Now, when I was this question is more focus upon Marvel, considering the 'feminist' pushing they've done with some of their major characters, backing down and cancelling certain comics covers because they're seen as 'sexist' (Riri Williams).
Though, DC is also guilty of the latter, for instance the with the Killing Joke comic.
Anyway, what're Sup Forumsmics thoughts on this?
Whilst I welcome humanitarian liberalism, modern liberalism is more akin to soft fascism with a (un)healthy dose of hypocritical virtue signalling.
college age writers with liberal views write more comics than conservative writers.Marvel in particular has always leaned left with its politics which is why reading back issues you see a lot of it either ages well{captain america defends a gay ally,oliver queen wants social reform] while some of it doesn't {Nixon was a super villain!Hal is a racist for helping other planets and not blacks at home}Like then some of the current liberal ideas in comics will age well{Kamala khans first volume will be a classic},while the rush for diverse characters and tumblr speak won't.Its pretty easy to ignore
Noah Foster
I ain't giving your site clicks shill.
Henry Ortiz
company wars guarantee marvel and dc will always have diehards who keep books above 30000 plus disney support means marvel doesn't worry about loosing money anymore
Tyler Gutierrez
Because they think this is how they attract new millennial fans. They don't realise that 99% of the SJWs who bitch and moan about lack of diversity don't read comics.
Look at how bad Marvel are doing, RIRI is going to tank Iron-man, Thor is shit, TA Hulk #1 debut at 125 in monthly sales.
They need to create Diverse characters by making new characters or utilizing old ones not by changing Thor into a woman or making Ice Man gay. Marvel will have to bring back their classic characters soon.
Jack Ward
Holy shit... that's rather in your face.
Apparently they aren't seeing the shift in the Zeitgeist the across the West, with the rise of nationalism and right-wing politics in general? They're quite fucked, unless they stop it.
Please, I'll get fired.
But they should worry about popularity, as without popularity, they'll soon lose that backing with the shift in political preference?
Nathaniel Ramirez
Go fuck yourself
Asher Baker
The Thor thing is simply retarded, as Thor is a masculine name and the concept was/is based upon a MALE Norse God.
Top tier modern liberal discourse, what happened to humanitarian liberalism that actually valued intelligent debate?
Robert Ross
>"become" liberal >"virtue signalling"
This fucking Sup Forums shit needs to go back to Russia where it belongs.
Brandon Ross
You do know the difference between modern Western liberalism and the intellectual humanitarian liberalism that allowed it to exist?
It would've been great if you'd read the whole OP before attempting to redirect me.
Jaxson Johnson
well yeah marvel and dc usually hire very liberal writers,in marvels case just look up mark waid or brevoorts twitter and for dc look at Ruckas twitter.I don't think worldwide politics is gonna change the writers and most of them are rather decent.
Charles King
all forms of media are liberal virtue platforms except for government funded propaganda
just look at the entirety of history
Isaac Williams
Aaron whole argument was that the hammer was inscribed with whoever wields the hammer will be there,before thor was born,so the name was a title odin gave to his kid to encourage him to try to be worthy.Its silly but i enjoy unworthy thor so ill accept it
Luke Butler
>this is not a bait thread, I swear!
Nolan Robinson
Creators, editors and the people in charge compromised with the SJW movements. They accepted them as part of the industry, and now they are taking over.
Mind you, SJWs don't care about comics, they care about their agendas, and it is evident that their only real concern is their image to others, not even their actual cause.
Writer's have been injecting politics into comics, but it was always limited to it's reflections on the characters, even in Miller's works.
Now we get shit like Wonder Woman using the word "mansplaining" and Bor being sexist and having "unsolicited opinions on Israel" -because sexist white men are also fascist.
Kudos to all those not giving a shit about them like Frank Cho or Jim Shooter.
Mason Campbell
Oh look Sup Forums and Sup Forums wanna have this discussion AGAIN,can't we wait for marvel and dc story times for this bait shit
Ayden Stewart
This might be true, but the issue is that they are pushing the corrupted form of liberalism, that, as I said is no longer what the purpose of liberalism was.
Sort of, at least in modern history. Liberalism used to serve as purpose, as to keep the far-right in check.
I guess, it just wish it was for a good cause and not to simply 'shake it up'.
More top tier modern liberal political discourse and you wonder why the right is rising again? It is because of denialism and idealism, just like your post.
They'll kill their own industry, it is rather sad.
