Nick pulls Harvey Beaks off network to spite CH Greenblatt despite barely airing it in the first place

>Nick pulls Harvey Beaks off network to spite CH Greenblatt despite barely airing it in the first place
>CN burning off all of Uncle Grandpa after laying off the entire team and pretending they were renewed for more seasons when really they just split the episodes
>Disney cancels Wander before the second season premieres despite having nothing else to replace it, and also denying Craig McCracken continuity in the first season even though that is what made Gravity Falls successful
>CN's horrible hiatus schedule
>TEEN TITANS GO, SPONGEBOB, FAIRLY ODDPARENTS ONLY. JUST MARATHON ONE SHOW OVER AND OVER AGAIN.
>Refuse to air Adventure Time then wonder why its season premiere got bad ratings
>Shoving Bunnicula off to Boomerang and Sonic Boom at a death time slot
>The CONSTANT new episode leaks that CN suffers from (Has that ever been patched?)
>The bullshit Nickelodeon pulled with Making Fiends and just never airing the remaining season despite it getting good ratings
>Fucking over Korra's crew with surprise renewals and budget cuts

And the list goes on and fucking on. Why do these networks have such bad practices?

My guess is that kids just don't watch much TV as they used before. You know, let's plays, kids being pulled off from childhood earlier in new generation and netflix

>Durrr so why no foccus on us?

The adult fandom of animation is still very small even with Sup Forums and tumblr. The young audience is still big enough to hold this channels like we will never be able to

because on-line streaming is replacing TV

Shows that have shit rating and don't sell merchandise means shit.
The moment you hear that a cartoon is popular with "young adults" is the moment the cartoon is doomed to fail.

Then how is it Loud House gets such good ratings that it surprises Nick. Kids will still clearly watch cartoons if a network would just air them and not sabotage the production crew or schedule.

Because the business people don't watch there shows or give a shit. They only know and care about the business, and they don't see the potential a show has to be good, they see the potential a show has to be profitable. Whether the teams they work with are difficult to deal with, or they have more attractive shows lined up economically, the fact of the matter is that we see these shows through the eyes of an autist while they see the shows through spreadsheets, powerpoints, and dollar signs

You forgot

>CN canceling RS despite it still being a quality show

You forgot the way CN treats every single DC show that's not TTGo.

Are you serious?

Did they really take harvey beaks off the network?

>Putting robots in disguise in a morning death time slot
>every single episode leaks before it airs
CN is a mess

>Fucking over Korra's crew with surprise renewals and budget cuts
Making them do a clipshow for a cartoon was ridiculous

>canceling

This is becoming a meme word

Everyone gets pissed off for Korra being disaster of a show but really, they were setup to fail. If they were given the same respect as when making Avatar, probably would have been a 10/10 show.

If a network decides a show is over, it's cancelled.
If the creator decides, it's ending.

Doesn't matter if the show has one season or forty, that's typically how it goes.

Avatar had its own issues with Nick, I think some of the fault is that a lot of the creative team didn't come back for Korra. Many ideas from ATLA came from Aaron Ehasz.

>Nick pulls Harvey Beaks off network to spite CH Greenblatt despite barely airing it in the first place
They insulted us otaku, it was for good reasions.
>CN burning off all of Uncle Grandpa after laying off the entire team and pretending they were renewed for more seasons when really they just split the episodes.
Most people hated that show anyway.
>Disney cancels Wander before the second season premieres despite having nothing else to replace it, and also denying Craig McCracken continuity in the first season even though that is what made Gravity Falls successful.
The sooner Iger & paul Rudish are fired the better as Lasseter id the only one doing any right to Disney.
>CN's horrible hiatus schedule.
Every US channel is like this now of days, it's why web streaming took off the way it did.
>TEEN TITANS GO, SPONGEBOB, FAIRLY ODDPARENTS ONLY. JUST MARATHON ONE SHOW OVER AND OVER AGAIN.
CN has old HB show they can air instead, Nick at this point should just close down.
>Refuse to air Adventure Time then wonder why its season premiere got bad ratings
It became Shipping Time.
>Shoving Bunnicula off to Boomerang and Sonic Boom at a death time slot
To be fare, it was for the best, also thats what you get for not getting TMS to do AOSTH 2.0 (Because... Aikatsu)
>The CONSTANT new episode leaks that CN suffers from (Has that ever been patched?)
If the shows had a actulal budget it will matter, but they don't
>The bullshit Nickelodeon pulled with Making Fiends and just never airing the remaining season despite it getting good ratings
It was garbage anyway.
>Fucking over Korra's crew with surprise renewals and budget cuts
Bryke had no reason to spend a million on Korra like they did with the first Avatar, Mir did treated to go on strike because they were not getting payed enough on Korra (book 1 was only $200,000 a episode) and after that whole Pierrot/Magic Bus/Actas mess Mir was brought back with more money with better pay at $300,000 per episode.

are you sure those ratings are kids?

