Why doesn't Gandalf ever use AoE against the Orcs?

Why doesn't Gandalf ever use AoE against the Orcs?
Isn't he supposed to be super powerful?

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How does Bilbo kill orcs by throwing rocks?

they lift
unlike you

He does once, against the Nazguls.

lol fuck u man

thats kind of shitty dont you think? he doesnt seem to help much in battle being a wizard and all. i only see him sword fighting.

it's just banter mate
cmon, did i hurt you so badly?

the only one who actually owns is legolas

i can handle the bants you pathetic worm, dont worry about me m8

in the hobbit five armies movie when the eagles come in with radagast and drop bears on the orcs, are these the eagles people talk about flying frodo to mordor?

He is severely nerfed by the almighty God

He uses the most powerful flashbang ever.

What do you mean by this?

Is this what Sup Forums is? Just autists nitpicking popular franchises?

He is not allowed to. He really only should use magic against others that can use magic, like the Witch King.

How says he isnt allowed to? What is gandalf? Is he an angel?

Pretty much, he was only sent to middle earth to deal with the ring. I'm guessing he was gimped like said.

Saruman doesn't use much magic either.

And who created the rings? Doesnt the elf Lady have a ring why isnt she evil? Who sent gandelf? God?

>Is he an angel?
Yes actually.

Let's dispense once and for all with the meme that Gandalf never uses magic, OK? Here is a list of the magic Gandalf has used in the Hobbit + LOTR trilogies:

- Pyrokinesis (fireworks, pinecones, on Strider's sword)
- Telekinetic staff blast (rock split, vs Saruman)
- Animal control (moths, eagles, horses)
- Concussion blast (in Goblin Town)
- Light (in Moria)
- Remove Curse (on Theoden)
- Aura shield (vs Balrog)
- Bless / enchant weapon (vs Balrog)
- Weather control (vs Saruman)
- Advanced Light (vs Nazgul)

and that's just off the top of my head

He never uses frostbolt or blizzard. Not even an arcane explosion.

lotr.wikia.com/wiki/Rings_of_Power

Start readin' boy

LOTR magic isnt "12 level mage casts fireball lvl 3 dealing 3d12 damage" tier you twats.

I watched a 4 minute video instead. So the end of the lord of the rings means .its the end of the age of magic and time for the age of men, what does that mean for the elves? They are immortal but their kindoms fall to ruins over time? Why dont they just do maintenence? I don't understand this

Wizards in the world of tolkien is supposed to be angelic beings similar in strength to sauron n balrogs but the God of the tolkienverse nerfed them to make them a guide to good rather than major power players.

insufficient funding
blame the ruling class, not me

he's a fucking FIRE wizard

The elves have a very strong longing for a land beyond middle earth. The longer they stay in middle earth, the stronger that longing gets. The less "magical" middle earth becomes, the stronger they want to go to that land.

This is all so interesting. Was tolkein a huge nerd? Will anyone ever create a better, and vast fictional universe than this guy?
How do we know this isnt what it's like for us in this reality?
Do you think if theres infinite universes that there is one where tolkeins world is real?
Has anyone ever written stories after lotr?

Why do the stories told in the star wars universe suck so much compared to tolkeins?

actually Gandalf used both lightning and fire in books when fighting off Nazguls and charged his sword with a lightning to kill Balrog, so he's not a fire wizard

Far out dude

I think the fatman who is writing GoT is not bad at world building.
That being said the got tv show cannot even be compared to the lotr movies.
The movies are pure kino, a visual and auditorial ecstasy.
The tv show started off okay but became utter shit real quick.

Lightning is often part of the arsenal of fire mages.

Fire mages are fucking gay, lightning mages doubley so.

are you saying that the lotr movies were good?

>As his unrestricted form, Olorin, he had all his previous powers massively boosted and the ability to shapeshift. As for his raw power, he should be comparable to Arien, who could move the sun through the sky, thus making him enormously beyond most fantasy characters of this style.

>However, even this form seems to have restrictions, as the Ainur were said to have their power restricted upon descending to earth. If so his true form would be enormously beyond his other forms, possibly capable of destroying entire universes.

