Is the massive misreading of this film by the movie critic establishment solid proof most critics are fucking retards?

is the massive misreading of this film by the movie critic establishment solid proof most critics are fucking retards?

Other urls found in this thread:

rogerebert.com/reviews/starship-troopers-1997
youtube.com/watch?v=s-ajyGCh0rs
youtube.com/watch?v=RCVBEE1SfXI
youtu.be/faFuaYA-daw
overthinkingit.com/2009/11/26/starship-troopers-fascism/
twitter.com/SFWRedditImages

Probably.

If they're not smart enough to understand what the movie is you'd think they could at least appreciate it as a BGF popcorn flick (see also: Independence Day).

people who are paid to have opinions usually have bad ones

In terms of quotability, this movie is pretty high up there.

Not as high as Aliens, but pretty high.

Why would a bug that thinks be offensive?

...

most critics recognized it was anti-war/anti-fascist satire. Only stupid 70 IQ Sup Forumsbeards think it's "redpilled"

what's the massive misreading?

rogerebert.com/reviews/starship-troopers-1997


>The action sequences are heavily laden with special effects, but curiously joyless. We get the idea right away: Bugs will jump up, troopers will fire countless rounds at them, the Bugs will impale troopers with their spiny giant legs, and finally dissolve in a spray of goo. Later there are refinements, like firebreathing beetles, flying insects, and giant Bugs that erupt from the earth. All very elaborate, but the Bugs are not interesting in the way, say, that the villains in the "Alien" pictures were. Even their planets are boring; Bugs live on ugly rock worlds with no other living species, raising the question of what they eat.

take your pick

>solid proof most critics are fucking retards
no proof needed
it's self evident

>critics hate it because they thought it was just a dumb movie and the message and references behind it went straight over their heads
>book fans hate it because it destroyed anything good about the book

Truly a patrician piece of cinema, Verhoeven was ahead of his time.

One of the worst misreadings in my opinion was the critics' response to A Scanner Darkly. It felt like some of them were too stupid to follow the plot of the movie.

He just didn't care for the action. I can understand where Ebert's coming from, the bugs are some of the most basic antagonists in the history of fiction. I don't think Ebert ever cared that much for pure action so this kind of movie would always be a hard sell for him. If I remember right he liked Robocop, which while not quite as strong on the action front is probably a superior movie overall.

>the message
which was?
>references
to?

This movie is good but loved and hated in all of the wrong ways.

the most retarded post in this thread

I bet John Wick is one of your favourite movies.

No? Why would a modern movie be one of my favorite ones?

Because you have shit fedoracore taste in movies.

epic, simply epic

Starship Troopers is a giant 100 million dollar meme with fun retarded action and nothing else going for it.
>but the uniforms looked like SS stuff
deep

I like this bait

Unironically what is there to enjoy about Starship Troopers aside from the memetastic stuff like future-football, retarded nonsensical training programs and giant bug-fights?

everything, it is infinitely re-watchable

I've seen it 10+ times, but for the future-football, retarded nonsensical training programs and giant bug-fights. This thread's OP seems to suggest that I'm missing something.

it's kino

you just don't get it

>film is anti-fascist

>Shows a society that is heavily diverse, socially equal, and near perfect in every way. The citizens are shown to be happy, they understand why their government is the way it is. The soldiers are volunteers who are willing to place their lives on the line for the good of everyone. The society in the film is about as close to ideal as humans could get.
I get what Vaerhoven was going for, but it's hard for me to take an anti-nationalist film seriously when it portrays a civic-nationalist world as basically a utopia.

>most critics recognized it was anti-war/anti-fascist satire
false

Interesting stuff

youtube.com/watch?v=s-ajyGCh0rs

>fun retarded action and nothing else

...and?

>if you understood it you would understand it

I think it was more antiwar as you are supposed to see rico slowly become apart of the war machine and be kinda disgusted when thwy say its afraid knowing hes become trapped within the system.