It's book 4 with it's $90,000 per episode budget is when things gone south, and Voltron:LD is only making the budget worse ($90,000 a episode at best, $60,000 a episode on average).

Ha, this. Loud House is watched by waifu faggots first, kids second.

>quality
Pfft

>And the list goes on and fucking on. Why do these networks have such bad practices?
zero cometition. in the video game industry if a company acts like a dick, it results in them getting pirated games and bad PR. Cartoon networks don't have to worry about piracy since their audience base is too young to pirate.

>implying it wasn't a husk of it's former self that needed to be euthanized

>Cartoon networks don't have to worry about piracy since their audience base is too young to pirate.
I was pirating back when I was 12, and that was in like, 2005.

I would say we as a collective here on Sup Forums should head to social media and fight for these shows to be brought back but you faggots don't even watch the shows on their peoper channels. Streaming and torrenting doesn't help keep a show on the air

>Why do these networks have such bad practices?

Because having the network be both distributor and producer creates conflicts of interest. Ideally, TV networks ought to sell air time to individual studios/production companies. But this is not what we ended up with.

Show runners should accept the realities of network cartoons in this era, treat every season as their last, and make season finales that satisfy.

Owning content opens up a more lucrative revenue stream than renting others' properties to broadcast. The problem is that the artists don't have enough cash in the game to affect how their creations are presented.

Letting the networks manage the money is a short-term solution for content creators, but it takes away long-term control (and ownership) for their content.

A perfect example of content creators taking control of what they make from media moguls is United Artists. Three of the wealthiest actors of their era (Charlie Chaplin, Mary Pickford, and Douglas Fairbanks) and one director/producer (D. W. Griffith) form their own production company and leave the iron fists of the studio system behind to make and own their own works.

Until animation artists can do this (and still make a living at it), they will be at the mercy of the media titans who control access to their audience. Even if they do this, there is no guarantee that they have the fiscal sense to properly manage anything they create.

This.Every single time, same with comics.

>hur durr why does good stuff get cancelled?
> anyway, here's a download link for all of said good stuff.

I would, but first I'd need a green card.

Regular networks somehow manage, no?

I just miss fried dynamite.

>cancelled

So do we just call any show getting an ending "cancelled" now

>TMS
Opinion discarded.

Are they really that big of a population though?

You mean the previously planned series finale which the crew of the show had already drew up a story for?
In that case, it's not cancelled, it ended naturally

That's the thing though
>CN didn't decide the show is over

We always talk about CN's eras and where it all went wrong.

what about Nickelodeon and Disney XD? I never followed those closely so I wouldn't know

Well Tumblr still buys coloring books, that's an untouched market

Woah, there was an entire other season of Making Fiends?

Can I buy it on DVD or something? I loved that show when it was on the web, and the Nickelodeon version hit its stride near the end of what I saw.

I can't imagine that Hot Topic shit doesn't sell at a huge profit margin. Nick's still selling Invader Zim shit to this day, the young lolrandom/tumblr crowd has to throw away their allowance on something.

>Nick pulls Harvey Beaks off network to spite CH Greenblatt despite barely airing it in the first place
He started a social media bridge burning campaign only after it was pulled, which made things worse for him. It got pulled because its a ratings pit.
>CN burning off all of Uncle Grandpa after laying off the entire team and pretending they were renewed for more seasons when really they just split the episodes
>Disney cancels Wander before the second season premieres despite having nothing else to replace it, and also denying Craig McCracken continuity in the first season even though that is what made Gravity Falls successful
No idea about WoY's continuity thing, but I doubt that would've made that show any more successful. It just didn't click. Neither did UG.
>CN's horrible hiatus schedule
>TEEN TITANS GO, SPONGEBOB, FAIRLY ODDPARENTS ONLY. JUST MARATHON ONE SHOW OVER AND OVER AGAIN.
Those shows get good rerun numbers.
>Refuse to air Adventure Time then wonder why its season premiere got bad ratings
Because that show has gotten shit and is a fine example of "successful only on premiere day".
>Shoving Bunnicula off to Boomerang and Sonic Boom at a death time slot
Who gives a shit about Sonic, that diaper fur bait needs to go away forever. Sucks for Bunnicula though.
>The CONSTANT new episode leaks that CN suffers from (Has that ever been patched?)
Doesn't really make too huge of a difference. It's probably CN themselves leaking it since their target audiences don't download and they rely heavily on the internet for word of mouth.
>Fucking over Korra's crew with surprise renewals and budget cuts
Korra flopped on its own because the first two seasons were terrible.

this. things can't stay on the air if they aren't actually being watched on tv

>coloring books, that's an untouched market

I wouldn't say that's untouched considering I keep on seeing commercials for "adult coloring books" that are supposed to reduce stress and shit. Just two payments of $19.99 plus shipping and handling.