More top tier modern liberal political discourse and you wonder why the right is rising again? It is because of denialism and idealism, just like your post.
Ethan Collins
>complains about something Marvel is guilty of >blames DC for the same thing
Why do Marvelfags do this?
Caleb Wilson
Im not a fucking liberal,i like comics and am sick if seeing this same thread every fucking time tv and pol see a comic panel about sjws,its fucking annoying
Blake Clark
Cho definitely cares though.
Leo Thomas
>triggered
Alexander Ross
Because then it isn't showing a bias, you could really benefit from the same mindset of 'balance'.
Well you picked the wrong thread, I'm seriously curious why they are willing to destroy their industry for an erroneous and dying ideology.
Ayden Nelson
More top tier modern liberal political discourse and you wonder why the right is rising again? It is because of denialism and idealism, just like your post.
Owen Martin
>you could really benefit from the same mindset of 'balance'.
Jordan Brooks
I can't really see it in DC now desu. All DC seem to do is add diverse characters as sidekicks like the new Kid Flash, Duke, etc. They also try out new characters like Chinese Superman. It seems a lot less intrusive and forced as to the way Marvel do it.
Luke Cook
It's hardly destroying the industry,most of what kills the industry is marvels sale tactics and gimmick diversity,Books with lots of liberal writing like green arrow,Wonder Woman,Cap Hydra etc are doing alright
Ryder Ward
...
Noah Brooks
Well no, the purpose of this thread is ask a balanced question about both parties. The difference is, like playing devil's advocate, everything you debate doesn't have to be from your bias, moron.
Agreed, I guess whichever does it less will become the more successful, who knows?
see again, same answer for your repetitive answer.
Benjamin Kelly
>>I can't really see it in dc desu,cause I don't read Green arrow or wonder woman or all star batman
Ryan Johnson
Holy Christ, what is the fuck is wrong with them? Are they aware this will stop most men reading their comics?
Elijah Adams
>Well no, the purpose of this thread is ask a balanced question about both parties. Except you're arguing something that has no basis in the real world. Which I suppose is par the course for Sup Forums.
Don't you people have another pizzeria to shoot up?
Juan Nguyen
Why is Captain America Hydra now? Because Superior Spider-Man sold really well.
Why did Civil War 2 happen? Because CW1 sold really well and the movie was coming out.
Why are there all these Ethnic minority legacy heroes? Because Mrs Marvel sold really well and got tons of publicity.
Comics, like any medium, is dictated by what sells, and right now for Marvel the most visible consumer behind the Hardcore fan (who they believe will buy no matter what) is the Liberal, Tumblr using 18-24 year old. So they will pander to this group in the hope more of this group buy their comics. They will also try to avoid offending this group, hence cancelling covers which cause a fuss.Comics are a niche industry, so a consumer demographic buying your products consistently is highly sought after.
Its not like there is a deeper conspiracy (Marvel's CEO is friends with Trump for instance), they're just trying to make money.
Benjamin Jackson
>Has no basis in the real world. >Comics are physical objects. >Their politics is very real. >Right is rising again, Brexit and Trump, also the increase in European nationalism is proof. >BTFO. Try again? >Also, see: Thank you, become again.
I know it isn't a conspiracy, I am aware it is capitalism, but they clearly aren't paying attention to the Zeitgeist in a post-Brexit, post-Trump and post-European nationalist world.
Ian Harris
But the majority of people voted against Trump.
Brayden Price
Look man when green arrow,Hydra cap and WW sell they don't loose sales because the writer decided to add a ham fisted page,if your only reading a comic for politics your gonna be dissapointed.Green arrow has stupid politics bits it's art and fun characters make up for it.Just cause a writer adds one hamfisted page it doesn't undo the rest of there work or readership.the rise of conservatism isn't gonna suddenly make every WW fan drop a comic 10 issues in
Charles Jones
>Has no basis in the real world. >Comics are physical objects. >Their politics is very real.
Except, again, you're talking out your ass. You're blaming DC for Marvel being a shithole.
Luke Reyes
>But the majority of people voted against Trump. No they didn't.
Blake Cox
In cities and the majority was only by 1%, also it isn't just the US that is their customer base, they are a multinational industry.
I agree, but with things like mansplaining they are going to be alienating you as you read and therefore you are less likely to actually buy another one of those comics and so on.
No? I'm saying Marvel is a bigger shithole than DC, but DC is also swallowing the 'modern liberalism' load, it should focus on what isn't becoming taboo.
