The DCEU is finished

youtube.com/watch?v=FXpiRzumrVY

From the guy who bought your favorite video essay about why Marvel films suck. DC films have no character.

Where are you now DCucks.

Other urls found in this thread:

twitter.com/mikeklimo/status/659427006174638080
rottentomatoes.com/m/ghostbusters_2016/
twitter.com/scottderrickson/status/791121896100208640?ref_src=twsrc^tfw
youtu.be/dDMQ3tXNKgM?t=5m33s
twitter.com/NSFWRedditGif

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kek at how true this is

Even YouTube commenters get it right sometimes

>DCucks
Where are you now, OP? Banned.

People will bitch about the part of his argument pulled from Begins, but as for the rest of it? Pic related.

nope STILL HERE. DCucks can BTFO

If I ran DC's film department, I'd focus on low-key stories that addressed the main complaint against a lot of DC heroes (that they're bland compared to Marvel ones).

It's pointless for DC to try to out-Marvel Marvel.

The main weakness of Marvel film is obvious: most of its villains are weak, and it refuses to kill off any heroes or heroines of real significance.

Witness the de facto bloodless "Civil War".

I'd take the Gotham principle and apply it to the other heroes; fleshing out their antagonists, worlds and allies.

It's why Gotham is so much more fascinating than Metropolis. We don't get as much of a sense of how the city works.

>it refuses to kill off any heroes or heroines of real significance.

People whined when Quicksilver died, though. There's no winning with character deaths.

Since he died in his first movie exactly like most MCU and DCEU villains, Pa Kent, Jimmy, etc.

comic book fags whined

if they killed him and brought him back 10 minutes later, any gravitas his death had would go away (and it wasn't much to begin with)

Everyone whined. Everyone was excited to see MCU vs Fox Quicksilver, only Whedon threw in the towel in round one.

Wow. Marvel killed ONE heroic guy in God-Knows-How-Many movies, and we just met Mr. Disposable too.

He didn't have a bullseye totally painted on him at all.

I'm more mad at Marvel got rid of Edward James Olmos.

It's Edward James Olmos, the master of being a soft-spoken badass! He could drive Coulson out of a room by just speaking in a whisper.

Pietro isn't disposable, stop stroking Whedon's head.

pls don't bully the Bob. :(
It's bad enough they'll never give him a movie

>and it refuses to kill off any heroes or heroines of real significance.
>Witness the de facto bloodless "Civil War".
> # #

Sup Forums fucking hates hero vs hero conflict, and you want to make them kill each other?

They've fought a ton of villains and the bad guys can't kill one hero? How am I supposed to be impressed with these "ultimate evils"?

>Pietro isn't disposable
He kinda is.
Like, definitively.
Worst 'core' Avenger.

I don't approve of hero vs hero stuff, which is why we had fifty thousand Marvel villains appear in the films beforehand (and not one of them could kill a hero apparently).

Disposable. Disposable. Disposable. He appears briefly in one film. He has a minimum of connection to the existing heroes. He's an antagonist for part of the film.

You might as well write "Dead Man Walking" on his clothing.

Sup Forums hates action in all forms and would make both the MCU and DC films lighthearted comedies where the heroes and villains gather at a coffee shop and quip and snark at one another.

Sup Forums's opinion on anything should be taken into account for nothing.

Good villains can be a legitimate threat. But Marvel keeps nerfing its bad guys so they can't do a thing right.

All it does is kill them off.

Get lost.

Whedon shot an alternate ending where he lived

Superman does change. The whole beginning of him saving people is that he's not staying around because he doesn't know if he should let the world know his existence. By the end of movie he doesn't disappear after Zod, he becomes part of that world. He also grew by the end because before he didn't even though if he wanted to be thought as human. After meeting Zod he knew which people he care about more. Did this faggot miss the whole "Kryton had it's chance" line?
>Nitpicking the truck and drone scene
Truck scene was joke. Government don't deserve the right to spy on Superman because he's an alien.