Gandalf is OP

>God of the tolkienverse nerfed them to make them a guide to good rather than major power players.

just in case they decided to turn evil so there weren't multiple saurons, which was a good decision considering sauromon.

>Will anyone ever create a better, and vast fictional universe than this guy?

"No!"

Yes, those eagles participated in that battle.

Yes they are masterpieces honestly.

>powerful wizards confront each other
>it's another episode of telekenetic Wizard Wrestling Entertainment

In the book the fellowship is set upon by a pack of wargs on their way to Moria. Gandalf basically unleashes a giant fire nova and wrecks them.

Fuck off Christopher. Fuck off.

That's dumb. Who's gonna stop him

What is this about other forms? Like if he was not on earth and in his true form he could destroy universes? That doesn’t seem right compared to what I’ve read. Isn’t he a wizard and like a guardian of earth?

Yeah, in a tabletop D&D game or in an MMO you would want to use AOE spells because in a virtual world there's no chance of you causing a fucking flash-fire or hitting your own dudes.

In the film universe, it's pretty fucking obvious that Gandalf's spells aren't targeted. I.E. if he blows up a building, chances are EVERYONE in that building is gonna blow up too; not just his targets.

What kind of bush-league questions are these. It's like you guys have never had a D&D game where the DM decides that the fireball you set off also collapses the wooden support beams and causes a cave-in.

tl;dr: Gandalf is too wise to use AOE spells that could devastate allies as well as enemies because he knows he's not in a videogame you fucking retards.

>Who's gonna stop him

The literal God of the universe.

Autists, fetishists, angry loners

I thought he might be able to cast a targeting circle and rain down frost bolts or something.

In film universes with established lore, yes. If you would rather talk about who's fucking who or how pretty explosions are you should visit a Game of Thrones or Comic Book Movie thread.

Who has better lore, us or Tolkien’s world?

lightning IS fire, haven't you seen The Last Airbender?

Who has better lore, Tolkien or the flint stones?

I just read that on the wiki too. Where the hell does the destroying universes thing come from? Nothing even remotely like that is in any tolkien shit.

Um no, it’s different. Who the fuck thinks lightning is fire?

what god's gonna come down from heaven and smite him? dont be stupid

real Life

t. archaeologist

There are consequences to actions of these beings. Sauroman wasnt able to join the after life for instance.

>wikifags

Lightning is normally not considered a core element (air, fire, wind, earth). Its mostly seen as a combination of air and fire.

Redundant question since the tolkienverse is a reflection of our world.

>Will anyone ever create a better, and vast fictional universe than this guy?
try original nordic Sagas, the were his 'inspiration' e.g. it's exactly the same

No it isn’t lightning is electricity it’s not fire. I know I’m a weatherman

no, it's water

Are you saying that we are living in the age of men and all the stuff that happened was so far in the past we don’t have records of elves and orcs and wizards?

>- Remove Curse (on Theoden)

thats how they depicted it in the movie. in the book he just convinces him, its not magic.

The story n the lore is an allagory.

Of what?

Of personal divinity. Espacially the lotr books. A hobbit, a lowly creature, overcomes his temptation to become Godly through his personal sacrifice.
Your inner good defeating your inner evil.

no, that's Conan

ask me anything about Old Norse

That’s got nothing to do with our world.

The RPG-tier magic you'd consider powerful is more of the realm of the Valar. They built the world from scratch to make it look like what they had seen in the Vision. The Maiar like Gandalf are closer to servants, usually having small abilities in very specific areas of the realm of their patron.

Using raw magical power is against the wizards' mandate, as far as the gods are concerned it would be no different from Sauron's methods.

Our world is full of people who either compromise to evil and people who achieve acsension by remaining good. The whole point of the lore is to highlight this notion.

bullshit, there are tons of scenario's where orc armies come in such vast sizes where it would be impossible to hit anything but orcs

They did miss an opportunity to show Gandalf revealing his power level early on in Fellowship, before they reach Moria they get pursued by wargs with a few orcs and surrounded on a hilltop and Gandalf basically says "Fuck it" and sets the whole hill around them on fire and lights Legolas' arrow on fire to pierce the alpha wolf's heart. I think it was retooled for the Hobbit but they made it seem lamer by making the extent of his ability lighting pinecones on fire.

