Without using the prequels that came 15 years after, tell me how the Emperor is a more complex character than Snoke

Without using the prequels that came 15 years after, tell me how the Emperor is a more complex character than Snoke.

you can't

emperor wasn't teased, we were baited all of TFA and even in fucking TLJ about Snoke and making him out to be this interesting and important character

but he wasn't, it seems, bait bait bait bait

nobody talked about the emperor in the movies, he just was

fucking idiot

lets also take a look at what we know from him through the OT fucking films you dumb nigger

>the Chad Palpatine
>the imperials fear him, when vader says the emperor is coming to the DS2 the admirals eyes get huge and says he'll double his effort immediately
>vader bows to him and shows him utmost respect when speaking, vader doesnt respect anyone else that way, even though palpatine calls him friend you can see vader is the submissive in that relationship and so we know right there this dude is not to be fucked with
>his massive hologram implies dominance over everyone not just vader
>he tells luke that everything has transpired according to his design, hes let the rebels win little battles so he can crush them at the DS2. this implies an almost omnipotent intelligence and shows hes a cunning opponent
>hes flanked by silent regal red guards who never speak or move, he also tells them to leave when luke gets there showing that he doesnt need protection, even as a slim old man
>he lets luke attack him and starts laughing when vader immediately goes to defend him, showing that he has absolute control over vader even when dealing with the guys son
>he throws out fucking lightning, a power never seen before and starts frying luke to death. yoda never showed power like this, and took great effort to move the xwing out of the lake. this guy shoots death from his finger tips like its no big deal, which implies that the dark side IS stronger and yoda was bullshitting
>only loses because vader finally makes the choice to be good, someone he thought he was in control of the entire time

i think everyone can agree one one thing: OP is a fucking moron

now lets compare

>the virgin snoke
>his apprentice is wild and unstable, not fully under his heel
>this apprentice murders him like a bitch, not for good but to take the throne. showing hes incompetent as a rulr
>the first order doesnt fear him, they have some weird indoctrination going on like north korea where they just parrot the supreme leader is wise
>over compensates for his weakness with a massive star destroyer even bigger than vader executor
>made a death star 20 times the size of the first and loses it immediately after its completed, not learning a thing from palpatine
>needs his red guards by his side all the time, also showing his weakness. dudes a little bitch for needing SEVEN protecting hm at all time when palpatine only used 2 and told them to fuck off when a potential threat was right in front of him
>gloats needlessly about his accomplishments and how powerful he is, once again showing insecurity since he hasnt done shit in the movies other than turn ONE edgelord kid
>desperately wants to find Luke to kill him, showing hes afraid of the jedi. unlike palpatine who played those faggots like a damn fiddle

brainlets i swear

wow so butthurt. The Emperor was mentioned in the very first movie. He mad an appearance in the second one. Everyone back then was curious about him. Just because you're a faggot millennial don't assume you know how people received his character back then.

At the very least, the emperor didn’t reveal vader as Luke’s father to the audience. Snoke reveals Han is Kylo’s dad in the first act. Opportunity wasted.

There was no need
He was the evil leader of the empire.

But you can't tell a story 20 years later, featuring a seemingly more powerful character, and not explain where he was during the days of the empire.

Someone like Snoke would have been in contact with the emperor.

Haha. Okay so with two deathstars, the most powerful force being in the world at your side, you can't squash a pitiful rebellion? Snoke has them down to less than 400 in TLJ. His death star gets wrecked twice. He gets picked up and is flailing around helpless in the air like a girl. Snoke's guards are infinetly more badass than the Emperor's AND we at least get to see their skill.

>Complex character
>dies after some edgy over the top moustache twirling monologue
>complex
kekled

or not, but snoke is just kind of bullshit. even if he did have power over the force, the chances of him becoming a sith by finding old manuscripts or something is astronomically small considering the events that take place in the old EU.

The Emperor showed sympathy and benevolence only to take it away. Came across as a mild old man but had plans up his wizard sleeve. Had the intention of forcing a son to murder his father for his own enjoyment. Snoke was openly out for blood and held hidden no cards.

you talk like a 12 year old first off. secondly the rebellion was being fucked at endor, they would have been done for if not for luke. luke is the hero who was able to redeem his father who betrayed his master. sidious died because of a virgin emotion like love, something you should understand considering youve never been laid and probably fall in love with every girl who politely smiles at your dumbass
>infinetly more badass
go back to Sup Forumseddit you stupid faggot

>you talk like a 12 year old
>you stupid faggot
leled

Complexity isn't entirely the point of the argument.

In the OT, the Empire just sort of always existed in the world of Star Wars. There didn't need to be a justification for the Empire existing because it had existed long before the start of the first movie. That was the default state of the universe.

The reason Snoke and the First Order need to be explained is because at the end of RotJ, the Empire had been pretty much destroyed, the Force was brought in balance, and the galaxy was at peace. The First Order and Snoke just sort of showed up at the start of TFA. This makes every person who watches and enjoys the movie think, "I wonder what happened between 6 and 7 that brought about the First Order and this Snoke guy?" The default state of the universe post-RotJ had been changed without explanation or justification. It's fine for the first of three movies to not explain things, that's what makes the mysteries enticing. You leave it hanging and detail it out later in 8 or 9. But now Snoke is dead, so there never will be a reason to extrapolate on his existence. And even if they do, it'll be horribly done and won't matter anyways since he's been removed from the story.

Imagine if Darth Vader died in Empire Strikes Back with no explanation as to what his relationship with Luke was.

