Was Childs the Thing at the end?

Was Childs the Thing at the end?

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yes

I think so. In the canon videogame, he's dead, either because he was a Thing or because he froze to death

No. He would have assimilated McReady if he was.

You were the thing all along OP.

>implying both of them arent 2 seperate things

MacReady was no threat to The Thing at the end because he was gonna be frozen to death anyways and had no weapons left.

Nah, the setup was too outlandish for that to be the case.
If Childs was a thing why didn't he use the flamethrower or just merge with Macready right then?

That aside, the music at the end could imply they could still get thinged upon, but really it was just a way to close out the movie in a bleak fashion.

Thematically the only possible ending is one where McReady is a human and Childs is the Thing.

That way the movie ends with a human facing the alien menace face to face, just like how McReady was playing chess earlier in the movie and both ran out of moves to make.
The alien though, just like the computer before is "cheating" since it can freeze up and hybernate.

Also a further chess analogy because white player faces black player.

He was literally the only threat left to the Thing. He spent the whole movie kicking its ass. The Thing would have every reason to kill MacReady at the end and literally no reason not to.

Yes.
Macready was last filling the alcohol bottles with kerosene and Childs drank it but didn't react to it tasting different.

That's not important, user, because IN THE END NOTHING REALLY MATTERS.

y the fuk does he have the last name childs anyway

Yes

When asked about the theory, Russell shook his head before explaining why it may be missing the point.

“John Carpenter and I worked on the ending of that movie together a long time. We were both bringing the audience right back to square one. At the end of the day, that was the position these people were in. They just didn’t know anything,” said Russell.


It was open ended, but ‘Where were you, Childs?’ implies a fuck ton

I don't think it makes sense for Childs to be The Thing at the end but I like/agree with this perspective. Most of the movie is spent priming the audience to think that if a character is off camera or away from others, he's going to be The Thing. So at the end, our gut tells us that Childs is the Thing but there're reasons to doubt this and in the end, we just don't know, and never will (as it should be, I think).

>I don't think it makes sense for Childs to be The Thing at the end

Yes it does. the dude was more paranoid than anyone else. had a job to stay put, if he was human he would not have ran out into the snow because he "thought" he saw blaire and be gone for that long. And the cameras wouldnt have made it a point to show that the gen room in the basement led to the hallway right behind where childs was keeping an eye out the door. the same basement that blair dug through leading into the gen room. he was attacked from behind, replicated and ran out to preserve itself.

Yes the movie is opened ended but based on the way his character acted throughout you can make the assumption that he wouldnt have ran outside in a blizzard alone. He was willing to let Macready freeze out there because he could have been a thing.

What would be your argument for him not being one?

Childs was assimilated by Blair and then sent outside to be insurance. It probably learned after the mistake it made at Sweden's base.

>What would be your argument for him not being one?
The most obvious and also strongest one - He didn't kill MacReady. The arguments for Childs being the Thing are convoluted, open to lots of interpretation, or just plain weak. For example:
>based on the way his character acted
>you can make the assumption that
Or you can go with the obvious conclusion that he would have killed MacReady at the end if he was the Thing

>Childs was assimilated by Blair and then sent outside to be insurance.
Pure speculation with no reasoning.
>It probably
Confirmed for nothing but speculation

You're arguing facts about a constructed situation in a piece of fiction.

Look at what the film is giving you, thematically.
First scene we see McReady and he's playing chess and he claims the AI is cheating.
Last scene we see of him is against a "black" opponent and the alien is "cheating".

This is not a coincidence for a reason since everything in a film narrative is deliberately constructed.

The thing is careful as fuck. It approached him but couldnt guess that he didnt have a weapon on him. Mac could have had a flamethrower on him. He also has all the time in the world to assimilate him if it wants, Mac would pass out before dieing and he could take him then.

We gave you logical reasons based on visual evidence the director showed us with the shots of the basement door open leading to childs, and character evidence with his behavior being contradictory to how his character had been.

you are just disregarding that despite them being fair and valid reasonings. Not to mention, this

>Look at what the film is giving you
The Thing kills anyone as soon as it has them alone.
>Last scene we see the Thing alone with MacReady but it decides to bide its time for no reason whatsoever.
>This is not a coincidence for a reason since everything in a film narrative is deliberately constructed.
Like deliberately training you that anybody who is out of sight ever will become the thing?
Also
>You're arguing facts
Yeah...you're arguing what? That because it's a work of fiction any interpretation is true and therefore we're both right? Or just that your interpretation is true?