Juan Wilson
I just want to say that, while DC did some stupid stuff with that Batgirl/Joker cover controversy, that was just one book. Most of their stupid is confined to a few books which are aimed at that target audience. And there is no problem having a book or two targeted at someone who is not me.
Marvel's problem is that they have taken every single character, every single major superhero they have, and turned them into that. It isn't that they have some books that target the SJW/Tumblr crowd. It is that they have practically no books targeting the teen male audience. Diversity for them seems to mean everyone but the cis/white/het/male shitlords. You know, the people who traditionally buy superhero comics.
Gavin Jenkins
>Why has Marvel and DC become liberal virtue signalling platforms? Because modern liberalism only works in fiction.
Blake Wright
You mean the ziegeist of people who dont read comics?
Marvel isnt going to risk striving for the older conservative demographic when they can rope in the acessable young liberal crowd more reliably.
Samuel Nelson
I don't even have to troll the Trumpsters any more. I just wait for the new comic books to come out every week and then watch the shitstorm unfold. Even when Spencer bashed the SJWs the Trumpsters complained
Isaac Barnes
Yeah but the number of reader you'd loose at that point won't be that significant,after the first few issues most comics have a stable readership,most WW readers didn't drop that book because of that panel and most captain America readers won't drop the book because nick spencer made Red skull a nationalist.What kills comics is usually convulted continuity,bad art,poor direction,poor brands and high costs.Those are gonna kill marvel long before SJWs do
Brayden Roberts
>cucks STILL seething
Evan Barnes
This was an out of continuity rotating writer anthology Wonder Woman series. You don't see this shit in the main series.
Jaxon Smith
I somewhat agree, I just hope it doesn't becoming as large a part of DC as it has with Marvel.
Good joke, 10/10.
The thing is that being a right-winger, or even a nationalist is becoming a fad among many young adults and teenagers throughout the US, Canada and Europe.
More top tier modern liberal political discourse and you wonder why the right is rising again? It is because of denialism and idealism, just like your post.
Yes, but the SJWism is causing them to make errors, just as shitty continuity.
Nathaniel Nguyen
They should've created: >The Manspreader >Dishing out injustice at every available public convenience.
Lincoln Clark
>Good joke, 10/10. Reality isn't a joke.
Michael Murphy
You should do stand-up, user.
Adam Cook
And that's still an uncertain demographic and attempting to appeal to them would only drive away a reliable source of profit.
Sebastian Wright
True, I guess we've found part of the reason for their blind trust.
Brandon Clark
>Donald J. Trump 62,979,879 >Hillary Clinton 65,844,954
Thing is, he played to the states that are the most republican and have large portions of republican electors.
Bentley Martinez
The thing your not getting is that this isn't some writers pandering to leftists,these are books written by some leftists,changing demographics won't change that for a long time and most of the buying public cares about all the other things I mentioned before they care about whether a writer is liberal or not
Bentley King
>people don't count if they live where most people live
ok. Glad we cleared that up. At least you admit that your views are only held by a minority.
Justin King
>vote rigging and illegal immigrants Nope. Most Americans voted for Trump.
Andrew Mitchell
>I somewhat agree, I just hope it doesn't becoming as large a part of DC as it has with Marvel.
Have you seen DC's sales compared to Marvel's recently? DC is kicking their asses with a back to basics approach that reverted their characters to their more classical styles. But to keep all their weird/Tumblry/special stuff alive and well, they have the Young Animal line where they do the weird books like Shade the Changing Girl and Doom Patrol and Cave Carson Has A Robotic Eye. And that's fine! That's great! That is exactly what is needed. DC seems to have figured it out. Give every potential audience a book they might like instead of turning over your entire brand to a bunch of whining snowflakes who don't even read comics in the first place.
David Gutierrez
I guess, but I know, if I started seeing modern liberal buzzwords being used in a serious way, I'd put it down.
Kayden Collins
That doesn't dismiss the fact that there are still a higher number of dens than republicans right now so marvel won't loose that much readership since they rely on about 2/10s of that demographic
Liam Rodriguez
>shit_that_didnt_happen.txt
whatever helps you sleep at night, Sup Forums.
Asher Ward
What if people just have different moral values than you?
Ryan Lopez
Most Americans didn't vote. Less Americans voted for Trump than the last Republican candidate, who lost in a landslide.