>Streaming and torrenting doesn't help keep a show on the air

I don't have a nielsen box. So what effect does it have if I watch something on tv when it actually airs or on some streaming site later?

Ssssh, most of Sup Forums doesn't know that's how ratings work! Let them think them tuning in has an impact...

The best way to support a show is a couple of days after you watch it in the convenient way, stream it off of the official site (if they have it up) with the tab muted. They still get the pageview and ad revenue and your view is actually counted, unlike on traditional broadcast.

Guess what, Networks have always been shit and always fucking over shows/ creators

Just with the internet you find out a lot more of the behind the scenes reasons and realize how retarded execs are

anyone in the industry could have told you it was like this decades ago

>who gives a shit about sonic.
If no one gave a shit, we wouldn't be in our 2nd season of Boom. Or still be dealing with Sonic comics.

Newsflash, if you have any kind of cable box, it can tell what you're watching.

Nielsen boxes are still used because they are far more accurate.

>implying

>Regular networks somehow manage, no?

You mean networks that are not animation-centric? Regular TV shows get cancelled even more often for frivolous reasons, because the turn around time on those things are shorter.

This. Networks that fail to adapt will soon be phased out. Its one of the reasons a premium channel like HBO is still as popular as it is while the other premium movie channels are getting left behind.

no one's watched it in like 2 years

Ratings show otherwise

Nick's comfortable with just Spongebob, he's their cash cow.

If that means cutting off a cartoon with tons of potential (such as Harvey, and Loud) then so be it.
That doesn't mean I agree with them, I wish they'd give newer shows a chance, experiment a little bit and see what sticks. But, with how they've acted these past few years it's going to be a while before Nick actually cares about sharing some air time.

As for CN, I like their practice more than Nick's, but it still falls flat a bit.
They at least experiment, and even show off pilots on their network.
But, as for last and this year, I'm boggled that they give TTGO so much air time.

It's probably one of their least favored shows, and even with the DC brand I can't see it making them that much money (toy sales included).

>quality show
Not since season 5 started

There are many reasons why, even though I want to do an animated television series, I won't.

The audiences, executives, and even many creators don't expect or believe that animation could be any better other than dumb comedies for dumb children. The absolute bullshit many cartoon creators have to put up with Nickelodeon, Disney Channel, and Cartoon Network is proof that those channels, despite being children's channels, don't actually care about animation and wouldn't blink an eye if, say, animation was banned from planet earth.

Disney Channel would rather focus on its sitcoms, rather than its cartoons, despite being from a company known for quality animation. Same with Nickelodeon (unless your show is Spongebob). And I bet that if any show on CN real actually took off, CN would dump cartoons and show nothing but crap reality TV, just like the rest of cable. And unless you want your show to be South Park clone #387, you wouldn't stand a chance on any other network.

In theatres, the only company that has any quality and effort to its animated films is Disney. that's it. Sure the movies they create aren't all that revolutionary, but those movies look like Citizen Kane compared the shit like The Emoji Movie or Boss Baby or Minions. Animation is even duller in theatres than on television nowadays, so much so that even stuff like Sasuage Party seems like a gift from god, even though that film's just another Family Guy wannabe, just on the big screen.

Face it, I rather get a colonoscopy from Freddy Kruger than to spend time creating any sort of animated work and getting shat on by everyone from moral guardians to network executives. With all of this shit in the industry, I won't bother trying to step foot in it. The state of animation could be so much better, but it won't, because very few people truly desire to make it better. Everyone else, at best, will regard it as trash, and with shit like this, would you really blame them?

>user tries to justify why he can't get a job in the animation industry to make himself feel better that he's probably faced rejection for years and isn't even close to getting his own show.

You went out of your way to not mention Regular Show's mistreatment, huh?

No

You do know TMS did the best episodes of AOSTH right?

Also they did the good episodes of Aikatsu and the only 2 episodes of Space Dandy worth a damn (episodes 2 & 17).

Also they did the best show of this year (Nobunaga's Shinobi).

Regular Show got 8 seasons and is getting a proper finale. What mistreatment? Because they won't air a 3 year old special for Thanksgiving? Or because they're marathoning all the new eps?

Adventure Time is getting way worse treatment and that was their fucking flagship show. RS is sitting pretty for a show that relies heavily on a formula that got old after 2 seasons.

Who could tell? I haven't seen it on TV once.

Nick's golden age started in 1991 and ended in the mid 00s

DXD was never good

>AT and RS were CN's flagship shows
>rarely air anymore because YOUR NEW FAVORITE SHOW

TTG is the cancer killing CN, I swear on me mum.

you don't need one

making fiends was really good, what happened

>Ideally, TV networks ought to sell air time to individual studios/production companies.
Japan isn't doing much better, really.

