Have living standards of eastern Europe declined after Communism?

Have living standards of eastern Europe declined after Communism?

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Declined at first, improved afterwards.

These living standards make think of suicide every day.

there is trash all over the place, because they just don't give a fuck about it.

nothing to do with communism

Yes. They skyrocketed during the glorious Communist era, and fell significantly after the system was destroyed by filthy traitors.
Take a look at Ukraine for example, it was a booming prosperous republic back then, and now it is just a pure disaster, and only getting worse.

arent you guys currently bombing, cyberattacking and invading Ukraine though

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I heard that human trafficking and Prostitution have become a serious problem after they left communism. Lots of child porn are from Eastern Europe.

Ofc we don't, where do you even get such bizarre information from?

>you
Ask Putin and his criminal friends, i don't know what they are doing.

Mate you need to stop sourcing your knowledge of EE from Srpski Film.

not really

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xD

They had 23 years, but wasted it to self-destroying

The KG.. no, I mean FSB would like the have a word with you.

The garbage is put in order by a personal effort.

Ukraine has gotten much worse.

Russia was Somalia-tier in the 90s. But now improving.

Countries like Poland and Czech are progressing fast. Almost Western tier.

Former Yugoslavic countries, except and Slovenia and Croatia are still poor. Slovenia is arguably the fastest developing ex-commie country.

idk my parents tell me communism was the worst, but that's probably because they own a business now and are rich. Can't imagine it's any worse now though.

First of all, thinking of Eastern Europe as one region in terms of economy and standard of living is inappropriate nowadays, the countries have diverged from each other and for example Poland is much richer than Ukraine than Germany is than Poland.

There are basically two "Eastern Europes", the one that joined the EU, that is developing fast and the one that didn't, that is stuck in stagnation or even got only worse since communism collapsed (like Ukraine, Moldova or Serbia).

Unfortunately, the more successful part of Eastern Europe has adopted slightly anti-EU stance recently, probably due to Tocqueville's statement that revolutions break out not when there is the worst crisis but when the crisis is overcome but things are not improving as fast as people expect. Basically, eastern Europeans believed they would become as rich as Germans just after they join the EU and many of them can't understand that it takes decades to catch up with the richest countries in the world and they want to be rich now, not to work for the richer nations as cheap labor.

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that's how it was like in Hostel?

My flat on the right

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You can't fix subhuman behavior and culture. The Sl*v is literally a nigger in all but skin-color. Communism or Capitalism, the Sl*v needed a strong Government that forced them to clean up after themselves in order to prosper, once that Government loses its grips, the Sl*v reverts back to its natural state of degeneracy and uncleanliness.

true

GDP per capita growth 1980-2017 (selected countries)
China - 2001.39%
Vietnam - 518.56%
India - 404.01%
Myanmar -366.83% (start 1998)
Thailand -333.89%
Indonesia - 287.53%
Malaysia -242.48%
Turkey - 196.65%
Ethiopia - 165.15%
Poland - 140.94%
Pakistan - 134.57%
Morocco - 126.69%
Egypt - 126.51%
Colombia - 104.12%
Romania - 95.95%
Nigeria - 72.15% (start 1990)
Philippines - 70.88%
Peru - 68.20%
Iran - 45.13%
Mexico - 37.13%
Kenya - 34.37%
Argentina - 29.80%
Brazil - 26.17%
Russia - 22.24% (start 1990)
South Africa - 13.30%
[b]Negative[/b]
[b]Ukraine - (-)21% (start 1990)[/b]
Venezuela - (-)38.13%

>Unfortunately, the more successful part of Eastern Europe has adopted slightly anti-EU stance recently, probably due to Tocqueville's statement that revolutions break out not when there is the worst crisis but when the crisis is overcome but things are not improving as fast as people expect. Basically, eastern Europeans believed they would become as rich as Germans just after they join the EU and many of them can't understand that it takes decades to catch up with the richest countries in the world and they want to be rich now, not to work for the richer nations as cheap labor.

too simple getaway, eu fucked up on many occasions

The only fuck-up of the EU is taking the refugees, but it didn't deserve as panic reaction from Eastern European countries as they did, it's just Eastern European populists that took advantage of it and exaggerated the danger.

