why do people have such a hard time filling in the blanks in this movie? Why do people have such a hard time accepting that Batman didn't know Superman had a human identity when they plainly say he thinks he is an alien menace and when there have been plenty of comics where he doesn't know his identity right away (like New Frontier)? Why do people feel the need to see every single second that happens between scenes or its head canon?
I thought it was a pretty good movie, people trash on it too hard.
>Batman didn't know Superman had a human identity WORLD'S GREATEST DEFECTIVE
Jayden Howard
thats another thing, why do people hate that scene? Its a pretty cool little parallel between the characters thats never been used before and i thought it was a good way of Bruce to see himself/humanity in Clark, by the fact that he wants to save a "Martha" which has been fueling Bruce's whole crusade.
Hunter Martinez
Holy shit this movie was so awful it's not even funny
Hunter Gonzalez
And? Does a detective need to know everything about everyone? Plus they say he was blinded by rage, I dont really see the problem....
Liam Gonzalez
>Snyderverse Thread #2567 >This has been going on for 3 and a half years.
Henry Gomez
then why doesnt he know Joker's identity in the comics? Or Superman's in New Frontier? Or Superman's identity when they first meet in the comics?
David Moore
It's dumb, and it's horribly written. From the way the scene is presented and everything that could have been done prevent it from ever taking place to the fact that it's forced that Superman calls his mother Martha instead of Mom. It doesn't even stands the slightest scrunity.
Noah Murphy
maybe if someone just gave some straight answers instead of memes.....
Jack Cook
how is it forced though? He knows Bruce thinks he is an alien and saying "save my mom" wont really narrow down who is in trouble or who to save.....
also explain, in detail, how its horribly written and not just "I DIDNT LIKE HOW THE PLOT WENT!"
William Ramirez
thats what it was supposed to be, most people do in fact understand its intent
but sadly concept and execution are not always related
MARTHAAAAAA
Gavin Young
You've gotten straight answers, you just won't accept them.
Camden Davis
The movie would have never been able to please everyone unless they did something really by the books. Snyder went experimental and of course the fanboys freaked out in response. The movie had the highest expectations to live up to, on par with Ep7 or Ep1 I suppose before people knew that would be terrible.
Joseph Long
If Lois was able to figure out who he was by using google then there should be no excuse why Bruce couldn't when he is a much smarter person.
Michael Cruz
>to the fact that it's forced that Superman calls his mother Martha instead of Mom. It doesn't even stands the slightest scrunity.
Why would Superman, an alien, ask his prejudiced killer to save his moments, when moments earlier he was shit-talking his alien parents? Superman would just be giving Batman a new target after his death.
Superman tried to appeal to Batman's sense of vigilantism and care for his fellow human being, by asking him to save a poor unaffiliated woman named Martha.
It was Lois that fucked up the plan and explained that this Martha was actually Superman's mom.
Ryan Cook
It's the most retarded reason ever for stopping the most retarded movie fight in history.
Levi Allen
its retarded that Batman, who thinks Superman is an alien menace, realizes he is just human? character growth is retarded?
Carter Cook
In the first picture Batman is talking about Superman's alien parents.
In the second picture Batman decided to help after going through a PTSD moment where he realized he was acting the same as his parents killers and learning that Superman's human mother who share names with his own mother was in danger.
Adrian Kelly
>Does a detective need to know everything about everyone? duh. he's a detective, he investigates.
"know thy enemy" he should have tried to find out as much as he can about Superman, but then Zack won't have his "DO YOU BLEED" moments.
I don't read comics, but in the cartoons he figured it out minutes after they had met.
Easton Kelly
how was the execution bad? Superman's possible dying words are pleading to save a human and someone he loves, seems pretty Superman to me. Batman, who often gets too zealous and goes overboard, realizes two people can work together instead of fighting each other (like he literally just did with Clayface in Detective Comics and kinda did with Superman in New Frontier). Seems all good.
Kevin Russell
Bad filmmaking isn't experimentation.
Parker Price
Batman didn't cared to learn about Superman's identity because he thought he knew all there was to know about Superman and because his desire was just to kill the guy.
Eli Moore
a picture that misses a key part of Batman's character arc isnt a straight answer...
and just saying something is shit without an explanation isnt an answer either.
Nolan James
>"know thy enemy" he should have tried to find out as much as he can about Superman, but then Zack won't have his "DO YOU BLEED" moments.
Batman was basing his own misgivings unto Superman and hating Superman for it. He was blind by self-loathing and hatred. He thought he knew Superman well, because he could see himself in Superman.
That's why Batman didn't investigated about Superman's whole life. He just wanted to learn about the means to kill him.
Dylan Morris
Lois found it out by following a hunch and happening to run into him. Batman didnt care or think he had a secret identity. Why is that so hard to accept/understand?
