Adventure Time

>save and protect one little demon girl
>because of her protector demon girl grows up to be the protector of humans
>demon girl saves humans from being wiped out or enslaved by vampires
>humans go on to create Founders Island, the origin of Finn the Human
Simon's good heart literally saved the species.

Logic!!!!!!!

the lore in this show is so spread out I have no idea if what you are saying is sound or not

In Stakes Marcy told the Ice King he was the reason she killed all the vampires. The humans Marcy saved left Ooo to establish themselves off the continent somewhere. They are presumably the Founders of Founders Island, the last human colony on Earth. Simon therefore saved humanity by being a decent human being.

It hasn't been stated, but it all fits together well and I find it so damn interesting that the original antagonist of the show turned out to indirectly be the savior of humanity and the whole reason the protagonist exists in the first place.

Wait a minuter, are you trying to make cry again?

I just finished Islands.
Just fucking wow.

I'm really glad they finally gave us some answers after leaving a thousand loose ends and cliff hangers. I think Minerva is awesome. I thought Martin was telling the truth about Finn being born on a boat, but i guess it could be partially true due to his foggy memory. It's neat to see Martin actually didn't want to leave Finn, though.

What I really want to see is Betty give Simon his sanity back, but that probably won't happen. Hopefully soon they start to tie off that loose end, giving us some answers.

We saw the manifestation of the Ice King in the distant future. It was just a flapping beard with a long nose and jewels for eyes, as if it wasn't a human anymore and just the features the crown imprints onto whoever wears it.

My headcanon is that Betty removes the crown and left on its own long enough the crown itself gains the iconic Ice King features.

>>because of her protector demon girl grows up to be the protector of humans
>>demon girl saves humans from being wiped out or enslaved by vampires

When did this happen?

Good point!
Do you suppose that it's the original Gunther's entity, or Simon's immortality?

Stakes miniseries, season 7.

Stakes

>The humans Marcy saved left Ooo to establish themselves off the continent somewhere. They are presumably the Founders of Founders Island
Nigga, in Islands Pt. 6: "Min and Marty", there was a fucking statue of Two Bread Tom, who was first introduced as basically being the leader of the humans fleeing from vampires, ooozers, rainicorns, etc. in the Stakes miniseries.

I don't know what you mean.

I was saying my headcanon is that Betty removes the crown and the crown gains a mind of its own, becoming a weird flapping beard creature with a long nose and jewels for eyes.

Ah, so I guess the OP is less supposition than actual canon. Simon saved humanity.

That's what I meant by Gunther.
Gunther and Evergreen created the original crown. Seems like the crown is a manifestation of Gunthers insecurities as his sorcerers apprentice, which causesnthe bearer of the crown to be unhinged and awkward.

What I couldn't figure out is if the flying beard-crown-thing is Simon long after the extinction of Ooo, or like you said, a "canon ending".

It doesn't seem like Pen goves us canons, though. I though Finn would meet Minerva in the flesh.

Ah. I shouldn't have skipped that but I just found marceline so boring

The crown is more accurately the way Gunther sees Evergreen. Gunther's one wish was that he could be like Evergreen, he saw Evergreen as an exaggerated jerk, and thus the crown turns the wearer into an exaggerated jerk version of Evergreen.

Stakes was fucking great, bro. It's almost universally praised.

Except for he last episode, that was bullshit. Oh, and all the Finn and Jake jobbing.

Finn was objectively hilarious in every fight. He's the sole reason Stakes was more funny than Islands.

"The Dark Cloud" had really nice visuals thanks to Tom Herpich and possibly Steve Wolfhard, but the ending ultimately made the whole miniseries feel pointless.

Finn & Jake were fuckin' hilarious, though (aside from the extended burping scene at the beginning of "Take Her Back").

>I'M A *ppppffffff* STUPID *ppppfffff* VAMPIRE *ppppffff* *ppppfffff*

It's best to think of the miniseries as its own thing. From that perspective, the ending was quite satisfying.

I just want to take a moment to give praise to the phenomenal voice acting that contributed to Islands overall greatness.
I mean I really felt for all of the characters.
And Minerva?
Despite her short time on screen, I absolutely adored her character.

Islands was truly great.

Now I only wish the SU crew could find a way to make Steven sound less annoying, so I could maybe give as much of about a crap him as I do Finn.

I loved Pep Butler's role in the story of Stakes.
Honestly love how much he's been involved in the show as of late.

This scene broke my heart.

That's why Nemesis is one of my favorite episodes of season 6. I'd love to know to more about Pep Butt's association with dark magic.

She got a dumpy ass

Whoa, I just noticed. The last episode of Stakes is called "The Dark Cloud", and the last episode of Islands is called "The Light Cloud".