>Mac could have had a flamethrower on him.
He could have been hiding a backpack with a flamethrower attached to it by a hose?
>We gave you logical reasons based on visual evidence the director showed us with the shots of the basement door open leading to childs, and character evidence with his behavior being contradictory to how his character had been.
You gave a way to logically connect circumstantial arguments that lead to the conclusion that it's possible that Childs was the Thing. On the other hand, Child not being the Thing is the most obvious and most likely conclusion (by far) because if he was, he would have killed MacReady. The Thing only showed restraint when he was outnumbered.
>you are just disregarding that despite them being fair and valid reasonings.
No I'm not, I'm pointing out that you have to jump through a bunch of mental hoops to make those arguments and even then, the only conclusion you can make is "Child could be the Thing" and then contrasting that with the obvious: "If Childs was the Thing, he would have killed MacReady" which takes zero leaps of logic and doesn't rely on personal interpretations.

you are retarded and the only one jumping through mental hoops with personal interpretations. you are disregarding all evidence given for the sake of being argumentative. Your only argument is he didnt attack macready instantly.

It doesnt fucking need to. If he is the Thing, he already won. That is the point.

>If Childs was a thing why didn't he use the flamethrower or just merge with Macready right then?
No point in it and needlessly risky.

This has always seemed like the strongest interpretation. It's a stale mate.

Wrong.
When they are setting explosives we see Macready has two molotovs on his belt. When the massive thing appears at the end and destroys the detonator we see the two molotovs on the floor next to it, they are also destroyed.
After the huge explosion the view of the camp shows Macready's hut is intact.
In the final panned out shot just before we see the freezing Mac stumbling across the camp, bottle in hand, it is in flames.
This, along with Mac clearly being about to take a swig before he hears Child's behind him, clearly indicates that Mac went up to his hut and grabbed one last bottle to drink and numb the pain of freezing to death, then set his hut on fire.

Well one of them was

>No breath

It's irrelevant. David's xenomorphs will rule the galaxy soon.

>you are retarded and the only one jumping through mental hoops with personal interpretations
>Your only argument is he didnt attack macready instantly.
How is that jumping through mental hoops?
>you are disregarding all evidence given for the sake of being argumentative
I haven't disregarded anything. And now you're making assumptions about my motive with literally no evidence whatsoever. "Waaahhh you don't agree with me, you're just being obstinate".
>It doesnt fucking need to. If he is the Thing, he already won.
No he hasn't, as I've pointed out several times. There's literally no reason not to kill MacReady and every reason to do so (e.g. MacReady has spent the entire movie fucking it up). But of course, when the dog first appears on screen, it looked left then looked right, which is exactly what Childs did when we first see him and MacReady at the end, so obviously Childs is the Thing.

what about xenomorphs infected by the thing?

Crossover opportunity. Hopefully they can keep the damn Predator away.

Why can't the thing just become a piece of wood or something? Everything is just particles on an anatomic level

Yes, Childs is a thing.

Not him, but the most accepted theory is that childs was assimilated during that scene where he is left alone watching the door.

1. Childs is shown looking at the door and the camera pans backwards, showing the door to the basement, where the power generator is.
2. we know that a thing is by the power generator because it gets shut down, also anyone coming out of the basement would be behind Childs
3. we are shown the door open and the coats next to where Childs was standing have been switched and some boots were thrown around

if you think the coats and the boots were moved by accident in a movie that takes such a focus on details you are a fool, Childs was assimilated right there, the struggle moved the clothes around and then the thing switched coats.

I'm sorry if I forgot some details, it's just that this has been common knowledge for years, just go rewatch the scene again, you can go into detail over the other theories about Childs at the end, but the scene where childs is shown dissapearing was made for a reason,

a thing. not THE thing. learn to read, fuckface.

John Carpenter changes his answer to that question all the time, but he did endorse the video game.
Anyways, the best artistic choice is to not know one way or the other. Was one of them the Thing? Were neither of them the Thing? It didn't matter.

>most accepted theory
>this has been common knowledge for years
The most accepted theory is that you're wrong, It's common knowledge that I'm right. See how that's an unsubstantiated non-argument?
>if you think the coats and the boots were moved by accident in a movie that takes such a focus on details you are a fool, Childs was assimilated right there, the struggle moved the clothes around and then the thing switched coats.
>you are a fool if you disagree with this thing I said and now I'm going to ride that to imply you are a fool for not agreeing with how I interpret that thing I said,
Typical of someone who says "It's common knowledge!"