I've never understood Denise Richards's reputation as a bad actress. She's just fine. And I'd rank her at her peak as one of the most beautiful women to ever appear in cinema.

the utopia part isn't because of the nationalism, it's because of the civics, or the liberalism. the nationalism is openly mocked.

or do you think civic nationalism and fascism are identical?

Ask OP

Well, many people on the left (Vaerhoven included) would probably consider the Civic Nationalism shown in the film to indeed be a kind of Fascism, even if any one center or center right knows better.

Being a Civic Nationalist myself, I don't at all consider it to be Fascism, but try explaining the difference to a normie and see how far you get.

My argument is that Vaerhoven made a mistake by keeping the Civic Nationalism from the Starship troopers book as the society in his film, he should have made them a more blatantly fascist and neo-nazi type society if his goal was to make an anti-fascist/anti-nationalist film. The movie constantly says, "look how bad/silly/etc nationalism is," but rarely does it ever present the character's society as something negative.

I was there (fuck I'm old) when this came out. 9/10 people just did not get it. The loss of humanity, the loss of individualism. The jingoism, the blatant propaganda, the false flag attack, the parallels between the bugs and modern society. It all went right over people's heads. And considering you have neo-fascists praising the film to this day it's not that surprising.

actually they read it completely right as satire

However because it played the satire completely straight they felt they had to pretend it "wasn't" satire in order to discourage the dumb masses from thinking fascism was good

>And considering you have neo-fascists praising the film to this day And considering you have neo-fascists praising the film to this day

That's because it is great fascist propaganda

That's why it works so well as a movie. It's played completely straight. There is no scene where some snarky liberal has to come on screen and carefully explain to you that you are watching satire and then go on to tell you what you "ought" to think.

In the modern world if some centrist neoliberal isn't telling you what to think you might have the chance to mentally stray off the reservation.


youtube.com/watch?v=RCVBEE1SfXI

Alright since you might actually be retarded ill explain.

Basically the film is a razor thin satire of fascism and propaganda. The characters are purposely cardboard cut outs to emphasize this. The way everyone looks like a teenager from some shitty WB show, the triumphant ending where they state that the bugs are afraid are all aspects of the satire. The horrible mutilation all the adults suffer from in the film reinforce the idea of a nation of endless war. The very justification of the war is rediculous nonsense to justify the humans aggression. All of this is played pretty straight but apparently to straight for most people like you (retards) to pick up on. The films slips up in a few places but it's unwavering dedication to this central concept is what elevates it. Where lesser films would have winked and nodded at the audience, star ship troopers place it deliciously straight. It subverts propaganda films as well as satire itself by walking the line between it.

And in the end all the most superficial and evil characters survive and are consumed by the state in a perpetual state of war. The tone is unlike anything else which makes it a unique kino, unappreciated by Mongoloid critics and retards like you. You have to imagine yourself living in an approximation of that society going to the theater and watching a movie like this, of course the society looks perfect because it's a propaganda film from that perspective. I don't understand how people can love robocop and hate this movie when it's that same idea and tone turned up to 11.

>rarely does it ever present the character's society as something negative.

It does portray it as bad, you're just too retarded to get it. Civic nationalists are generally too low IQ to understand why inhibiting individual freedom is a bad idea.

>I don't understand how people can love robocop and hate this movie when it's that same idea and tone turned up to 11
Eventually Robocop turned on his corporate overlord. The irony of the old man CEO giving Robocop the kill order again, goes over people's heads. Starship Troopers doesn't even do that. The same people who whipped Rico's ass are portrayed as the good guys all the way through.

youtu.be/faFuaYA-daw

I don't get how any one can watch this without laughing your balls off, especially at the part where the teacher laughs like an insane person. The film drops little hints here and there like when the reporter says maybe we provoked the bugs and the "protagonist" comes up to the camera and immediately puts the point aside by saying we should kill them all while theatrically putting his hat on. It's supposed to be done in the moment but it's so obviously staged that it becomes comedic. To the plebian it comes off as cheesy or bad acting but if you understand the tone the movie is going for it elevates it to a wonderful exercise in deliberate artificiality.

