Okay, so I get why she goes in the cave, but what is all the mirror bullshit about?

Okay, so I get why she goes in the cave, but what is all the mirror bullshit about?

It looked very cool and I think it was suppose to tell us a message, I just don't think they had it worked out exactly what message it was supposed to tell.

If it's suppose to foreshadow that she's always known her parents weren't coming back then it did a piss poor job of it.

She asked the cave about her parents because she was thinking it would give her meaning. The mirrors was the cave telling her that the only place she'll find that meaning is in herself, which is what she was scared of.

It's supposed to represent how Rey is looking for a deeper meaning, as to her role in this story, based on her lineage. However, no matter how deep she looks, the story begins and ends with her. There is nothing beyond the veil. She stands not upon the shoulders of her forebears, but only upon her own two feet.

However, despite authorial intent, what it actually represents is the superficiality of this trilogy. We, the audience, are looking for the deeper themes we associate with this universe. In fact, the very notion of the jedi pilgrimage into a sinister cave is supposed to signal our recollection of when look glimpsed a premonition of his own fall to the dark side. When Rey enters her cave (here, a stand in for the audience) she finds no great revelations or premonitions and nothing of any substance. Only a simple reflection. Two dimensional. Flat. There is no depth here. Rey is as deep as this story dares to take us.

It looked "deep"

Rian wanted to rip off the Luke cave scene for ESB, but he wanted to make it slightly different so he doesn't get called out on it. So he made some non nonsensical bullshit.

How would you fix this scene Sup Forums?

Remove it completely, or rather overhaul the entire Luke/Rey arc.

this scene is retarded

To fix this you have to fix Rey's entire character.

the message is:
weak Luke was scurred in his Cave ordeal, but brave Rey had no fear in hers.
she is the alpha and the omega, the infinite reflections. its all her. she needs no training at all to defeat Jedi masters and she aint be needin' no man

kylo ren pops out from around the corner, they duel, rey chops off kylo head, his mask assplodes, she sees her face in the mask, gasps, tells luke what she saw, has a training montage with luke. or maybe the montage comes first i forgot

This. We don't know what the fuck the vision means for Rey because as of the end of The Last Jedi Rey doesn't mean ANYTHING. She has no famous parents, which you can like or dislike. Snoke calls her Kylo's "equal in the Force," which is an extremely nonsense statement. She's powerful as fuck but we don't know how or why and Rian seems to be telling us, "fuck you, don't ask questions." So as of this moment Rey means absolutely nothing but "extremely powerful female Force user," and if you think about the one thousand generations of the Jedi Order there are probably hundreds of those. But they didn't get weird visions.

At this point you're going to have to fuck around with Rey in Episode IX for the vision to make sense, because right now it means nothing.

Just make it so Luke was hiding on Dagobah rather than the shitty "birthplace of the force" island, and have Rey go into the same dark side cave Luke went into in Episode 5.

WHERE THE FUCK DID THAT VOICEOVER COME FROM
HAVE WE EVER HAD VOICEOVER IN A STAR WARS FILM
IT CAME FROM NOWHERE AND WAS SO OUT OF PLACE AND JARRING FUCK THAT VOICEOVER

I enjoyed every other aspect of that scene though

>At this point you're going to have to fuck around with Rey in Episode IX

this is like the big budget movie equivalent of writing your thesis paper the night before it's due

Ice wall shows the First Order marching on Jakku and taking Unkar Plutt (and others) away in chains. Cut back to Rey's smiling face, she clearly likes the idea of using force to remove some of the shittier things of the galaxy. Quick cut away so we don't know if the Dark Side has successfully tempted her or not.

Make it happen after lewd hand touching
She gets surrounded by Rey from different points in her life, loli Rey that got sold, younger version of herself, old women Rey, pregnant Rey, motherly Rey, etc
One of the Rey is the hair down, dressed in grey version that we see later in the movie. Kylo Ren is standing behind her. That Rey steps forward into the ring and they have an epic lightsaber duel.
Real Rey loses her shit in the duel, fights with anger and fear and cuts arm of future Rey. She crawls towards motionless Kylo Ren before Real Rey stabs her lightsaber through her. Then one by one all the different versions of the Rey fade away. Rey is visibly shaken.

>fix
Do you mean create?

Yeah, that bothered me too. I got okay with it when I realized that it was Rey retelling the incident to Luke via dialogue, but I think it was really telling as to the weakness of the scene that they felt like they needed a voiceover of some kind to tell the audience what it was supposed to be about while it was happening. Luke didn't need that in his cave scene.

Isn't it pretty explicitly stated that Snoke planted the visions in their heads to bring them together?

We don't know for certain Kylo knew who her parents were, this could just be him running with a fake vision in order to crush her spirits and bring her to rule with him.