Other than that, the EU did nothing wrong to Eastern Europe.

Southern europes are not fond of EU either, mostly because refugee crisis, lack of solidarity and esterners that drain european funds but wont contribute
If you exclude refugees from this equation, EU would be perfect, but its ibvious EU is not able to, they are the playball of geopolitical games

kys brainwashed leftist dog

>Southern europes are not fond of EU either, mostly because refugee crisis, lack of solidarity and esterners that drain european funds but wont contribute

I totally understand them, it must hurt when you remember how nice your country was just 15 years ago, like Italy or Greece and how much worse it's turned since then, while Eastern Europeans do whatever they want and don't get punished.

>If you exclude refugees from this equation, EU would be perfect, but its ibvious EU is not able to, they are the playball of geopolitical games

Eastern Europe wouldn't like it either, we have a different mentality, unfortunately, old commies didn't die out as fast as we expected and stupid people get brainwashed by anti-EU propaganda so easily. Here priests say that the EU is evil because it forced us to build wind farms that make cows stop giving milk. And people believe it.

Without the EU we would be like Ukraine or Moldova. I don't want it.

>old commies didn't die out
either its commies or mafia (see slovakia)

mafia is usually connected with commies

This. You see all that trash in OP's pic? They couldn't have afforded all before.

thats a gypsy neighborhood in slovakai that has been abandoned by local city administration long time ago

Daily reminder to not go to war with us.

Commie era had more job/life/pension security at the expense of personal freedom. It was ok if you had no ambitions in life and just wanted to work in a factory and have a reliable pension when you retired, but anyone with any smarts or creativity suffered.

>Unfortunately, the more successful part of Eastern Europe has adopted slightly anti-EU stance recently
It's become pretty clear now that the EU is a front for German economic imperialism.

No, nothing comes close to communism when it comes to economic declines

Good, thats what you deserve for sucking NATO dick.

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Depends on country. Personally, I think that cultural differences are to blame. In Poland, for example, communists failed to nationalize everything due to polish resistance. Private farming was even recognized as part of polish socialism in 1956. So, since Poland had many private entrepeneurs, we did a lot better than countries where there was little to no private businesses at all.

Czech and Pooland
>almost western

kek.
Maybe if compared to Portugal and Spain

Say that in front of any spaniard/italian/greek and you will probably get your skull bashed

It's gypsy or arab ghetto.

At least you aren't a Russian

>Ukraine has gotten much worse.

I wonder why

You might be right about Poland but you are underestimating the Czechs. They are like Germans of Slavdom, when it comes to business.They will probably outperform few western countries during our lifetimes.

East Germany seemed to accept socialism almost willingly and there was remarkably little resistance unlike some parts of the Eastern Bloc. It may be due to political traditions as the DDR occupied the former Prussian heartland and this region had always had a history of authoritarian rule without much of any tradition of liberalism or entrepreneurship.

>It was ok if you had no ambitions in life and just wanted to work in a factory and have a reliable pension when you retired
Not even that. Old people in the USSR lived in near-poverty. The famous British spy Kim Philby, after defecting to Moscow, in his later years was appalled at the poor living conditions suffered by "the generation that, after all, defeated fascism".

By the 1980s, a staggering 60% of the USSR's total GDP went to defense spending. That left very little for pensions or consumer goods.

It would go without saying that the V4 cunts have the best prospects since they're geographically closest to Western Europe and prior to communism were already fairly well developed and had a middle class while places like Bulgaria were dirt shit poor peasant societies.

Perhaps you'd be worse if you didn't join the EU but nowhere near Moldova/Ukraine levels.
Besides, how is your population leaving en masse to work in the West not a bad thing? The EU also paralyzes your government from protecting the domestic market from Western competition, something you cannot win against in a free market.