Do you have a single fact to back that up?

>The same people who whipped Rico's ass are portrayed as the good guys all the way through.

He did get someone under his command killed

If you've seen it 10+ times and are still arguing this point you should kill yourself, you obviously love the film and think it's Kino but can't bring yourself to own your taste because you are insecure and must adopt others' opinions.

I'm searching for arguments in this post, but I see none.

You'll have to read the screeds the reviewers wrote in the 90s

Contrary to popular belief many acknowledged that the movie was satire, but ultimately said the movie was bad, not because it lacked artistic merit, but because the satirical message could be "dangerous".

And?
The authorities recognized Rico was good material and bent the rules to keep him in.

War makes for fascism was the point. They go through the ringer and come out fascists.

Yes, the film is so great because it is almost totally unique among films. I can't think of another one that walks the line as readily as this one. They drop little tid bits here and there but you would only get it if you were half way intelligent. If they were in your face at all it would have ruined the entire thing.

Verhoeven uses some fascist imagery like the SS uniforms and the design of their parliament thing being very reichstag-like but I don't think that any of the examples you're bringing up are coherent enough to constitute satire. Starship Troopers is a deliberately dumb action movie where the heroes dress up kind of like Nazis and fight a retarded war because they feel like it.

Robocop was much more straightforward and seemed to be working towards one point from start to finish. A good man in a hopelessly corrupt society buys it trying to do the right thing. These corrupt people aren't done with him though, they try and take what's left of him and make him into a tool to further their own ends. However, Murphy's humanity prevails over evil science and programming allowing him to be reborn as his own avenging angel, purging Detroit of evil with the help of the other good people. Very simple pro-Christian, pro-individual, anti-capitalist/materialist/greed story. What the fuck am I supposed to take away from watching Starship Troopers?

Post 3 or more reviews that state this and I'll stand corrected, other wise shut the fuck uo

>there are people that think this is satire

I honestly don't know how dumb you would have to be to see the Starship trooper world and think Verhoven wasn't purposefully portraying some sort of future dystopian society.

Did you not notice the obvious government propaganda? Aggressively stupid militarism? The fact that most the characters with good intentions died horribly? The fact that you didn't even have political representation unless you went through government brainwashing?

>Rico is from Argentina
>clearly white
That's how I knew Buenos Aires was an inside job. Rico was probably just some clone implanted with fake memories

All I want is a live action Starship Troopers movie with the same budget of the original.

All I get is direct to DVD Sci-Fi channel quality snoozefests that desperately try and ride the coattails of the original film to success.

I'd recommend just reading this article

overthinkingit.com/2009/11/26/starship-troopers-fascism/

Not that you will "get it" anyway

jesus christ how are people so fucking thick

seriously watch the propaganda little inserts they have

my fucking 12 year old cousin understand this shit

The film failed as a satire piece and only made the war machine look fucking awesome.

those are clearly propaganda for the population. of course they are over the top. But they don't mean the entire movie is satire.

>Starship Troopers is a deliberately dumb action movie where the heroes dress up kind of like Nazis and fight a retarded war because they feel like it.

Did you just not read my post at all? This is exactly the point.
>why is it good?
Read the fucking post
>Where lesser films would have winked and nodded at the audience, star ship troopers place it deliciously straight. It subverts propaganda films as well as satire itself by walking the line between it.

If you can't appreciate a film that does something almost completely unique in all of film making I'm sorry for you.

