Watchmen/DC Rebirth

>take the best graphic novel ever written
>that is a parody and deconstruction of superhero comics
>shove it into your crappy comics that are the subject of the satire
>with absolutely no self-awareness

I'm honestly confused why people aren't in an uproar about this. Comic fans complain about muh SJWs and other bullshit incessantly, yet DC is desecrating Watchmen and no one seems to give a shit. It comes off so lazy, as if they need to boost sales any way they can and went "Hey, people like Dr. Manhattan right? Let's have him fight Batman!"
Sorry if that came off overly cynical but I'm genuinely perplexed about this.

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Moore tried to warn us

youtu.be/mKgblaifX1s?t=58s

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>desecrating Watchmen
It's not some untouchable sacred cow. At the end of the day, it's a comic book. A good one, but senpai this shit just ain't that drastic.
You can talk all day about how Watchmen is a parody/satire of superhero comics, but both Moore and Gibbons made many of those comics. They aren't above it, and neither is Watchmen.
It helps that most of the writing in the Rebirth books are actually pretty good.

Ok, OP. Ok. Just wait a few mounts and you will read your Make Mine All New Marvel Legacy/Generations by Bendis #1.

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>greatest graphic novel ever written

It's not "shoved in" anything and Watchmen always takes place in the Bleed of the DCU because DC published it.

You sound like a dumb fucking casual. It's the same thing as DC using Red Son Superman.

I do find revisiting Watchmen incredibly tiresome but hey, DC got the rights.

Because we all talked about this to death a year ago when Rebirth first started you casual

DC fans let them get away with everything. They are probably going to make Batman kick Manhattan's ass for some reason.

>It's not some untouchable sacred cow.
>It's the same thing as DC using Red Son Superman.
Not really. You're disgracing an incredible and complete story when you revisit it. I can understand doing it for sales but let's not pretend this is anything other than a black mark for every creator involved in it. Nobody is going to write something on the level of Watchmen in this so the best you can hope for is something which doesn't shit on it and its legacy too badly.

I found the 9 panel grids in the first issue desperate and insulting. I hope the writers artists and editors didn't feel pleased with themselves in any way for that. I can just about accept this as a marketing gimmick but fuck.

Watchmen isn't a Graphic Novel.

>best graphic novel ever written
>"graphic novel"
>"desecrating"
Just because it's very good and very popular doesn't make it a holy text, man.

>It's the same thing as DC using Red Son Superman.
Or KC.

He'd be right to be skeptical.

I think they're taking Watchmen's incorporation in a decent direction, but DC did give us Before Watchmen.

It's important to remember that we're all comic fans, and console war shitflinging is stupid. Deflecting criticism as "the other company" is pointless.

I'm with you OP, this is fucking stupid beyond words.

But, it's cape comics in 2017 so this is just kind of par for the course. Nothing means anything anymore in comics. Just buy it and shovel some shit in your brain.

>graphic novel
>best ever written
>deconstruction
there's a lot to be annoyed at here

It's OK when DC does it

How long until pic related happens?

>You're disgracing an incredible and complete story when you revisit it.
You're being way too dramatic. They're not changing the original story, it's still there. Buy it, read it, nothing DC does now is going to change what you hold in your hands. This isn't the damn bible.
Frankly, Watchmen has been very overhyped. I love it and read it a lot but it isn't on some higher level than the rest of the comics industry. Get over yourself.

It is very much self aware. Watchmen boils down to

>dude, capeshit sucks lmao

Rebirth is all about reigniting a little bit of the earnest superhero stuff back into DC. Basically giving the finger to what Moore's story preached. I don't know about the execution, it's too early to tell, but the idea of it is sound.

I wouldn't say Watchmen is a parody m8.

It is a deconstruction tho.

Kek are you really fucking stupid enough to think Watchmen is the only comic to use the 9 panel grid. The more you talk the more you show you don't know shit.

I bet Watchmen is one of maybe five comics youve ever read.

Red Son Superman is still Superman. Watchmen doesn't have any DC main characters.

Because it's Okay If DC Does It.

DChads, guys! LOL!

>I'm honestly confused why people aren't in an uproar about this.


Some are.

Others just have shit taste, thing is, nothing is a sacred cow, i'm mad that Johns, a hack that is mentally ill is doing an executive ordered event with very limitated writers.

You need people like morrison involved, not the guy that gave us pic rlated

>It is very much self aware. Watchmen boils down to
>>dude, capeshit sucks lmao
You're an idiot.