It has to do with the part of the books that no one talks about, because they were bamboozled by the adaptations that treated it as an adventure series akin to a more epic scale and fantasy filled Tarzan, as opposed to the downright biblical (I'm not kidding or making this up) legend it's supposed to be; and ignore that parts of the story that didn't make it into the adaptation, because clearly if Peter Jackson didn't think they were important enough to include, and they look silly on the first look, then they're just in there as a stupid mistake, and Tolkien didn't think through his fucking Magnum Opus.

To keep it short: The original idea behind the whole legendarium was to artificially create an "English Mythology". (If you look into it, while the English do have some bits and pieces of mythology, it's mostly lifted from others, like the Celts or Norse.) He wanted to make something like Norse Mythology, just more inline with English values and concepts. Which also of course included Christianity, whether people like it or not.

That is what "The Age of Man" is about.
You know Tom Bombadil?
He wasn't there because Tolkien was High. He was a blatant parallel to pre-Apple Adam. Magic Forrest that is his domain, beautiful wife, simple life, evil tree. Can't be any more straightforward.
He wasn't immune to the Ring because he was "LOL Too Stronk". He was immune to the Ring because he, like that Adam, was Innocent.
He didn't want anything. Nothing that the Ring could promise him. Not power, not wealth. Nothing that magic or strength or anything of the sort can bring.

Every character and people is shown to be imperfect in this.
Except for a single one, outside of Bombadil. Except he isn't some magic dude in a forest. It's Faramir, who equally refuses the ring, being a truly good man, wanting only his father's approval for who he is, which the Ring cannot provide.
He shows that Man alone, still has the capacity for Innocence, even if not all men are so.

So they can’t use magic, even though they are wizards and thousands of people suffer and die because god says so? Cool.

In addendum, if you're not into mythologies or religion or anything like that:

Man inherits the Earth, for he alone is worthy of it, not the proud and apathetic Elves, not the Greedy Dwarves, no one but Man.

He isn't allowed to. There are rules. We only see him use overt magic against the witch king and the balrog for a reason.

That’s brillaint

>It's Faramir, who equally refuses the ring, being a truly good man, wanting only his father's approval for who he is, which the Ring cannot provide.
Then what did the ring offer Gollum? He's not like a dragon or a dwarf that desires greed but he seems to want the ring for the sake of having the ring without any ambition to put it to use.

>He's not like a dragon or a dwarf that desires

>Implying only Dragons and Dwarves can be greedy
>"Precious"
>"They STOLE it!"
>Not Greed
Are you serious?
Gollum wasn't innocent, but he was too simple a creature to lust for the kind of power that builds empires.

The one time the Valar got involved, the conflict sank half the continent.

One thing you gotta understand is that most people living on Middle-Earth at the time of the War of the Rings are either
1) Present by their own will
2) Having ancestors that didn't heed the call of the Valar, committed evil or outright sided with Morgoth in the past.

I'd argue the only folks who can legit complain are the true numenorean descendants like Aragorn. Numénor fell into evil while they remained loyal to the Valar, but they ended up having to flee to Middle-Earth while Numénor was destroyed by Eru himself.

Everyone else left on Middle-Earth are either wildmen and elves who refused to go west, evil men, evil numenoreans or orcs. And then you have the few remaining elves who came from Beleriand, but those are free to go at their own will.

Also, the War of the Rings is therefore mainly a human problem, and the Valar always had a lesser relationship with humans than they had with elves, perhaps because they do not know where humans end up after death. Humans aren't invested in the world the same way elves are, and only Eru really knows what they are and where they go.

Greed is wanting excess, constantly seeking more. Gollum was content with just the ring.

>for he alone is worthy of it, not the proud and apathetic Elves
I'm not sure if Tolkien considered men to be higher than elves at any time. The 4th age is certainly their time, but from the start there is this idea of permanence with elves, they are part of the world, part of the landscape, and will ever be, while men are visitors of the world.

