This makes me so angry, we see stories like this everyday about how endemic America's opiate addiction is and how something needs to be done about it. Meanwhile a plant, Kratom, that is helping people get off addictive prescription pills and heroin is going to be banned by the DEA.
It's outrageous that they're making it schedule I meaning it has high potential for abuse and no medical benefit BUT there are numerous scientific studies proving it's effectiveness in treating addiction, chronic pain, PTSD, anxiety, depression and other beneficial physiological properties. And once it's schedule I that will make it much harder for scientific studies to actually be done on it's benefits just like marijuana.
The DEA has this misconception that it's a "legal high" like that K2 Spice or a subsitute for heroin to get high and that's it poses an imminent hazard to the public health but their evidence is horseshit. Kratom has been used for hundreds of years and not a single case of death has been attributed to Kratom alone. Kratom acts on opiate receptors to create a mild-sedative effect but it does NOT suppress the central nervous system which is what causes over doses.
Big Pharma can't patent a plant, they've been trying to synthesize Kratom's alkaloids for a while now and once Kratom is banned they'll have a financial monopoly on it, you've seen what big pharma does in this case just look at the price gouging this month on Mylan's EpiPen; and who knows what effectiveness or side effects their synthetic version might have.
The whole reason we got into this mess is because gas stations and head shops started slinging Kratom products laced with shady synthetic chemical blends. I'll be truthful and admit Kratom should be regulated as a drug not an herbal supplement to ensure people are receiving a quality product that says it is but out right making it Schedule I is ludicrous. Florida has already ruled it does not pose a danger to public health.
The bottom line is people are going to die when Kratom is banned and people return to more dangerous opiates, they already are in England and states like Alabama which have banned it.
Sup Forums this is not an issue of druggies chasing highs this is about the DEA forcing it's way into our life without due legislative process and diminishing thousands of peoples quality of life. Please sign the white house petition, write or call to your congressman and the DEA.
god dammit Sup Forums this shit is actually important
Ayden Wright
I agree, but theres nothing that can be done.
I fucking hate those people, playing ignorant. They deserve Hell, and I wish a timely death to all who were involved
Brody Reed
What kind of man talks to the DEA?
Charles Richardson
That's not entirely true, look at the history of MDMA being scheduled. Our efforts definitely are making an impact and the DEA themselves have said they are surprised by the reaction they're getting hammered with and were unaware how many people calling them benefit from Kratom for their health.
Bumping for Kratom. Still waiting for some fresh arrivals in the post.
Jose Hill
bumping because I fucking hate the DEA
Josiah Peterson
Yo fuck that "ban" bullshit. People don't realize that there are many effects of decisions, they don't think outside the box. This fight is literally a fight for what's right, not what's popular.
Christian Gutierrez
If nobody was addicted to drugs the DEA would be out of a job
Nathan Baker
bump
Julian Scott
Discuss kratom and watch battlebots now at bretty good dot com
Sebastian Brown
fuck off, junkie. no wonder your country is going to shit.
Evan Robinson
Just legalize all drugs and allow hospitals and insurance to refuse treatment for ODs. Use the tax revenue to pay for the cremation of the idiots that ODed and schools.
Noah Clark
You must be dumb, swissbro. Kratom helps junkies with their opiate withdrawals. The only reason Kratom is being banned is because the big pharma companies want to keep people on their opiate-addictive pills.
Noah Richardson
Banning drugs is just job security to them, they don't give a shit about your rights, or anything else for that matter. They're just like the BATFE, snivelling welfare-queen blowhards that don't deserve the honor of being Americans. I laugh when they get killed on the job, and I applaud anyone who dispatches them.
Recreational drug use is degenerate, but not nearly as degenerate as being a DEA agent.
>take junkies >detox followed by professionals >reintegrate into society but no, muh naturel plantz will cure me, doctors are all scammers and i know better than them because i read about the subject for five minutes in the intertubes
kys
Asher Sanchez
You applaud people who kill Americans, you're as much of a disgrace as a BLM protester who calls for police death. Fuck off to south america and renounce your citizenship before you kill yourself with that edge.
Austin Green
Kratom is in the same family as coffee. I guess coffee makes me a junkie too. Fucking kill yourselves. Keep licking boots faggots that's all you're good for. Personally I'm against the Obama administration turning innocent people into criminals and addicts. You know why? Because I'm not a cum-sucking cuck like you guys.
Charles Thompson
Haha yeah dude! Why don't we just integrate all of these chronic pain patients back into society? Its not like prescription painkillers ruin your fucking life or anything.
Sad cuck.
Andrew Kelly
It's not about getting high , in my case it's about treating my anxiety and depression and it works far better than the benzos and SSRIs they peddle out that fry your brain.
For other people it treats chronic pain like fibromyalgia, that's not being junkie.