Watchmen is both
>superheroes don't work in a "realistic" setting
and
>look how awesome comics are as a storytelling medium

They primary cast is exclusively based directly on Charlton characters owned by DC.

You know this.

>3x3 grid is a sacred cow now
is this what hell feels like

Oh shit, it would got nicely.

Are you retarded? That are just Elseworld versions of DC characters. Moore wanted to use DC characters and DC said just make it take place on another earth.

I swear the only people who act like this about Watchmen are babies first comic readers. I've owned a physical copy of the book since long before the movie came out and this doesn't bother me in the slightest.

Sure, but it's not the same. They are not Charlton comics earth 2.

Yall faggots take your baby books too seriously.

>take the best graphic novel ever written
Already wrong by a long shot. Kill yourself Moore.

Are you really such a dreadful ignorant cunt that you'll argue the repeated use of the 9 panel grid in the last Batman issue was NOT intended to reference Watchmen? That's an impossible argument to take in good faith.

>You're being way too dramatic. They're not changing the original story, it's still there. Buy it, read it, nothing DC does now is going to change what you hold in your hands. This isn't the damn bible.
I agree, but you have to consider the mindset of revisiting it which is: good for sales, but creatively very ugly.
>Frankly, Watchmen has been very overhyped.
I agree.
>I love it and read it a lot
I don't know about love it but I certainly admire and appreciate it a lot.
>but it isn't on some higher level than the rest of the comics industry.
It literally is. There's like 1% of 1% of cape comics stuff that might sit alongside Watchmen. And honestly Moore puts a comic together better than the vast majority of non-cape comics writers too.

They essentially are.

I doubt Moore even thinks Watchmen is his best work, let alone the best """"""""""graphic novel""""""""""""

Nice retort, fag.

Its not. But keep reading wikipedia, it's not the same, this isnt watchmen 2, this is Johns presents: shitty event with Manhattan as a gimmick

It's not about 3x3 itself. It's about using that here for the shilling of a book off of Watchmen's reputation.

Just stop.

>take the best graphic novel ever written
It isn't even Moore's best work, buddy.

There's something painfully ironic about people crying that DC is using the Watchmen characters, while they themselves were just knockoffs of existing Charlton characters.
Talk about self-awareness lmfao

They are not filthy casual.

>I've only been on Sup Forums for two months, the thread

did you whine when Tom King blatantly referenced Watchmen's page structure in Omega Men?

That dude has no fucking clue what Omega Men is. It's a retard that saw Watchmen in HS and thinks it's the Holy Grail.

Learn the difference between an ogn and a mini series

Was Omega Men sold on the back of Watchmen's legacy? Can you point me where Dr. Manhattan appears? Is it on that double page explosion spread in issue 9?

If you cannot actually understand the words you read don't bother responding to my posts. Try reading again and see if you get it right this time.

What is it, them? i'm not trolling.

>I'm going to assume you're acting in bad faith so I don't actually have to argue with you!
Just going to direct you to too

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Nothing bad about that or watchmen 2.

Even moore asw interesed in that, pic related, it already existed and ws great, but it wasnt just a selling gimmick.

everyone is going to give you a different answer, but I like Swamp Thing

They literally are just reworked Charlton Characters. You got Captain Atom as Manhattan, Peacemaker as Comedian, Question as Rorschach, Blue Beetle as Nite-Owl, Thunderbolt as Ozymandias, Nightshade as Silk Spectre.

I get more out of Swamp Thing and a lot of the ABC books.

>take the best graphic novel ever written
>Watchmen
>the best graphic novel ever written
Stop with the OH IT'S SO INTELIGENT bullshit, Watchmen is garbage and so is Alan Moore
Even the fucking movie was better, i'm angry that they're putting this shit into muh comics but it's because even 90's garbage was better than Watchmen

If you think Alan Moore is garbage, who do you think that writes comics is good (English language comics)?

Kek Manhattan hasn't appeared, this isnt sold on the "back of Watchmen" it's sold on the back of Wally West. They also stated this will never be a JL vs Watchmen type deal. My God have you even read the comic you are bitching about? You sound so God damn dumb just stop talking.

now this is shitposting

Two sides of the same terrible coin.