Charles Brown
>realizes he is just human? So is the Joker and most of the people he kills on a daily basis. The entire point of Batman not liking Superman dealt with Superman's destructive power and pretty much having no one to keep him in check, and then The Flash made Bruce doubledown on killing Superman before he does something horrible. Having a mother named Martha wouldn't change any of this.
Retard.
Adam Harris
I've only seen it once but I thought it was fine.
Xavier Ward
That's dumb, even from a detective standpoint. If he was going to try and kill him he should've found out everything he could about him because he's an alien that can level a city to the ground.
Hunter Richardson
seems pretty stupid. I'd expect that out of a 20 something Batman. an older Batman should be more wiser about the world and life.
maybe they should have made Batman younger and prone to making judgments based on his emotions instead of being rational.
Mason Jenkins
see We've been over this shit, you just have an autistic need to defend shitty movies.
Joshua Rivera
arguing about execution is a fools errand, since there is no accounting for taste, the best we can hope to do is count how many people liked it, and how many didnt
most people dont know why they like or not like something, usually they go with feeling, this is important since movies are an inherently emotional experience, not a logical one
Jaxon Richardson
You think that because you're an idiot.
Asher Butler
>Batman didn't cared to learn about Superman's identity because he thought he knew all there was to know
Obviously wrong and stupid decision right? I mean the POLICE and the GOVERNAMENT check these things out to get terrorists.
Why Batman wouldn't do basic research, apart from plot induced stupidity?
There are inumerous advantages to it.
Samuel Wright
I fucking hate all of you. I hate you for starting this bait thread, and I hate you for responding to it like I am now. DCEU, capeshit, whatever, it ruined this goddamn board. Even Sup Forums is sick of this shit, we've become worse than Sup Forums in fact.
Jayden Taylor
It's awful. The lead-up to the scene fails in virtually every respect. But the scene itself fails by Superman using the name “Martha.”
Why would he use her name and not say, “Save my mom”? Why would asking Batman to save a mother from death not carry the same weight? I'd venture to say it would carry more, because Batman should see anyone tossing out the word “Martha,” apropos of nothing said to this point, to be a potential distraction, whereas asking to save a mother is the kind of thing someone could reasonably say at that moment.
Also, there's no reason for Superman to believe the word “Martha” would have any impact on Batman, while mentioning a mother could, because (in theory) everyone has a mother. Martha only works because Snyder needs it to, not because it does. And that's why it's rightly mocked.
I think the whole thing falls down when Superman fails to simply ask Batman for his help to save his mother, and when Batman threatens, Superman mo ves in to fight/be harmed rather than fly above until Batman calms down. But if Superman didn't do that, we wouldn't have been able to see a kewl, X-Treme bad-ass fight!
This movie is indefensible.
Samuel Taylor
Batman in this movie lost a Robin, lost his faith in himself as a hero and feel guilty for the Metropolis thing.
He's an emotional wreck.
Nathaniel Baker
>why do people have such a hard time filling in the blanks in this movie? Why do people have such a hard time accepting that Batman didn't know Superman had a human identity when they plainly say he thinks he is an alien menace and when there have been plenty of comics where he doesn't know his identity right away (like New Frontier)? Why do people feel the need to see every single second that happens between scenes or its head canon? Because the movie does an absolutely shit job at making us care about it. That's the alpha and omega of it. There is no suspension of disbelief, there is no immersion into the story, there is no investment into the characters. The natural response to that is to nitpick the shit out of it.
Chase Nguyen
God, I'm just sick of these threads. Same thing every time. Haters bring up some valid flaws, supporters refute those with equally valid responses, back and forth, everyone's a dick. I love the movie to death but y'all are always doing the most.
Daniel Barnes
Because he is insane retard in BvS, obviously. >can't keep secret identity literally from everyone >can't into detective work >easy to manipulate >was VERY lucky that Superman is ignorant and arrogant retard who can't dodge slow grenade. >was VERY lucky that Superman throwed him in EXECT building where he buried his spear >spitten on his vows to kill few mercenaries, but haven't killed Joker and Harley after Robin's murder Zack just really. I mean REALLY hates Superman and Batman.
Charles Bell
Literally no reason why he couldn't have done this. In Man of Steel he masters his super hearing by focusing on his mother's voice.
Fuck Snyder, fuck Goyer, fuck Terrio.
Aaron Davis
HOLLY SHIT
You are this patethic Snydercuck that went insane on the other day!
lets just watch Batman/Superman: World finest from the DCAU
Ryan Cox
>supporters refute those with equally valid responses Headcanon bullshit isn't valid, Snyderfag.