Superman helps people because the same people of earth helped him by raising him. How dumb is this nigga? Also the Kent argument has been proven that he didn't want Clark to let the kids to die he just wanted him to think about the outcomes of using his power how saving a handful of kids could affect world in a negative sense in a much better way and in BvS that is proven to be true with Batman and Lex. Fuck even in the comics most Super villains threats wouldn't be a thing if heroes didn't exist.

You do see what he wants. He wants to know about himself, his people and where he stands in the world. He's thinking that if he learns about his alien origins.(which why he was looking for the ship.) he will know what to do with his life.

This person is beyond retarded.

Truthfully the problem with Superman isn't that he doesn't change. It's that we don't have enough of a sense of his city. Crime didn't vanish because Superman appeared in Metropolis, it just became under-the-radar and sophisticated.

the fuck Sentry has to do with console wars you unbearable autists

yeah I agree with you, but expect people like
to do mental gymnastics to disagree with you. Like seriously his argument is

>well the problem isnt actually what the thread is about its something else entirely!

I have my own issues with Superman. Unlike Batman's Gotham, I don't have a real sense of Superman's Metropolis so I can't suspend my disbelief.

A hero is only as good as the world surrounding him.

Way too often, Metropolis is just the offices of the Daily Planet and Lex Luthor.

>Government don't deserve the right to spy on Superman because he's an alien.

Yes they have, considering that he conquer the world on Knightmare, basically showing that Clark is not far away from insanity.

This is autism and again, mental gymnastics just because you just have to be right. We don't get any idea at all of any of the cities in the Marvel movies, where are you bitching about that?

>because of one paranoid man's dream the government has the right to spy on a superhero

what the fuck, are you crazy?

That was the future, not a dream.

They don't' deserve the right. You can't take away someones rights before committing any wrong. Also Knightmare Superman is a different Clark, we don't know what happened. We know Lois died and Batman may had killed her, but don't know what went down for Clark to be working with Darkseid. For all we know it's was Darkseid(his sign and parademons.) that did something to Superman and uses Lois's death to channel his madness.

it was a dream dumbass

also

>what are possible futures
>what are parallel worlds

come on this is DC we are talking about, and again, one man's dream does not give the government the right to spy on anyone. The current Action Comics arc, RIGHT NOW, is Superman defending Luthor who is accused of FUTURE CRIME.


God you are a dumb mother fucker.

Why do people want Marvel and DC to make the exact same kind of movies? Let marvel make their forgettable popcorn movies, let DC do the 2deep4u shit, let Valiant do the schlocky B-Movies. Everyone gets something.

there he is

the only DCuck in the world keep fighting slugger

>implying rotten tomatoes means anything

twitter.com/mikeklimo/status/659427006174638080 (embed)


rottentomatoes.com/m/ghostbusters_2016/


From the director of Strange himself: twitter.com/scottderrickson/status/791121896100208640?ref_src=twsrc^tfw (embed)

.The whole beginning of him saving people is that he's not staying around because he doesn't know if he should let the world know his existence

Which doesn't mean anything because we have no frame of reference for who he is as an adult.

>but the flashbacks

And? Those flashbacks lay the groundwork, but the actual character establishment of who he is as a grown adult instead of a teenager never come. He's a hunky loner with no purpose, but they can't even really relay that properly because the first act is a Lois Lane film that features Superman, so he's a ghost she has to track.

And once we're done with hat, his ENTIRE personality is defined by his conversations with his father and Zod, making him play a game of Musical Chairs with father figures until it's time for the action scenes to start.

The only part of the film where he's an actual character with an externalised personality is the last ten minutes, all of which is rendered meaningless two minutes into BvS because apparently a bunch of life-changing shit happened to make him depressed in-between the films and we missed all of it, turning his major character turn into a glorified montage.

Because DC does 2deep4u poorly. Snyder treats his themes as excuses to cram more of his violent fetish objects into the action, not to actually explore anything interesting.

And Suicide Squad was a wet fart. Ayer never had a chance to make something interesting with the suits tearing his production to shreds.

