Tfw trying to make an honest living and career out of animation, comics, and illustration

>tfw trying to make an honest living and career out of animation, comics, and illustration
>that gradual realization that this career is really made for rich art student kids and fanatical asians, and that there's very little place for uneducated american poor fag unless you're willing to starve yourself
>even if you get a job to sustain yourself the amount of effort expendature means you'll never have time to do much of anything and it will take years for you to go anywhere
>as we speak animation and comics are becoming more and more incestuous and you basically have to travel to places like Brazil or France if you want any kind of meaningful future that isn't just as a 3d rig animator at Disney AT BEST

I mean, I get it, you gotta work hard anyway and you gotta be competitive and it's a hard knock life

But damn, man

God damn

Other urls found in this thread:

arniesarchive.tumblr.com/
arniesartblog.tumblr.com/
youtube.com/watch?v=UQgjCGUfYp8
twitter.com/AnonBabble

>tfw an american is sad while you're pretty much getting fucked to death by the government in Brazil
>the gradual realization that you'll never have money to leave and that any kind of art job will fail because the country doesn't consume art and it's too expensive to export

Oh, sure, it's EVERYONE's fault but yours. Cry more.

Damn, last I heard weren't you guys getting on the up and up animation wise because of some recent broadcasting law regarding airtime for national content, similar to canada?

>this career is really made for rich art student kids

It's not much of a secret that anything in entertainment/media is most of the time just for trust fund babies who both have money to live off of for god knows how long until they get a break AND usually have parents, faily, other friends who are connections in the industry because it's all about who you know.

Anomalies do pop up (people not from some rich California or NYC family) who aren't but you're better off trying to win the lottery.

>try to make a career out of a honed skill
>pissed that people who went to college for this skill are the ones getting their career going

That ain't what I'm saying, man. I get that it's on you to get yourself ahead in life.

What I'm saying is that it's fucking tough and I'm starting to notice the craft seems to be delegated to a circle of opulant urbanites and a bunch of koreans, and that if you're not in those circles and you're particularly poor and have to sacrifice a lot of time to get by instead of establishing an online presence, it's tough. A lot of people just end up being webcomic peons either doing it for free or for a pittance on patreon that breaks even if they're lucky.

>getting a job is tough if you're not rich
Yeah, no shit. Maybe if you had a modicum of talent you'd have an easier time breaking into the animation/comics industry.

Ha ha. You think hard work and effort are the keys to success? It's nepotism and where you were born.

You are stupid for not getting a STEM degree and trying to make it with art in your spare time unless you don't mind starving to death on the street.

Plenty of wildly talented artists "relying on their art" are starving to death. You don't "make a living" on art, it is a hobby.

I feel like these kinds of posts are made by high schoolers or college dropouts that haven't even tried to get into the industry.

PROTIP: It's like any other thing. Get good, be personable, don't be an asshole, and you'll get work. Shit needs to get done and you will get hired if you can do the shit that needs to be done. From there you move according to your ambition. Are you happy getting paid decent money to rig Mickey Mouse characters? Then stay there. Do you want to move up? Actually try to do so. Talk to people. Posting on Sup Forums isn't getting you anywhere.

But almost none of it has to do with skill as much as just happening to be in the right circles and rich. Sure, many rich people go to college and they can be talented, and look, not gonna knock on someone if they struck out lucky by calling them some bourgeoisie cucks or something. The problem is that the bar of entry for everyone else is a lot lower than anticipated and for something that takes as much time as art, it's harrowing how difficult it can be to even just get a head start and some kind of freelance income online when you're worried about not being out on the street.

All I'm saying is, look, you know what'd be nice? Low bar of entry jobs like in betweening being done in the states again, more studios in general in more states besides california, nothing luxurious, but enough expansion in the market that you have a fighting fucking chance, you know?

There is no such thing, but there is a government program to finance animation, but every state service is Brazil is deeply corrupted and buried under bureaucracy. The people most helped by these programs are artists that publicly speak well of the government and militate for the party in power, which to me just means propaganda.
We have a large animation festival, which is normally the incentive for animators, but most Brazilian animators have moved from Brazil a long time ago. Staying in Brazil is misery, your only hope is being good enough to be hired by a Canadian or American industry and getting a visa.

>stem

Sure, if you want to never have a job anywhere because of lack of experience, or overqualification

Get a fucking trade.