Pottery.

The Ass Was Fat

I haven't watched islands yet, I'm assuming they give more details about finn's father right?
He was an awesome character so I was hoping to see a backstory

It does give some backstory to Finn's dad yeah.

It's worth noting that the Ice Thing only has two of the jewels.

forced glurge garbage
everything is MUH FEELS and MUH INTERCONNECTED LORE

Neither of those things is the focus of Adventure Time. Besides, feels and lore are not bad if executed right, and this miniseries delivered in spades.

That, or it's the crown animating part of the living Simon, after Betty seperates him from it like cleaving off a tumorous growth, only this tumorous growth has the ability to magically force itself to live.

What is Ice Thing any way? Did Betty fail in curing Simon? Or did the crown take on a life of its own once Simon died/ was seperated from it?

Nobody knows. Everything about that episode is up for speculation.

It's kind of sad though, that bot Finn and Minerva will forever belieive Martin Kidnapped him then abandoned her.

Even if Minerva is able to see what Martin did in the database, all she'll see is martin fighting the Guardian to escape.

she'll forever live with a sense of betrayal.

I think the founders are more than mere stragglers. However I do think that the humans reached founder's isle. Perhaps the older population was living their VR life.

>It hasn't been stated, but it all fits together well and I find it so damn interesting that the original antagonist of the show turned out to indirectly be the savior of humanity


Nigga, the same happened on the Farmworld.

Simon is by far one of the most altruistic and heroic heroes of this show.

I hope he doesn't have a very happy ending.

I really thought they would see some footage or memories of Martin that would make them both understand the truth. Nothing but bittersweet memories and doubt for them.

> the founders are more than mere stragglers
Pretty sure the founders ARE the humans who first settled on the islands. Later the society simply overglorified them for propagandistic purposes (in the movie dr Gross shows to young seekers they are portrayed as angels bathing in divine light).

Was one of the founders Irish? How did they preserve different cultures?

god islands was garbage though

Its cool once you watch it all and are able to look back and think about it as one big thing, but it just sucked going through it

No you're garbage, Islands is the only good thing to come out of adventure time in YEARS.

it would be cruel but fitting if he doesnt get what he deserves

...

Where did you get those opinions? from the trash?

I think she's just #1 at #2

It's nice if this is true, but I honestly wanted the founders to have an independent origin. If this theory is indeed true then that would mean if ice king just so happened to not raise marcy, humanity is doomed. Circumstances like that always scared me, where a seemingly tiny or trivial thing can have major effects

I like the idea that relatively small acts have indirect, far reaching, and similarly natured consequences. Anyone can be the straw that saves or breaks the camels back. That's why I like the movie Cloud Atlas.

soon

>I hope he doesn't have a very happy ending.
THE FUCK IS YOUR PROBLEM, BRAH?

>tell Finn they are too unique and awesome for sex
>fucks Finn's grass clone
DON'T YOU DARE!

...

I like this bear dog, she's a nice bear dog. I need at least, 30 more pics of fin schmoozin this bear dog

Islands was just kinda meh. Better than most recent AT but still just kinda strange and lacking in the basic building blocks of a story. You can't fill 50% of your run-time with dancing and exclamations - use that time to have some actual conflict that lasts more than 5 seconds for once.

Also Martin actually being Finn's dad instead of a random huckster that took advantage of the situation when they met is FUCKING RETARDED

Finally caught up after abandoning the show at the end of S6. I saw so many positive feedback about Stakes and especially Islands that I had to give it a go again. And boy am I glad I did.

Holy fuck especially during Islands I teared up a few times (and I'm usually not over emotional). I'm fucking back on the hype train and can't wait to see what will happen next!

lol u dumb

>You can't fill 50% of your run-time with dancing and exclamations - use that time to have some actual conflict that lasts more than 5 seconds for once.
What episodes were you watching, because it wasn't Islands.

>what episodes were you watching
That literally describes all of AT.

In terms of the more egregious examples:
-Invitation
-Whipple
-Imaginary resources
-helpers
-light cloud

Also they spent the last few episodes building a totalitarian ruler for Finn to beat/convince and get the humans off the islands but that would require maybe thinking about how that would effect Ooo's status quo so nevermind lol

Martin really being Finn's dad will never not be the dumbest ever

damn look at those stigmas

She isn't a totalitarian ruler. She was just the manager of the helpers who was desperate to protect her boy and by extension the entire island who she has to protect on a day to day basis.

>She isn't a totalitarian ruler
Well lets see
>controls all resources on the island
>won't let anyone leave
>when there was a chance people would leave she jumped to forcibly digitizing the entire human race
Whether or not she's totalitarian is irrelevant to the point, but she absolutely was.

