Can we agree that this is really a children's cartoon compared to Korra?

Can we agree that this is really a children's cartoon compared to Korra?

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Well yeah, Korra showed an airbender sucking the air out of a queens lungs and suffocating her with it until she died.

Doesn't mean it's a better show than ATLA though. Don't really understand what there is to discuss about this topic

So long as agree that Korra is a no one's cartoon.

Actually both are children's cartoons. Nickelodeon is a channel that works in children's programming. anything that is produced for that channel will have children as the target audience.

siege of the north 1 and 2 weren't episodes made for a kids show, i'll say that much

Except the second half of Korra was dark as fuck, to the point where Nick wouldnt even air the episodes. I'd say TLK matured as it went on whIle ATLA stayed focused on the child audience

we need some drawfags in here

Airbender dealt with themes of genocide, survivor's guilt, colonialism and oppression; generally in ways that didn't talk down to the issue. The Fire Nation is a real threat once you get to them, and the higher ranks of them are all ambitious and ruthless jingoists.

Korra had murder, revolution, anarchy, and fascism. But it touched on them at best. Amon and the Equalists were pretty good at showing a people's revolution until we got no point of view from the non-bending public (especially after the police state is involved), the Red Lotus were brutal and radicalized and did do cool things (they were easily the best part of the show) but they also led to us not directly seeing the rise of fascism which is a big deal with the whole last season.

Airbender showed rather than told about a lot of things, every character was affected by the war or the genocide or had built their lives on the bones of both in some way. It was everpresent, like you'd expect global conquest to be in a non-modern time.

Korra told rather than showed about a lot of things, and the events in one place didn't always hit anywhere else because they were essentially living in the modern world and what happens in the Balkans doesn't reflect what happens in L.A. or what have you. Nobody had much of a tie to the larger themes unless it was a pulled "my relative is evil" or something between seasons that didn't really pay off.

Korra had more intimately adult items in it, but used them less effectively than Airbender did with its broader scope adult themes. Airbender might be a children's cartoon in comparison of that alone, but it did a better job with what it had than Korra did. Implication is often far more allowed than true presentation.

I agree, the show never reached that point of dark in the next seasons.
>Moongirl died
>Admiral-general of fire died killed by the avatar itself (the same avatar that never killed no more, even not the fire lord)
Damn that water monster was scary

>Amon and the Equalists were pretty good at showing a people's revolution until we got no point of view from the non-bending public (especially after the police state is involved)
It always bothered me that the Equalist movement was treated as if it had been rendered a fallacious scam just because Amon lied about his face.

>Can we agree that this is really a better cartoon compared to Korra?

Hey, fixed that for you.

All cartoons are for children you fucking autist. Haha don't tell me you were fooled into thinking that there were deep and intellectual cartoons? It's fucking animation. Go back to /lit/

How was Ozai's plan to torch the Earth Kingdom going to work? The comet lasted no more than half an hour, and he would have covered maybe a small region with brushfires at the very worst

What equality comes from putting a mask on a statue, making posters, and being ready to remove the bending of your own children since we know that non-benders can have children capable of bending even without training?

What equality comes from your main guy saying the spirits have blessed him with an amazing power if said amazing power is bending?

What good comes from wanting to get rid of all bending if all you really want is to choose your own representative separate of what Great Britain...the other nations (plus Tenzin's commune) push on you?

Would you follow a man who wears water soluble makeup and is ashamed of his bacon face while Zuko never hid it?

>All cartoons are for children you fucking autist

retard spouts a blatant lie and feels like a big tough guy on the internet: the post

In hindsight, his plan was kinda stupid. It would have been better if, instead of random forests, he targeted some kind of area of massive farmland to fuck with the agriculture. Or perhaps just went full crazy and went straight for the capital.
Either way, whatever he planned to do wasn't exactly thought out.

Both are children's cartoons. Korra is just a worse one.

>It always bothered me that the Equalist movement was treated as if it had been rendered a fallacious scam just because Amon lied about his face.