>take the best graphic novel ever written
I don't understand how All-Star Superman relates to Rebirth

Dave Sim

NOT self aware? Take a step back
So in the grand meta
>Watchmen hits, sells like hotcakes, around the same time DKR hits, more hotcakes.
>Why hotcakes?
Pick a reason: tremendous story, capeshit sucks, dope art, regular shit too cheesy, too happy, gritty enough and brutal, etc
OHH...we get it now!
>Begin the late 80's-late 90's downhill slope of PURREE EEDDGGEE
Hey guys, why no hotcakes? We're cranking out new #1's new gritty heroes, covered in edges. What gives?
>Early 2000's arrive, and with it, Ultimate Marvel and The Crises... Batman Begins... new realizations...
GUYS! They didn't want NEW stuff! They want the entire status quo grimmed up, also darken that grim boi.
>Identity Crisis, Infinite Crisis, Final Crisis, some bullshit, Flashpoint
Okay guys, check it out...uhhh...we're gonna...uhh..TAKE 10 YEARS AWAY..soooo uhh...refreshingly dark stories..?
>......Nu52.....oh - oh no...
GUYS NO HOTCAKES WHAT DO WE DO?
We need to undo this thing, without admitting we were wrong....christ how did we get into this mess? What started this? (looks up)
Guys I have an idea...but we're gonna need to steal Morrison's playbook, Moore's material, and...dare I say it....optimistic writers.

>The entire reason for comics getting this bitter and cynical tonally, for the last 20-some-ought years, is Watchmen. Now that will LITERALLY BE CANON

Oh, OK. So this won't involve Dr. Manhattan or Watchmen?

So you think 1 guy is better than Alan Moore, and Alan Moore is garbage?

>They are probably going to make Batman kick Manhattan's ass for some reason.

False, Flash is gonna be the one to kick Manhattan's ass

Yea

>spectroarscach on manhattan
>not on Adrian
pffffffffff

this is a pretty reductive view of the last 30 years

Feel free to add a few milestones, but yeah I was going for brief

>Hey guys, why no hotcakes? We're cranking out new #1's new gritty heroes, covered in edges. What gives?

Beyond shit like Bloodlines, DC didn't really do that much EDGE in the 90's.

Vertigo isn't edgy. My life is a lie.

Go back to the A.V. Club Sava.

youtube.com/watch?v=z36Xadupn5c

>the guy who what all over Lovecraft, James Bond, Moriarty and Harry Potter because he didn't like them
>complaining about people using his work in ways he didn't want

Moore has no right to complain the faggot. He's a great writer but he did the same thing to others. Also, I think using Dr. Manhattan as the reason behind DC New 52 is an inspired choice and one of the few ways you could justify a reboot in a somewhat nonshitty manner.

Manhattan even screwing it up is in character.

Dave Sim pls go.

Sales didn't really decline until Marvel literally crashed the industry, caused thousands of comic stores to close, and basically handed Diamond a distribution monopoly. The content of the comics had little to do with sales.

*shat

"for mature audiences"!=edgy

Calm down Alan

This is the truth.

If you don't like Rebirth, go back to reading Watchmen.

OP is just butthurt because people enjoy things he's too pretentious to enjoy.

Not in Sup Forums's strange world.
Although I guess it makes sense that a board that mainlines pre-school cartoons would have a fucked up frame of reference.

Sometimes I forget why people call Watchmen 'deep' as, while still being interesting and a good read, it doesn't seem so to me, but then people like you remind me why and remind me what a lot of people out there are like.

Thank you, retardanon.

This is the manchildren board, there's a good reason why Johns is so popular.

liking Geoff Johns>>>>>liking MLP/SU etc

>This is the manchildren board
isn't that every board

except maybe /lit/ I guess

Stop fucking being contrarian for the sake of it, is it so fucking hard to admit that something that is generally considered good by most people is actually good?

>best graphic novel ever written

>something that is generally considered good by most people is actually good
These two things don't really say anything.
The average person is not very smart/exceptionally smart.

Comic book fans often side with the industry instead of the authors. Also they're feud with Moore because he said mean things about capeshit

Is hating Watchmen the new cool kids meme?

>I'm honestly confused why people aren't in an uproar about this.
Because Before Watchmen already happened, and I already spent all the rage I could back then.

Now? Now it's time to shit. Bitch to be you now.

KC Supes was in Convergence

he was in JSA well before that

The original Watchmen will be literally unchanged by this the same wy it was unchanged by Before Watchmen. DC isn't George Lucas, they won't burn the original copies and only release Watchmen editions edited to fit Rebirth/Before Watchmen

So fuck off

Case in point
Nothing is "sacred"

Why should it be? That'd be like saying the double cheeseburger is sacred how dare Mcdonalds make the triple cheeseburger.

It's a product owned by the company. They can do whatever they want with it and it doesn't hurt the original. The only people bitching about this don't read DC. The Multiverse has always been a pillar of their universe.