You can be beneficial leader and still be totalitarian.

>still no Finn X Minerva ss

WHY

>controls all resources on the island
What resources?
>won't let anyone leave
The entire civilization was built up around not letting people leave for 1000 years. She didn't make the laws.
>when there was a chance people would leave she jumped to forcibly digitizing the entire human race
Yes, the point is that she overreacted because she is a fragile eggshell about to lose her boy a second time, also the citizens were going to break the founding principle of Founder's Island. She was helping them in the only way she could at the time, from her point of view.

To even call her a ruler, let a lone a totalitarian ruler, seems like a mischaracterization of her role. It's all more like an anarchistic commune where there is no single authority, but she is the one with the robot army so her interpretation is what gets enforced in this select emergency case that happens to involve her son.

Don't make it weird. The episodes haven't even come out on CN yet.

>Martin really being Finn's dad will never not be the dumbest ever

What makes you say that?

>use that time to have some actual conflict

What a bizarre criticism. It's just objectively wrong to say there is no 'actual conflict' in Islands.

>Invitation
Ignoring the fight with the giant fucking robot, this episode sets up the ongoing internal, emotional conflict that Finn goes through across the miniseries.

>Whipple
Same deal. Also the external conflict with the Dragon itself, and the seeds of brewing internal conflict with Susan.

>Imaginary resources

This episode is about the conflict between a 'better' virtual reality and the real world. While the virtual reality might give us immediate pleasures, they come at the expense of our humanity and connections in the real world (as shown with BMO).

>helpers
>light cloud

I'm not even gonna bother with these two.

>Martin really being Finn's dad will never not be the dumbest ever

What? Why? You would want the writers to just take away all significance of Martin's character arc and its impact on Finn in season 6? Now THAT is retarded.

>comes up with headcanon that Martin isn't actually Finn's dad
>hates the episodes that spoil ludicrous headcanon
This is why you don't put any of your eggs in imaginary baskets.

>changing the person's argument so you can argue a fake version of it
>equivocating a term with as broad a group of meanings as "conflict"
Cool story, bro.

>What makes you say that
His introduction as a con man who had no recollection of Finn - He could've (and should've) been any random asshole stuck in the citadel using Finn to escape. Making him really truly Finn's dad is just fucking lazy.

I'm gonna need you to go look up the meaning of the terms "totalitarian" and "ruler", buck-o.

>hurr headcanon
I don't make "headcanon" because I'm not 12.

>I don't make "headcanon" because I'm not 12.
Then you don't know what headcanon is because you obviously had one about Martin not being Finn's real father. You speculated and prefered your speculation over possible alternatives. That's headcanon.

That would be dumb though, the point of Martin was that he was a shitty dad who didn't care about Finn at all but he was always Finn's actual dad, it was a message that just because someone's related to you doesn't mean that they have to be a good person or care about you, and this worked fine.

I think they damaged this moral considering that Martin used to be a decent dad who fucked things up for reasons that weren't his fault but just making him a random schmuck would be stupid and make all the parts with Finn trying to reason with him and eventually accepting that he's the way he is totally pointless.

>Cool story, bro.

It's obvious you have no idea what conflict means narratively speaking. You made a claim, and I refuted it. Don't blame me for 'changing your argument' because you don't understand what you're talking about.

>I'm gonna need you to go look up the meaning of the terms "totalitarian" and "ruler", buck-o.
It's a mischaracterization of her role. Just because one has the capability of ruing doesn't mean they are the ruler. Technically some generals can take over countries in emergency situations. That doesn't mean they should be labeled rulers.

>I think they damaged this moral considering that Martin used to be a decent dad who fucked things up for reasons that weren't his fault
I don't agree with that statement at all. Obviously he had some good in him else why would Finn's necessarily altruistic mother be with him? The fact remains is that Martin is a bad dad NOW. That's the only thing that matters. It's not like his good intentions in the past absolve him of being a bad father.

>You speculated and prefered your speculation over possible alternatives. That's headcanon.
Jesus christ what the fuck happened to this board.

It's fucking fiction. Saying it would be a better story if X had happened instead isn't "headcanon" you mongoloid.

>it was a message that
No. This is Adventure Time. Don't take life lessons from Adventure Time please.

>It's a mischaracterization of her role.
It's really not. She has control over the island and exerts that control on screen.

He was the only other human Finn knew existed, he didn't have to be his dad for any of that to work.

It's obvious that you're illiterate and a victim of the dunning-kruger effect. Enjoy combating invented arguments.

>It's fucking fiction. Saying it would be a better story if X had happened instead isn't "headcanon" you mongoloid.
It literally is.