Kayden James
we're watching blade now
Charles Sanchez
Even weed consommation is not being junkie if you suffer from Cron's desease like me...
It puts you in remission right away.
Ian Richardson
Males sense to me, I'm cool with people using drugs as long as they don't become a burden to society. The public shouldn't be responsible for adults with no self control.
Juan Martin
I hope you get hit by a bus, break all the bones in your body, get addicted to opiate pain killers and die.
Aaron Ross
yeah goy keep pushing ypur body to the limit
Oliver Rogers
t. Juan the heroin mule
Cooper Turner
>but no, muh naturel plantz will cure me, doctors are all scammers and i know better than them because i read about the subject for five minutes in the intertubes
>Kratom is in the same family as coffee. I guess coffee makes me a junkie too. you are fucking retarded, know jack shit about chemistry (as made apparent by this last comment), but think you are fit to have a discussion about chemical substances. >american education
nice argument, friendo butthurt much?
Zachary Sullivan
literally what kratom does, and probably the most effective for helping with opiate withdrawls.
Btw, it IS the closest relative of the coffee plant.
Jackson Rodriguez
I never really post. 30 years old now.
Heroin addict from ~21 to 25. Then was on suboxone for about a year. Used kratom to get off suboxone, but got horribly addicted to it.
Yeah, it's nothing close to heroin or oxys or benzos or whatever. The addiction is still very strong and the withdrawal is hell nonetheless.
I've been clean about a year sans a couple little relapses.
I think it's a good thing it's being banned. It's a bandaid for an epidemic.
We need a cure.
Brandon Harris
I really can't think of a more productive and high-functioning drug as Kratom. Even pot will get you more out of it than kratom does. It's a light opiate-like buzz similar to a Tylenol-3 with a much lower risk of dependence and some mild stimulating effects. Like a cup of coffee with a bit of painkilling effect. I'm really only passionate about it because it got my parents off of prescription painkillers after a car accident that pretty much destroyed my mothers back.
And you think you're fit to have a discussion about American drug laws when you live in fucking Switzerland. Please, enlighten us with your chemistry knowledge you fucking cuck.
Aiden Gomez
>proud cuck/lea detected There's nothing American about violently oppressing people for consuming a plant, and the people who founded this country would agree with that unanimously. If you want to live in an authoritarian shithole surrounded by dumbed-down serfs and uninspired cuckolds, there's a whole world out there for you -- but don't pretend to be an American while doing it.
The proper American response to authoritarian shitbags is a bullet and an unmarked grave.
Holy shit, I heard the swiss were raging faggots but I had no idea just how bad it was.
Liam Flores
I was on a rotation of serious antidepressants for years (even two that made me MORE suicidal while on them) until I discovered Kratom. It helped me defeat crippling alcoholism, a heroin addiction and depression basically and I honestly attribute it to saving my life.
I talked a lifelong friend into transitioning to Kratom off opiates.. and after doing the research he decided to go for it. And now it's getting banned. He's going to stock up a lot of it and transition off the drugs regardless but I feel for the countless people who were/are doing the same thing who basically will be going back to street drugs amidst the nation's largest dope crisis
The really strange thing about all this is that his father, who is a highly esteemed doctor in NYC, thinks it's a GOOD thing that Kratom is being banned. I asked him why and he said that he and other doctors were given reading material showing that the plant causes death and seizures, citing a dozen cases of people who died with Kratom AND other substances in their body- things like Heroin, Benzos, Alcohol.. etc.
When I pointed out that the media-hyped deaths all had other street drugs in their system he said that the 'research' proves the plant is just too dangerous and basically like a Narcotic! How could someone that smart buy into that crap unless he was being fed misinformation? I want to ask him for the research to see what it says since he thinks anyone who uses Kratom is basically a junkie which seems totally nuts to believe since I know he actively smokes weed, which is also a plant that people use for self treatment that is demonized by the government..
I just don't get why they're going after Kratom NOW of all times while kids are dropping like flies due to dope cut with fent and other crazy shit. I've seen firsthand how it destroys lives. And now it seems like we're gonna have a ton more relapses and ODs in the near future...
sry for the rambling. it just seems really nonsensical, sad and maddening.
Ayden Hernandez
You do realize the ban is only because a couple big pharma companies decided they wanted to make a synthetic version of kratoms actives right?
John Harris
No, an oppressive liberal government abusing its power for shekels is what gets me butthurt.
Nicholas Morales
better go online. best place is coastlinekratom.com and buykratom.us
effects vary on color(green, white, red) and area of origin(thailand, malaysia, indonesia). Some are energizing, some are sedative. ensobotanicals.com/kratom/
the effects of kratom are very similar to opiates, as are the withdrawals and such.
there are different strains which act a little differently but not to a large degree.
head shops' kratom is about 2x as expensive as online, or more.
