>George Lucas in Legends of Tomorrow
I kind of like Legends, but did anybody else feel like this episode was very "How do you do fellow nerds?" Like, it's all about his Star Wars an Indiana Jones was the most important thing in the world and shit.
And how did the creators get away with shilling this hard for Disney properties on a WB show, especially on a network partially owned by the network they owns Star Trek? Couldn't they have just done a Roddenberry episode?
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They could have, but Star Wars and Indy are more well-known. The writers are probably not Trekkies, and that was that.
They're Trekkies, too. I don't remember the context, but they had Kendra mention Vash in a conversation with Ray.
Vash was only in three episodes of Star Trek, and in my opinion she's not very memorable. You don't make a reference like that if you're not a Trekkie.
I saw it mostly as a celebration of Lucas' impact on the comics of DC and on sci-fi/pop culture in general, and also it's the 40th anniversary of Star Wars this year so it's sort of a recognition type dealio.
>also it's the 40th anniversary of Star Wars this year so it's sort of a recognition type dealio
Last year was Star Trek's 50th, and they didn't get an entire episode dedicated to their impact on society and pop culture.
Legends of Tomorrow itself seems to be far more predecated on the Star Wars type of science fiction story than it is of the Star Trek form though. Also, there's the simple fact that as impactful as Star Trek was, Roddenberry is far less recognisable to the general public than Lucas as an individual, so it just works better.
>Lucas' impact on the comics of DC
DC comics predates Star Wars by like 30 years.
>Things that come after something else cannot influence the future development and directions of the thing that came first
not to mention star trek has largely been raped in favor of a more starwarsy look lately 09' star trek movie is a better starwars movie than Force Awakens.
Star Trek has had way more impact on society than Star Wars. It was important for racial equality and inspired things like cell phones and even theories of FTL. Plus Star Trek is owned by CBS and gas crossed over with DC before.
Shilling Star Wars is just tasteless.
Did I say anywhere in the post you replied to that Star Trek wasn't more impactful? I said that Roddenberry was less recognised by the general public, both in name and visually, and that's just outright true.
You're both wrong, Starwars as a cultural idea has had way more impact than anything startrek has ever done. Long after star trek is dead as a creative series which it really is even with the new series, its on some pay wall garbage by cbs.
Starwars has touched billions of people and as a recognizable idea, it has went way beyond into a kind of cultural currency that was never meant for a piece of entertainment and star trek was a tv show that got canceled, had several tv series which all ended up cancelled and some shitty movies which honestly are of varying quality and most recent best selling movies have all been coined as basically being starwars romps in star trek skin.
You're both delusional if you think otherwise.
Star Wars is literally nothing but action figure commercials. It's the same as He-man.
>SWfags vs trekfags
Dis gun b gud.avi
Joseph cambell's philosophical ideas have never been told in a better medium than starwars.
Babylon 5 > every other American space opera.
Get fucked, faggots.
Oh, and Fireflyniggers need not apply.
The fuck are you on about? Why am I wrong to state that George Lucas is more recognisable to the general public than Roddenberry, when that seems to line up exactly with what you're saying?
I haven't ever in any of my posts said which of the two I feel is more impactful because that's not the point of what I was saying. I was saying that they picked Star Wars for reasons of it being influential to the particular style of LoT and that Lucas is a more easily recognisable character.
Also it's easier to explain Nate becoming a historian due to Indiana Jones than because of amything in particular that's explicitly widely recognisable in Roddenberry's work.
You were agreeing that star trek had more societal impact which is wrong.
I have no clue which user you are but one of the two of you said this. "that Star Trek wasn't more impactful?" It isn't. Star wars is more well know by any measure you'd like to employ or poll you could dig up. Impact is presence, influence.
Star trek is minor league. To point that it has been rebranded as Starwars-lite.
it isn't even star trek anymore at its core and you two chuckleheads in here talking like either of you know what you're talking about ..
And if you're not the one I pointed out then you're this guy. Either way you're both wrong and if you're a third guy, you're still wrong because Star trek will never be said to be more impact-ful, ever.
The correct answer is Lexx
Fug, totally forgot about Lexx.
>we will never get anything like that again
What's the fucking deal about Star Wars, I don't ever remember what happens in it.
What impact on society has Star Wars had other than making merchandising the most important part of moviemaking?
I never said it wasn't more impactful, but I never said it was either, you fucking dipshit. Learn to read. I specifically never stated either explicitly because I wasn't interested in a Which Is More Important arguement, which is invariably something that happens any time you mention both ST and SW in a closed space.
The point of my arguement was that George Lucas was a more easily recognisable name for casual general public viewers and that it would make sense to pick him for this reason alone, even before you start getting into debates about which franchise is more impactful. The recognisability is the key factor here, although that likely correlates strongly with cultural impact so take it as you will.
Probably all those scientists and astronauts and other technical shit that was inspired by the franchise, just hazarding a guess.
You can't objectively quantify the impact of both franchises in the technical advancement sense unless you know exactly what inspired each person to do what they do, but Star Wars has an undeniably greater popular culture impact.
The SDI project for orbital defense wasn't nicknamed Star Trek for a reason, user.