>and some kind of freelance income online

Do graphic design along with web design, know some front-end computer programming, then you have a shot. Design company web pages and make little graphics and animations for companies.

>muh STEM

Go into an in-demand engineering field and do lots of internships and co-ops while getting your degree.

Put up, or shut up.

I have money, show me your tumblr/DA/artstation/etc.

If I think you have talent, and you can demonstrate to me that you actually know what work is, I will help you.

I really don't know a single career you can grab where you're paid a living wage (>55k/year) without being skilled or delving into nepotism.

So you're not connected? Get gud, faggot and stop anonymously crying on the internet.

Guys, work is hard. Why can't companies see how often I browse tumblr and jerk it to porno mangas and give me a job?

How do you get a connection to someone to get into storyboarding? Specifically in a regular college? I feel like this is how you get shows if your good enough and to avoid being an animation slave

>He doesn't get his main passive income from stocks and investments

The entertainment industry in general is made for rich kids. A bit different, sure; but pretty similar.

You go to a college with a decent reputation and talk to your profs. If none of them have/had connections to the industry, they're shit so look elsewhere. Most colleges gearing you to work in the field and not just babysitting rich white kids who want to play pretend artists will have days where companies go to your school to see your work. Obviously don't miss these days, and meet as many people as possible and show them your stuff.

I walked out of a career doing motion graphics; I was sick of literally working 22 hour shifts, only to sleep for 5 hours and work another 12. All for clients who play on their laptops all day and look up for 30 seconds at a time to tell me I am doing exactly what they want. Then at the end of the 12 hour day, they tell me I went wrong somewhere and we need to go back to square one. Then we finish and ship and the entire thing is used in one closed door meeting and seen again by anyone. It sucks. And it's hard hard work. Good luck, user, but I think you're a fucking idiot. After I saved up enough I got out.

>its tough to get a job in animation if you have no animation training

Wooooooow.

But here's the problem, if you don't have the money to even go to a community college, the fuck are you supposed to do?

>motion graphics

That's like settling for being the janitor at a hospital when you want to be a doctor. I don't think anyone here wants to to bitch work just because it's tangentially related to drawing cartoons or comics. If they are, then they're fools.

D-do you animate user?

D-do you need acting talent? Writing?

Take this with a grain of salt, since im just as inexperienced as you might be but branch out to reddit art subs and try asking "hey you got any connections to some comic/cartoon studios" or whatever. Like i said, i know its reddit but i feel like thats the best place to ask if your in a community college.

And like i said take this with a big pile of salt

Save money, then student loans.

>used to be a drawfag on here, lost all of that because of multiple computer crashes including numerous portfolios.
>Used to go to school with Mary Cagle before she went to SCAD
>Wants to see her do well, even with though secretly hates her art.
> can't do animation job because the company is retarded and childhood illness requires me to get a hip replacement.
>get in graphic design/website management for companies. Fail.
>Send work into people, kickstarters, fail.
>Because Elementary School Art Teacher, It's Houston so kids are stabbing each other left and right. Have to call cops.
>Kids don't clean one day because they were never taught. Day I teach them I slip and crack my head open. To the ER I go.
>Shortly after that punched in the testicles with permanent nerve damage.
> Her Kickstarter has 75k

Don't forget, you have to be constantly talk about how much you care about the poor without actually doing anything.

Ok, do i dont know if you know this school but would going to the art insitute be a good choice? Specifically the one in philly? Ive heard they're a scam but it would be nice to have a clear option

You forgot
>be me

I did. But also, drinking.

What did he mean by this?

Normally I'd hop right on, but I'm currently working on another comission and the hostel I'm living at is being fumigated for the next couple of months so I'm trying to figure out where to go live within the week with the little I have. Realistically I can't commit to anything else at the moment until I'm sure I'm not gonna be out in the street.

I mean, here's the thing, I learned how to draw and animate on my own so I never really went to college, and right now I'm trying to just set up a ragtag animation studio with some people and get an income through comission work. I was only just recently able to save up to quit my old 12 hour shift job to try and, you know, put in some time into the craft and the circuits and stuff to at the very least end up in a situation where I can draw at all, even with a part time job later.

Send me an email, cause yeah, we have a group, we're getting our shit together, we got scripts that we gotta board and we're hopefully gonna put together a presentation, show off to potential investors, maybe get an office somewhere and live that animation studio dream.

I don't ever really bitch about this stuff. Felt appropriate here.

No, I don't understand what you are saying.