It hits you in about 30 minutes and peaks after an hour, then dwindles for the next ~4 hours.
Taking too much makes you feel VERY ill - i think people call it the wobbles or something.
Isaiah Bennett
So that should make the ban acceptable? That big pharma decides to take away a plant from us so that they can sell us their shit? Its a profit motive.
The moral question here is: Why should they get to decide what is and what is not medicine, based on their personal profit motive?
Kayden Morales
>Laws = authoritarianism
Jesus you must have lived a sheltered life, you realize your standard of living here is better than most the world?. Did you get busted for weed in high school? The USA is not an authoritarian regime and you have nothing to fear from the dea unless you are dealing or manufacturing millions of dollars worth of drugs. Go visit north Korea if you want to see what it's like to live in a police state.
Dominic Miller
Criminally underrated.
Ayden Young
no, not really.
>Btw, it IS the closest relative of the coffee plant. again, that means nothing. two molecules can be very close and have vastly different effects. same goes for plants, genetic closeness doesn't mean what you junkies want it to mean. >And you think you're fit to have a discussion about American drug laws when you live in fucking Switzerland I'm not claiming to be an expert on american law, I'm just saying that this whole delusion is on the same level as "DUDE WEED LMAO, ITS A PLANT SO IT MUST BE GOOD FOR YOU"
>I've read about them all extensively and have first hand experience yes, and i'm a dog.
t. 60% white, country in a steady downhill path for half a century and no end in sight, originators of SJW bullshit, and last but not least, shart in mart >REEEEEE KEK >HAHA GUISE I CALLED HIM A KEK, THAT'LL SHOW HIM LOL
Henry Murphy
All I can think of us that poor kid. I hope he finds a family to raise him well.
Samuel Bailey
It's only mildly addictive, you have to really abuse to reach levels of physical withdrawls. It's more psychological imo. Even in such cases I've heard heroin addicts say kratom withdrawls are childs play on par with a common cold at best.
The question you should be asking is, is regular use harmful. There's no evidence to substantiate that it is.
Angel Perry
Thanks
Is it possible to take a small enough amount to prevent withdrawals, or would it have basically no affect at that point?
Im really liking the sound of it. I have a niggling injury which gives me pain and trouble sleeping and this sounds like just the thing. I just really dont like the idea of withdrawals.
Leo Johnson
I mentioned that in my post. I do think it should be regulated so consumers are sure to get the pure product they think they are because the only cases of toxic incidence are synthetically blended products.
Matthew Allen
Yeah its pretty crazy so many fentanyl ods recently which is probably why im making a killing off mdma and lsd everyone around here is to scared to buy herion or coke i think im going to get a few naxalone kits to sell to my customers
Tyler Gonzalez
>The autism in this post.
You're a virgin, aren't you, mate?
Lucas Smith
not an argument
Nathaniel Brooks
You wont have any withdrawals on kratom unless you take too much, as someone said, the wobbles. Just use a gram in your tea and you'll be all good.
Asher Lee
>namecalling >still no valid arguments
Levi Powell
I cannot take seriously a poster that tries arguing with caps lock, throwing around insults like theres no tomorrow and shows the social intelligence of a 5 year old. Try again.
Jacob Brown
See:
Charles Powell
If you're not going to make an argument why would you post?
Jace Cruz
some motherfucker's always tryna iceskate uphill
Evan Richardson
I made my argument.
Lucas Gonzalez
No, they are banning it because big pharma has found a replacement that they will copyright/patent then charge a fortune for.
Bentley Cooper
I NEED A MEDIC
Jackson Torres
>wow these goyim must fall into my narrow ideas of how life works!
>pesky fucking goyim!
Nathan Fisher
>I don't take you seriously
Is not an argument. You haven't refuted any of the Swiss fag's points.
Blake Reyes
>I cannot take seriously a poster that tries arguing with caps lock that wasn't an argument, that was just making fun of his shitty post >throwing around insults like theres no tomorrow maybe insulting, but factually correct >and shows the social intelligence of a 5 year old because "HAHA LOL UR AN VIRGIN XDDD" is so very mature huh
Brayden Mitchell
The American government banning a substance always leads to more dead Americans, they clearly don't give a fuck about that, though.
Ryan Bennett
It wouldn't hurt to do so. I also know a lot of folks who are too scared to dip into dope due to all the recent ODs.. which is good in a shitty way.
Problem is with the people using it already.. One dose of those bags cut with the elephant tranq or whatever garbage is going around now and they're a goner.
Personally I've been thinking about taking the harm reduction class to get a license for carrying and administrating narcan
I may never need to use it but who knows.. even if it helps one person out it's worthwhile.
Mason Williams
I didnt even smoke a normal cigarette in my life
just legelaize the shit so the state can get some money to treat these faggtos.