Please, answer what nobody else has been able to: Why wouldn't Childs kill MacReady if Childs was the Thing? He had every reason to do so and no reason not to. Why can't anybody address this? Why do they all ignore it and go into 3 part explanations open to vast amounts of interpretation only to conclude that Childs MIGHT be the Thing when Occam's Razor says he's not?
>Not him
Sure thing

He did 'kill' him when he gave him the booze to drink user. Thats why Macready pauses for a second before drinking. He realizes that the only reason childs would potentially infect himself was if he was already infected. Macready gave up and drank it the same way he made the computer 'give up' at the begging of the film. He had been out-smarted. Also everything that user said was correct and is common knowledge. There are many youtube vids discussing this point to death.

Because the final part of the film is the most ambigous one, the same way you can attack the way I worded my statement I can say you keep trying to ignore the scenes that were made beforehand to make us go no where and get stuck on the final 10 seconds of the film, As I said before, the final scene has alot of different theories surrounding it, there's no 100% clear answer, what's clear to me is the scene I mentioned before.

>why can't you give me a straight solid answer for the most debated scene in the movie
come on

imo they don't attack each other right away to leave it as an open ending and leave the audience guessing, maybe the thing thinks that it already won, they were shown to be extremely aggresive only in certain situations.

also what do you think about the scene with Childs going out into the snow storm and leaving the door open because he saw someone, when he was shown in another scene deciding to keep people locked outside?
the entire movie isn't just those last seconds.

The worst thing is the implication that, if Childs is indeed the Thing, the alien isn't just crafty and clever and intelligent, it's sadistic. It plays with MacReady, fucks with him, maybe purposefully drinking the molotov cocktail due to the smile after he does. That's a pretty horrifying thought in itself - the thing doesn't want to just assimilate you, it savors the moment.

Besting an intelligent opponent must be a universal pleasure.

it wasn't a molotov cocktail, someone on the thread already explained it but I can't find his post, in that scene where McReady is about to be attacked by the giant thing, he loses all the molotov cocktails, they are shown on the floor while he is prepping the explosives.

It's not sadism, he's just intelligent and knows that a fight isn't necessary

It always makes me happy to see this movie is still promoting so many discussions after all these years.

Macready is the Thing.
The Things only goal is to get off Antarctica and to the mainland where it will have more biomass than it could dream of to assimilate.
Mac is the most aggressive and forward in efforts to combat the thing to keep all suspicion off himself throughout the movie.
Even he doesn't actually realise it, as he is being assimilated extremely slowly. He was infected when he took a swig from Blair's vodka bottle, which Blair was drinking during his simulation.
Mac even has a concerned look on his face, remembering what he did, when Fuchs tells him that a tiny particle of this thing could infect anyone and they should prepare all their own meals and only eat canned food.

>ywn be a winged hussar

Doesnt explain childs willingly drinking with him at the end though. Childs isnt a fool and would know drinking together would infect. And I doudt the creature wouldnt know both parties are assimilated. Although ive never seen this brought up......I always asumed blair was infected when they shut him up in the shed, not before though.

they're both thing

The thing passing a drink between itself to celebrate? I dont buy it.

I personally think the whole point of that ending is that no one knows, ending the film on the same level of paranoia that had engulf the characters during the film.

It's not about who is/isn't the thing. It's about the audience still asking the question at the apparent conclusion to the film.

if they are both thing than who was phone?

Blair pokes the dog-thing with a pencil then puts the pencil on his lip.
It's partly why he goes crazy after watching his simulation and realising that the thing can assimilate from a single cell, he's horrified realising what he's done, and the thing cells slowly taking over are probably messing with his brain too.

Eh I guess i can see that. Problem is you could also say he goes crazy from the idea of world wide assimilation. But I havnt seen it in a few months...........which end of the pencil does he bite on? Need this shit on blue ray stat.

:o

thing doesn't know if others are thing, it doesn't have telepathy in the movie

But......how would it ever assimilate anything then?

The 2011 remake was such shit but the advertising was godtier.

yes and so was McReady

He bites the same end he stuck in the dog.
Whilst the realisation of the implications might be enough to set him off, he's a surgeon, a very smart man.
He would have realised exactly like Mac did that at least some of the people (probably most of them) were still human.
He could get everyone together, explain the situation and they would have agreed to cutting off outside communication and disabling transport, or risked incriminating themselves by resisting the idea.
Instead he does the one thing which he wagers will get him cut off and isolated to pursue his own agenda whilst the others are busy arguing amidst increasing paranoia amongst themselves.

The original storyboard and the practical effects actually looked pretty good, it could've been great.
Whatever studio exec said "nah we need to paste over all these effects with CGI" should be taken out back and put down.