>Because Elementary School Art Teacher, It's Houston so kids are stabbing each other left and right. Have to call cops.

-clears throat-

Whoops. Embarrassment

Becomes Elementary School Art Teacher*

Fug, forgot email.

[email protected]

If anyone else has even a passing interest in working on animation stuff, we got voice actors and we're working out a pipeline for animation that involves non artist people learning how to animate. So the door's open for the willing.

If you were reviewing a portfolio and you saw someone mention they were from Sup Forums, would you hire them?

>-clears throat-
Faggot

Nice, I just colored a John Harris study.

Do you have any digital work?

>2017
>STEM
Nice meme.

Very nice, has a Chris Foss vibe

I've hired several people from Sup Forums, but not because they were from Sup Forums.

I literally only have three rules:

>How well can you pare down your style in order to meet a rigid work cadence?
>Can you stick to the rigid time tables that go along with said cadence?
>You better not fucking draw loli/shota.

>Brazil
>getting good in animation

Nigga, even Perú has a best shot to improve themselves than Brazil.

How good are you looking for, like storyboard wise.

...

>Save money, then student loans.
Horrible advice. Sign up for the military and stay for a minimum of 20 years instead, user.

Yeah. I just finished organizing my old blog into an archive since a lot of it is old learning work I made as a kid in venezuela

arniesarchive.tumblr.com/

started up a new blog, haven't posted anything there just yet. Hoping things stabilize soon.

arniesartblog.tumblr.com/

Feel like you should wait after trump leaves though if your American, cause it looks like hes gonna send troops to syria at any moment

Well actually, I have an animatic to show you. I worked on the boards and design, we have a writer and creator, and the whole script's been voiced. If you've got any interest in adult animated stuff that isnt comedy, this is the group for you. We've got this noir hort, a horror short, and an action short in the pipeline.

youtube.com/watch?v=UQgjCGUfYp8

Good. No one fucking wants you in any of these industries.

Yeah, they're cutthroat. Yeah, they're unfair. So what? What are you gonna do? Cry about it more on this Bosnian basket fishing website? Who cares. Go whine about it somewhere else. The industry doesn't want or need you. There's a million pissy artists and writers who think they're sooo special, that if only the game wasn't rigged, they'd win. But at the end of day, all that counts is what you do with what you're given.

You know how you break into this industry? By actually fucking working. At the end of the day, the only thing you can control is you. Be helpful, go the extra mile, take risks, and take initiative. That's how you get your chance to succeed. And by succeeding, you cut a path through the jungle for others like you to succeed. But you must be a leader first.

Tl;dr deal with it.

Interesting colors and character designs. Also, just throwing this out there for future references, what are your feelings on fan art of your own characters? I ask because a couple of artists(usually old furries) will throw a tantrum if you don't ask first, even if it's SFW.

brother, I save every bit of fanart I can, no matter how big or small. I can't take it as anything but a complement.

A lot of graduates from art colleges are terrible, terrible artists.

Gotcha.

>trying to make a living from art
You have to be really REALLY REALLY good at your craft to actually make money off it if you don't have any connections. Like top 10% in terms of quality, and there's quite a few people like yourself.


It's way easier to make money off drawing porn and doing commissions. There's a reason why every artist under the sun has their own Patreon now.

I mean shit, I'd be happy enough to just get a source of income from art on top of a part time job. These days, though, pretty much have to take full time hard time shit, drink energy drinks to draw when I should be sleeping, and then die asleep during the weekend. That's just a miserable way to live.

LOOOAAANNNSSSS!! Then bust your fucking ass, treat your college years working like your life depended on it...because it does.

>You better not fucking draw loli/shota.
Why not? Why does it matter what they do in their free time?

>committing the sin of usury
>committing it in a state monopoly
>expecting to live a happy life afterwards and not one of a serf in all but name

Because you stupid ass, it's an enterprise.

This isn't fucking Japan, imagine if your employer found out that you drew (in many people's eyes) CP.

Do you think for an instant that they would have hired you if they knew about this in the first place?

counter point: if you're someone who doesnt have a public presence and just works as someone producing a show, what does it matter what they do if it isn't public information anyway?

Rebecca Sugar drew shota porn and she has a whole show

It comes down to the circumstances involved.

Let me illumine you, you aren't Rebecca Sugar.

Have you ever wondered why that one artist who draws porn just the way you like it one day just deletes everything, and all trace of them is exterminated from the internet?