Amon said that spirits put him in charge and gave him power to change the world.

Turns out it was a lie and Amon would NEVER be able to remove bending from a single city considering that he has to personaly capture and do it himself, much less the world.

The entire movement REALLY became pointless and would never go anywhere, a suicide mission.

>Dark as fuck

>Characters can't say "kill" or "die"
>World views about as mature and nuanced as Power Rangers

Pretty sure ATLA never had a problem with these words.

>mercury poisoning, PTSD, assassination, dictatorships and enslavement aren't dark because the show didn't say the words kill or die

I understand the hate-boner for the show but come on

Being dark doesn't make the show good

It was probably a morale thing. The Earth Kingdom and its military was already organizationally shattered after Ba Sing Se fell. Massive wildfires with the aid of the comet and summer heat would have made them capitulate much quicker

Doing dark things doesn't mean the product is good. Things happening just because you can do whatever you want as a writer doesn't mean that if you do something that isn't all sunshine and rainbows then it's interesting.

Sure, attacking morale is all well and good, but as you even pointed out, the military was shattered. Why not take the blimps and head directly to Ba Sing Sei during the comet?

He never said those make it good. Just that Korra has dark themes for a children''s show.

Stop moving goalposts.

They make programs for teens too.

>a children's cartoon

>enslavement
Mentioning something and never showing any repercussions of it is not using it. "Yeah they put us in camps" "ok lol"

>Except the second half of Korra was dark as fuck, to the point where Nick wouldnt even air the episodes.
The content isn't why Nick wouldn't air the episodes and what's more I think you know that.

The original portion said "I'd say TLK matured as it went on whIle ATLA stayed focused on the child audience"

ATLA stayed focus on a child audience and managed to bring in teenagers and above age groups (people who can buy things to support the show and influence viewership.)

TLK went for a teenage audience (the children who would have watched the original growing up) and alienated them, went online and lost it's children audience, and was terrible enough to have people change the channel when it would come on - not even leaving it on as background noise.

The dark themes didn't do anyone any favors.

>The Fire Nation is a real threat once you get to them, and the higher ranks of them are all ambitious and ruthless jingoists.
More importantly the fire nation was shown to also be full of people; kids that just wanted to dance and villagers that were hurt by the war machine just like everyone else.

Whereas in Korra no matter how often it looks like the bad guys have a legitimate point they end up being 1000% wrong just so Korra can be right.

What equality comes from a system that gives undue political clout to a 19 year old that's all but devoid of emotional maturity and hasn't even been socialized properly just because of the mandate of her birth giving her extra superpowers?

You know how badly the Equalist plot was handled? The fucking AtLA game for the Xbox did the same plot but better.

>You know how badly the Equalist plot was handled? The fucking AtLA game for the Xbox did the same plot but better.

Did you side with the force that opposed Aang in that game?
Did you think Aang was wrong?
Did you think Aang's actions were wrong?

He doesn't need to remove/block everyone's bending, just enough that other benders are too scared to use their abilities in public or even to teach the skills to the next generation.

>Whereas in Korra no matter how often it looks like the bad guys have a legitimate point

The only one who had a legitimate point was Kuvira. And even Korra was okay with her until Kuvira started personally attacking people she knew.
Also it was "the good guys" who end up being 1000% right, not Korra. Include all the chucklefucks in your statement.

I mean, Sun Tzu said to attack cities last. Even Ozai probably would have been able to see Ba Sing Se's value as a logistical capital and a way to humiliate the Earth Kingdom through subjugation.

Incidentally, is it just me or is firebending way underpowered in Korra? With the exception of P'Li, I can't recall a scene where fire alone had the upper hand in a fight.

>until Kuvira started personally attacking people she knew.
Which as a reminder, was completely Su's fault for trying to sneak in and kill/kidnap/shag/idfk Kuvira in the middle of the night after a truce was brokered.

Yeah. ATLA is a better show though, proving that more mature doesn't equal better.