Way to ugly up a thread.

>Occam's Razor
Cringy bitch to boot

the bottle, think about the bottle

there were multiple things acting independently

Both Blair and McReady obtain insights into Things plans and mind after being infected

>Why can't anybody address this?
It's been addressed multiple times.

The movie doesn't answer that in the ending which means there is no answer to this.But I like to believe they are both human and they froze to die.

>they froze to die.
those two playing dice to death would have been really strange

There's gotta be something that the thing cannot assimilate. That's just not fair

is the prequel canon? There was something about the thing not being able to replicate silver and childs in that last scene did have an earring in so if that's the case he wasn't THE Thang

It's pretty clear that its a hive mind creature. It is THE thing, after all. Not the things.

The thing can fight itself to prove amongst itself which is the strongest thing of all. If childs and Mac were both things then they were going to fight for a right to assimilate the rest of the planet. Then the chain would continue until only the strongest thing was left alive to go to another planet and it would start all over again. This is best theory DO NOT STEAL

>Blair pokes the dog-thing with a pencil then puts the pencil on his lip.

Incorrect. He never touches the pencil to the remains. Watch it again, you are incorrect.

His gloves, still bloody from the autopsy, touch the pencil however, as he is holding it in them.

However, the notion that he touches the tip of the pencil to the dog-thing is incorrect.

>Had no weapon left.
The flame thrower was pointed right at him and lit.

I (like to) think so.

man i love carpenter
youtube.com/watch?v=fPC60B1v2Rc

This thread made me want to watch it again, so I'll check it out tonight after work and reassess. Thanks user.

Well the thing is a hive mind so if it got caught once due to not replicating an earring it would have learned to pick up Child's earring after it assimilated him and stick it back in the copy.

Please do. It is, for some reason, a common mistake. But there is no moment in the scene where his pencil touches the remains, makes direct contact.

His bloody gloves, however, do touch the pencil, the body of it under the eraser. It is debatable if thing-germs could travel up the pencil to his lips. I think not.

Personally, I do think he was infected during the autopsy, but it is nothing so simple as the pencil being the reason.

>Well the thing is a hive mind

No, it isn't. There's literally no proof of that claim.

It appears I was wrong, just watched the clip. Blair is not wearing his gloves while holding the pencil, but I must reiterate that he does not touch the remains with the pencil.

Info outside of the movie dosnt count.
If you have to explain scenes in your movie you already failed, and the movie dosnt work as a single coherent piece.

In the end we dont know.
My guess is he wasnt, since as others pointed out the thing has no reason to not attack, misleading a dying man gains it nothing.

If Childs is the thing, it has no reason not to attack (except perhaps it is just being smart. Macready has been the most resourceful and aggressive in taking out the Thing, why attack him and risk him having one last trick up his sleeve when they can both just freeze together and get picked up by a rescue team after winter?)

If Macready is the thing (which I believe), then he doesn't attack Childs because he's pointing a flamethrower in his face. It laughs when Childs drinks the whiskey because it's won.

Video games are never canon.

Because a fight risks him losing entirely or losing biomass. He can simply wait for him to pass out then assimilate.

Yes.
Childs breath never condenses.

If either of them were the Thing, why would they help the other one kill the other Thing? Wouldn't they just turn into the Thing, absorb the last human, and then there would be 3 Things to build the spaceship and GTFO of Antarctica. The point was, they were BOTH still human, but they couldn't ever trust another human being again, so they froze to death.

I read something once about the bottle that Macready passes to Child containing gasoline (since they were using molotovs by the end of the movie). The Thing drinks the gasoline unknowingly, giving Macready confirmation of Childs assimilation.

Carpenter confirmed it canon.

Problem is that both are susceptible to cold.
So no, it cant wait.

He's been trying to get into the vidya game lately, still not canon.

Cold is only fatal to humans

its fatal to the thing if nobody unfreezes it
It might be years or decades or more before somebody finds the body
By that time thing might not be a treat anymore

Rescue teams would arrive within 6 months.

not too long to wait for an alien lifeform that's already been in the ice for god knows how long

Plus it has a coat plenty of biomass to eat. It'll be fine.

2011 version wasn't technically a remake.
it's a prequel

notice on how the ending was a helicopter chasing THE dog

>canon video game

Yes it does, just hard to see in the lighting. It's most obvious just after he takes a swig of the whiskey.
You can see his breath the whole time on the Blu Ray release.

See

Plus, the thing as a biological thing would clearly also breathe and exhale water vapor