Is there any other show where a character design goes completely Off model all the time?

Is there any other show where a character design goes completely Off model all the time?

That's more of a modern cartoon thing.

Samurai Jack.

Transformers G1

Do they really go off model in the same way as OP, which is completely different art styles

If I recall they do change sizes all the time due to plot and laziness and animation errors, but the art style if you can call it that is pretty much all the same

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They did use fucked-up character sheets for a while. Starscream was officially one-eared at first, I think.

>All these cancerous crossboarders that have never heard of Ren & Stimpy

Model Sheets are the work of hacks that should stick to anime.

Sugar is legitimately an incompetent creator. It's her job to check the story boards for off-model shit and out of character interactions. She clearly doesn't do that.

Only in the comics, and really only by Jose Delbo who was a notorious model sheet copier.

That said, the toons did have a few model sheets so sometimes some studios would use outdated references. Arcee in "Only Human" noticeably uses an older model that puts her car kibble on the front of her shoulders instead of her back.

Ren and Stimpy but that's kinda the point

On one hand I want to agree with you simply because I hate weebs....
But why is Ren and Stimpy considered good again? From an animation standpoint, sure, nothing to frown about, but animation itself is only one small fraction of a good show, you can have the greatest drummer in the world in the worlds shittiest rock and rolls band, they're still gonna be a shitty band with one good aspect. Yngwie Malmsteen is without a doubt a great guitarist, but he can't write a song for shit.

It's been stated that they don't really demand adherence to design sheets, most noticeably in their lack of consistent heights. The boarders are left to their own styles, and I can appreciate the idea behind it.

But good god have there been some bizarre slides in terms of design as things have gone on, like every one of them is playing telephone with the previous boarder on how some character or thing is supposed to look.

>story boards for off-model
not the story board job to be on model. They are only there to describe the scenes.

>off-model is bad
Stop being retarded. There is a difference between proper, intentional "character goes off-model all the time" and "The artist is so fucking bad that is unable to draw on-model"

>being this stupid
There were model sheets for Ren and Stimpy you try hard newfag. There is not off-model without on-model.

I wonder how many retards actually believe this.

>trying to compare Ren and Stimpy with SU
Oh, how the depths you (((people))) would plumb.

>and I can appreciate the idea behind it.
the idea of being lazy and unprofessional?

Some of the later episodes of Flapjack were like that. Early ones went off-model too, but not ALL the time. And Transformers G1, like mentioned.

I want to say Jem had some trouble with staying on-model, but I can't remember if that was its problem, or just spectacular animation goofs.

Chowder, Flapjack, Adventure Time

Hey retards, does this piss you off?

That looks like intentional off-model so, no.

Most of the retards have only seen SU post-Return/Jailbreak. If they followed the show from the beginning they'd know why the staff DOESN'T want strict rules on how the characters are drawn and never did.

>it is fine ruining characters. That was our plan all along. It was on purpose!

I think a lot people forget SBT went off model a lot of times too. Not to extent of SU but its still vey noticeable

The problem isn't that Sugar follows the loose philosophy of models (which has its pluses and minuses but overall is the way I prefer it, as evidence in storyboards that Sugar herself does, which are always doing new things and look very stylish), it's that one of the storyboards she keeps on has hijacked the character into a horrible Invader Zim parody and won't give it back.

Who are you quoting?

>Peridot needs redemption!
>Jasper needs redemption!
>Rubies needs redemption!
>Diamonds needs redemption!
Why this people are so afraid of having an antagonists?

>l is the way I prefer it
totally not a biased slave sucking the cock of his e-waifu there.

People like the characters and want a happy end for them.

Is that even English? Do you really want to go back to the Animaniacs era of religious model-following? Why would you ever want to do traditional animation if you were just going to follow a model? Why not just use, you know, a 3D Model.

They forgot SBT, too.

>I-it's intentional I swear

>green memelord goblin
>happy end

You don't know what on-model and off-model mean, do you?

Disregarding your meme description, yes.

I know what they mean, though I have no idea what they mean in your head. But we've already established that we don't speak the same language.

I was not that guy and no, you don't know what on-model and off-model mean.

