So why is Marvel trying to push Carol so hard? They've already tried multiple times in the past, and she never sticks...

So why is Marvel trying to push Carol so hard? They've already tried multiple times in the past, and she never sticks, at all. The excuse of "we need our own Wonder Woman" doesn't make any sense, because why not use a female character that people actually liked well before this? I mean shit, she's so literally who that the crowd went quiet at the MVCI reveal, and yet she's getting a movie in 2019?

She is the most powerful and most popular hero in the world

YAAS QUEEN!

Who would you propose Marvel could use? Pretty much all the major female heroes I can think of are tied up in X-Men or other team baggage and have rights issues for use outside the comics.

I liked her in Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes.

All of Marvel's best ladies are X-Men who they don't have the movie rights to.

She-Hulk's movie rights are probably nebulously tied up in Hulk's, who they don't have distribution rights for movies.

She's one of their only lady characters with a big powerset. Seriously who else do they have? Moondragon? Tigra?

So it's basically out of desperation?

Because even as pathetically nebulous as WW is in the eyes of the casual public Carol is the only woman Marvel has that's even remotely close without being tied into a million other things.

Yep! And that desperation is leading them to relaunch the character again and again without a solid idea of what they want out of her other than "be popular".

Also She-Hulk is green so she lacks the necessary mass appeal beauty required. Her niche is covered by Gamora in GotG anyway.

Why not Kamala?

Christ, she gained popularity faster that Carol ever did or will.

And popularity seems to be what Marvel wants.

Because her whole deal is the unsure teenage hero looking up to others.

She can't fill the powerful independent woman role right now.

Until they tanked her book with crossovers and forgetting that the jersey street level hero was what made her popular

Kamala is actively being ruined by getting pushed too fast. If she had stayed in her book for a few years and built up a good rogues' gallery and maintained her supporting cast, maybe people would agree with you.

But they're pushing her way too hard right now and it's getting on peoples' nerves, especially since it seems like nobody but her own writer can write her worth a damn.

They want a Wonder Woman, a confident adult heroine.

>ever did
Carol sold more than her as Ms.Marvel

They are pushing the fuck out of her already are you blind?

>tfw something Marvel pushed for diversity's sake like with Miles and shit turned out to be good
>tfw it's just gonna crumble apart because they can't fucking handle that well enough.

Eh Gamora is just green Black Widow so far. Just being a bruiser would be enough to differentiate SHulk from every other female MCU character.

We'll never have Tigra licking her cunt clean on the big screen.

The X-women sell like shit too. None of them do well outside the team.

Sadly sony owns her movie rights.

How? Was the deal for any character and all characters related to Spider-Man?

This right here could've worked

Monica Rambeau
Better powers.
Better optics.
Better history.

Squirrel Girl could've worked had they handled her comic well. Maybe. Probably not.

MCU is lighthearted and all but I don't know if it's ready for something out-and-out silly

the only thing Monica is good for is frying blacula

The other non-exclusive character in the deal is Jessica Drew, who can be used by Sony as Spider-Woman but also by Marvel provided their version does not include any of the character’s Spider-Man related elements. The list of related characters that goes with Drew and which are also held by both Sony and Marvel on a non-exclusive basis includes SHIELD agent Jerry Hunt and her business partner and actress Lindsay McCabe plus the rights to “Drew & McCabe Investigations” so it appears that around the time these rights were original assigned, Marvel (or someone else who held those specific rights) may have had some thoughts towards either a film or TV series set during the period when Drew lost her Spider-Woman powers and was working as a private detective in California in the course of which the character might also have had some dealings with SHIELD.

What’s clear is that under this deal only Sony had the rights to either make a Spider-Woman movie using Drew or use the character in that role in any of its other Spider-Man related films.

>gonna crumble apart
>gonna
Have you seen her numbers lately? It's already happened

IT'S NOT FAIR

This, with Monica around they don't have to try too hard forcing diversity like making Valkyrie black
Or shilling for shitty black sidekicks

Clearly MCU didn't think this trough

But she does it damn well!