Justin Wood
>Also, there's no reason for Superman to believe the word “Martha” would have any impact on Batman
Superman knew that Batman was Bruce Wayne.
Elijah Edwards
Lois pussy changed his priorities, mate. Now he only listens to Lois heart.
Eli Peterson
Not enough of a paranoid to investigate the guy identical to Superman who hang around the same girl.
Christopher Carter
>TELL THAT TO ZOD'S SNAPPED NECK Jesus, Snyder, was that necessary?
Connor Gomez
Where Batman cucks Superman and teachers him how to be a better hero?
Michael Rivera
Just like in the comics, you pleb.
Chase Hernandez
Superman have a different eye color when he uses his Clark Kent persona. That changes everything.
Adam Sanders
Luthor was even more stupid by bringing his mother FROM KANSAS, to right before Superman is fighting.
Its obvious that it was done just so Batman can save her, even if make no sense to bring her there.
Evan Cox
That's retarded.
Even after he already met Lois in Man of Steel, he still had his "homing beacon" on Ma Kent when Zod went to the farm.
Benjamin Miller
it also shows batman doing detective work
Ethan Ross
Why is the trolling today so piss-weak and obvious?
Dylan Garcia
Batman never fucked Lois in the comics. He'd never do this to Clark. YOU SHUT YOUR WHORE MOUTH!
Matthew Gomez
Because like anime, movies are now being made by people who "like" movies instead of people who are passionate about making films
That's why all movies today are remakes/revivals of old franchises. No one knows how to make something new or they're too afraid to so they just play it safe
And that's why 90% of anime is slice of life garbage
Michael Ward
Contrary to what you DCEUfags say the vast majority of people understood all this stuff perfectly well.....it's just that everyone with taste and standards thought it was stupid as shit.
Parker Cox
Its an actual autist.
Here, read:
Aiden Torres
>implying Also he did. In new52
Jose Gomez
You have a dude who is, in your opinion, deserving of destruction because of a 1% chance that he might destroy humanity and you stop killing him just because he just so happened to utter out his mother's name, rather than saying "mom" like most normal people.
The entire climax of the film depended on Supes calling out his mother's first name and Batman not simply killing him before he has a chance to utter anything.
Colton Walker
Dude, in MoS he had just gotten to know Lois and his claim on her pussy wasn't strong.
In BvS he has been taping that shit every day as if her pussy exuded special air properties that he needs to breathe to remain alive. He'd never let such a prime pussy like that get killed.
Have you ever been in a relationship with a hot girl? You'll forget you mother ever existed very fast. You'll forget your whole life existed before that point. That's what a good pussy does to you.
Or Lois in DCEU is actually Poison Ivy's cousin and her pussy leaks a mind control drug that is specially effective on kryptonians. God knows Faora was all over that.
Charles Edwards
No, he didn't. Shut up. You lying whore.
Jonathan Rivera
>you stop killing him just because he just so happened to utter out his mother's name, rather than saying "mom" like most normal people. Trigger words often work like that, and it WAS a trigger word.
Ayden Peterson
Dropping shit onto a turkey sandwich is not experimentation.
Jace Cruz
Well, he goes murderous insane if she dies....maybe she IS Poison Ivy, and is using her powers to make Super super protective of only her.
Michael Rodriguez
Since when? When was this ever established in the film?
Isaiah Clark
>character growth is retarded?
kek, you pull anything reaching that hard?
Camden Thompson
When they meet each other. Superman picks Bruce talking to Alfred.
Asher Scott
He knew, I just forgot when.
We are also never getting Clark Kent back.
Aiden Powell
Have you read Batman/Superman? He fucked her just like in DCAU.
Isaac Perez
Why didn't we explore this shit in its own independent film? We get like one line implying Robin's death is what broke Batman but if you weren't familiar with the Batman mythos, you wouldn't know who Robin was and what they meant to him.
BvS should've been something that happened after a standalone Batman movie, Tony Stark and Capt. America didn't fight one another immediately after the Avengers were formed and there's too much info that wasn't properly explained during the movie.
Nathaniel Rivera
The party scene he overheard the undercover talk but stopped to save the girl in the fire.
Easton Davis
so then why doesn't Batman know Joker's secret identity?
James Green
>haha ur just dumb 4 disagreeing with me Nice argument there, user-friend.
Robert Green
so you are saying that you cant actually argue why its bad execution? and one can completely and logically talk about execution. Thats why we have schools that teach people how to make film effectively, because there are techniques that are more or less universally good. Not to say that when new things are done there isnt backlash at first of course.
So why was BvS executed badly?
Hudson Jackson
It's contrived as fuck and only worked out because Snyder willed it to be so. If Supes called out "mom" or said any other word instead of "Martha," he'd be dead a lot sooner than what we saw in the movie.