Charles Morgan
Precisely, this is what I mean when I speak about 'balance'.
A 1% margin could be a statistical error, probably isn't, but could be. That means, it could easily revert, it is still a shock to see that many people vote republican in the first place.
>post-Trump, post-Brexit and post European nationalism. Really gets my neurons firing.
Dylan Phillips
"original fans" as you call them, are getting old, moving on, and some are even dying. They're trying to stay relevant and some market research probably told them their new fanbase is more raging feminist than conservatives.
They will ink what they think their fanbase wants to read. Because that's how they sell comic books.
Yes, Marvel represented the feminist for a very long time. At least since the 70s.
Alexander Stewart
History
Luke Torres
Could be the reason, or they think that a shift will not occur, when it is already occurring. Then again, I suppose a majority of it might be comprised of die-hard modern liberals.
What parts of history precisely, user?
Carter Lopez
So don't fucking read it? You're acting like a modern liberal bitching about content you just can choose to not read. I haven't seen this thread before so I find it interesting, kindly grow up.
Brody Ross
...
Lincoln Butler
..Comics and superhero comics specifically are a medium invented by liberal Jews from NYC. Literally. Superman started out as an actual fucking Social Justice Warrior. If you're now complaining about it as a medium imparting liberal and left values then you are a fucking moron. Go get into anime or vidya with the other edgelords.
Austin Gray
My problem isn't humanitarian liberalism, my problem is the modern liberalism that is aiding in the destruction of Western society.
Isaac Russell
>I am a sperglord
Evan Bell
More top tier modern liberal political discourse and you wonder why the right is rising again? It is because of denialism and idealism, just like your post.
Going to actually provide an argument, or?
Brody Gutierrez
The election has really ruined every corner in the internet. Even co of all place. I just want to talk about comics, talk about them and bash all the bad ones.
Tyler Cook
Sorry for disrupting your safe-space user, I'll be gone soon.
Noah Walker
Close thread and move on, friend.
Jose James
Okay your going full pollack this thread was about why comics are liberal you got a bunch of explanations,all of this debate on trump,types of liberalism and changing demographics belong on Sup Forums,your questions been answered
Nolan Morgan
It has, yes, but I can't delete the thread (otherwise I would). However, that doesn't mean I'm simply not going to reply to you when you're being rude.
Juan Cook
>>Wanting to discuss comics and cartoons on Sup Forums and not the ethics of liberalism,changing demographics and political nonsense is now safe space seeking
Dominic James
>aiding in the destruction of Western society. And you don't think that's sperging out? Western society has been around for thousands of years. But YOU think it's going to be destroyed by a bunch of tumblr feminists.
Aaron Jackson
>I don't understand what a joke it.
That's true, it'll still exist, but with things such as the covering up of rape (in Sweden and Germany) as to save face of the modern liberal leadership. It threatens to make rape perpetrated by minorities a 'norm' that should be accepted. - That's one example.
Jeremiah Edwards
DC is more soft actually.
Noah Johnson
Regarding purely Marvel, because I don't see these problems as much in other publishers. Maybe just because they're the biggest one, but still.
Honestly, the problem with Marvel lies more in the fact that they have no fucking talent to work with. There's very, very few good or even decent writers at Marvel and the situation isn't much better when it comes to writers.
Them being "liberal" is merely a symptom, not the cause. A good writer knows not to inject hamfisted political bullshit in his comics, whether he/she's left or right wing. Was their alignment reversed they'd still be bad writers.
Add to that what said and the formula's clear: shit quality + chasing trends and gimmicks = modern marvel.
MOST of modern marvel, that should be said. There are and have been some exceptions (Moon Knight, Ewing in general, the new Nova was fun) but this is what I see as being their problem.
Henry Hill
...
Kevin Barnes
...
Juan Martinez
This does indeed cover politics, but mostly their relation with comics. Still Sup Forums material, no?
And if you don't like it (I don't care for a lot of cartoon threads, for example) just don't enter it.
Now, if the thread went straight into Sup Forums sperging territory then yes, nuke it, but it's still (surprisingly) civil to me.
Noah Brown
This has certainly been the most concise answer all thread, exactly what I was looking for, thank you, user.
Agreed.
Thank you, user.
Gabriel Robinson
Reublicans are out having sex, lifting weights and making capekino. Not namby pamby comic shit.
Tyler Ortiz
Then why're you busy posting on a Sup Forumsmic forum?