"The model" is a set of guidelines that are circulated in the studio by some authority (probably lead animator/designer) which describe the ways that characters "should" be drawn. This can be anything ranging from exact dimensions/proportions and relative sizes to gestures which should/shouldn't be used, whether creases should be drawn at certain angles, how the hair parts, what kind of poses to use, essentially anything that can be described may be described. "On-model"/"off-model" is not a binary thing, but is rather a gradient of philosophies of whether or not it's more important to use artistic judgment to create a pose/scene/whatever that the individual artist feels is aesthetic or whether it is more important to very strictly stick to the given guidelines for consistency's sake. It's not a very complicated concept.

I can only assume you're taking my crack at on-model philosophy being too robotic far too literally. Which is both ironic and fitting considering the subject matter.

>the golden age of the animation was an era of religious model-following
>somehow this retard thinks having proper model sheets is a bad thing
Your regular SUfag

The golden age of animation was a time of pre-unionization where genuine artists of robust backgrounds congregated at a time in history not to "make cartoons" for business's sake, but to make art for the sake of art. Golden ages never come again, so stop living in the past.


It's cute that you have a hate-boner for Steven Universe, but believe it or not this subject is larger than one cartoon that you're obsessed over. Stop comparing feature animations with hundred-million dollar budgets to Network cartoons and start comparing the average cartoon that has a strict model philosophy to the average cartoon that has a loose model philosophy. The production cycle of a cartoon does not allow for a lead artist to micromanage every animator's every move and without that if you try and reduce the story-boarders to the role of Korean animator then that is exactly the quality you're going to get.

>diamonds need redemption

Lol ok,when you learn how to redeem 3 people who basically hiroshimad your people and even some of their own the come back to me.

Peridot,jasper and the rubies are fine, but cant go redemming the main antagonists, thats like goku redeeming frieza

There is a big difference between a "loose model philosophy" and shit like THIS I don't mean little changes. I don't mean different styles for a character. I don't mean different kinds of animation. But when a character height changes non stop every episode you know that the things are fucked up. Like how Greg sometimes looked as small as fucking Steven in those flashback episodes.

SU is the only modern cartoon with this king problem. You can't defend this

no because this was one of the first episodes to be produced, plus ian has a very distinct artstyle of animation that translates poorly to steven universes more rounded artstyle. However its no excuse about the eye lid thing going on in pic related it just doesnt work here

You know those were hallucinations right?

>ctrl f sonic underground
>no results
cmon, guys

Fucking hell

Making characters larger or smaller to emphasize how powerful and/or in control of the scene they are is ok in animation. They even use it in live action from time to time by manipulating the angle of the shot.

They don't do that in SU and you know it. Stop making excuses.

>Stop being retarded. There is a difference between proper, intentional "character goes off-model all the time" and "The artist is so fucking bad that is unable to draw on-model"
Which of those do you think is the case with Steven Universe?

Spoiler alert, it's the latter.

its fun to see antagonists in more friendly terms senpai

But you gotta realize it's not fun for people if the original villain character was completely revamped into a new personality.

No. Even teen titans go has consistency in its shitty art. SU is a unique specimen of horrible talent

Remember Bismuth?

Sapphire getting her way to inspect the station vs. Sapphire being presented to the Diamonds.

It's not an excuse it's a visual effect.

...Panty & Stocking?

Nobody cared about her.

But Panty and Stocking is intentionally doing it they switch art style all the time for fun. Like the Volleyball game turning into south park stop motion cut outs. The ghosts exploding are models with fireworks in them.

Thats all intentional for comedy but even then the characters themselves stay fairly on model. Panty doesn't shrink over the course of the season ending up a quater of her height by the end any time they do change its completely intentional.

If Steven Universe just had a few fuck ups every now and then it would be fine but its 1 episode Stevens normal height the next hes half that and needs a ladder to use the kitchen and it constantly happens with multiple characters heights and designs fluctuate and change.

It's very obvious those two pictures were drawn by two different people though

Holy shit but look at amethyst's face.