Because she was once the biggest thing in Marvel all by herself, without any pushing.
Fans just liked her for her.

And you know what Marvel did then? Just what you would have done: they character assassinated her to near-death-coma, and worse, because most of them couldn't write a woman as an actual human being thanks to your kind of sexist crap were women are seen as worthless if they aren't blow-up dolls.

So now they have lots of writers that can see a woman as human and they look around and see that they don't have any feminist "WonderWoman" icons in their comics to sell to an emerging female market.
They could have created another token character and pushed some half-assed writing to explain why a nobody new character was being made Marvel's new top-tier hero ...
but why do that when there's an old popular icon in their lineup already that's (not literally) made for this moment but may as well be?

I only knew her existence because of paid shilling here in Sup Forums

Though I will never be her fan nor will watch her movie
Already did It with Doctor strange

because people only like the female mutants and they don't have the movie rights to them

Are you sure about that?

She's got superstrength. Just that it seems to be a bit above CapAm strength rather than Hulk level strength.

And I was only referring to the aesthetic of being a sexy green lady anyway since my point was that Shulk being green reduces her effectiveness in the image of traditionally sexy to the largest audience.

>Because she was once the biggest thing in Marvel all by herself, without any pushing.

Why does this sound like a crock of shit? Was this back in the 60s or something?

Honestly? At this point they'd be better off just making a new one all together.
Carol ain't gonna happen. That was confirmed for me during the Capcom vs Marvel trailer. And now she can't even sale number 1's any more.

Not chance. Any female character who is just a spin-off of another male character can never fill the Wonder Woman role.

She had a nine volume 50 issue run back in the mid-2000s. That's pretty dang impressive for a character like her.

lol that hardly makes her the biggest thing in Marvel

And not a single one of her books since has gotten even close to that number before relaunching again

Not exactly the biggest thing at marvel, definitely not. But definitely an indicator of who to push if you want a big female character.

But they've fucked it up and every launch she's had since they put her in the new costume has been terrible.

That series was actually the first major push she got after they tested the waters with her in New Avengers and House of M. It's also arguable the most successful of her pushes, saleswise. Prior to that she was a second string Avenger and X-Man. Granted she was linked to X-Men during their heyday.

It's hard to push a waifu that is not a X-men. Marvel should have thought on that way before everyone was in love with a mutant girl. Now they want to get rid of mutants (the most memorable female cast from marvel) and at the same time push another one mixed with a sjw agenda? Never gonna work.

How many solo females have done better?

>that projection
>once the biggest thing in Marvel
>emerging female market
hmmm

Because she's one of their oldest with the most history. While there's tons more interesting varied female characters with with defined arcs and roles It looks good on paper to say "this character has existed since 1967 and is well loved by all."

Also I'm sure having the company name in her hero name probably helps wanting to see her succeed.

A black female lead? I don't think so. But please praise us for giving minority women table scraps.

YAAS QUEEN!

It's because she's their attempt to have Superman, but also pander by having her be female and a dyke.

>why not use a female character that people actually liked well before this?

Name a character they could use for this that isn't X-Men affiliated. Like it or not, Marvel wants to have their own Wonder Woman and they don't want to overly promote characters owned by Fox in the process.

Let's all make Namorita Marvel's next big thing!

>they character assassinated her to near-death-coma, and worse, because most of them couldn't write a woman as an actual human being thanks to your kind of sexist crap were women are seen as worthless if they aren't blow-up dolls.

The blonde woman next to Val is his wife. She's powerful, she's a good mother and she was once a queen of an island. She is everything a strong female character should be.

This is a comic from before WW2, by the way.

Namorita is a good girl and has roots in Namor, who's like totally fundamental for Marvel and shit.

My image didn't post.

Can't market a movie with a black female lead

I do hope Marvel doesn't whore out my brown waifu.

This question, again? I need to save this response and make it pasta or something.

