)
what im trying to get at is: in some way each and everyone is in his own universe and reality. and each of the universes are connected, they can exchange data by talking, watching/showing or feeling/touching with each other. sometimes your reality will alter itself for example when you get new information, and suddenly the all good government turns into the corrupt piece of shit. some see this as a destruction of their reality instead of an alteration or addition and thus do their best to preserve the original state by ignoring and supressing the information
but if now the mere thought of something being the way it is, something being there creates it there in this specific reality, how much does the human mind in general accomplish with sheer will. i mean of course there has to be some objective data fed to everyone that is the same, but the interpretation is completely different and thus the realities can differ.
now you said neu rejected his death. is such a thing maybe even truly possible? some people survived the most outrages wounds just because they didnt want to give up. can you do that every time? how much is it possible to take influence in stuff just with your mind and will alone? especially when you talke about the "holographic" nature of reality

also im curious about that guiding stuff. if you have any interesting information left pls let me know. i love to get new informations. thats why i made this post in hope of getting new insights x)

Adam and eve story is allegorical. It's a story of a couple having sex. The snake is the penis (on thy belly thy will go...) The woman is fascinated by it. They end up having sex. They now have to decide between what is good and bad for their offspring.

thats one boring interpretation x)
but it seems fitting kinda

so guys, its kinda late here so i have to leave you but i thought i leave a last bumb so you guys might find someone to talk with :D

was fun with you and im happy to see you can have some deeper discussions here =)
good night/evening/day/morning when/whereever you read this. hope we can do it another time again =)