>why would Finn's necessarily altruistic mother be with him?
Because he was funny and charming despite the fact that he was a shitty conman and she felt bad for him, and she seemed to have been able to make him into something resembling a decent man when they got together.
None of those mean he was actually a good guy though.

Considering the huge disparity between Islands Martin and the rest of Martin I think a lot of stuff had to happen to him in those 15 years so I don't think he can be blamed for it.

That's not how it worked though, Martin's story was explicitly about family and not species, he had to be Finn's dad for it to work. If he wasn't then he would have only had as much importance as any other human/pseudo human in the show and Finn wouldn't have placed so much importance on him.

Headcanon: Used by followers of various media of entertainment, such as television shows, movies, books, etc. to note a particular belief which has not been used in the universe of whatever program or story they follow, but seems to make sense to that particular individual, and as such is adopted as a sort of "personal canon".

Now stop being so fucking retarded

>It's really not. She has control over the island and exerts that control on screen.
You are reading too much into it. It wasn't supposed to be a political drama. It was supposed to be a helper trying to help people in a way they didn't want to be helped, like a mother not listening to her children. You wanting to watch a political drama is all well and good but holding it against the show that it didn't conform to this oddly specific plotline that you just came up with is weird.

>That's not how it worked though
you...you know it's fiction, right?

Made up. Didn't happen.

It's like I'm arguing in a Man of Steel thread again

> a totalitarian ruler
> how that would effect Ooo's status quo
The fact that Minerva is a (seemigly benevolent) dictator of a (seemingly just) totalitarian state doesn't have to affect anything in Ooo. A totalitarian state can be completely isolationist (as it is in Islands) and indifferent to any contact with the rest of Ooo.

>says him believing Martin isn't Finn's dad is by definition not headcanon
>proceeds to give definition that proves that it IS headcanon
>claims victory

>You are reading too much into it. It wasn't supposed to be a political drama.
>You wanting to watch a political drama
Jesus christ you kids need some fucking reading comprehension classes.

The point wasn't that it needed to be a "political drama" the point was that the whole thing about getting humans not to live ruled by fear gets thrown out at the last minute like every other plot point in Adventure Time because it would pose even a minor challenge to writers in future episodes.

You're both pedantic AND incorrect.

Are you fucking dumb dude, I'm not saying Adventure Time is real life but the stories it presents did happen in the show and you're complaining that the meaning wasn't suited to your desires even though that would have ruined the entire storyline.

reading comprehension, get some

>Enjoy combating invented arguments.

You said there was no actual conflict. I explained that there was. Then you got mad.

>It's obvious that you're illiterate and a victim of the dunning-kruger effect.

Something tells me you fear this about yourself. Have a nice day.

>Considering the huge disparity between Islands Martin and the rest of Martin I think a lot of stuff had to happen to him in those 15 years so I don't think he can be blamed for it.
There is no huge disparity. I's really simple. He lived his entire life as a cconman. When left alone to fend for himself he went back into the lifestyle he understood, being a conman.

Literally just read the definition you posted. You are frustrated with the show because of some absurd story you preconceived.

>believing
lol wat

I said it would be a better story, not that that's what happened

You are as good at reading as Jack is at cooking

In Islands he wasn't nearly as much of a piece of shit as whenever he showed up later in the show, so I have to believe something happened that made him substantially worse off, besides just losing Minerva's positive influence.
Or maybe the writers just didn't think that far ahead, but either way I think some of the affect is lost when we knew that Martin did care about Finn at one point.

fiction is mutable you goddamned retard

>You said there was no actual conflict
Anyone can scroll up and see that that's not the case. That sentence has more words.

It was thought up by you before you even saw Islands. You then got booty flustered that the show didn't use your absurd headcanon. It's happened to hundreds of anons on Sup Forums. You are no different than anyone else who builds up some elaborate headcanon and then gets frustrated when it obviously doesn't pan out.

>fiction is mutable you goddamned retard
What does this mean in this context.

>I said the story worked this way to tell a message
>You tell me the story is fiction
>I tell you no shit
>You tell me fiction is mutable

So how does this help your argument? They didn't retcon the entire Martin arc, it was still about Finn coming to terms with his dad being shit, and for that to work Martin had to be Finn's dad you retard. You can't pull "this is just my interpretation" on that shit.

I just wish we´ll be one day told what the hell Martin did to deserve going to a multiversal prison. Seriously, what kind of cosmic crime would a mere human being be able to commit?

He tricked Prismo into granting him 2 wishes

Calm down, dude.

>inb4 I'm not even mad
Then I'd hate to see your post quality when you actually are mad.

Is that canon or are you fucking with me? I had put this series down for a while and have just now caught up.