Who else do they have to be their iconic female hero? Jean Grey? Storm? Rogue? Lets leave out those are all fox film licensed and remember their "X-men" not solo characters. Sue Storm, also a team member.

That's not the only issue. Other female heroes are often really tied to their team or husband. Scarlet Witch with Avengers and Vision, Wasp with Pym and Avengers. Black Widow, not really a "super" hero, she fills a different niche and isn't always a "hero" So they have..... Spider-woman? She-Hulk? Again, female version of a male hero, they'll use her, but marvel wants a front and center female icon.

They DO need a wonder woman, they just are going about it wrong. Wonder woman is like any other hero, but a women. Marvel always makes their women "women" first and heroes later. Carol needs a male non-super, non-hero b/f like Steve Trevor. Peter has MJ and Gwen. Bruce has Betty. Clark has Lois. They just keep fucking the fuck up with Carol. If you're going to push a character push them right.

Carol is still associated with a male version of her name, but she is pretty far removed from that now.

This all may seem like superflous things, but it's all foundation and water-cooler type talk for casuals or normies. Everyone knows Superman is weak to kryptonite, or spider-man gotten bitten to get his powers. No one really knows jack shit about Wonder Woman, but they know she's not Supermans Wife or Girl friend, she's her own thing. Carol though? Fucking forget it....

They wanted something unique from their heroes and DC heroes. I think they should have looked into Hellcat or Sif or Crystal but it still comes down to a brand and marketing, these names, the costumes and ect. "Captain Marvel" was a huge fuck you to DC. They pushed her so hard DC calls their "Shazam!" now.

I still think they went about it all wrong and I miss the old carol a good deal.

This. A solo female superhero film is already considered a risky enough venture by most film companies. A solo black female with no connections to established superheroes for fans to use as scaffolding is just too much of a chance of failure.

>Wonder woman is like any other hero, but a women. Marvel always makes their women "women" first and heroes later.

georgeconstanzabaseball.jpg

>They pushed her so hard DC calls their "Shazam!" now

wut. DC has been calling him shazam long before Marvel started pushing carol

The character was still Captain Marvel till 2011. The character is now called Shazam and NOT referred to as Captain Marvel. They started pushing Carol after House of M back in 2006.

But they didn't make Carol captain marvel until 2012. Shazam's name change has more to do with people referring to Billy by that name

I don't know why. Spiderman has been their top guy for years and he's not really like either Superman or Batman. Besides, Kamala can do more to appeal to the young female audience who prefer a self insert over role model.

Worst thing is she's always been a bitch. Even in superhero squad she was a bossy know it all kill joy. She's not even the best female captain marvel and rogue used her powers better

Spider-Girl

Me too. FemShep Carol is best Carol

they're have only been 3 ongoings so far Rogue, Emma and Storm and none really tried to do basic superhero stuff, they were all character pieces.

Jean Grey at least looks like it's going to try it's had at big plot points and she doesn't have a supporting cast of literal who's and new character to bounce off of.

These are characters made for a team book, what do you expect?
And there's never been any real ongoing for any X-Man other than Logan, everything else has been a miniseries with one storyline.
And almost every X-Man has had one:
Gambit twice (!),
Bishop,
Emma Frost ( I still need to read that ),
Mystique,
Storm ( hers wasn't bad ),
Dazzler's was one of the very first,
Iceman's about to get his second,
Nightcrawler,
Cyclops ... sorta... twice.
This is no big thing.

Yea and I think that this should be the character they go for in the films. Basically a female Jack Reacher (film version, never read the books before any of you CRUISE WAS TOO SHORT spergs come in)

DAMN IT ALL!
I forgot Magneto's two, Psylocke's, Pixie's, Quicksilver's, Domino's, Longshot's miniseries...
And Cable's ongoing...