In fact, Korra mostly failed DUE to attempts at making it more mature - relationship drama, clumsy depiction of trauma, and hamfisted and even clumsier political and ideological commentary and all of the above not being given enough time to be explored in depth as it all had to take the sideline to action scenes.
Also, attempt to force a story arc structure like SERIOUS shows that teenagers like, instead of episodic+myth arc structure of Atla - when most of the stories would've been better as single episode stories, most villains better as one-off villains that are dealt with in one episode rather than in a string of fights that HAVE to be lost until last one is miraculously won, and Red Lotus being a specific overarching threat that hangs above the heroes heads at all times and is finally dealt with in the finale.

Without these issues, if they instead tried to simply make Atla 2: Now With Steampunk Cities And Spirit World, I think it maybe could've been as good as ATLA - maybe even better? Definitely better than what we've gotten.

Teaching the skills won't stop benders from being born. Fuck, air benders just sorta fucking happened in TLK just because, and the bending tournament or whatever it's called didn't use the techniques of bending, opting for a more street fighter style.

>He doesn't need to remove/block everyone's bending,
He does since that's the Equality he was asking everyone to digest. He never says that he can't accomplish his first goal so they have to settle.

Also Katara wasn't taught her skills yet was still capable of bending water in the first episode. And Toph learned in secret. And unless you kill the moon or the animals capable of bending then people can learn again.

Yes, kind of, and maybe, because the difference in timing changed the implications of the narrative a lot more.

Because that game took place during the war. "we need to stop the benders" takes on a different tone at war time, and The Maker actually recruited from three of the nations as well to form her resistance so it was a little more nuanced.

>I can't recall a scene where fire alone had the upper hand in a fight.
Mako

>Fuck, air benders just sorta fucking happened in TLK just because,
I assumed that had something to do with Korra fucking with spirit poles.
Which was a bad idea when her uncle wanted to do it but suddenly spirits stop having blue and orange morality when Korra decides its a good idea.

Speaking of the Spirit World, I didn't like how they changed it in TLK, making it a physical place humans could potentially go, rather than, you know, a spiritual thing. This also goes into one of the issues of the show, it mostly abandoned the spiritual aspect, and when it tried to bring it back, it did it poorly.

All that text and you still miss the point.

What irritated me most about Korra was how they depicted the Spirit World. In ATLA it always felt unsettling and had a great 40K warp-like vibe around it, and it fit with the Eastern mythology of the show well. In Korra, they regress to cartoon caricatures and the world looks like something out of Alice in Wonderland - ostensibly one of the things that they actually tried to make more childish.

>Teaching the skills won't stop benders from being born
It will stop them being effective though.
It will stop them learning how to control their abilities.
It will make them easier to isolate.
It will make them easier to blame for burning down their house and whatever other damage they inadvertently cause before having their bending blocked.

>Which was a bad idea when her uncle wanted to do it but suddenly spirits stop having blue and orange morality when Korra decides its a good idea.
They could have shown that having the devil now locked up inside the spirit of Order doesn't have spirits go wild so easily instead of being left to roam or sitting at The spiritual hot-spot of both worlds.

The worst but is everyone's like "Oh thank you Korra for bringing back spirits, thank you for bringing back airbenders!" It was bloody Unalaq's idea, Korra was just a tool to get his foot in the door.

They had to abandon the spiritual aspect. Korra was bad at it so the rules needed to change significantly to suit her needs as a character. So spirits stop being these beings you need to respect and observe the proper forms with and turn into good pokemon to buddy up with and kaiju to punch. Aang was the diplomat so he gets Wan Shi Tong, Korra is a brawler so her spirits are there for fights.

>the point
>Actually both are children's cartoons. Nickelodeon is a channel that works in children's programming. anything that is produced for that channel will have children as the target audience.

>the post
>Except the second half of Korra was dark as fuck, to the point where Nick wouldnt even air the episodes. I'd say TLK matured as it went on whIle ATLA stayed focused on the child audience

Nick didn't air the episodes because they wanted to try their website at handling things. Then they end up airing them on the primary Nick channel anyway and then shuffled it off to the Nicktoons channel.