Nah, I like the DCEU too im that guy. But one thing that really bothers me is when DCEU defenders use some argument or well thought out points, and people use the rotten tomatoes rhetoric of "its bad it, it just is" without any form of critical thinking.

>Which doesn't mean anything because we have no frame of reference for who he is as an adult.

Thats not true at all, we see him wondering, we see him defend the woman, we see him saving people from the oil rig selflessly, we have him even saving Lois. Just because you cant understand what saving people means doesnt mean others cant.


>but the actual character establishment of who he is as a grown adult instead of a teenager never come.

Yeah it did, through actions, but I supposed those are too hard for you to understand, you need smarmy quips or exposition?

>The only part of the film where he's an actual character with an externalised personality is the last ten minutes, all of which is rendered meaningless two minutes into BvS because apparently a bunch of life-changing shit happened to make him depressed


Haha what? first learn to spell, second he doesn't get sad until after the senate bombing or when people are praising him like a god, which Superman SHOULD be against dummy.

>turning his major character turn into a glorified montage.
Him just saving people from natural disaster is not his character at all, thats not a character, those are actions. You don't know what you are talking about.

> to cram more of his violent fetish objects

More proof you have no clue what you are typing and are a frothing at the mouth shitposter

Did Joss Whedon make this after everyone bullied him because of Trump?

Compare Snyder to Whedon or Ayer to any of the other cucks. DCDomination nigga

DCcucks need to learn that no-one cares about console wars. We would love to have good DC movies. No need to defend uttershit.

The only problem with 2deep4u movies is that it isn't really that deep. It's shallow as fuck. It's literally a 13 year Olds view on what deep probably loos like.

BvS and MoS are good though, and BvS is a genuinely deep movie.

>inb5 jesus analogues

no one is a jesus analogue in it

Literally everyone gets this but Warner. They are a soul less robot wondering why people don't like their movies despite having BATMAN

I feel pity for you and your delusion.

>I dont have an argument but you're wrong
see

>we see him defend the woman, we see him saving people from the oil rig selflessly, we have him even saving Lois

"saving people" isn't character, it's actions without context. Even the real human bean from Drive got a groundwork established for his character and he's an autist who has twelve lines of dialogue. Even fucking Jason Bourne in Identity, a character who is defined by the fact that he HAS no background to work with is established by having a Marie to talk to and give his lack of character into a character into itself.

Clark is nothing. He's a folk tale and flashbacks for the first half, and searching for a father figure in the middle, and a CGI cape in the finale. He's a guy looking for a character and doesn't get one until the very end, because Snyder loved Batman Begins and thought he knew what made the flashback structure work in that movie despite utterly failing at copying it.

nah, see

are you being intentionally retarded? You called saving people his character in your very first post

>but the actual character establishment of who he is as a grown adult instead of a teenager never come.


But Clark gets plenty of background and context, we see how he is raised, we see that he wants to do good and struggles with how best to do that, even from a young age, we see him as an adult trying to do good and again struggling/making mistakes (destroying a truck so a guy wont be an ass v saving people from an oil rig), we see that he is a bit of a loner but will always sacrifice what he must to save people (hence him saving Lois), we see that he wants to know where he came from (set up in the flashback when he finds out he is an alien, and expanded upon when he finds his kryptonian ship).


He does have character, sorry you need exposition to lay it out for you.

>The whole beginning of him saving people is that he's not staying around because he doesn't know if he should let the world know his existence. By the end of movie he doesn't disappear after Zod, he becomes part of that world


reading comprehension is hard for you isnt it? This is what we call a character arc.

>He does have character, sorry you need exposition to lay it out for you.

The squawk of the DCEU fanboy, it's amazing that you people repeat this and expect to be treated like anything other then children. Do you have any idea how quickly you'd be laughed at if you tried that in an actual big-boy conversation?

It's meaningless, you could use it to defend it every piece of art ever made regardless of quality.

"Saving the world" is not a fucking character arc, it's a joke motivation. Whatever struggles he had about his parentage were cleared up when Double Hitler decided to genocide billions of people which made it really fucking easy for him to pick sides. The Tick was making jokes about it years ago.