This always bugged me. The enemy is a bug. It has no hands.

not him but there's no actual evidence, the corniness is simply because it's a b film

>Verhoeven uses some fascist imagery like the SS uniforms and the design of their parliament thing being very reichstag-like but I don't think that any of the examples you're bringing up are coherent enough to constitute satire. Starship Troopers is a deliberately dumb action movie where the heroes dress up kind of like Nazis and fight a retarded war because they feel like it.
The bug society, the fat thinking bug supported by the lower caste bugs and protected bt the warrior bugs is a direct commentary on modern society and no one got it. look at the badges, specifically the badge for the MI, it loojs like a bug. Threre are other examples.

>but you would only get it if you were half way intelligent

I guess that's the real problem

There are also thick fucks who miss the point entirely and then brag about that fact on the internet

Not him, but I think you're pretty dumb too.

>miss the point that wasn't there

>same budget of the original
user look up how much this movie cost to make and how much it made

I read your post and it's as unhelpful and badly written now as it was 10 minutes ago.
>central concept
Explain what you think is the central concept of Starship Troopers. I know that you wrote 'satire of fascism and propaganda' but what the hell does that mean to you and why does it make the movie worth watching.

> the fat thinking bug supported by the lower caste bugs and protected bt the warrior bugs is a direct commentary on modern society and no one got it
Unless you can show me Paul Verhoeven saying this I don't buy it. And even if he did I don't see what the hell difference that would make to anything.

>The film failed as a satire piece and only made the war machine look fucking awesome.

Pretty much

> Look how awful the military industrial complex is
> Look at this rich kid who has no drive and doesn't know what to do with his life
> Watch as he finds his purpose in the mobile infantry
> See as he builds bonds with his fellow troopers that will last forever
> Gaze as he goes from trust fund twat suckling on the teat of his parent's wealth to a self made soldier who has made it his personal responsibility to safeguard his planet from an alien menace while finding personal satisfaction
> Be jealous as he gets to fuck Denise Richards AND Dina Meyer holy shit

This.

Whatever the directors intentions, he still eneded up making something that appeals to a larger audience. Maybe he was forced to make it more of a standard action flick by the production company, but either way, the satire doesn't really get in the way of the action or establishing protagonists the audience likes. But then again, some of these directors like to make things that right leaning people enjoy, even if they secretly see it themselves as right wing satire.

>it's a b film

You don't know what a b film is

Starship troopers had a $100 million dollar with some amazing cgi and practical effects especially for its day.

>But they don't mean the entire movie is satire.

user...

ST: Invasion was great. Not as good as the original, but miles better than 2 or 3.
I just watched Traitor of Mars and holly fuck. The graphics and animation are improved in most cases, but in some scenes it's so bad that I've no idea how they fucked it up. Like pretty much any scene where the geeky officer is panicking look like GMOD parodies. Or there are a few scenes where the characters look like they are walking before a greenscreen. But overall they did improve on the CGI. The thing that bugged me the most in Invasion was how the bugs in close ups had these really realistic skin textures and it looked out of place.
The story, plot, dialogue and characters were shit though, totally anime tier. Although it gives more credibility to the "Buenos Aires was an inside job" theories.

Starship Troopers was the movie you bought to show off your brand new DVD player and 5.1 home theater speakersystem back in 1998.

This reiterates what I've been saying, I said most critics got it wrong. The article also goes into further reasons why this film is subversive. Thanks for the read

>the true love of his life dies
>his whole family is exterminated
>hes going to live a life of constant stress from losing friends and comrades to an unending war

his life is legitimately shit now

Carmen was the true love of his life, Diz was just the friend that had a huge crush on him for years that he had to constantly friendzone.

Why is any movie worth watching dip shit? It's entertaining and hilarious Some of my thoughts about a particular scene, want me to go through each scene and point out the jokes for you dumb?

The central concept is riding the line between propaganda and satire. It's not completely satirical, nor is is completely propaganda. The mix makes it unique among all of films and something different to watch. It's simply a good movie but good for semi complex reasons.

I've now explained it two different ways and I'm sorry if you are to fucking dumb to understand it.