It's because that person was told by another person that if they wanted a job, they were going to remove all of that content. And they did.

No one wants to have their boat's rocked, especially not if they're just a small publishing company (read as: everyone who isn't DC or Marvel). Someone at the very start in a chain of committee based decisions has to say, "Is it worth hiring this person despite the fact that they freely associate with that content?"

Most people are going to say no.

They don't want to take the risk that somehow, something happens and they take flak for hiring you. It's really that simple, and if you can't figure that out, it's why you haven't been hired anywhere yet.

If I was fucking William Christensen over at Avatar, and some dude (or group of dudes) came along and submitted something I kinda liked, the very first thing I'd be doing is Googling them. And if something came back that I didn't like? Tough shit, pal.

>Wanting your company to be falsely associated with pedophile-related scandals just because some sick fuck likes to draw little kids
There are very few artists in the industry(America) that draw/drew loli/shota shit, but they tend to keep it to themselves, have iy set under an alternative alias, or deleted it long ago. They do this so they don't unintentionally soil their company's reputation, or their own. Like said, imagine if an employer found out that you drew that trash. But again, the people that draw/drew it keep the images to themselves, always separating their online smut far away from their portfolio. There's no way in hell a major corporation would hire someone that has a main focus on creating anything sexually related to children, whether they're real or cartoons.

Hiring them could cause a scandal, and not the good kind. Really, everyone says 'any publicity is good publicity', but when it comes to this, it'll destroy your social-life and any chance of you getting ANY good paying job. A great example would be Shadman, this smug bastard faced a huge backlash and got his family and himself doxxed after drawing a suggestive image of real children("Because how are Americans, of all people, going to react to something like this? What could go wrong? lol" says Shadman). Even after all that, he still drew suggestive images of real children to "spite" the "haters" or some shit, the guy is a social-retard. I can only imagine what would have happened if they found his older art, if I recall correctly he had drawn porn of a kid from some shitty live-action show waaaay before they jumped on him.

Other user here, while we're on that subject. How extensive is this background research? Is it really just googling or is it more like doxxing? Just a calm unsuspectful question haha

Does this apply to people working at normie jobs, or just in the entertainment industry?

t. normie with weird foreign name who gets easily doxed

Wow, you really made OP check his privilege!

>Rebecca Sugar drew shota porn and she has a whole show

It was one goofy picture and she's female.

I think there's a difference between people like that and people who have countless pictures clearly pandering to pedophiles. You need to consider context and individual situation. A couple of wacky pics of cartoon characters, a lot of artists have something like that. Someone like Shadman, huge fucking difference.

>shadman

who?

>You need to consider context and individual situation. A couple of wacky pics of cartoon characters, a lot of artists have something like that. Someone like Shadman, huge fucking difference.
Exactly. Someone like Shadman could never make it in the industry. Also damn, how hard is it for people like him to study up on a country for a good week or two before moving there? You could come across important information that'll explain how somethings might not be appreciated there. You wouldn't go to a Middle Eastern country, crudely draw Muhammad, and hold up the image outside for everyone to see -- would you? But whatever, it's his own fault for being stupid.

I saw your thread in /ic/, man
shut the fuck up

?
You got the wrong guy, man, but for the sake of curiosity, you got a link?

Who the fuck are you? You shut the fuck up, bitch. Go tongue BadMan's yuck-mouth teeth, crackhead.

please into stoping this
no bullying

Depends, if you're applying to a giant, megalithic corporation they may or may not do truly extensive background research. Further, they normally farm out this work to contractors. If nothing really dings back, they won't (or shouldn't) make a fuss.

That being said, I am going to highly advise the both of you that if you plan on ever applying for something where the person interviewing you (or some adjunct to them) is going to look into who you are, prepare for them to make gut decisions.

They may overlook weird fetish stuff, because it isn't questionable. Hell, if you're sending your portfolio or submission to a publisher they'll probably be understanding. What they won't do, and I guarantee you this guys, is let someone who is drawing 8 year old's in string bikinis with the BLACKED meme in the corner slide on through like no big deal. It will never, ever in a million years happen.

Either way, I just want to point out that the less porn you have (read as: zero), the better. You really want to/need to draw porn? Use a pseudonym, create plausible deniability. Don't cross the streams between your private life and your professional life.

Put it to you this way, let's use the scenario I mentioned in my other post.