Christian Parker
okay, so why doesnt he try and find out Joker's identity?
Aiden Allen
Post the pages, you liar. You twister of truths.
John Garcia
He tried asking Batman for help.
And at the end he simply was desparate for someone to save his mother. If there was any chance Batman would decide to save Martha after he killed Clark then Clark had to take it.
Kayden Johnson
So Bruce talking to his employee automatically means that he's Batman?
Dylan Hill
Writters have no idea what is his real identity. It's part of the "charm" even if makes no sense.
But didn't he asked to Metron's Chair?
Cameron Clark
you could go check all those reviews, roughly 4 out of 5 are in the negative
Dominic Wood
but why should Batman think Superman has a secret identity? What reason is given in BvS for Batman to think he has one at all and isn't just Superman 24/7? Doomsday doesn't have a secret identity, and he doesnt care about learning Joker's so....
Hudson Ross
Even though he knew that Batman was a dangerous psychotic who had no reason to help him save his mother?
He could've just as easily decided to fuck off or even finish the job himself and it wouldn't have been out of character since Batman in this universe uses guns and kills mooks by the handful.
Nathan Taylor
>He tried asking Batman for help.
Like an idiot would.
I hope Deadpool 2 mocks his attempt of warning Batman in some way.
Logan Jones
>can't keep secret identity literally from everyone Literally only Superman and Lex know his identity.
>can't into detective work figures out where an unregistered secret boat is, figures out it isn't a boat and is actually lex, and figures out how to get kryptonite and how to kill Superman. More detective work than he has done in film before.
>easy to manipulate but he was manipulated into accomplishing the goal he wanted anyway....
>was VERY lucky that Superman is ignorant and arrogant retard who can't dodge slow grenade. Superman had no reason to think the grenade would hurt him you dummy
>was VERY lucky that Superman throwed him in EXECT building where he buried his spear He literally set it up that way, he baited Superman to come at him from a certain direction with the turrets and whatever. No different than the plot armor every bat-plot needs. >spitten on his vows to kill few mercenaries, but haven't killed Joker and Harley after Robin's murder Harley and Joker were in Arkham for the duration of BvS. And he just started man-slaughtering because of Superman not the mercenaries themselves dummy. Like how in Dark Knight Strikes Again he has Lex killed and kills Dick Grayson because the circumstances are so extreme.
Blake Allen
Nah, just read Batman/Superman# 13-15
Charles Perry
how does that disprove anything? You said he doesnt kill Joker because he is human, so by realizing the same thing about Superman he doesn't kill him.... so you agree with me?
Joseph Barnes
>but why should Batman think Superman has a secret identity?
He destroyed a satellite that was made to track him.
He doesn't even need to look for secret identity, just look for where he lives or daily routine - extremely useful things - and he would have discovered it.
Alexander Clark
Because for all he knew, he could've been masquerading as a civilian the whole time, which is possible since that's EXACTLY WHAT HE FUCKING DOES!
Also, Doomsday is a monster that was literally born in the last 20 minutes of the movie and Joker's identity is the Joker, he can't turn it off and he doesn't bother hiding who he is in public.
James Young
he calls him Bruce when approaching him after meeting with Lex on the rooftop too
Oliver Gonzalez
>figures out where an unregistered secret boat is,
Nothing says that was unregistered.
Austin Ramirez
Batman had a reputation for being a hero in Gotham, he goes and investigates this as Clark Kent. The citizens just say he recently (since Superman showed up) started going crazy.
He knows Bruce wants to save people, even if at the moment he has gone bad. Superman believes man can be good again. How did you not understand it? Bruce flat out says it.
Jeremiah Brown
nah I cared about it just fine, sorry you suck at watching movies
Daniel White
how is it headcanon anymore than assuming Doctor Strange's cape is magic despite it never being flat out said and it not being magic in the comics?
Benjamin Morales
>More detective work than he has done in film before. Yet he still didn't know that Lex was manipulating him from the get-go, or that he was connected to the senate bombing, or the checks, or anything substantial that could've made us avoid the entire debacle.
And for the record, Batman does plenty of research on his foes, we're talking about a dude who has a database on every meta-human he has encountered during his run in the Justice League and in Gotham, yet for some reason, he couldn't figure out that Superman had a secret identity, or a family, or a home, or anything else that wouldn't helped him ultimately kill Superman.
Easton Thompson
What you are writting has nothing to do with what I said.
Are you autistic? Why you quoted me?
Joshua Watson
there was a kill order to just instantly kill her should Superman come close.... thats like asking why didnt Superman save both Lois and the world in the reeve's movie despite being shown to be fast enough to do it (since he went back in time). Why did he have to travel back in time if he was fast enough to save both anyway?