>Oh no, the world?! But that's where I keep all my stuff!

There's no emotional stakes to the third act of the film. The finale of Batman Begins works because we had a long, established relationship between Bruce and Ducard so "confronting his history" actually worked. Clark knew Zod for three hours before the third act started.

You might as well claim that Suicide Squad had a decent character arc.

see
>But one thing that really bothers me is when DCEU defenders use some argument or well thought out points, and people use the rotten tomatoes rhetoric of "its bad it, it just is" without any form of critical thinking.


way to ignore the post and just strawman.


Also YOU are the one who said

Meant to say YOU are the one who said

>but the actual character establishment of who he is as a grown adult instead of a teenager never come.

implying saving the world is his character, you cant even get your own facts straight kek

>The government doesn't have the right to spy on him because he's an alien
Yes they do.

>Whatever struggles he had about his parentage were cleared up when Double Hitler decided to genocide billions of people which made it really fucking easy for him to pick sides

You are an idiot, the point wasnt that he was going to defeat Zod the point was he condemned his entire race, the last chance Krypton had, in favor of humans. He was decidedly becoming a human.

Also why are you so obsessed with Batman Begins? No one is talking about it but you.

No, they don't. They don't in the comics either. Secret Identity is literally all about how they don't have that right. Read comics kid.

> He was decidedly becoming a human.

Becuase the non-humans were going to nuke the world.

And he condemned his race because Zod and his Power Rangers were the only examples of his world he has.

>Also why are you so obsessed with Batman Begins?

Because it's a serious DC movie that does all the shit MoS does but well.

>Becuase the non-humans were going to nuke the world.


Again, thats not the point, the point was that he condemned the entire Kryptonian race, locking its last survivors away in a dimension he has no access to.
>And he condemned his race because Zod and his Power Rangers were the only examples of his world he has.


Wow, see confirmed for never watching the movie. He talks to Jor-El multiple times and even sees a whole history of his people. Hence him knowing that Zod and his people had the potential to be good (after all Jor-El and his wife were able to overcome their programming)
Come on, get some real arguments.

>this Batman movie is my favorite Superman movie

confirmed for not liking Superman

>he wants a Superman movie to take cues from a Batman movie

holy kek what? read comics kid.

No you, this is a board about comics and cartoons, go back to your own damn board and bitch about it there.

Sure is comics and cartoons here. Reported.

Yes they do user. An illegal alien with the power to destroy the world is something the government deserves to study.
>B-But comic books
Are generally not trying to be realistic like the shit snyder films.
>Kid
Oh wow, tough guy over here. Especially funny since you are defending a shit film.

>a movie about aliens invading who look like humans and can fly and shoot laser is trying to be realistic

kek no its not, its trying to have to be realistic in portraying what humanity's reaction might be to such an event, but the movie itself is not realistic. And no, the government does not have the right. Read Secret Identity which, surprise, is literally set in "the real" world just with a Superman.
It doesn't surprise me that a MoS detractor doesn't read comics though.

Good analisys.

Warner should learn because EVERYBODY is saying that they fucked up and made something DBZ Evolution tier.

>Realistic in portaying human reaction
Oh, do how the government would realistically react by spying on him as they are allowed to since Supes isn't a real citizen.

>MoS fan
>Pretends to read comics
kek.
Keep shilling Snyder.

>confirmed for not liking Superman

I'm not that user, but after watching BvS I was so depressed and put-off, I went home and asked myself a question:
"Do I actually like Superman and Batman? Do I actually like the characters? Do I like their comics? What do I actually like about them?"

So I went a re-read Superman and Batman comics. I read Adventures of Superman, Legends of the Dark Knight, Superman/Batman, Batman/Superman, the classics like Year One and DKR, even Birthright, Secret Identity, and Geoff Johns' run on Superman, I even took a look at Justice and Kingdom Come.

The answer was yes. I do like the characters. I like the composite of them that exists in my mind from all those writers that have contributed their voice to the character over the years.

I see very little worth liking in MoS and BvS. I'm not interested in seeing suffering or apathy or demoralization from superheroes. They are meant to learn from their strife, not languish and compromise.