I am the editor taking a gander at what you sent in, or hell, I am scouting for talent to hire. If I can find out that you drew Lightning McQueen fucking Minnie Mouse recently (not like 10 years ago when you were going through a weird ass phase) via a simple Google search? It's time to take stock of where you actually want to go as an artist.

Do you just want it to be a hobby and draw porn forever? Or do you actually want to try and make something in the industry?

Just move to Canada and do flash animation.

A friend of mine did a course in roughly a year and got hired practically right after grad, he's earning enough to pay back his loan and still has plenty of time in life to enjoy living as it were.

>Do you just want it to be a hobby and draw porn forever? Or do you actually want to try and make something in the industry?
Not even trying to be funny, but this is an important question for everyone on /ic/ to ask themselves.

Also thanks for the information, user. You seem pretty cool.

Where did your friend did said course?

Desperate spic looking for a way to get to and work in Canada here.

You just got to make the right connections in college, faggot

Can't you just start a Patreon? Sure, you'll have to put in time getting popular off of fanart and such, but that's the life.

Holy shit, this really pisses me off. You have to go to college in order to make connections for this shit. Bite your fucking tounge and dont you dare tell me my dreams impossible.

You sound like a quitter, OP. Are you a quitter?

One problem is tumblr labelling everything as child porn "somehow" even if it's of 90 year olds. Even if it's not porn.

So if you don't want accusations from tumblr to show up in a Google search, never draw any pictures ever. Or ever say anything on the Internet either. Or exist.

No problem.

One last piece of advice I want to impart.

If the writer seems like he knows what he's doing? Listen to him. He has the most riding on the project's success.

>Or ever say anything on the Internet either. Or exist.
As long as you can say it was all lies however

OP here, that's pretty much my plan and I'm pretty sure that's most people's plans for those who aren't going to art college.

Made this thread pretty much to vent about being a poorfag in the interim. Dunno why it turned into a discussion about pedo employment.

Nah man, I mean, I'm working on the comissions I can work on, I'm working on getting a gonzo animation studio going, I'm working on a webcomic buffer, sending pitches out to publications.

I don't know anything else besides art, man, I grew up in some third world shithole and it's all I was good at, and now it's hard to get by doing it cause I don't have a security blanket of any kind to really kick it off. My education is shit and I'm too poor to even get in a trade school. This stuff is all I got going for me and there have been a lot of sleepless nights where I feel like I don't have the option to give up, cause the only other thing is death.

I'm pretty much just giving myself the next six months to get my shit together. Otherwise I'm considering either working some dangerous coal mining job for a few months to get some investment capital to put into the studio to make it more of a traditional commercial studio, or its off to the french foreign legion.

>Made this thread pretty much to vent about being a poorfag in the interim. Dunno why it turned into a discussion about pedo employment.
Sorry about that, OP. I can't stand those nasty cunts is all. They all need to be castrated, god damn.

>flash
I thought ToonBoon was the industry standard for Canada now. Or maybe I'm thinking of the United States? I can't remember.

>As long as you can say it was all lies however
If it's from tumblr it probably is. Real pedo artists don't post there and tumblr never goes after real pedo artists just anyone they don't like with false accusations for any reason. Pedo artists turn my stomach but I almost never see tumblr actually attack them. Just some twelve year old who likes a "ship" they don't like between a 45 year old and a 50 year old.

Anythign from an ed page about your deviant art to old reddit posts. Says there lies and you can well in life

Have you not heard of Patreon? It's literally easier than it's ever been to pursue a financially stable career in art and animation because of it.

I've never drawn or done anything that could get me close to being accused (though since it's all bullshit with them who knows I guess) I've just seen seriously psychotic accusations against tons of people that are nowhere close to the ballpark of reality. I never believe any tumblr callout posts anymore because 99.99% of the time they are bullshit. But according to tumblr every single person in the world is a pedophile which I just can't buy. Meanwhile the frankly disgusting subhuman shits i.e. actual pedophiles that get lauded here on Sup Forums never ever draw tumblr's fire, it's always just some friend they had a fight with or somebody they're jealous of for having a lot of reblogs who half the fucking time is an 11 year old themselves. They just make shit up about everybody all the time with no shame.

Welcome to the real world user, it's shit and no matter how good you are at what you do you're never gonna get anywhere if you can't play into all those bullshit office politics.

>setting up a patreon without an established fanbase

Man you can barely set up an Artstation or Deviantart without an established fanbase