Ukraine is fucked because it's a completely artificial country. All the worst attributes of post-communist EE in one country.

>it's another episode of 53% face telling us how Europe works

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But wait, why does Sup Forums have 20 threads at any given moment of Yuropoors telling me how America works?

There aren't any though, just people making fun of your retarded """"culture"""

You know that the opposite of love isn't hate, it's apathy. People who actually dislike something just ignore it instead of being obsessed with it. :^)

You might have a point. If you take a look at prussian virtues, then Prussians seem like society perfect for fascism. Remove nationalism and adjust the rest a little and they will make very good socialists.

This is true though. Germany also has a very strong lutheran tradition which has less respect for the individual, as opposed to denominations like calvinism and catholism.

>remove nationalism
Nigga, the DDR was Nazi Germany except without hating Jews. They hated capitalists instead.
Where BRD abolished its old Prussian-style military uniforms, the DDR kept them. They even boasted about it in many parades.
youtube.com/watch?v=6vBGYe19Ibk

Someone described Berlin in the mid-19th century as being little more than a glorified army camp. Certainly the western German states were always wealthier and had a more grounded tradition of liberalism and capitalism--Otto von Bismarck had a notable loathing of Frankfurt for being one of the major centers of anti-monarchical political activity in Germany.

>Germany also has a very strong lutheran tradition which has less respect for the individual

Scandinavia is also Lutheran and they're notoriously collectivist.

True, but combined with what you mentioned it makes for a pretty autistic mix

the food had less cancer additives

Wait, I read that the wrong way. You're right.
It's also why Sweden is extremely liberal and don't dare to oppose the government, just like Germans.

Bulgaria didn't have much anti-Soviet dissent either, but pre-communism they were extremely poor and if nothing else, the commie era brought some positive improvements like modernized infrastructure and abolishing the remnants of feudalism.

Orthodox countries have similar problems because Orthodoxy also doesn't respect the individual too much and it also values education less than Catholicism or Protestantism.

>problem
Collectivism is good when it's used for the right purposes. It's how a strong nation and society is made.
But of course it can be exploited like it is now.

Getting way better today in terms of development

>It's how a strong nation and society is made

It falls apart in a heterogeneous society. It worked for Sweden in the 1960s, not anymore since "immigration" happened.

True.
Europe needs strong, homogenous and collectivist societies. Our power would be without limits.
youtube.com/watch?v=Le-9uWKe2dk

a lot over a million people have even left Lithuania for western europe that's how shitty it is

Just because x is better than y does not mean y is shit
of course people go somewhere where it's better

>60% of the USSR's total GDP went to defense spending. That left very little for pensions or consumer goods.

Source? I'm not sure I believe that

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_history_of_the_Soviet_Union#Military-industrial_complex_and_the_economy
>In the late 1980s the Soviet Union devoted a quarter of its gross economic output to the defense sector (at the time most Western analysts put the figure at 15%)

Note: "In the command and control economy as Soviet economy was GDP number is meaningless. When Central Planning Committee (CPC) determines levels of production, consumption, prices, wages and currency exchange rate the GDP is what CPC says it is.
It is impossible to judge the share of defence spending. Soviets didn't have normal budgeting process. Many defence related activities were performed (and paid for) not by Ministry of Defence, but by various of other Ministries so the defense spending was easily hidden inside other innocuous spending items."

This would have 60 replies if it had a burger flag

For some people definitely but overall the standards have gone up.

Great tier
>Czech Republic
>Slovenia
>Estonia

Good tier
>Poland
>Hungary
>Slovakia
>Latvia
>Croatia

Okay tier
>Romania
>Lithuania
>Belarus
>Bosnia

Shit tier
>Russia
>Bulgaria
>Serbia
>Moldova
>Albania

Ukraine tier
>U*raine

I have a friend in Russia and her life sounds like a living hell. She's unemployed even though she has two master's in STEM fields.