>some sort of future dystopian society.
I'm not actually sure I would describe it that way. Obviously military bureaucracy being a clusterfuck is a given in any society, but the civilian life depicted in the movie seems quite pleasant and completely devoid of Orwellian overtones.

Also not him, but you're delusional.

you gotta be fuckin kidding me, it was satire of the american dream and the horrors of youth sacraficing their good life for a military life you absolute mongoloid

>Why is any movie worth watching dip shit? It's entertaining and hilarious
I agree completely. I'm . I love the movie to death, I'm only arguing with the underage fedoralords who think it's some kind of cutting-edge social satire or something.
>it's not completely satirical, nor is it completely propaganda
I'd say that it's none of either and a good movie for blindingly obvious reasons.
>tfw to unintelligent to argue with user the genius.

>Starship Troopers
>The Fifth Element
>Face/Off
>Men in Black
>Austin Powers
>Con Air
>Liar Liar
>I know what you did last summer

I want to go back and live in 1997 forever.

I mean, you are wrong and you seem pretty tone deaf if you can't see the obvious tone the movie is going for. The satire isn't particularly cutting edge but the way it plays it so straight makes it unique.

It's a good movie for obvious reasons, but the thread isn't about that. It's the misreading of the film by critics who shit on the movie for being propaganda when it clearly was poking fun.

Carmen made it clear she didn't even like him
By the end he starts to actually like Diz because he sees her for a good fit for him

This is valid criticism

Starship Troopers is a fucking masterpiece.

Paul Verhoeven is amazing and he has put out some awesome scifi films like Robocop and Total Recall.

I think a lot of people cannot appreciate his sense of humor or judge his films too harshly without considering how groundbreaking they were for their time.

>gee why is my purposely artifical and rediculous propaganda film have paper thin characters and almost video game like environments

Gee I wonder

You're one of those fucking idiots who can't accept what Starship Troopers is and insists it's just a dumb action movie regardless of what the director said and regardless of the glaring evidence, why are you cunts in every Starship Troopers thread

>is the massive misreading of this film by the movie critic establishment solid proof most critics are fucking retards?
That's far from the worst example

The irony being that it was the government that disabled the military's hand, sending ground-troops in to be massacred rather than pushing the button.

This movie is special because it was the first times I got to see penor on screen.

the hand is the US military in 1964 and the knife is Robert "Rolling Blunder" McNamara?

>I honestly don't know how dumb you would have to be to see the Starship trooper world and think Verhoven wasn't purposefully portraying some sort of future dystopian society.

the most dystopian thing about it was an attack on earth by aliens, not the culture lol


>Did you not notice the obvious government propaganda?
verhouven loved to use fake tv commercials and propaganda clips. it kind of made the film like a USO documentary of a war that followed a group of characters where it is more hopeful in the beginning and more grim near the end.

the movie was first and foremost about the horrors of war/violence with dark comedy.

Aggressively stupid militarism? The fact that most the characters with good intentions died horribly? The fact that you didn't even have political representation unless you went through government brainwashing?

Arcturian here. This movie was just out of place for the time. It wasn't as funny as it could be in a time of great comedies. It wasn't as fun as of ID4. It was also very lefty.

Always amazed this movie came out before 9/11. Gets the mindless jingoism of America so perfectly

Really gay.

Robbie S did nothing wrong

Dude casper is hot and he aged better than both those cunts
I'd still jump his bones

To the retard arguing that the film is openly dystopian
>If I tell the world that a right-wing, fascist way of doing things doesn't work, no one will listen to me. So I'm going to make a perfect fascist world: everyone is beautiful, everything is shiny, everything has big guns and fancy ships, but it's only good for killing fucking bugs!"
- Verhoeven
He even admits that he made the world a fascist utopia. Theres no elements of a dystopian future in the film.
If the fucking director of the original total recall and robocop wanted to put dystopian elements into ST then he would have. Its not like its something that hes not good at.
Book>Film anyway. its a great movie but he should of called it something else to allow a real ST movie to be made