Dan Slott freaks out

So Dan had an episode on CBR regarding the marriage of MJ and Peter.

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Believe all you want.
It AIN’T happening.
I’ve told people this for 9 years.
Me pitching RYV and getting permission from the Powers That Be to do it– and it selling well enough to merit an ongoing– is as good as you’re going to get (so please keep the sales for Gerry & Ryan’s book up, up, UP!).
Every single editorial team since the marriage worked hard to undo it.
You will not see the marriage restored in the core continuity ever.
It’s far more likely that you’d see a line-wide reboot that reset Spider-Man to high school years (and on model with the creators’ original intent) then the marriage being restored. And THAT is never going to happen either.

Again, believe all you want. Put MJ and her wedding dress or showing off her wedding ring in EVERY message board avatar in the world. Still never happening. Ever. Ever. Ever.
I’m sure I’ll be here next year telling you the same thing.
Apparently, that wasn’t clear enough for some.

Not happening. Over a quarter of a century has been spent by Marvel to undo it. The change from 2007 is the one where they put their collective foot down. It ain’t happening. Sorry. Ever. It’s not a question of “current writers” or “current editorial”. Marvel wants it to stay undone. Could the CHARACTERS come back together in the core continuity in a relationship that’s not a marriage? Sure. But the marriage is NEVER being officially restored.
Clear? Still no.

This isn’t a “let’s argue about it” or “let’s debate it”.
This is fact. This is in stone. This is a done deal.
There is no administration in the near or distant future that will ever reinstate the marriage to the core continuity version of Spider-Man EVER again.
Could the two of them become a couple again? Yes. That could happen.
Could there be an alternate continuity where they’re married? You bet. And we worked to make that happen.
Will they ever be married again? Never.
Is there some future person out there who loves the marriage and will someday wind up a creator or editor at Marvel? Could happen.
Will they be able to reinstate the marriage of these two Marvel characters?
No.
A person who believes that’s a scenario that could happen does not have a realistic grasp on how a company/corporate entity like Marvel functions.
That’s the reality of the situation.

Post link faggot

Apparently, there is still some wiggle room.

It’s not happening.
Ever.
It’s never, ever going to happen.
There is more going on then just people willing or wanting to write for that set up.
There is no person, no matter how passionately they cared about the pre-OMD setup who could ever make it through all the steps and paces to get to a position of editorial power AND be given the reins of the Spider-Unit who would EVER be allowed to put this back into play.
There is no lottery ticket BIG enough that anyone could win it, buy Marvel, and make this status quo happen.
It’s NEVER, EVER, EVER coming about.
No matter how much you want it.
It ain’t happening.
There is NO possible path to this.
….

It wasn’t some magic concurrence of “THESE GUYS” want to undo it.
EVERYONE in power was working on how to undo it NOT THAT LONG INTO THE MARRIAGE.
The undoing was going to happen. It was just a matter of when.
Now that it HAS happened, it AIN’T unhappening.

Your premise of why-and-how it happened isn’t accurate, and the obstacles against the inverse happening are– when you understand the larger forces at work here– are INSURMOUNTABLE.
…

I can think of at least 3 specific things we could do in the book tomorrow (NOT MJ or marriage related) that would cause a boost in sales– and that we WON’T do. (And, no, I won’t tell you what those are.)

Because there are battles you fight and there are wars you win.

There are elements of this job which are about brand management. I could go into how and why this works, but I’m not going to.
There are factors at work here that are not taken into consideration by fans.
There are things fans don’t even add into their “math” when they think about outcomes that they’d like (like, in this case, reinstating the marriage).
Yes, everyone who works in comics IS a fan. No one falls into the job of writer or editor or editor-in-chief by accident.
Everyone who works in comics does this because we dearly love it.
But there are aspects to this job where if you approach it PURELY as a fan and DON’T take those factors into account– you will NOT survive. You will NOT get certain assignments. You will NOT reach certain levels or positions. You will NOT get to affect the changes you would like. And because of that, there are some changes/choices/concepts that WILL NEVER HAPPEN. Not oh-maybe-someday-the-right-person-will-end-up-in-the-right-place-and-THEN-it’ll-happen! NO. NEVER. Again, it’s about fighting battles vs. winning wars.