Silly faces is different from constantly changing height

When you're dealing with Western animation studios. Koreans don't refer to model sheets, they just draw as closely to the storyboards as they can (excluding Lapis tits). For a show that ran this long Sugar should have learned that even if she didn't know at first.

And what's your camp of thought? Rebeca does everything perfectly and then gremlins break into the studio at night, draw characters off-model and write OOC dialogue?

Here's a shot right after meeting the Diamonds.

It's hard to believe they accidentally scale Sapphire to 50% size just for one scene where she is in trouble.

>It's hard to believe they accidentally scale Sapphire to 50% size just for one scene
Is it?

Well then they have superb luck since it just happened to fit the atmosphere of the scene.

Considering they are paid professionals, it's not only hard to believe, but unacceptable.

Steven Universe regularly makes the most fundamental of animation mistakes. Forgetting what color the cloths a character is wearing are supposed to be. Forgetting to draw important character features like the gems' gems. Forgetting to flat out color certain parts of the scene. Animation clipping. Not remembering the placement of items so characters and objects teleport around the scene.

It's just all around really, really sloppy.

Through all of the episodes her height changed though

Those sorts of mistakes have occurred since the beginning of animation. No real reason to call out one show in particular for it when it doesn't do it much more than most other shows.

Wander Over Yonder "went off model" all the time, but you can tell that whenever they did it was intentional and to serve a purpose. You can see this in Craig's design notes on the character sheets.

SU does not do this. The show has no consistency, and thus, gives the impression of incompetence or a lack of care.

It uses crappy Flash animation. Not really an achievement.

It deserves to be criticized because modern tech and libraries makes that shit hard to happen "by mistake". You can't compare ninja turtles color error for 1 frame with Steven purposely looking like a grotesque blobs for whole sequences.

>Koreans don't refer to model sheets,
You are wrong. They do, when studios provide them. Those same studios that you are deefnding for having hard time keeping Steven at the same size also draw Japanese anime without breaking a sweat, and for cheaper. so it's clearly not a matter of "hard work". It's bad work.

Notice how Craig mentions that certain characters change sizes when put in different situations, or how artists have to "cheat" with model design in certain views.

This off-model work is done purposely, and is consistent in the show. SU doesn't do this.

You really can't compare color errors with "off-model" drawings. That's on the artist, not the technology.

...

you think they made those old cartoons with computers? How fucking dumb are you? Fuck off, retard.

Look at Garnet's bracket lips

[I]

>When you're dealing with Western animation studios. Koreans don't refer to model sheets, they just draw as closely to the storyboards as they can (excluding Lapis tits). For a show that ran this long Sugar should have learned that even if she didn't know at first.

Absolutely incorrect. Steven Universe's reliance on storyboard is a very deliberate choice.

Remember this?

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>it's that one of the storyboards she keeps on has hijacked the character into a horrible Invader Zim parody and won't give it back.
Zuke, right? She left the show months ago dude. Old news.

>Golden ages never come again
maybe if you're shit at Civilization, pleb

Not all technology is computers, dum-dum.

>Dragon Ball super
>Frieza's race gets redeemed

I'm going to bet they don't have in depth character model sheets like most cartoons do. MLAATR had a fuck ton for just for Jenny alone right down to the elements required for the various weapons and tools she has.

It's almost like they put care and effort into making the characters have a specific style and to stay within it.

You know, you can be a likable antagonist and still be defeated in the end. It's been done before in plenty of shows.

And?

You're not being serious are you?

>there are people in this thread RIGHT NOW that think on-model is a bad thing

Source?

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>there are people in this thread RIGHT NOW that think off-model is a bad thing

Bullshit. That doesn't explain how with every story boarder every character is off-model in a certain consistent way. The chinks obviously refer to the story board for modeling and an on-model storyboard would mean on-model animation.

user, Frost is the leader of a band of space pirates who starts wars secretly and sells off planets.
Hell in that tournament he literally poisoned Goku and Piccolo.

>drawing characters off-model is a deliberate choice
>in a cartoon with continuity
Either you're retarded, or the person who made this decision is retarded.

Let's be honest, he will be redeemed in the future and you know it.

In the sense than he won't be a weakling anymore.
Get ready for Golden Frost.

that shit was great and still applies