Can someone please explain to me what Rey's character arc is? I might be a brainlet, but I seriously don't get any of her shit. I think maybe I tune out when she's on screen because she's so boring.

He takes credit for linking their minds, not for the vision. The movie implies that the cave is just a cave.

I don't like it either, user. But here we are.

very kafkaesque

theres a line that kylo says to her: "you dont belong on this story"
shes a character insert for something, maybe the audience, maybe not. the mirror scene is her breaking the fourth wall. note it is the only time she narrates her thoughts.

but they linked when they touched, which would've been a product snoke's thingo then surely

also what were the respective visions, i can't remember, but i feel they were competing?

I don't think there even is one, but according to some faggot on another thread is her wanting to be special but discovering she insn't, kinda like K from BR2049, but shittier and it doesn't make sense.

she represents disney vis a vis starwars.
she is omnipotent and convenient, a deus ex machina and plot device rolled into one. the story revolves (loosely) around her yet she is entirely a bystander watching events unfold around her.
she is disney reviving starwars.

Instead of showing Rey alone in the end, show a projection of Kylo Ren looking at her.

It would be a cool twist if it was revealed Kylo Ren also traveled into the mirror years ago and saw her staring at him.

>mfw that force tree fanfiction that was spread on Sup Forums a couple of months back was a better explanation to Rey's character than what we've actually got

that's clearly just kylo nurturing rey's fears. he wants to join forces with rey and establish something, exactly what is never really clear. but he's clearly fucking with her.

remember, so far, the new trilogy titles all refer to rey.
'the force awakens', is rey and her 'awakening' to the force.
'the last jedi', is rey. at the end of the movie, she is the last jedi.
this is clearly rey's story. it's just a story you should accept no matter what. i guess they were boxing on prequel-hate thinking they could do whatever they want because 'at least its not prequels, right'.

haven't seen that one

>It would be a cool twist if it was revealed Kylo Ren also traveled into the mirror years ago and saw her staring at him.
It would also explain how he somehow knows who she is when he goes "What girl!?" in TFA

Okay, I can see that with her parents ending up being nobodies like her, but she literally IS special. She's a force user with such raw power that both Luke and Snoke are impressed by her to the point of fear. Also, I might have missed this when I went to the bathroom, but how did Rey go from not even resisting being seduced by the dark side to being a champion for the light side in her interactions with Kylo? I seriously can't tell if her entire plot in this movie is just all over the place, or I'm just retarded.

>its just kylo nurturing reys fears
lol the movie hits you over the head with the theme that rey is a non character. rian intended it.
>she has no backstory
>she has no arc

D R O P P E D
R
O
P
P
E
D

>but how did Rey go from not even resisting being seduced by the dark side to being a champion for the light side in her interactions with Kylo?

i watched the whole thing and i don't know either

i kinda don't care also because all i've learned is that she just does whatever the plot calls for, when luke asks her why she's there she just repeats her line like a fucking robot.

droppedpoaster, you are doing great work. i appreciate your comments.

I'm glad to hear I'm not alone. I seriously thought I was losing my mind. She's all over the fucking place.

they had to put something in the movie

>I only know one truth: It's time for the white men to end.

what did he mean by this?

First off if you watch literally any Hollywood movie post-1930 or so, it's gonna be all Jews behind the camera so you're a little later to the party for that. And don't bring Frank Oz into this. Besides, by Jewish standards he isn't even a full qualifying Jew on account of his gentile mother.

how does someone who lived all her life on a desert planet know how to swim?

Can you share or summarize it?

Convince the Director to go back in time and kill himself.

I don't agree.
This is the part where I think Rian is trying to 'deconstruct'. He's trying to say that not everyone needs to be 'someone' in the Star Wars universe.

Sup Forums has joked about this themselves with wookieepedia articles. Everyone in Star Wars is someone, that's just how Star Wars has been.

Rian wants to subvert that and gives us someone that doesn't have to be anyone. Rey doesn't need a backstory, her backstory isn't important.
Its just a really bad idea when we're nearing the end of the trilogy and Rey hasn't really done that much yet.
So far all she's done is leave Jakku, meet Finn, Han and Chewie. Go to not-cantina planet, get captured, be saved, go to jedi temple planet, meditate a bit, get herself captured on purpose killed some guards and lifted some stones.

If her actions are to be greater than a origin story, she really hasn't done all that much yet.

Based droppedposter

Some 4channer came up with this^ in 2 minutes and that hack Rian Johnson had two years and $250,000,000 and came up with an infinity mirror and snapping

Man, TLJ’s writing was godawful

She fought Kylo Ren at the end of the last movie. That's pretty much it. Rey was a lot better when she was sharing the protagonist role with Finn, who is a fun character played by an actor with charisma.