>Clearly MCU didn't think this trough

Marvel Comics itself renamed Carol as Captain Marvel in around 2012. The movie didn't get announced until 2014 and Marvel really wanted to push Carol Danvers. Feige meanwhile wanted to do a superheroine film but Perlmutter refused because he didn't believe superheroine films would sell in box office or toys. Feige and Perlmutter managed to sort of come to an agreement in that Captain Marvel would get made as Feige desired while Inhumans would also get made as Perlmutter desired.

They're getting a lot better with the movies.
I remember the piss-poor synergy they tried to pull off with the X-Men comics when those first three came out, I had to stop reading for a while.
They made the disastrous mistake of trying to make the comics conform to the movies.

These days, if you look closely, you can spot foreshadowing for the comics in the movies and the synergy is limited to gawdawful, but temporary, themed crossovers.

I have a pet theory that they were originally going to ease up on the Carol shilling when they announced Janethor, and they were going to try and make her their Wonder Woman.


But between Jane selling like powdered water, and everyone not giving a shit pretty much a month after she appeared, they were stuck with Carol again.

Fucking Christ, Perlmutter and his fucking Inhumans. What's it going to take for him to get off that shit? For the movie to bomb?

Jane Thor sells way more than Carol, it's actually one of the best selling Marvel solo books and outperforms Iron Man and Captain America every month.

This variant for The Mighty Captain Marvel #3 by David Lopez is utter shit.

She looks like Storm who stole Carol's wardrobe.

It's like that fucking rat monster girl from "Splice."

Ever since Feige took control away from Perlmutter Inhumans got deprioritized and now Perlmutter's pushing for a TV show instead (but with the pilot being screened in theaters, IIRC)

In all fairness, Carol does probably make the most sense as one to push (suitable powerset, not tied up in anyone else's rights, not just a female version of a better known male character), but they fucked it up by sanitising all the interesting traits out of her in favour of Yaas Queen Slay.

Is she supposed to be black or is it just shit art?

Doubt it, Captain Marvel got announced as a film in 2014 so they had to have been thinking about it as far back as at least 2013. And remember that was Feige's pet project.

Plus on top of that Jane as Thor actually sold decently until the relaunch.

Jane Thor might be more of a way to put Natalie Portman in a starring role in case Perlmutter doesn't wan't to pay Chris Hemsworth more money.

Isn't Portman sick of Marvel movies, though? She's not showing up in Ragnarok.

why she' sick from marvel? I'm still not sure how they managed to not give her a starring role

LOL Carolfags must be salty

She's not even going to be in Thor 3.

doesn't thor 3 take place entirely in space

Because SJW tumbler feminist bare asking for marvels wonderwoman

That's why I despise her so much and her lesbian hair

She's originally Ms. marvel

Monica on other other hand is her own character

we are

>Isn't Portman sick of Marvel movies, though?
correct. It's unlikely we'll see her or Pepper again.

Excuse me didnt we have a deal that there would be only 1 carol thread up in Sup Forums at the time and that monday is the day you can create them.

Futa Carol Confirmed

Because she's the best character Marvel has

Carol was fun there. Also the wacky misadventures of Carol and Jessica. Marvel just stripped the fun and interesting parts out of her character (Ex-Military, former Alcoholic, screw up trying to make right) and books to please people never interested in her in the first place. And the cringeworthy marketing.

Marvel can't just make her their Wonder Woman as Wondy has mythos developed for decades along with the mythos they derive from Greek culture that affected her character development over years and has lead to constant reinvention and fresh ideas like Johns, Azzarello and Morrison's runs. Carol doesn't have that sort of legacy but the interesting history they have with her they want to delete for a blank slate (House of ideas, my ass) even though the current book is gingerly small steps forward (Like everyone in the hero community hating Carol so much she has to stay in Space most of the time to get yelled at by Abigal Brand)

Carol and Jessica room-mate comedy team up book when?

...

>Carol presenting a big D to Jessica
They are not even being subtle

Why is this board so obsessed with Monica?

They really need to bring back "Power-Girl" Carol instead of this forced, bland Wonder Woman pinnacle heroine bullshit.