>12 min to say "DC movies are bad because WB doesn't know and has never known how to make a super hero film"

no need to watch it. just ream my post right there.

That's Marvel's loss they don't bother to flesh out the environments more.

Too bad he's completely wrong and literally says that he's going to ignore all comments that prove otherwise.

He literally JUST did this to "balance the scales." Basically DC has no problems so he had to make something up.

>DC has no problems
HAHAHAHAHA

>DC has no problems

They're wasting time trying to out-Marvel Marvel, when they should be playing to their own strengths.

Marvel films have almost universally bad villains, DC should not copy this mistake.

they don't know how to make movies at all

The DCEU films have universally bad villains. Joker and Lex are just utterly abysmal, Doomsday is The Abomination with worse CGI, Faora is a baseball bat with a frowny face, Zod is mediocre and Enchantress is as bad as any Marvel villain.

At least the MCU has Loki.

>using 'literally" twice in the same paragraph

There's nothing technically wrong with that, but for some reason it irks me.

Sup Forums should be gassed.

lol. yeah, thats true to.......;_;

I wish someone else would make these movies. almost anyone. I really feel like I could write a better superman or batman movie.

>Oh, do how the government would realistically react by spying on him as they are allowed to since Supes isn't a real citizen.

But he is, he has birth documents and a social security number, also yeah its realistic in that is shows the government trying to spy on him, but Superman comes in and having gained their trust, they stop doing so.


And yes, unlike you im actually able to name comics to back myself up.

>Birth documents
He was born on another planet. How did he register to become a citizen?

So 4 Superman villains. What a shock.

yup. Lex could have been a good villain that should have been in every movie, but never went toe to toe with the hero until maybe a trinity movie.

No he has faked birth documents. Superman is not a citizen of the USA.

The government will spy on US citizens with links to terror groups. Why wouldn't they spy on an alien who can destroy buildings with his eyes?

But they do learn from their strife, the whole moving is learning from their strife, or did you miss Superman's whole arc in regards to Batman where he learns to trust and be honest with him? Superman's whole motivation in the movie is trying to do good due to his unwavering belief in humanity. Literally the whole crisis of faith Superman has is whether or not his heroism is actually helping humanity is is a detriment to them. This superman is a pure waifu.
Please point out where all the languish and compromise? Where Batman learns to believe in humanity again? Where the world learns to believe in Superman?

>the Lex that actually manages to kill Superman is a bad villain
>Doomsday having more thematic relevance to Superman than ever before is a bad monster villain


lol no

Because he saved the world and they trust him, the movie literally explains this.

The same way he does in the comics, his parents fake em or claim he was born in their home.

They don't need to fake anything. He would be covered by foundling laws regardless.

>I see very little worth liking in MoS and BvS.
So you don't like Superman whose every action is based on trying to do the most good for humanity? You dont like seeing a new side of Batman where he crossed his line and see whether or not he can come back from that?


See, I love these movies because they build on those very composites you mention. Instead of regurgitating whats come before, they take whats come before and build on it, tell new versions of old stories or re-contextualize, just like comics like Kingdom Come and Birthright do.

Fuck off, faggot

>But they do learn from their strife, the whole moving is learning from their strife, or did you miss Superman's whole arc in regards to Batman where he learns to trust and be honest with him?

They're friends for like three minutes when batman discovers their moms have the same name. Superman then dies fighting Doomsday which batman or Wonder Woman could have done better.

I'ts contrived and unearned and melodramtic

>Superman's whole motivation in the movie is trying to do good due to his unwavering belief in humanity. Literally the whole crisis of faith Superman has is whether or not his heroism is actually helping humanity is is a detriment to them. This superman is a pure waifu.

He actually only seems to like his mom and Lois and seems overall perplexed that he's polarizing to other people. He seems utterly indifferent to collateral damage or that's he's always a reactive, passive presence who never speaks out and is baffled why people are confused.

>Please point out where all the languish and compromise?

