What is your stance on the "Street Leveled character vs. Super powered character" trope? It depend how it's written?

What is your stance on the "Street Leveled character vs. Super powered character" trope? It depend how it's written?

If it is like Steve vs Sentry. No, just no. Steve vs Pete is really really pushing it. "But my tactics!" Tactics can't stop overwhelming power, plus Pete is not an idiot.

no

street level vs superpowered is kinda who is vs who.

vs a supes level guy? no
vs a person with X powerset? maybe, depends on the character vs other character and powers involved

like, im sick as fuck of any speedster being tripped. holy shit, your going so fucking fast, you can't fucking look at your surroundings? you have near infinite time to counter shit!

It's always frustrating bullshit.

It's bs that make the characters lose the veneer that they may be more than products.

I think one of the worst for this is deadpool vs marvel universe.
Almost none of the kills made any sense

Consistently dumb.

I like Frank, but shrugging off a Penance Stare was the peak of bullshit.

Not his fault, blame Deacon.

if its written well then its not really a problem.

sadly, good writing is getting rarer and rarer

badass

It depends on how it's written, and the characters involved.

Like, say, if you've got Cyclops vs Captain America. That's pretty hard to make unacceptable bullshit. Cyclops' super-power is his eye beams, which Cap can block with his shield. Otherwise, arguably a close enough match that either way it goes it shouldn't rankle too much.

Then you've got your fights where it's Superman vs. Batman or something. It's really tough to make that work - it takes something like Frank Miller's set up to make it work. The book builds a lot to that fight, and Bruce has the deck stacked in every way for him - and it's still a fight that sparks debate.

Is that the one where superman goes easy on him until green arrow can kryptonite hime and then batman acts like he just kicked his ass?

This. It's still bullshit. Superman should still win in any circumstance

It's always stupid because the make the brute dumb as fuck and the street level dude "preptime" intelligence his way to victory.

>It depend how it's written?

No, it should never happen. Is just impossible to writte it in a non-idiotic way. Character that deflected bullets all his entire life won't suddenly get confused by some shots, also doesn't matter how low your center of gravity is or how much martial arts you know, you can't take down a guy that can lift a ship with a throw technique like you can't throw a building.

Street level should only face at most slightly enhanced characters

It's always dumb and panders to the writer's own personal fetish for the streetwise character.
It also made the annoying 'Prep time!' Meme of Batman.
It got annoying.

A gun puts someone about 2/3 the way up the superhero power chart. Almost all characters die when hit by a bullet.


The reason they aren't is writing. They'd all be dead by now except the bricks.

>you can't take down a guy that can lift a ship with a throw technique like you can't throw a building


lol fucking this.

Animated superhero movies drive me nuts with this kind of shit

that's true.
any sniper could kill most of them

>this happened
Technically not street level but still completely retarded.

He lost anyways so i don't see the problem.

Flash got shot by an assassin with a rifle once. When people complained, in the letters page they explained that the Flash, while fast, had normal human reflexes.

This was before auto-instant-enable-bullet time.

he twists the blade, too, that being the current rage in movies

a few panels later he's better.

Neither did flash

Depends on the power of the character. Frank could kill 90% of super powered characters with bullets or explosives.

Daredevil, Cyclops, Spider-Man, Iron Fist, Beast, Iceman, Scarlet Witch, all can be killed with standard stuff if caught unaware.

The bullshit comes in when it's massively powered/durable characters Luke Cage-ish? And above.

>Frank could kill 90% of super powered characters with bullets or explosives.
bullshit. That's bullshit and you know it.
He couldn't even kill 90% of the X-Men if a competent writer was writing.

>Spider-Man
I thought he had super-invulnerably?

Watching people get gibbed trying this was the best part of Uber

>if a competent writer
>writer
That's the thing -- supers vulnerable to bullets only continue to survive when statistically they'd all be pushing up the daisies because of "exciting writing".

I don't think it's beyond plausible. A .50 Cal rifle can blow a hole through armor plated vehicles. Beast, Cyclops, Iceman, Angel, Kitty Pryde, Psylocke, Emma Frost, Banshee, Nightcrawler, Warpath, Havok. None of those characters could take that kind of damage from 2+ miles away.

He also beat Lobo in nu52.

Goddamnit user. NOW I NEED NEW PANTS.

This is pretty much my stance on it

If you have a street level human vs. a guy with like one power then okay I can believe that with proper preparation and tactics he can overcome the disadvantage of being a baseline human e.g. Cap against Cyclops or Batman against Killer Croc

But a normal human versus any JLA level guys or high tier Avengers then no that ends up like or pic related without a tremendous amount of bullshit plot armor for the human

depends on the tech and tactics used, Deathstroke vs Superman made it work pretty well.

I love seeing the underdog beating the topdog, but it's written poorly most often.

Take for example DC's Prometheus. In his first appearance, he basically "fights" the whole JLA to a standstill with preparation, abusing a weakness (they're the good guys after all) and a bluff. It's just one issue but it's pretty plausible and only works so far (he loses in the end), but it was pretty badass on all accounts. I loved this.

In his pretty much last appearance he fights a whole bunch of superheroes, but instead of doing something that works on his level, it's basically a handwavy "insert magic gadget here", which was shit on all accounts.

It's funny because in the next panel Frank sends him flying.

What is this from? I want to read more

The thing is, if this is a 'genuine' story where this is little more than an element of a Superman focused plot, it's revealed that this is a distraction and totally not Bruce at all. I love Batman, but as long as he sells like 70% of their merch, he will always come out of top or at least survive.

For some reason I remember really liking Daredevil beating Absorbing Man by chipping away at him while he's in diamond form. I haven't read it in forever but it always stuck in my mind.

I haven't seen that but the concept makes me vomit with rage.
The absorbing man can go toe to toe with the motherfucking hulk.

That's some elite level bullshit right there

That was a Cary Nord one right? I liked that one. He just dodged around until he got Creel to take a form that had a fundamental weakness and then exploited it. They never acted like he wasn't completely outclassed.

Honestly, Daredevil is one of the few people I can accept this kinda shit for, because he has evasion hax and the perfect superpower set for exploiting opening. When it's pretty much any other street level I think it's total shit.

Though I also enjoyed the Nocenti Daredevil/Blackheart stuff, so I figure my opinion is worth nothing on /co

That page is from an issue that is basically two kids arguing over who would win in a fight Superman or Batman the first thing they have to do is take away the greatest weapons of the two characters Batman's ability to use kryptonite and Superman wanting to kill Batman

Because let's be honest if Supes wanted Bats dead he could just heat vision snipe him from the stratosphere and be done with it

That issue is interesting to read because of all the convoluted preptime meme bullshit batman has to make it to the end of the issue, like blocking out the sun with a swarm of bat robots

Superman always winning in any circumstance is bullshit.

Either the street levelled character is killed instantly, or you just don't fucking do it in the first place.

I would be more than happy if no one from the Bat family fought anyone from the Super family ever again.

Why people complain about preptime?

Superman has his bullshit powers that are just maximum because. That's his thing.
Batman has his bullshit preptime that always get him out of jam because. That's his thing.

Not to mention that Batman never wins the fights. He merely survives them.

Because when written poorly, he DOES win the fights. Do you remember the beginning of Batman Endgame, where Batman beat almost every member of the Justice League?

He barely survived and the only thing he managed to was momentarily stop them for their own good.

Ive read that deathstroke moves as fast the flash in maybe the first step they take.

so...maybe?