This reminds me of the really old days when he freaked out on scans_daily a couple of times.

Some days I wish the MJ-marriage-fans could understand the amount of water I had to carry– and the political mine fields I had to dance through– to GET Renew Your Vows to happen. THAT was a longshot. And THAT was in an alternate reality. You are NEVER getting that close again. (And, BTW, you’re welcome.)
…

This is something even above an EIC at this point. Using the example of “well some day a new EIC might change it on a whim” argument is inapplicable. It feels right from a fan perspective, but it has no bearing on the reality of the situation. There are a lot of “fan beliefs” that work that way. For example, the “Now that Disney owns Marvel, things will change the way *I* think they should” recurring fan fantasies– like who will be fired for saying what online or what properties will be allowed to cross-over with which things.

There are things fans really want to believe because they feel right or possible– but for anyone on the inside, we look at that and go “they just don’t get it”.
…

The fantasy scenario where someone “comes to power” who wants to reinstate the marriage, while a false one for many reasons, with every passing year is even less realistic as a fantasy. Marvel editorial is in lockstep on this (which is besides the point, but bear with me for a sec). Every 18 year old who started reading Spider-Man at the age of 8 has grown up with a post-OMD Spider-Man. For them, the marriage was undone, and they’re cool with that. Those post-Marriage stories are the ones they grew up reading. Those are the Marvel college interns cycling in now. Those are the assistant editors of the future, who will one day become the editors of the future, and the editor in chiefs in the future. And every year that gets set further into stone. There is no 30 year old or 40 year old who’s going to magically pop into Marvel editorial from the side. And year after year, the people who’ve grown up who feel as strongly as you do about the 1987 marriage status quo are further and further away from Marvel editorial positions. With that in mind– IT DOESN’T MATTER. Because even the ones in those positions aren’t really the ones who can or are going to change it.

Alright I'm not a shipperfag so I could literally not give a shit about any of this, but why is Dan Slott so adamant about Peter and MJ never getting married?

Is there a story here? Is he a hardcore Gwen/Peter shipper? I don't get it.

Marvel doesn't know what to do with its characters, this is nothing new.

There is no lottery ticket win big enough that is getting someone into a magic position of power that’s going to change this. There’s no zillionaire who’s a big reinstate-the-marriage fan who can rest this property away from Disney/Marvel Entertainment. It’s never, ever, ever happening.
…

I think there could be a run or a storyline that resolves OMD. Or one that gives Spidey a win over Mephisto. But the end result of that story would still NOT be the reinstatement of the marriage. That’s never happening for many, many, many ironclad, set-in-stone reasons.
….

Spider-Man and Spider-Man’s status as a character, brand, and franchise isn’t just the purview of an editor, a group editor, a senior editor, or even the EIC. The fan-dream-scenario of someone who was Spider-Man-marriage-friendly secretly slaving away to rise up through the ranks that way and reinstate the marriage is a tad naive. Why?

Because there are VPs, Senior VPs, the CCO, the publisher, the president, the owner, Marvel Entertainment, Disney…

It’s too simplistic to think that something like the spider-marriage– which was initially rushed into happening– and then was something the Powers That Be tried to undo (unsuccessfully) not that long after– would EVER happen again (and that includes the act of reinstating it).

It just isn’t happening. Even if you’re not a fan– or are even incredibly upset– of how it happened, the fact that it did– and it’s stuck for a decade means that it’s done. And it ain’t EVER happening again.

Why are you crushing fans’ dreams? Because it’s been 10 years. It’s NOT changing. EVER. I’ve seen members of the hardcore fringe argue about this for a decade– and outside of the cathartic act of venting about it– it is a completely pointless waste of energy. It’s NEVER coming back.