I think implication would be that Amon's "equality" would require basically a secret police of bloodbenders taught to remove people's bending, who seek out benders and remove their bending at birth - with rare exceptions trained to make more bending removers.

I agree with you but honestly they already screwed the pooch the second they introduced the concept of these big master spirits of order and chaos.
Because they did the same thing that happens 90% of the time in western fiction; order is all good, chaos is all bad. Eurocentric perspective doesn't mesh with the idea of balance found in eastern mysticism at all.

The only franchise I can remember that does it even remotely as Korra should have is Soul Calibur of all things.

>Nick didn't air the episodes because they wanted to try their website at handling things. T
And the abysmal ratings had absolutely nothing to do with that?

No, both are children cartoons.

But Last Airbender handled its plots and characters with more maturity.

One of my favorite moments was when Iroh called Azula crazy and said that she needs to be put down. How many cartoons do you know that are this frank and for all the right reasons and not just "if you kill them, they win"?

Amon wants it gone.
His sycophants want it gone.

They didn't want to settle for anything less. Otherwise they just jail them instead of bring them before Amon and have it go on their credit report or not get them a gift for the Winter Solstice. A naughty list, so to speak.

>It was bloody Unalaq's idea
Unalaq's idea was to bring back the spirits to subjugate all humans and make himself the king of all.

Well, the problem is that it's an action show (rather than action-adventure like Atla), and it's about physical conflict. If you want to make something like Spirit World important part of the narrative, you need to somehow make sure that either things from it can punch people, or you can go there and punch things in there. Preferably both.

It's kind of like action games trying to have a grand plot in them, but it will always involve you shooting stuff in the end, sice that's what they're about, and if you try to put in stuff that's not about shooting, you end up with a mess like Bioshock Infinite. If Spirit World remained intangible, it'd make the show much worse and boring, or would require it to be less important - or it'd require a different show.

>And the abysmal ratings had absolutely nothing to do with that?

I agree with you. But the person saying that we were moving the goalposts and not remembering the original point is saying that it isn't important.
That it's fine.
So long as it is dark and darkness.

It makes even less sense when ATLA had the concept of Yin and Yang, essentially with the ocean and moon spirits. The idea of balance, right there, and somehow, the screw it up in the sequel series.
I mean, I guess you can blame the fact one of the writers for ATLA left, and the creators just didn't really know what they were doing after he was gone.

I really can't understand how anyone thinks Korra is as good or better than TLA. It's not even close, and I liked Korra. Korra is a 3.5/5, TLA is a 5/5. It's best animation was way better, but other than that it doesn't compete with TLA on any level.

>It makes even less sense when ATLA had the concept of Yin and Yang, essentially with the ocean and moon spirits. The idea of balance, right there, and somehow, the screw it up in the sequel series.

It had to be done otherwise the likes of Amon would be even more wrong.
To remove bending and make sure it never comes back would require getting rid of sources of bending. Waterbending can pop up in people like how it did Katara despite neither of her parents being benders. So to do this you have to kill the moon.
And in doing so you upset the balance by killing a spirit, a spirit that would be among those giving Amon his gift.

>Nickelodeon is a channel that works in children's programming.

Wait, WHAT? I'm watching BABY SHOWS?!

I understand it "had to be done" to fit in line with the new direction. I just very much dislike the new direction they took, and how many changes it made.

So it would be a lie and a fraud and built on lies and fraud and asked to be perpetuated through lies and frauds?

Okay sure. Go ahead and make that guy right and everyone else wrong for not trying to reach a consensus and see that bad things happen regardless of bending and that benders are subject to bad things too because people are people.

>having the devil now locked up inside the spirit of Order doesn't have spirits go wild so easily instead of being left to roam or sitting at The spiritual hot-spot of both worlds.