He wasn't addressing people who can't do much, though.

To be fare, TV Tokyo, TV Asahi & NHK do have input in the shows they air.

Have you forgotten Regular Show received a theatrical release? If anything, CN has been too generous to RS.

>Japan isn't doing much better, really.

I wasn't making that comparison, but Japan is still getting several dozen new shows and originals IPs each season, plus merchandising, plus an industry that's still largely domestic. I would take their "not much better" any day if I could.

>It got pulled because its a ratings pit.

That's retarded. The show got less airtime in a year than sponge gets in a week and is almost never advertised. Of course the rare occasions where it actually gets shown it's gonna have a hard time getting up to the same numbers as shows that have consistent airings and time to develop larger fanbases. Shit, Harvey was doing far better than it should have been under those circumstances.

"Well shit, the sprinter with the broken leg only came in third place. He must really suck."

I guess this will be the obligatory "Korra was a decent show post".

I wouldn't be surprised if in the future most cartoons are made for adult nerds that air on the web rather than for children. That doesn't mean they'll be quality, but...eh.

>But at least Snyder is gone!

Yeah, it definitely IS better, but the trajectory is just as bad.

I'm slightly heartened by CN's new dual senior VPs for original programming. One of them even used to work with CN's action shows. Hopefully they'll put good stuff in the pipeline.

Its been ported to Nicktoons...on weekends...once in a while.

Korra deserved it
I want to smack the cunt in charge of CN though that shit is ridiculous

Cable boxes aren't used to calculate ratings though. It's basically Nielsen families + Twitter mentions.

it's a market that only being held up by those who buy their merchandise religiously and often than not relying on their parent's money to supplement their own if they actually have a job

I'm pretty sure adults would just watch it online. The majority on Sup Forums download it off MEGA.

That's exactly why it works. It's a bunch of niche media catering to niche audiences. Costs are low enough that they don't all have to cater to the mainstream.

4000 fans can keep an anime alive. Anything under 1 million viewers here, and a show gets axed. Which one is ultimately more sustainable?

The west because the animators are able to have lives outside of cartooning.

Regular Show ending is not the problem. CN treating Regular Show like it's a fucking cancerous tumor that they have to actively destroy is the problem.

You act like it was a bad thing. You don't need a large ass crew spending disgusting amounts of money to make a good episode. Let alone overpaying retards who think they are worth more than what they really are so they can keep living in luxury.

>>which choice we have, these chanels schedules are a giant mess.

Wow, pretty rare to see someone THIS wrong on Sup Forums.

>Who gives a shit about Sonic

The people who got Boom it's 2nd season, retard.

Still weird how shows that have no merch lines at all get crap from their networks for not selling enough merch.

Did they even attempt to make any tie-ins for Wander, Uncle Grandpa, Harvey Beaks, or Bunnicula at all?

>"it got seasons and a proper finale!!"
not a proper argument when the OP is talking about AT which got 9 SEASONS and a THEATRICAL MOVIE in production.

almost 15 episodes have aired without any promotion and no one knew they were airing

Wrong, it was shown at a film festival deal or something, very low key as well.

>If anything CN has been too generous
In what single given way?

>Wrong, it was shown at a film festival deal or something

One screening at one theater is a theatrical release. RSTM got a week.

>In what single given way?

It got a theatrical release.

Does not count as a proper theatrical release, those are hardly theaters. They're just special screenings for film festival fanatics and are accompanied usually by their creators, as a special presentation. Doesn't even count as a "1 week special theatrical feature" for a limited time like some things, because it was never promoted.

Adventure Time is getting a fully endorsed far and wide theatrical release, not just some small local thing partially endorsed by CN with other works.

I don't know how you don't get this, it's not an official theatrical release, it was a specific made for TV movie and wasn't even that for a long time. CN asked if JG wanted to do one of those fake TV movies that ran 44 minutes like all those old Nickelodeon specials, but he pushed for a movie, and instead of giving him one that was special, it just counted as slots in the season. The movie wasn't a movie at all, just a long episode, in playout and in treatment. That's why the season was down by some episodes.

The shorts the show got to do didn't even count as their own thing, they were taken out of the season run.

AT's movie isn't in a Seasonal episode order, it's a special deal.

>Regular Show ending is not the problem.
Yes it is. How often do you have a cartoon that, through eight long seasons, despite its ups and downs and shit moments like any other show, is still actually really good and hasn't gone to shit?

If you have a cartoon like that on your hands it doesn't make any sense to cancel it especially when it's still pulling in good ratings.

Regular Show had at least 3 more seasons left in it if not more.

I want Stu Snyder back.

TV is dying, but they're still clinging stubbornly to the idea it'll be able to survive by ignoring competition, like it has since its begining. They'll get what they deserve.

>having a life
Haha!
Ha...aw...