Cameron Nguyen
I did, earlier in the thread. The post you are quoting is the culmination of the Swiss fags caps lock faggotry a la:
Carson Murphy
>justifying your subjugation this hard I don't do drugs, never have and don't intend to -- but I have zero respect for the notion that it's acceptable for the government to imprison myself or anyone else for possessing a plant, as that's and exclusively anti-american proposition.
You find comfort in being controlled, that's understandable, probably the natural state for someone who's unsure of themselves -- but it's not the providence of free men. The US isn't prosperous because of our laws constraining an individual's own private behaviour, our prosperity comes in spite of them. America wasn't meant to be a cuckold collective, or some safespace hugbox of serfdom and supplication, stop trying to turn it into one.
John Bell
Drug seeking behavior is a real medical condition.
That said, interruptions in supply and variable potency are the biggest dangers to opioid users. Both of those problems are directly a result of the war on drugs.
Safe measured doses, readily available will prevent these fucks from thieving and trying to replace opiates with other drugs then ODing.
There can easily be more than enough opiates to feed the demand, but there is a global cartel deciding which nations are allowed to grow opium poppies for medical use.
The problems with the war on drugs are enormous, and difficult to change. Probably why you still see more Americans dying from ineffective policy.
Colton Morgan
Always the same degenerate addict spamming this nonsense because the big ebil gubmint is closing another loophole. Nobody gives a fuck. No matter how hard you spam and shill for your "totally legal and safe and legit and it's NOT for getting high guys!" drug of choice, nobody will ever care.
Henry Reed
>no valid point >M-MUH CAPS LOCK USED FOR COMEDIC EFFECT INVALIDATES YOUR POST
Landon Cooper
That face is not digitally altered.
That kid is a fucking shape shifter.
You mother fuckers see it, right.
He is the Clinton Body Double.
He is the bringer of darkness.
We are fucking doomed.
Rest well sheep.
William Sullivan
You're a fucking Eurocuck, your opinion on nanny-statism is worthless to us.
James Garcia
Have a bump, op, though nothing can be done until someone (hopefully Trump) cracks down on the DEA's bullshit.
Owen Williams
>The bottom line is people are going to die when Kratom is banned and people return to more dangerous opiates
They have never cared about drug policy killing Americans, and they will not start now.
Find a new angle.
Easton Gonzalez
We don't need to equivocate the USA with NK as an authoritarian regime to fault the DEA. See
Blake Bailey
This. Brits offering their opinion with regards to personal freedom is like an Ethiopian giving their opinion on buffets.
Mason Cruz
You're being willfully ignorant because you have a problem with recreational drug use.
I don't even take doses strong enough to induce the mild-sedative effects. Only low doses are required to reduce anxiety and depression and improve mood, very similar to a cup of coffee.
And you're wrong hundreds of thousands of people care because it's enhanced their quality of life enabling them to be productive members of society not junkies.
Nicholas Cox
>UK >European
Easton Rogers
When did all the medpacks turn into massive autist?
Joshua Hall
Portions of the United States military are international drug smugglers. All these wars have to do with economic resources or drugs not people, it's a massive money laundering scheme. If you're stupid enough to put a needle in your arm and shoot up heroin kratom probably isn't going to be staving you off form death it's going to be making you feel like you need a stronger high or to spend more on drugs.
Cameron Bailey
Yes, Britain is European. Switzerland is European too. European-ness is a geographical concept, there's no going around it except for taking your territory and pushing it all the way to another continent. European Union? Fuck that shit.
Blake Miller
I came here just to call (you) a faggot
Christian Sanders
>The DEA has this misconception that it's a "legal high" like that K2 Spice or a subsitute for heroin to get high.
Let me stop you right there. They know what they're doing and they know who benefits from it being banned.
Joshua Gomez
Not all hope is lost See The medical community nearly stopped the scheduling of MDMA but a lone DEA administrator rejected the judge's verdict and scheduled it anyways (what kind of bullshit legal process is that)
It's possible that part of the reason they're scheduling temporarily is because they're not sure what to do with it permanently. They don't understand it and are misinformed about the risk they just see the sudden surge like the fake weed and bath salts a few years ago and think it's a dangerous trendy legal high.
I think our movement is making an impact though, we're starting to get national coverage and educate people. >Melvin Patterson of the DEA said he's overwhelmed with the response from the chronically ill. They had no idea so many people found relief.
Christian Nelson
and still no valid argument
Sebastian Scott
You never countered mine. I have a M.S. in Biomed Eng btw, I didn't get my info from Vice.
Justin Flores
I was justing reading up on kratom news then came to pol. And its on the first page, the government are monsters in this instance, ive used kratom for 2 years to avoid surgery and manage my own life safely and the federal government comes in and decides it knows whats best. Thia representative democracy needs to be replaced with a demi pure democracy now that the technology is available. Leave things like this to the people. Its our country not the govs, they are supposed to serve us.