Could MJ come back into the book? Yes. Could she be the main love interest again? Absolutely. Will they restore the marriage in the core continuity Spider-Man book? No.

The closest you’re coming to that– EVER– is the Renew Your Vows continuity. So if you like that, please spend some of that energy and dedication supporting it.
…

The argument that “one day a spider-marriage-loving EIC– or even OWNER– will reinstate it” really should be retired. Because it’s not even a pipe dream. It’s an impossibility– it’s nonsensical, because the system doesn’t work that way. And the silly thing is, with every passing year that impossible argument becomes less and less viable, even by its own “logic”, as the 8 year olds of ten years ago, who grew up w/o the marriage, are getting ready to be the new Marvel college interns of tomorrow.
….

post source

There is no amount of writer-clout in the world that could make this happen. Zero.
J.K. Rowling could show up tomorrow and ask this.
Wouldn’t happen.
It is not a question of clout.
…

The marriage will never be reinstated in the core continuity. I’m on year 9 of breaking the news to a certain segment of which, judging by your avatar and endless posts, you’re a part of. This is a lock. There are no “people in charge someday” that will bring about your dearest, fondest Spider-y wish. It AIN’T happening. I could spend hours breaking down for you all the magical dream scenarios you could have– and crush them one by one. IT AIN’T HAPPENING EVER.
Responding to comments that Ben Reilly returned after being equally banned by editorial, he says,

The reason for the Ben Reilly embargo is an apples-and-oranges comparison.

It was because multiple creative teams wanted to bring the character back– multiple editorial teams wanted to bring the character back– the powers that be wanted to bring the character back– and it was all a question of timing of when the character would come back.

There is no circumstance at all like that for the marriage. There is a lockstep all the way up to infinity for why the marriage will never, ever, ever be reinstated in the core continuity. Ever. You may get What Ifs? or alternate realities or what have you. But in the core continuity this is a thing which will never, ever, ever happen. Infinity.

…

There is no time that will ever happen. Ever. I’ll be back to remind of this next year as well as you continue to charge at this windmill yet again. It ain’t happening.

community.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?92750-Thread-Drift-Will-One-More-Day-ever-be-reversed/page16&p=2674226#post2674226

>high school years (and on model with the creators’ original intent)
but he was in college in the creators' original intent

>It AIN’T happening
Yeah, and Peter was never getting his body back either.

>buy Marvel, and make this status quo happen.

Don't fucking test me Slott. I'll force you to suck Bendis' dick when I do while he takes it up the as by some BBC.

I learned a long time ago, Slott is a liar. So obviously MJ and Peter are getting back together.

>next year
>next year
>next year

rrrrRRRRRRRREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE...........EEEREEEE.......eeeeeeeeeeee

r-ree

Yeah, fans will just have to sort of get used to Otto Octavius as the new Superior Spider-Man!

>I could go into how and why this works

> but I’m not going to.

Because it doesn't. Sales /still/ haven't recovered after OMD and no fan wants this. Just bring the damn thing back you selfish child.

Why does Slott hate MJ?

Just like Bucky will always be dead and will never, ever come back?

I can appreciate what he's trying to say, but I wish he'd give some explanation as to why. He just keeps saying over and over it can't happen, and that Marvel from editorial up to EIC and beyond has been against it for 25 years.

Why? What's the reason for this?

He was fine with her before, but ever since Superior Spider-Man he lost his mind with no rhythm and reason and the quality of his writing suffered for it.

19 y/o here. I'm not okay with this.

what I don't get is how he insists literally everyone at Marvel hates the marriage and has been working non-stop to get it removed for 25 years

Why is Dan Slott so defensive about this stuff? This guy sounds like those Marveldrones that post on Sup Forums every time a DC movie comes out.

He sounds like a really pathetic human being.

In a post that wasn't quoted here he says that the marriage was rushed in the comics because when Stan decided to marry the characters in his strip, he got lots of media attention and people wanted to boost the comics as well as a result, but then shortly after they decided the marriage had to go.

