People claim this scene is a "disgrace to the title of superhero" and "a symbol of modern-day pessimism"

>People claim this scene is a "disgrace to the title of superhero" and "a symbol of modern-day pessimism".
>Implying that a hero killing the villain doesn't show that he/she actually cares about doing what's right instead of being a self-centered shit who only cares about his or her self-image.

Go cry somewhere else, cuck.

Really, how is BVS so bad again? I mean there's worse shit out there like Batman and Robin and Superman Returns.

I think it's a symptom of defeatism. Of giving up. Of saying "this is really bad, but we have to accept it because the alternative is even worse". You know, as in killing is bad, but if I kill this guy I prevent more people from getting killed. That's rational. That's something we have to live with every day. Thankfully it's usually only in small, barely significant ways, but still. Choosing the lesser of two evils is something that will come up many times during anyone's life. We've all had to deal with moments where we had to back down, give up, and betray our own morals simply because at that time it seemed like the sensible choice to make, because the alternative would be worse.

The thing is, that's not what Superman is about. Superman is about being faced with an impossible situation and finding a solution anyway. About beating the odds, not just playing them out in your favor. About fighting for the best solution, not the least bad one. It's definitely not about destroying a city and killing a guy in order to prevent something worse from happening.

Now, is this the first time something like this has happened to Superman, or any other character? Not by a long shot. Hell, Marvel is pretty much nothing but this with their endless hero vs hero bullshit. But that doesn't excuse it. Especially because it's Superman, who's supposed to be better.

>Really, how is BVS so bad again?

How is it GOOD?

superman represents the desire to be able to do good without compromising.
when the climax of your film is superman compromising his moral code, that's it. superman lost. the whole film builds up to this moment where Superman is screaming in anguish as he throws away what made him admirable as an icon, and Snyder masturbating furiously in the corner

it really is worse than both of those.

the no-killing rule has alwaays be the cancer of comics, a cheap excuse to not kill off characters, so that you might be able to use them again and again, so that you can extend stories and cause suspense without having to deliver actual quality writing. I can't believe people have been falling for this meme since decades.

>LOIS! GET ME SOME ORANGE SLICES!

DC is just more in your face and get your hands dirty about it

How many Marvel villains are still alive? Aside from lolki

It always depends on who the villain is and what they've done. It's that simple. If you are the type of person that says everyone who commits a crime should be killed, then I don't know what to tell you. Besides even the worst villains can do some good in cape comics. Like in the Thunderbolts or the Suicide Squad.

People are saying it's a disgrace because it has no consequences, thematic significance or any other purpose in the story. It's there solely to hammer the point that "This ain't your daddy's Superman. This is a badass killer Superman."

In a superhero movie killing should never be just for the sake of killing.

there are enough stories to warrant even most heroes getting the death sentence, this is another comic meme which is, you are forgiven as long as you do more good than bad.

This. Some people don't understand what (most) superheroes should represent:
That goes for some writers and directors as well.

Kryptonians are superpowered because of the yellow sun

Superman would have just put a fucking bag over Zod's head and depowered him, locking him up before he could figure out what the problem was and making sure no yellow sunlight could reach him ever

this jerk didn't

>In a superhero movie killing should never be just for the sake of killing.

Zodd literally came back from the death as Doomsday and killed Superman.

Obviously comics have their own laws. Most of the stuff that is tolerated in those universes wouldn't fly in ours. Punisher should have been executed (if that is who you are referring too) while most versions of Catwoman shouldn't.

>In a superhero movie killing should never be just for the sake of killing.
Nice meme moron
Only sissies have this opinion, period

>mfw It's this thread again

What was wrong that statement? Are you saying heroes should kill for no reason when there are other ways around the problem?

I take it you are probably not a fan of the hippocratic oath either.

Oh look, it's a frogposter again. Mods!

I'm saying that the only reasons heroes never kill in the first place was because of censorship to comics, it was never an idea held by writers but something enforced upon them because of not wanting kids to see "violence"

I'm also saying that morality is subjective, and not everybody (in fact, most people don't) share the opinion that killing is something that never should be done, most people agree that some people need to be killed and that killing some people is the only way to solve some problems

except you don't have criminals who had commited one or two crimes, you have decades of crime cases.

So, not a fan of the Suicide Squad either? Yes, considering the threats that face most comic worlds (alien or otherwise), obviously the rules are different than in our worlds. Do you really want comics to work like our reality? Sounds boring.