See, the thing that mentions is only part of this discrepancy. In AtLA, spirits are consistent. The spirits we see are all wholly animals, with the slight exceptions of the Painted Lady and Roku's Dragon which are still singular. They exude a noble atmosphere until their territories have been disturbed. Hei Bai goes rampage mode during the solstice when his forest is burned, Wan Shi Tong goes berserk at his library being disrespected yet again, the Ocean Spirit merges with Aang to unleash a fury the world has never seen since, and the only thing keeping the Painted Lady from doing likewise was that her territory was more corrupted than merely destroyed, what with the pollution and her being nature spirit. The spirit world is a mysteriously, twilit place that you travel to metaphysically, leaving your body behind and even then the only one seen actively doing that is the bridge between the worlds himself.

Legend of Korra can't even be consistent within its own seasons.
>"We are bonded forever" Raava says 6 episodes before being ripped apart
>how the fuck do we know dying in the Avatar State will destroy the Avatar if even Raava had no idea what fusing with a human would do, everything Raava says is basically unfounded
>bending in Wan's era is the only thing that can keep spirits at bay, yet in AtLA and even Korra for most of the season they're immune to all forms of bending save for the waterbending technique
>spirits literally "go dark" and are affected by the people around them for their anger instead of it being internally driven grudgemode
>the fucking Miyazaki knockoff parade and inconsistent presentation
>the entire humanity meeting the spirits and cooperating is skipped over

Didn't Azula drink wine? Have we ever seen Korra drink alcohol?

Well yeah. I'm not defending the source and disregard only how that one part that user mentioned could be handled. Granted it is like saving a tree during a forest fire. The changes made during Wan are a problem that many people overlook because it's Wan. Everything was shit.

Only yurifags and SJWs like Korra.

Half of SJW like it. The other half hate it.

And of course yurifags like it. Though I'd love to see what hoops they'd jump through to justify loving it if it didn't have a yuri ending.

100% this.
What's the point of spending time developing the Equalists as a political faction if you aren't going to even address them ever again. Did all those people just take their buddy's word for it that Amon was a sham?

It had good scenes, but none of it's arcs came close. In the end it's episodic nature hindered it as a series.

We can't let SJWs liking things ruin them for us, especially when the things they like about it are almost intangible in the source material.

I didn't watch korra after season 1. Did they ever have new styles of bending that arouse as a result of the nations mixing and people being exposed to the elements in new forms through industrialization? It was kind of happening in season 1, but there wasn't anything new, it was just old techniques becoming a lot more common.

>Did they ever have new styles of bending that arouse as a result of the nations mixing and people being exposed to the elements in new forms through industrialization
Kind of, in the sense that everything got mixed into a bland MMA "punch blast" style.

A generic evil empire that does vague evil things offscreen is neither dark nor mature.

Which is the problem. It trues to be mature and political but still using cartoonish villains and black-and-white morality.

That's the beauty of it. They spent time on love triangles, sports, and an island rather than developing the Equalists as a political faction in the first place. The Equalists were a terrorist group right off the bat, never had roots in non-violent politics.

Also movements and campaigns that happened in the past require people nowadays to take their buddy's word for it that history happened as it did.

Season 3 had an Earthbender called Ghazan who can make lava, Bolin learns the trick too, so that's a thing

No multi-element bending, but Earth got lavabending and Air got flight.

Mature movies like Bad Moms are much much better than movies for children like Toy Story

Nothing that was shown as the nation mixing bringing it about.
No one acted like lavabending was just invented when someone was throwing lava around in season 3. And a person flying on their own without a staff or air funnel around their legs is something that is ancient.

Nothing.

No, but your GIF gave me a good reason to download the 1080p upscales/remasters.

You're welcome!

Of course. Here's the "mature" version:

avatarabridged.com/episodes.html

Is another place I can watch this? Episode 4 doesn't seem to work for me.

TLA is 4-4.5/5. It's still really good, but people tend to ignore a lot of its flaws barring the big ones like chiropractor rock and lion turtles.

Honestly, I don't get this complaint. Plenty of benders in LoK use traditional stylings. It's like people didn't watch past book 1 of Korra.

Is that a problem? Because, at least, it worked way better.

Thanks, came here to post that.