He's not BSing there, since that's well documented (the marriage being rushed, if anything) and how the steps to undo it went as far back as Clone Saga - it was basically undoing the marriage and the whole "deal with Venom" and whatever other collateral recent years had to dealt to Peter all in one fell swoop, since the orignal endgame was for Ben to take the Peter Parker identity back.

Then you had the big crash of the 90s and since Marvel was hurting all over they quickly restored Peter, and not wanting to rock the boat any further, they decided they couldn't split MJ and Peter at the end of the Clone Saga.

Sure enough, when the dust settled a bit, the first thing you had was the unsuccessful MJ assassination in the Mackie/Byrne era.

He's got something up his sleeve and is weighting for a big reveal. It's all part of the plan

waiting* ugggg

Basically, Marvel is dead set on the fact that they believe that Peter should have stayed in high school due to the success of Ultimate Spider-Man (which wasn't even that good in hindsight, but I'm getting off topic). Having Peter married ages him (which was the Ditko's original intent. A character that grows and deals with real life issues), and aging Peter means he would be mature. Marvel can't have that since they want Peter to be a goofy teenager for the rest of his life (which /never/ even happened in the actual continuity. When Peter was in highschool he was an edgy loner who felt distant from his peers.)

Is there worse person than Slott in comics right now? I don't mean worse writer, but in terms of character...Why is he such an utter scumbag?

It's so weird for me. He became such a twat.

Uh, he's nowhere near the worst person in comics. Byrne, for example.

Is this fat fuck saying that a superhero being in a loyal marriage is somehow unrealistic or some shit like that?.

Sooo I can continue to ignore everything Spider-Man related outside of RYV?

Ok then

>This guy sounds like those Marveldrones that post on Sup Forums every time a DC movie comes out.

Gee, I wonder why...You do realize Slott has admitted to coming on here before, but stopped due to "negativity" Who's to say he hasn't come back?

Canon is a meme, these characters have been going on for 70 years and with influx of movies and overall mass media exposure will ensure they'll at least survive 70 more years, by that time fans who have grown up reading married Spider-man stories will have taken over.

I'd be more interested if anyone on CBR giving him attention stopped REEEEing about the marriage and asked what those plans-that-didn't-come-to-fruition regarding Ben were, and who were the creative teams involved. I feel DeMatteis, when he was on and off writing backups for BND, was involved, probably.

I am reasonably sure he's flailing so hard as a means to get RYV sales (and wank his ego at the same time). That's the only overbearing point all of his tirades have with "never coming back, this is your best bet".

>Who's to say he hasn't come back?
>Implying he ever left

That idiot still come here, I'm sure of it

Yep. In fact I am sure he was on one of those OMD threads yesterday telling everyone it will never be undone.

>full autist.jpg.webm.docx

Oh shit, thread link?. I wanna see it

Didn't he pretend to be another user in CBR before? Or am I thinking of Wacker?

Even his simple explanations are overdrawn and yet poorly articulated.

At the most basic level, he is a terrible writer.

> This guy sounds like those Marveldrones that post on Sup Forums every time a DC movie comes out.

This just pathetic. The movies are shit, that's why people say they're shit. Do people actually believe this conspiracy crap or is just bait?

Is Byrne still part of the inudstry at all? Did he do anything in the last years besides that shitty star trek photocomic?

>the Marvel college interns
So they do exist after all.

This exemplifies my biggest problem with marvel right now. This weird adversarial role that the creators have taken in regards to fans. I understand being frustated if fans are vocal about a storyline happening but it's weird to me that he gets so mad about people being passionate about the characters. Wouldn't it be worse for marvel if people stopped caring about the comics or got turned off by the creator being so vocally against a segment of the fanbase.

But Byrne produced good shit.

>Wouldn't it be worse for marvel if people stopped caring about the comics or got turned off by the creator being so vocally against a segment of the fanbase.
well that is starting to happen

>about the 1987 marriage status quo
This "it's old" dismissal is bullshit. The marriage was in top form in 2006, immediately before OMD. It's not a 1987 status quo, it's a 1987-2006 status quo and that's a big difference

Holy fucking shit why is everyone on Sup Forums so fucking stupid?