>rebellion was being fucked at Endor
HAHAHAHAAHA you mean the place where 3 foot tall teddy bears dismantled a legion of troopers and walkers with sticks and rocks? The place where Han disabled the shield around the death star and allowed Lando to swoop in on the Falcon and fuck up the reactor of the Death Star?

Luke had absolutely fuck all to do with the destruction of the second death star. Luke or no Luke, Vader and Sidious both fucking die at the end of that movie. You OT neckbeards are the saddest bunch of salt-infused retards I've ever had the displeasure of communicating with on the internet.

nice of you to concede pussy. now roll over i got some daddy dick for you

But I love cock in my boypussy dumbass

>death star destroying capital ships left and right
>imperial forces captured or killed most of the rebels on the ground
>b-but han and lando d-did x

ewoks pulling a vietnam saved their dumbasses, the rebels themselves were fucked. dont try to make it seem like the rebels waltzed into endor and BTFO the empire. they suffered heavy casualties and if not for ewoks the rebels would have lost. and yes palpatine dying had a huge effect on the imperials, losing him and the death star 2 broke the fleets morale and sent them fleeing. you stupid unlearned filth fucking learn to argue before making stupid fucking statements

>unintelligent AND a faggot
daddy never loved you did he?

>You OT neckbeards are the saddest bunch of salt-infused retards I've ever had the displeasure of communicating with on the internet.

>he is actually defending teddy bears winning any kind of battle against a legion of the Emperor's best men
Truly pathetic. The point is, the death star gets blown away because of teddy bears. Vader and the Emperor both die like retards with or without luke there because they would have been fucking decimated in the explosion.

You literally said you were gonna be my daddy
Try to keep up

>die like retards
>therefore isn't complex
non sequiturs are cute user
you must be a woman

If you think the Emperor is a deep character at all in the OT then you are a 2deep4me reddit faggot. He was a fucking retard who had no defense to a guy picking him up with one arm. Literally just screamed and took it like a bitch

The emperor needed no explanation. He was just the big bad in charge of the empire. Snoke doesn't work because he was nowhere to be found in the OT, so we need explanation how there is another force sensitive individual becoming in charge of the first order. The sequels don't work as stand alone films, where you can justify such a big character coming in existence out of nowhere.

>an enemy with complete knowledge of the terrain and landscape
>an enemy that is small and can hide in the underbrush and in the tress
>an enemy that constructs traps big enough to destroy atst walkers
>an enemy that eats the flesh of its enemies
>an enemy with sharp as fuck spears that can penetrate armor
>an enemy that is the main habitant of that planet
>teddy bears

even with all that, the empire still fought them off, retreated into a hermetically sealed bunker, and only fucking lost because chewbacca commandeered an atst during the battle, which let han get into disguise and trick the imperials in the bunker to open the blast doors. lrn 2 lore you stupid shit. and no, if luke was never on the death star 2, vader himself would have shot down lando and wedge

>reading comprehension
stop smoking meth

>deep
>complex
lel moving goalposts
woman argument tactics

Don't project, you drug addled nigger

HE'S ACTUALLY DEFENDING TEDDY BEARS HAHAHAHAHA

In his appearance in Jedi the intention was for him to simply be pure evil.

Star Wars is not about complex characters
Or deep backgrounds
Things a painted in broad strokes
The original trilogy did this well
Its a tricky thing to do, it depends on being able to handle how you introduce and present these broad simple characters through the course of the story, the quality of the story, the actors performance, and the scripts dialogue

The prequels fucked this up

And now the Disney films have turned it into a dumpster fire

>says the tweaking faggot wanting a daddy
>muh projection
not an argument

underage get out, or do you want a daddy too?

>relevance
You retards are hopeless

I agree but tbf Vader was leading troops on Endor originally so if Luke had stayed on Dagobah or whatever he either would have survived the DS2 or might have even flown his TIE to take out the Millennium Falcon.

>underage
>mu teddy bears are cool not retarded at all
Irony

>i lost so ill just start laughing like i won

>teddy bears defeating a legion of walkers and trained troopers with sticks is cool
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

This and this

He wasnt, but I still wanted to know more about him, same with Snoke.

Why the fuck is everyone talking about complexity? We don’t want a fucking character piece on Snoke. We just want a damn bit of information to explain how he started the First Order and how he seduced Ben Solo. You know, the entire foundation the trilogy should stand on? How the fuck are we supposed to care about Kylo’s struggle if we don’t know why he’s tempted by the Dark?
The fact that OP can’t tell the difference between creating a new character who’s part of the status quo in a new universe and a new character who significantly changed the setting of an old universe also suggests quite a lot on his intellect.

>Imagine if Darth Vader died in Empire Strikes Back with no explanation as to what his relationship with Luke was.
Or BEFORE the end of ESB, because THAT would sure subvert expectations!

>not an argument
not an argument

Snoke does nothing for 2 movies. But I guess killing him in the second movie subverted your expectations, so it's automatically a genius move.

Without Luke convincing the Ewoks 3PO was a god, Han and co. would have been their dinner, and the rebels were history.
Checkmate, post-Jedi Star Wars deconstructionist.

>Snoke's guards are infinetly more badass than the Emperor's AND we at least get to see their skill.
>AND we at least get to see their skill.
>their skill.
They could even kill Kylo or Rey despite having the number and technology advantage
They didn’t even react to Snokes death they just kinda stood there and waited
Sure The PLOT decrees that Kylo and Rey live
So pretty much they amount to beta guys who know how to stand around menacingly and twirl shit sticks

no one said it was cool you fucking retard. go back to neogaf

Pretty much.
>Luke and Vader meet
>They square off for a minute
>Luke then fucking slices Vader in half during the brief moment he's distracted by activating the Carbonite freezer.
That's basically what it felt like.