>If Star Trek is so good how come all the shows eventually ended?
If Star Wars is so good how come all the movies were eventually pulled from theaters?
Every movie you've watched since the first movies release has been directly effected by it, to point of it being called the first 'block buster.'
Which is where the term came from, including getting things like your favorite capeshit on screen when people used to laugh at nerds and now nerdshit has conquered every medium to point of crowding out most other content coming out of hollywood, forcing respectable actors to go to television to escape it.
To say the things that you and other person have spoken is admitting ignorance about large things that would be considered embarrassing if spoken face to face with another human being.
I can also help clue you in though by helping you address your win-less position that you're currently sitting in.
Is nuTrek not most hated thing ever produced, by other actual fans of the content? I mean all of them hate the new movies until this very last one which was considered to be most 'trek' of nuTrek but they even redid script of that movie to make it 'less' trek to sell it and the movie still considered a bomb, just this year.
it bombed. While some prequel, filler shitty starwars movie just made it into billion dollar club. And while yes we can differ on money = quality, the point is societal impact, presence, influence..where garbage starwars movies are still succeeding..and star trek has to advertise with actual star wars movie and it still can't succeed as its own thing.
Now obviously you might argue causation as in money doesn't mean anything in terms of content.
But I would argue appeal of the content is an indicator of the success "of the idea" as in..how well it has succeeded in market place of ideas which an user just described as "action figure commerical" which did 3 times business of a similar trek movie, in 2016.
screenrant.com
-continue
Gotta love peeps who can't accept that another sci-fi nerd franchise was just more popular than their chosen sci-fi nerd franchise.
>He says as he wishes that Plasmo was still a thing.
God damn, Star Wars fags really are as stupid as Marvel Zombies. Guess you have to be pretty dumb to think a fantasy franchise is science fiction, though.
screenrant.com
From the beginning, it became clear that Beyond would not be able to top the earlier films, and it’s had an uphill struggle to make its budget back. As of this writing, director Justin Lin’s movie has grossed just $196.9 million worldwide against a $185 million price tag
This also doesn't include the marketing budget which was substantial, profit sharing and profit split with theater chains which I can also go into to support my point.
boxofficemojo.com
Worldwide: $1,036,240,946
boxofficemojo.com
Worldwide: $343,471,816
To further my point, star wars also has a lot more market saturation working against it, to tune of yearly releases and tons of shitty fluff that should help it but have been shown that actually work against it and it's still succeeding.
-Con
Lemme know when we start replacing our tanks with gigantic walkers that can be toppled by tow cables.
boxofficemojo.com
If you go down to adjusted prices for tickets sold, the best selling Star trek movie, which even by fans of the series consider it not Trek, at all beyond names is best selling star trek movie and you're here wondering how star trek can have more influence and societal impact yet best selling product for brand is a star wars movie in trek skin.
It can't even sell itself yet you want to say its better? How, show me any data where I'm wrong.
Oh no people are using generic widely applicable terms that are in common parlance!
Given how Star Wars franchise works appear in the Sci Fi genre section of streaming services like Netflix, I'm going to go out on a limb and say it's fine to call the franchise sci fi, since that's likely how the general public would consider it.
Or shock horror, maybe it's sci fi/fantasy/action and it's entirely possible for fictional works to cover more than one genre. I know it isn't what purists might call sci fi but to get your panties in a bunch about a term being used generically is hardcore sperge.
Until you can point out how Star Trek was impactful on the development of the tank this is entirely irrelevant and a terrible angle of argument, but I'm sure you know that already.
...
That episode was more creative and interesting than the slave episode they gave the blacks.
It helped to expand on the intellectual aspects of Ray and Dork Historian American Colossus.
Defining characters is pretty nice in regards to writing.
While not for a tank, Trek has been a driving influence towards propulsion theories, wireless communications and communications devices, like Uhura's earpiece being a bit of an inspiration for the bluetooth earpiece, improvements to touchscreen technology, the PADD being an unexpected inspiration for tablet technology, as well as the Qualcomm science contest to develop the first functioning medical tricorder.
The slave half of that episode was garbage but Mick, Stein, and Ray on the ship was gold.
Yeah but look at all the money Star Wars made. Fuck science.
It probably was but all I can remember is the slave crap
The impact argument also completely ignores all the individuals who were inspired to get into science- or space-related roles either directly or through Star Wars being their gateway to geekdom as a kid. Even if all of those technologies were somehow inspired by Star Trek (and believe me, plenty of them are likely to be coincidental development or otherwise inspired in the same way that much of Trek's own technology is just derived from earlier science fiction works) you have no way of directly measuring the inspiring influence of the two franchises for getting into STEM careers, unless you want to go ask every scientist and engineer what inspired them.
>Star wars had more impact than Star Trek
>The first space shuttle was called Enterprise.
>Cellphone idea was inspired by the communicator on TOS
>Quicktime creator had his original from an scene from TNG
But yeah... A Nasa guy with an "The Empire Rules!" T-shirt totally makes your point.
The name enterprise has a long standing naval tradition that predates Star Trek by hundreds of years.