>First off
>No additional points
pathetic

I think the point is the whole sith and jedi dichotomy was unhealthy and would always lead to war. The proper way to bring balance to the force is to have a bit of both.

Rey seems specially gifted to not to go to either extremes of the force but walk the middle, hence why she's not afraid of looking into the dark side or go to Kylo Ren.

That's why there's even a sith hole in the first place on the island.

I don't remember much, it was something about Luke going to the island to learn more about the Jedi and that the Force came from a tree and that the tree originated a brother and a sister that were the embodiment of the light and the dark side, and they get reincarnated every now or so, and Rey and Kylo were the reincarnations of the siblings. Also, Anakin was a previous reincarnation.

It's dumb, but still better than Rey being a random girl that is powerful as fuck with no explanation and was sold by her parents for booze money.

It's also a terrible idea to have a protagonist in a story built on older stories and even older myths have nothing going for her. The Chosen One is an old meme, but it's old for a reason.

Pure kino post.

I agree with you about Finn, but his character was absolutely destroyed in TLJ. All his character development in TFA was negated by how he acted in TLJ and Rose murdered any chance he had of being a cool heroic character.

Unless some drastic changes are made in EPIX he's just a coward janitor.

As much as I despised TFA when I saw it, I will admit Finn was far more enjoyable than I was expecting. I went in expecting to like Rey and hate Finn, instead I got the opposite. At least Finn had a personality. Of course he got shat on in TLJ anyway to make room for Rey to do... something. I'm honestly not sure what Rey was even doing in TLJ besides lifting some rocks to save the now 2 dozen Rebels left.

She's talking to Kylo you mong

GEMS SPOTTED WHEN WILL THE GEMS BE STOPPED!

she has no backstory and no arc, yet she is supposedly the protag.
all i can say is, rian fucking intended it

When are you going to release your Death Note review, E;R? It's been months.

Also, you better make a TLJ review or I'll be disappointed.

>Lucas invented self reflection motif
>An obvious homage to ESB
I bet you think you're very smart

I've always thought the idea of Finn's character is awesome and I have no idea why they keep cutting away from him and not letting him do stuff. They might've also gone too far in making him a janitor. I think he should've been a fairly well-practiced stormtrooper who'd worked in a lot of places, including sanitation, and is a really good soldier as a result, making him a good adventurer. I like when he gets real serious about their chances against the FO.

You know, they also haven't done anything with his former stormtrooperness affecting his combat decisions. Like, I would've loved a scene in TFA where there's bad guys coming down a hallway and Finn tries to get everyone to do a lemming rush frontal assault with no cover like troopers do all the time.

>What the hell are you doing, you're just going to get yourself killed!
>But that's how we always do it...

There's a line somewhere in the nuWars about how when there's a strong force user on one side, their "equal" on the other side rises in strength, which I think is supposed to explain Rey.

>finnmind
Agree with both of you guys that he got ruined in TLJ, just like everything else. I wish that he did something useful, because there were a few moments where I saw what they were going for with him. Like, I think his arc was supposed to be that he stops running away and starts fighting for the rebellion, but that was already his arc in TFA, and either way, it was not fleshed out at all. Had to make room for cartoon llamas running through a cartoon city. Jesus Christ TLJ was so fucking bad.

Dude, the entire film series (especially the sequel trilogy) heavily features self-referential masturbatory bullshit. ESB didn't do it first, obviously, but you're being obtuse if you don't think this movie was full of references to that one.

Ethnicity is passed through the seed
Youre just a cuck who never had casual concubine sex

How is the writing of this film so bad, bros?

You didn’t miss anything, it’s just poor writing

This is such a bad development (let’s call bad developments “Rianisms”) because it’s utterly tension deflating and makes everything that happens pointless, in addition to being wholly inconsistent with what’s been established

>I think his arc was supposed to be that he stops running away and starts fighting for the rebellion, but that was already his arc in TFA
There’s so much character regression in TLJ, it’s the laziest thing imaginable

Would have been nice to see him slowly turn to the light-side and having to hide it from the higher-ups, who are always trying to detect anomalous behaviour in the troops.

Just a bit of progression to his character would have been nice, instead of him automatically becoming good on his first mission.

But, yeah, the idea of giving storm-troopers more of a role is interesting. What is too far is having him fight Kylo with a fucking lightsaber, even if the former was injured.

Rey is the only thing that matters in the New StarWars™
Rey is VERY IMPORTANT

holy shit that's what I though

The same vague bullshit the force did to show Luke this.

Rey is obsessed with her own identity, and how it relates to the people she surrounds herself around.

She's empty because she doesn't have parental figures, and the one she did get got killed, so she went back to search. The mirrors show her all she has is herself, and that there is nothing to find. She has to face herself, because like Kylo said, she's always known there was nobody there, because her parents are dead shitbags.