Snapping Zod's neck
Letting Pa Kent die for a dog
Kissing in the aftermath of super 9/11
ghost dad telling him to let horses drown

>Where Batman learns to believe in humanity again?

Yeah, after spending years trying to kill Superman.

>Where the world learns to believe in Superman?

That just wanted a martyr; a statue to raise.

lol. it could have been any one that killed superman, it didn't matter who it was because superman dieing is supposed to be such a big deal, bu in this movie it felt completely empty and abrupt. This lex luther was barely lex luther, and was also barely in the movie. he had no presence at all.

BvS was not good. MoS was not good. SS was a train wreck. I HOPE WW is good, and JL will probably be underwhelming also.

>So you don't like Superman whose every action is based on trying to do the most good for humanity?

He mindlessly saves people and never takes a proactive approach to improving the world, nor does he ever speak out to address the fear and confusion people have about him. He remains a mute for no purposes other than causing drama.

>You dont like seeing a new side of Batman where he crossed his line and see whether or not he can come back from that?

Batman having a midlife crisis about whether his war on crime actually amounted to something belonged in a different movie, not married to his quest to destroy superman for his role in the DC equivalent of 9/11. Batman fairs better in BvS, but it's still inconsistent.

>See, I love these movies because they build on those very composites you mention. Instead of regurgitating whats come before, they take whats come before and build on it, tell new versions of old stories or re-contextualize, just like comics like Kingdom Come and Birthright do.

I don't see anything worth liking about Superman's behavior in those movies. He's cold and indifferent and never voices concern for the safety or well-being of others. He just seems to work like a janitor cleaning up after disasters.

His kindness and empathy are never brought up.

I feel like these moves are a bunch of very colorful and well drawn comic book panels with no speech bubbles and no writing in them at all. A series of pictures. The people that hate it hate because they see it has no story. the people that love it do so because they have projected a good story onto it.

Which is nice and all, but technically speaking, these series of moving pictures have no story. no characters, nothing human, nothing that really means anything in them.

But the execution of all of this is atrocious and an insult to anyone with a brain. Snyderags usually appear to be autistic because they like the concept of something without having any idea that execution is important.

To be fair, it was a special kind of ball.
Not the normal retardball, but rather a "no trust ball".
Superman doesn't trust Bat or Wondy to do the job, even if Wondy would actually murder the shit out of Doomsday far faster than what Kent can even attempt

he is not wrong but Captain Kristian explained it better and in his case it wasn't even the main subject of that video.
youtu.be/dDMQ3tXNKgM?t=5m33s

>They're friends for like three minutes when batman discovers their moms have the same name. Superman then dies fighting Doomsday which batman or Wonder Woman could have done better.

Confirmed for not watching the movie. Re-watch the scene, even when Superman says Martha, Batman has his foot on his throat and is pointing the kryptonite spear at his face. Its not until Lois (whom Flash/a dream had previously told him is the key) comes and explains its his mother and Batman can see that Superman is a man with human connections does he stop fighting him. Its not contrived at all, its the core of Batman's arc, him projecting his own lack of ties to humanity onto Superman.

Also Wonder Woman had Doomsday distracted/tied down with her lasso and Batman couldnt get anywhere near Doomsday. Come on, try to have some original, non-bait complaints. Also none of them could have gotten to the spear and back in time.

>He actually only seems to like his mom and Lois and seems overall perplexed that he's polarizing to other people. He seems utterly indifferent to collateral damage or that's he's always a reactive, passive presence who never speaks out and is baffled why people are confused.

What the fuck are you talking about? Of course he is worried about collateral damage, he isnt perplexed at all that he is polarizing people, he knew this would happen, he just wishes it wouldnt and wants to know if he can truly do good. And Superheroes ARE always reactive, you are literally complaining about the core tenant of being a superhero. In fact there was a whole Civil War fought in the marvel universe over people trying to be pro-active and stopping crime before it happened.


None of the moments you mentioned are languish, in fact kissing is the opposite of languish, its finding solace in a moment of despair, and if you think Pa kent was telling him to let the horses drown than you are crazy.

I've never seen a more wrong, delusional post.