>They will probably outperform few western countries during our lifetimes.
Probably once the € brings a few of them down a notch.

>me too smort for gommy block
>me free thinker

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Ukraine is a special level of fail and AIDS (literally).

Ukraine is what Russia would look like if they didn't have oil, gas and whatever else they dig and export

Ukraine has loads of coal and other natural resources though plus they were one of the wealthiest Soviet republics. All of which goes to show just how colossally they blew it.

What the actual fuck
>Moldova better than Ukraine
>Bosnia better than Serbia
Do you have any fucking clue of what you're talking about

Ukraine was literally a Russian colony until Poroschenko and afterwards they got invaded and their most profitable regions either destroyed or taken.
He's a Bong, obviously he doesn't.

besides Latvia isn't any better than Lithuania

Well, they didn't do anything to stop corruption. In Belarus, Lukashenko, shortly after taking power in the 90s, had the army and state police go out and just gun down all mob bosses.

ukraine also has the most fertile land in europe

Eastern yurope?


No such thing

Yes, historically it was one of Russia's major breadbaskets. The soil and climate are similar to the Great Plains states in the US.

>how colossally they blew it
First, they were specialized in heavy industry and weapons manufacture. Neither of those were very interesting for western companies after communism fell. Especially those weapons, who needs them when the arms race was over? Ukraine was also fucked geographically, literally none of her neighbours was rich enough to trade with. Russians were poor as fuck, Poles too, Czechoslovakia wasn't rich either. Poland and Czechoslovakia bordered Germany and German companies smelled a good opportunity and bought what they could for pennies. Ukraine? Nobody gave a fuck.

That's not stopping corruption. It's just centralizing it. Russia did the same.

Food is hardly something you can get rich off, especially with the level of agricultural subsidies that goes on in Europe.

The DDR were massive race and ethnic traitors that willingly sucked Soviet cock. Even by the 1980's, Moscow still wouldn't let the DDR develop a separate arms industry because they didn't trust the Germans.

They also willingly supported left wing terrorist scum in West Germany, even going as far having the Stasi help them with murdering suspected anti communists back in the DDR.

But in the end, American influence is just as vile if not worse. And the "West" as a whole is a demographic catastrophe and surprisingly the former Communist countries in Europe are the last bastion of sensible immigration laws and anti degeneracy policies in general (though that is coming to an end unfortunately).

Europe would have been better off had the United States no intervened in WW1 and thus the the Central Powers and Entente would have fought to a standstill and have "white peace" of sorts and then work together to fight the Bolsheviks. But in the end, America killed Europe in part by allowing the Soviets to expand.

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yeah yeah whatever

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>Even by the 1980's, Moscow still wouldn't let the DDR develop a separate arms industry because they didn't trust the Germans
They actually required the entire Eastern bloc to use Soviet armaments. This wasn't without its advantages considering NATO's 20 or so member states most of which had a variety of incompatible weapons and varying caliber service rifles.

Europe should have looked to the Japanese, South Koreans and Taiwanese as inspiration on culture, immigration laws and economic policies. But unfortunately, whites like to think "western values" and the anti white perversion of French Republican values are the end all be all of being civilized.

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>Especially those weapons, who needs them when the arms race was over?

They suspect that Ukraine is where North Korea got their missile technology from because North Korea's missiles look very similar to the R-36 which was manufactured in Ukraine. Most likely, Kiev in the 90s were so poor and desperate for money that they sold weapons to any customers they could find.

>culture
no thanks

i would love to have something similar to japanese immigration policies
but it's too late mehmet and mohammed have already infiltrated politics

>Poland and Czechoslovakia bordered Germany and German companies smelled a good opportunity and bought what they could for pennies
As mentioned in .

But even Romania and Bulgaria aren't as totally fucked as Ukraine.

>if

They're not artificial countries that exist because Lenin doodled some arbitrary lines on a map after a few drinks.

That's because Russia is invading Ukraine and not us.