>The impact argument also completely ignores all the individuals who were inspired to get into science- or space-related roles either directly or through Star Wars
It's just as likely for an equal number of people to have gotten into science or space related fields because of Star Trek. Hell, a space shuttle was renamed to Enterprise due to so many Trek Fans mailing President Ford for it. Meanwhile, only the media christened the Strategic Defense Initiative as Starwars.
en.wikipedia.org
>Designated OV-101, it was originally planned to be named Constitution and unveiled on Constitution Day, September 17, 1976. A letter-writing campaign by Star Trek fans to President Gerald Ford asked that the orbiter be named after the Starship Enterprise. White House advisors cited "hundreds of thousands of letters" from Trekkies—"one of the most dedicated constituencies in the country"—as a reason for giving the shuttle the name. Although Ford did not publicly mention the campaign, the president—saying he was "partial to the name" Enterprise—directed NASA officials to change the name.
Which doesn't speak for wider society where ideas fail to reach more than a few people.
Impact is proportional to people it influences, getting niche anecdotes as other user points out without accompanying data is irrelevant.
I'm perfectly happy to admit that Star Trek inspired certain technologies, especially since I'm well aware of it being on record.
I also happen to think that "hey wouldn't it be neat if we didn't need to have our phones connected to sockets" os a pretty clear progression of thought and that regardless of Star Trek's influence it wouldn't have been long before we developed the mobile phone anyway.
And thing like tablets and bluetooth are basic evolutions of technology that had predecessors displayed in shows and scifi pulp novels/radio shows well before Trek. Believe it or not, development occurs in a cultural melting pot, rather than a vacuum of a ingular source.
There's no denying Trek's influence. There's also no denying Wars' influence.
>The first space shuttle was called Enterprise.
If you'd watched the opening sequence of Enterprise, you'd know there were ships and other crap called Enterprise before
>Quicktime creator had his original from an scene from TNG
>Quicktime
fuck TNG
Actually, it is only equally likely if the two franchises have equal mass media and general population saturation in a cultural sphere. And they really don't.
They kinda do though. Wars gets people in cinema for a few weeks out of a year. Trek gets people for a few months every year for several years, due to television shows being done through seasons and whatnot.
Star Wars' biggest "this franchise only" convention is Star Wars Celebration, and Star Trek's is Star Trek Las Vegas, both of these conventions are almost always packed and show no signs of stopping any time soon.
easy there Bizarro
Yes, there were several other sailing, steam, and otherwise types of seafaring ships named the enterprise, but the shuttle is specifically named so because of the whole thing of being bombarded with mail from Star Trek fans.
George Lucas is my idol. I want his autograph.
>Star Wars predates me by like 30 years
But Wars didn't influence anything. It's just a cynical commercial made for dummies.
>I kind of like Legends, but did anybody else feel like this episode was very "How do you do fellow nerds?"
Not really
>Like, it's all about his Star Wars an Indiana Jones was the most important thing in the world and shit.
The entire point of the episode was that those 2 were inspired, they watched those movies as kids and as kids we sometimes think things are the best in the world. A movie about alien races and advanced technology can make a kid fall in love with science while one about a man and ancient civilizations/artifacts can cause a kid to like history. None of the rest of the crew seemed to really care since the movies didn't have a great effect on their lives to cause a huge difference
>Trekkies actually believe this.
Star Wars got exported to the world.
Star Trek didn't.
>how did the creators get away
Because they never actually said Star Wars or George Lucas, it was just implied
...did you not watch the episode?
after Crusher, Vash is Picards most important love interest in the show.
Yes, it was better written, all praise JMS.
However, Star Trek tackled ideas better, a lot of the episodes were about human flaws and how we could be better. sometimes it was very hammfisted, like the one where they find the frozen people and the billionaire only wanted his money, but hammfisted or not it was exploring ideas.
I used to LOVE star wars when I was young, I loved Star Trek as well. But now I can go back and watch Star Trek and love it and Star Wars is just boring to me. There is nothing to Star Wars, the origionals were cool cause it was a space opera but now there is tons of other versions that have done it better, including Marvel movies. There is no reason to hang on to Star Wars. And episode VII proves it, there is NOTHING for it to do.
Didn't it imply George stole most of his ideas from his experiences?
You mean instead of stealing it from other movies?
Best part of this George Lucas episode was the meta joke about Vandal Savage.
Vash was pretty good looking for picard.
crusher sucks.
>we couldn't write him well, let's make fun of the actor for not doing well with the shitty material he's been given
Meh. For that joke to work the Crump would have been the only one to blame for Savage sucking.
*should
>A ship got it's name changed by Ford because trekkies spammed his e-mail
>As if trekkies weren't the only people permavirgin enough to actually spam the white house e-mail during the Ford years.
Probably like 20 people (which was probably 1/6 of the internet users in the US at the time)
I remember starting this on a whim because I loved Farscape's weirdness and I'd heard Lexx was in a similar vein.
I was not prepared. My god, I was not prepared. Truly the most batshit TV show ever aired.
WAY OH WAY OH
*Yo way yo
Do you even Brunnen G?