The comment I responded to said:

>Is there worse person than Slott in comics right now? I don't mean worse writer, but in terms of character.

We're not talking about talent, we're talking about personality. Byrne is enormously talented, but he's also a massive prick.

It was posted earlier.

I haven't bought Spider-man since ANAD because of Slott.

Is this a general Marvel thing, or just Slott? Who else at Marvel gets into it with fans like this?

It's like you didn't even read what Slott wrote.

...

t. D*sney intern

I'm feel like we have high school age spiderman in miles.

This far? I'm guessing Slott. He goes as far as to make personal snipes on people posting in the thread ("OH I KNOW YOU AND YOUR PRO-MARRIAGE WEBSITE [this sounds fucking awesome. Can we make this a thing? PRO-MARRIAGE? It sounds as loaded as "pro-life"] AND YOUR ARTICLES ON WHY THIS CAN'T STAND I'M NOT SURPRISED TO SEE YOU HERE")

>It's like you didn't even read what Slott wrote.
That's just standard best practices for comics fans.

He's right on this one though. Most of them did hate it and did everything they could to get out of it. It was only done because Stan was going to marry them in the newspaper comic and said it'd be a good idea to do it in the main comic too.

You have to remember that most of the people writing comics hate marriage as a story in general because it "takes away potentially dramatic stories" i.e. they're lazy hacks who think generic relationship drama with a bunch of different girls is much easier to write.

Spencer

How dare he bring Ms. Lion into this!

Fan-creator communication was a huge mistake. It was fine when it was letters, but the Internet just poisoned things. It made fans more whiny and entitled, and creators angrier and more reactionary, because everyone can now instantly shout at everyone else.

Seriously, do you honestly believe what you're writing or is this just trolling?

>He sounds like a really pathetic human being.

That's because a large number of the people involved in making comic books ARE pathetic human beings.

When the whole "anime was a mistake" meme started, what Miyazaki actually said was how most of the people making anime these days are themselves self-interested, cloistered otaku lacking in real-world experiences and perspective, and so the things they produce are likewise stunted and devoid of substance. The same principle applies to American comics, where instead of people who come in with well-rounded lives and pools of experience to influence their work, all they have to offer is their own regurgitation of the comics other people have already made.

Yes, there are exceptions, but generally they don't manage to make much impact amidst the sea of rehashes. Even when they do, their work inevitably ends up being reduced to fodder for the next crop of geeks lacking in their own ideas.

>J.K. Rowling could show up tomorrow and ask this.

Jesus Christ Slott is delusional.

If Rowling turned up at Marvel and said she wanted to write Spider-Man she could do whatever the fuck she wants. Her Spider-Man would outsell every other comic in existence by author reputation alone. Slott would be on his ass so quick his flabby cheeks would be cooked through and through from the friction.

>The marriage will never come back
>Trust me guys there are TONS of reasons
>like so many reasons it will blow your mind
>I had to suck so many cocks to write RYV
>There are so many reasons why OMD is final
>I could tell you all the reasons right here to
>but I won't because you should by RYV
>please buy RYV because ambiguous reasons

He writes so much and says so little

>do you honestly not believe the narrative my fellow astroturfers have worked so hard to create?!
>oh dear, better call an emergency marketing meeting or the boss will be furious!

Maybe you'll have better luck on Sup Forums, cupcake.

I'm so glad Marvel is failing. Their hatred for their fanbase proves that they don't deserve to exist.

Exactly. And the reaction from the otaku to Miyazaki and comics fans to anyone saying this is the same: angry rejection of the idea and REEEing at the normies.

Miles isn't on the teetering on the fine line of having an autismo break down and shooting up his school, so that'd be a negative.

If someone on Rowling's level showed up at Marvel wanting to write, Marvel would have Slott shot in the head if they wanted it.