What people forget is that Superman couldn't just overpower Zod and fly him away, he was just fighting not one, not two, but 3 people just as strong as himself and trained for actual combat. It makes sense when seen like that, but it doesn't help that the majority of the film was extremely mishandled as far as Superman goes. The only real noteworthy bit from that movie, and all of the DCEU films for that matter, is Superman learning to fly, every other good part of that movie is utterly forgetable, while we can all clearly remember the bad parts of the film.

Obviously! Most heroes operate like that these days. Batman, Spider-Man and Flash (sometimes) are the only heroes that SHOULD hold onto that code. Obviously almost all the other heroes are killers to make it more "real."

In that world. Obviously, it would be different in our world. Why would you want superhero stories to adhere to the rules of our boring world.

Forgot Superman. Meant to add Superman there as well.

to this day i don't understand how directors like Singer and the Wachowskis managed to make so many MC leatherdaddies in the 90s/00s without it getting picked up on

sure is funny tho

Didnt Superman murder Zod in an alternate universe for similar reasons in the comics?

No.

Zod had killed the entire human race.

>What people forget is that Superman couldn't just overpower Zod and fly him away, he was just fighting not one, not two, but 3 people just as strong as himself and trained for actual combat.
That was before they absorbed the energy of the sun and got used to the atmosphere like Zod does later. Goyer just forgot about that and them super powerful for Transformers explosions.

What we don't need is more faggots saying what is "exclusive" of faggots.

Still never managed to see the movie

How bad is Eisenberg?

Magneto, Trask, Abomination, Leader kind of, Amazing Goblin and Rhino, Doom, Mandarin kind of, Dormammu, Zemo, uhhhh....

Only Zod absorbed yellow sunlight right? The other two members of the Zod Squad were doing the Hulk thing and just jumping high, weren't they? Or did production completely fucking drop the ball?

You want to do dark and edgy Superman? Fine.

Have him kill Zod WITHOUT destroying half of Metropolis at least though.

>I have to stop Zod from killing a few more people

Nothing super about this shit show.

Aint how it works.

He is the worst aspect of every live action Luthor, mashed together.

He would be better as Glorious Godfrey.

Creel, Fisk, Donald Gill, Gavaton (kind of)

I'd respect heroes who don't kill more if they were willing to die for their code and not break or bend it to defend themselves. At least that way we know how much life means to them. Obviously I would kill if I was a cop or soldier or to defend myself in general. I just prefer superheroes (some of them anyway) to be above that. Anyone else know what I'm talking about?

Attempted vs actual. I think Man of Murder was justified but a NOOOOO is not enough remorse.

Superhero comics exist in their own universe where you could get away with a lot more stuff.

MCU "heroes" (villains that just happen to be helpful to us) kill people and make fun of it all the time. At least Superman felt bad about it.

Magneto, Rhino, and Doom aren't villain's anymore (technically because of sudden onset backstory Doom never was) and Zemo's more of a whiny asshole than a villain.

At least we have Spider-Man, Daredevil and Dr. Strange. Spidey will probably feel bad when Vulture dies while he attempts to save him.

It's not.

Good: visuals, pacing, music, characters, plot, scene transitions, dialogue, development, scenes, camera work, fight choreography, CGI

Bad: RT score

You can have heroes that don't kill while still killing villains off in stories. Superhero movies do that all the time. In the Sam Rami Spider-Man movies they make it a big deal that Spider-Man doesn't kill but pretty much all of his villains end up dying anyways.

>Oh no! The entire city is ruined! I better make out with my girlfriend!
>I just killed space Hitler whom I have no emotional connection to. WAHHHHHHHHH!
And this is why people hate MoS

No no, if he had said that critics and audiences would have loved the movie. And we can't have that!

>being able to reuse compelling, interesting characters is cancer
Moviefags, go home.

>visuals
Literally the only thing Sunder can do right >pacing
I disagree, the movie dragged on until itbwas suddeblyntime for Superman and Batman to fight.
>music
Eh, but like most movie sound tracks and scores it's completely forgettable
>characters
Heh, the only character that was remotely enjoyable was Alfred, and maybe Perry.
>plot
No, Batman vs Superman is always a dumb plot no matter what, and this movie didnt do anytjing to make that any better, if anythibg it served to show you how dumb that plot actually is as itbwas completely abandoded for the final 15 minutes
>scene transitions
Ah yes, dream sequences and vauge endings everywhere, top quality for a freshman level film student
>dialogue
Really? I wont even dignify this with a respons as it contradicts itself
>development
What did you mean by this? How it set up the upcoming JL film? Because the youtube videos and snap chatying was pretty cringey
>scenes
didnt you already list this? I will say i loked Luthor and Kal talking on the rooftop
>camera work
This was covered already with visuals
>fight choreography
I too was happy to finally see Batman be able to fight, too bad the main drawn was ass
>CGI
I didn't think Bizzaro looked good at all, but it did do a good job at making Wondy attractive

Zemo killed plenty of innocent people. He's a sympathetic villain, but he's still a villain.