>High in the air {Gandalf} tossed the blazing brand. It flared with a sudden white radiance like lightning; and his voiced rolled like thunder. 'Naur an edraith ammen! Naur dan in ngaurhoth!' he cried. There was a roar and a crackle, an the tree above him burst into a leaf and bloom of blinding flame. The fire leapt from tree-top to tree-top. The whole hill was crowned with dazzling light. The swords and knives of the defenders shone and flickered. The last arrow of Legolas kindled in the air as it flew, and plunged burning into the heart of a great wolf-chieftain. All the others fled.

You'd have to really twist your brain to have this make sense

It's really late, maybe "greed" is not the best word for it, but it's literally an object of worship for him.
Let's not pretend like his relationship with the ring isn't very much in line with things that Christianity views distasteful.

It's not so much Man being "better" than Elves or Dwarves. Having the immutable capacity for goodness is not a quantitative thing in Christianity, it's not like in video games where you can just accumulate karma.

I'm not saying it's 100% logical. I'm saying it's inline with Christian values, which it was meant to be.
Seriously, try and re-read the books with this concept in mind. Pay attention to how it talks of times gone by, and what the people that the characters interract with are like. What we learn of Minas Tirith for example before the battle, of the life of the citizens, etcetera.
If you were never part of a Christian community and never read the Bible, it probably won't do much for you, but there's a lot to it.
Nothing Tolkien put into his work was by accident. Durin "The Undying", the succession of Dwarf kings that the Dwarves considered to be each a rebirth of the same Dwarf was named as such because the word "durin" literally means "to endure" in Catalan or Old French (I can't remember which right off the top of my head). Hence the word "Endure" (endurin').

The legendarium is littered with symbolism, much less obvious examples similar to the one I mentioned above in terms of word/name usage, etc.
And he didn't just do it for a laugh either. As I said, it was supposed to be a proper Mythology, and mythologies often reflect the roots of words.

Gandalf doesn’t have enough mana for AoE spells, or maybe Middle Earth’s tax policy tax magical users extra when they use magic

Well he also did want to learn secrets, it’s why he wound up getting cast out from his home. He would use the ring to learn gossip and stir up trouble until eventually being shunned and despised. In the movie they make it like everyone knew he killed Deagol instead. After being shunned and having the ring for a long time he views mountains and wants to get into them because they hold deep secrets. The ring corrupts him based on his curiousity and greed to hoard secret knowledge. Not an extreme flaw but the ring worked with that only. But that evolves into something darker and he starts hating everyone and plots revenge. In the two towers he even plans to take the ring and get revenge on everyone(Sauron, the hobbits etc) and become a dark Lord in his own.

Oy te to laddy ye done fucked yerself now

>If so his true form would be enormously beyond his other forms, possibly capable of destroying entire universes.

who wrote this shitty fanfic? in his 'true form' he's a powerful angelic being yes, but one of many, and not in the top tier of the Valar, who have no indication of being capable of that either.

he came down and did a minor genocide on Aragorn's ancestors and destroyed their whole island after sauron convinced them to invade Valinor.

It's kind of correct, just not in the Dragonball Z sense.
Let's not forget that Melkor managed to fuck up the entirety of creation by adding a few verses of his own to a song they sang, creating the world.

Melkor, the most powerful of the ainur, managed to fuck with the earth's creation so it never became what was intended, but he still couldn't destroy it or create his own, and still a bitch compared to big daddy Eru.

gandalf/olorin isn't near that level, saying he's capable of destroying universes is almost literally something you'd see in dragonball fanfic, it certainly isn't coming from tolkien.

I mean I'm with you.
I just wanted to point out that if we purely look at it from what "tier" he's at, yeah he's amongst beings that alter reality itself by speaking their mind.

Destroying universes is a terrible example of that tier though, considering this isn't a battle shonen bullshit world where there's a sale on new universes every other weekend.

LotR inspired High Fantasy settings, but it doesn't conform to the High Fantasy setting tropes. As such, Gandalf is not casting Magic Missile and standad wizard attacks. In fact he is more just a wise leader than anything.

gj at the boomer tier """"bantz"""" you twats