After this rant OMD will be undone in less than 5 years.
Slott is vastly overstimating his own influence, especially considering how Amazing Spider-man sales are not that great anymore and a relaunch with new creative team is the fastest way to fix it

He's basically saying that fans coming up nowadays haven't grown up with the marriage so the people coming into the industry now are those raised on a post-marriage status quo, hold no affection to the marriage and thus there's even less of a chance than before of the marriage coming back.

On a deeper level, though, most superhero writers hate marriage as a storytelling device for reasons I already stated (writing cheap relationship drama with what amounts to a harem is way easier than trying to write a long term relationship with a single person) and many self-insert as Peter too thus want to pair him with the types of girls or characters really that they like. Remember that one of the reasons Quesada hated the marriage was that he thought the idea of a "nerd" like Peter being able to marry a supermodel like MJ (the supermodel thing had only been recent; she'd always been a low level actress before that) was unrealistic.

The level of delusion is astonishing. Please be trolling, for your sake.

>Oh boy, when I pull the surprise /so/ many people will buy the comic from word of mouth alone.

>What? People are figuring me out?!?

>Can't let the hype die down before the event happen. It /must/ be a surprise.

>DERAIL DERAIL DERAIL DERAIL!

Bendis, for one.

This, ruining Black Cat, etc. I like to believe the guy who wrote Spider-Island is still there somewhere, though. Like, Superior Spider-Man was a shit idea, but part of the problem was that editorial told him to stretch it for longer. I dunno.

Isn't somewhere else writing Renew Your Vows, though? Judging by I wonder if the success of renew Your Vows wouldn't be a way for Marvel to test the waters about bringing the marriage back later this year.

It's clear he's afraid. He desperately wants Spider-Man to be "his" with the longest run. He wants his run to be the definitive Spider-Man run.

Putting the marriage back would diminish his run and he knows it. He's arguing in his own self interest.

The truth is the marriage will come back. Marvel is slowly moving to its own rebirth. Dan Slott's run will never be remembered in the top runs.

Wacker, Spencer, and that one editor with the fedora. Tom something.

Sorry, love.

Best run along and call that meeting quickly if you want to keep your job.

Besides the FF, are there any high-profile married characters at Marvel?

Who in the fuck above EIC could be blocking this?

Slott clearly wants to be the one who brings the marriage back himself. It's gonna be his grand finale for the series. That way, when people remember Slott's run the'll think of the marriage first, which would paint him in a good light.

>Wow, Slott was such a great visionary for bringing the marriage back.

>And he was writing for /that/ long. What a legend.

Truly Slott is the ultimate Jew.

You know, this little breakdown is our best chance at getting Slott kicked out of the main spider title and, eventually, getting the marriage back. Marvel usually allows their writers and editorial to be pricks in social media but this is a step beyond that, it's just a pathetic meltdown.

That'll only happen if he puts the marriage back.

Dude, if they didn't fire him for telling a fan to go fuck himself (his words), then there's not a chance in hell this will get him fired.

>weighting

Is Slott heavy? Is this how the obese bide their time?

Dude's really rude to the fans. I remember once on his twitter some guy said "I really love your books, but don't infect it with your politics". And he responded with "I see you have a #FreeMilo hashtag in your profile. Please don't let me think less of my readers because of your politics". This was the pre-pedo thing BTW

Spider-man is dead. Bury him. Consider this mercy.

>Every 18 year old who started reading Spider-Man at the age of 8 has grown up with a post-OMD Spider-Man. For them, the marriage was undone, and they’re cool with that.

Reminder that Spider-man sales were halved by OMD and have only fallen further.

>They'll fire him for this
Dude, your appraisal of the media's current climate is really bad.

Can someone help here? Is this person being serious? No one can actually be this stupid, right?

Just ignore it, he's trying to rile you up

>Every 18 year old who started reading Spider-Man at the age of 8 has grown up with a post-OMD Spider-Man.

Because obviously fans never check out older runs.

Because in order to be a Marvel fan you have to be completely ignorant of all other comics, and like eating shit.

t.marveldrone