Holy shit.

oh Sup Forums would be in total meltdown if that shit was true, dont even deny it

>star wars is literally naruto

wow epic

Does Rey NEED a reason to be super powerful with the Force? I mean, it's shown that a Force-sensitive can come from literally anywhere, so Rey could just be that lucky 1 in a million persons who are born with it. It's not ALL bloodlines and shit.

Still doesn't excuse why she's super proficient despite having no training however.

Episode 9 will involve time travel. It's why they hired Trevorrow and Johnson.

The real problem I have with that is that TFA set her up to be something. If she was set up to just be someone new who is good with the force, that would be great, but they made a big mystery just to shit on us.

Rey is the Star Wars equivalent of a third-stage Lensman. Kylo Ren is as well. This is why she already has amazing powers despite having little training. Rey is Luke's daughter. This is part of why Jedi were not supposed to have children. Luke and his wife left Rey on the junk planet for her own protection. Kylo is lying or mistaken in his statements about Rey's parents.

As the breeding program nears its conclusion, humans are selected as the best choice; at the same time, the breeding programs of the other three planets are terminated, and their penultimates never meet their planned mates. Kimball Kinnison meets and marries the product of the complementary human breeding program, Clarissa MacDougall. She is a beautiful, curvaceous, red-haired nurse, who eventually becomes the first human female to receive her own Lens. Their children, a boy and two pairs of fraternal twin sisters, grow up to be the five Children of the Lens. In their breeding, "almost every strain of weakness in humanity is finally removed." They are born already possessing the powers taught to second-stage Lensmen. They are the only beings of Civilization ever to see Arisia as it truly is and the only individuals developed over all the existence of billions of years able finally to penetrate the Eddorians' defense screens.

>They are born already possessing the powers taught to second-stage Lensmen.

Because Luke went into a cave, saw a vision of Vader, then saw his own face after defeating the force vision.
Mirror scene with Rey is obviously more or less the same thing.
More ripping off past films while claiming to leave the past behind.

It's just the Force working its space magic on her to make her Kylo Ren's equal.

I still hope that while her parents can be nobodies, and her destiny begins and ends with herself, that she could've still had some Jedi training as a child she doesn't remember. Stupid JJ Abrams was making a mystery of Luke might've been the one to drop her off, so maybe he still did that, but doesn't recognize her.

It's just a scene copied from Empire to appeal to psuedointellectuals. It has no real meaning, it's only meant to feign that the movie has depth and contrast the 'dude hold the phone, yo momma lmao' cringe

rey and kylo both accomplish the same thing in their meeting. they both totally resolve themselves to light/dark. rey is just a little less convincing but she does go back for the 10 remaining resistance members i guess.

just because he didn't tell her he's her dad, doesn't mean he didn't recognize her.

they changed because Snoke was the one who was drawing them together like how Sidious drew Anakin and Padme together and Snoke died.

Do you have any idea how insufferable you sound?

it's more or less been what's been happening since the beginning though, the force in balance.

I would normally agree with this except for one thing. The mirrors showing her that is basically helping her; showing her the truth. The problem with that is Luke CLEARLY states this hole is the dark side. He freaks out how quickly her mind jumps into that hole. Wouldn't the darkness just show you your own twisted view of things in order to turn you? If the mirrors are the "darkness", wouldn't it be more believable they were manipulating her?

The fact Kylo supports this theory about her parents makes me question it all the more. He does this literally right before trying to get Rey to join his side. Classic dark side manipulation bullshit.

Sorry, I don't buy it.

/thread should have been right here

It represents female logic

what is this point even trying to say

It’s circular logic and thus logic isn’t needed. These are all male constructs so the Jedi’s & Sith’s constructs of light and dark don’t really apply to her. In this case the dark side is trying to temp her via showing her an infinity mirror that has no rhyme or reason or end in sight.

However if it really wanted to temp her it should have just shown her her future love interest — Kylo Ren. But since the writing committee was female they didn’t thunk that would be .. oh fuck it. The whole thing is out of place and fucking stupid. The whole thing sucks.

Lucas needs to come back

...

>Just pulled this out my ass lmao

2nd best scene in the movie. I loved when she snapped her fingers twice and it almost looked like a loop

At first I was thinking she was a child of the force like anikain, and thats why the cave showed her herself

But then I was like lol Disney cant do anything smart and dont know how to make a starwars movie lol

They were supposed to do a vision quest but Disney forgot how to write

>voiceover
>slowmotion
>flashbacks

There was a fuckload of shit previous SW movies avoided.

>yfw dark side is literally a black hole in the ground

No one should have posted after this. Perfect interpretation even if Ryan Johnson didn't intend for this it's how it comes across to the viewer