He hosts a dinner event and when he goes up to give a speech, that he had all the time to prepare for, and it is a complete rambling mess filled with stuttering and disconnected points.

That should sum up everything you need to know about him.

Sup Forums's butthurt about a lack of a kill code only applies to MoS. Every time the Joker and Batman comes up the criticism gets flipped on its head, and rightly so.

Superman literally died in this universe while taking out Doomsday.

Most people didn't see the extended edition ")

>willing to break his own moral cose to protect the innocent
And this got shit because?

>Optimus Prime brutally mutilates and murders anything he views as a threat without second thought, even making a one-liner once in a while. He even rips Megatron's head off when he offers a truce and then shoots his former mentor in the face despite him begging Prime not to.
>No one complains.

>Superman or Batman actually kill to protect others from being repeatedly killed.
>Everyone bitches.

"no u" the post

Try again.

Batman and superman are from comics and cartoons that are still popular today.

They're bad guys, just like the MCU and friends. Plus nobody cares about them.

Superman and Batman are good guys. And every casual and his mother thinks that they "get" Superman and should be the sole authority to him.

Not addressing the points is actually a "no u" post.

Next time have an image prepped if you plan on shot posting and not engaging in the discussion

This is a good one, free of charge.

Batman's referring to the bat family. Obviously members of the Justice League have and will kill.

>No one complains

[GIVE ME YOUR FACE]

Because Superman does two things. Save lives and doesn't kill.

This is a movie where he fails to save lives on numerous occasions AND kills somebody.

He's opposite of everything Superman is in these movies, but not even in the fun way.

Snyder broke the chains around Superman letting him be something new, letting him reach new heights of storytelling.

>People are constantly whining that Superman is a too perfect goody-two-shoes to be interesting.
>A film gives him genuine flaws and people bitch about it not being Superman they know.

>Zemo killed plenty of innocent people.
Such as?

Superhero fans in a nutshell.

Black Panther's father and other people in Vienna. Plus, that doctor he impersonated.

>New heights of storytelling

/thread

>It's Sup Forums defends MoS / BvS thread

>Superman does two things. Save lives and doesn't kill.

Autism or casual?

i just want snyder to leave

>No one complains.

PTSD suffering psychopath Prime is one of the redeeming factors of Bayformers. In a 'it's so bad it's good' kinda way.

That was Klaw

>Optimus Prime is a soldier in a war
>Superman is a superhero
Spot the difference

It really is that simple?

I fucking complain! Bays Prime is fucking garbage. Dont get me wrong, Optimus is no stranger to killing during war, but Bay turned him into a murderous asshole

Optimus never kills anyone

Lots of people complained. But the Bay movies keep coming out in a constant stream, I think complainers just got too tired to bother anymore. We're only three movies into the DC movie universe so arguments are still alive.

Pretty much. I gave up on being mad at the TF movies, because theyre off the rails shit and continue to be so

...

Did you see the fucking movies?

Then again they are shit.

Keep Sunder on visuals, but don't allow him any more kind of creative control. And keep Scott Snyder the tuck out of the dceu.

There is nothing left to be said about the DCEU.
Or the MCU for that mattter

Characters like Superman can have a no kill code because they have literally a thousand better options than just killing someone. With a dude like Batman or Green Arrow? It should occasionally be kill or be killed, because there is no other alternative. But for Supes, this code should only extend to people who are less powerful than him. For someone like Zod or Doomaday? You bet your ass Superman should kill them. It'd be morally repugnant not to do so, since he's the only guy that can actually do it for the most part.

>Have him kill Zod WITHOUT destroying half of Metropolis at least though.
But he didn't.
Only 2 buildings fell during their one on one fight and Clark did zero structural damage to ether.
>>I have to stop Zod from killing a few more people
Its not a "few" more people, a full power Kryptonian can kill the entire human race by hand.