Marvel Legacy

Will it change anything Sup Forums? Will it be Marvel's Rebirth?
Tell me your hopes and dreams

>Will it change anything Sup Forums?
Nope. Its will just be some nostalgia bait but nothing will change.

>Will it be Marvel's Rebirth?
Nope. Marvel had the perfect opportunity to have a Crisis-esque reboot/relaunch with Secret Wars but all they did was make things more convoluted and shit.

My dream is they take Mania, Aracely, Robbie, and a few other teen characters with loyal fans but not enough left to support an ongoing and put them on a team book written by Yost or maybe Kelly

It'll be so soulless and half-hearted it'll actually be offensive enough to fans and non-fans alike and cause sales to further drop. Marvel'll be revealed as what it always was: a company chasing the edge and youth so hard it makes a mockery of itself while wrecking the industry yet again.

DC, after all these decades, finally wins for good.

>Its will just be some nostalgia bait but nothing will change.
YOU CAN'T HAVE NOSTALGIA IF THE NOSTALGIA NEVER LEAVES!

Like how every, single, fucking Avengers run keeps flashing back to when the team was formed in the 60's!

Marvel runs on a "seasonal" model now. You know that right? Each "season" is centered around a major, encompassing event (right now, Secret Empire) and all major/involved books relaunch at #1 as part of the event.

Legacy is just the next "season" after Secret Empire wraps up in the fall.

I miss pre-2004 Marvel.

If I knew Disassembled/New Avengers was the harbringer of current Marvel I'd have never gotten interested in it.

This. Nobody is buying Legacy and nothing Marvel has shown enforces the idea that they are really going to change things up. Case in point, look at this promo picture. All these faces are the characters already in circulation or duplicates of them. Nothing is changing because Marvel (and fans) think what's missing is nostalgia wanking.

As long as femthor is still a thing it'll be the same shit they've been pushing since 2014.

So are we stuck forever with this?
I didn't know that about Marvel, I dropped comics for a while but Rebirth made me dive back into it so when I saw news of a "Marvel Legacy" I got hopeful.

I tried various Marvel comics but the only ones I liked was Conway's Spider-Man and Vision

Marvel has no idea what people want.

Fuck, the fans have no idea what they want. Change things up and the cries of "NOT MUH" can be heard from space. Keep everything stagnant and status quo and they'll complain that nothing ever changes.

You can even tell how they gave more care and attention to the diversity heroes faces and masks while giving unflattering and generic silver age faces and masks to the main heroes.

>make min marvel
cringe

Fans just want good stories regardless. Marvel refuses to hire actual talent.

I don't mind change. It's just that Marvel keeps hiring hacks who alienate readers and spend too long on books.

Then there are writers like Bendis who have zero respect for continuity or anything going on in other books, but are writing the important books and forcing everyone to write around their shit.

Which writers should stay and who should be let go? Bendis and Slott must be the worst offenders

I think what needs to happen is stability and stories that actually build up, and not the filler, event, filler, event structure.

Even if Marvel was like DC and actually earnest in their desire to change and make amends with lapsed fans and retailers which Marvel has shown no interest doing, they simply don't have the talent pool, writer and artist scouting and development programs, and editorial personnel to actually pull off a Rebirth.

Bendis's mentality has spread to other writer's, though, who share his narcissism.

Indeed many younger writers are influenced by the Bendis philosophy of "fuck continuity I'll do what I like!"

You'll get Avengers Arena 3 and you'll enjoy it!

Co-written by Waid,Bendis, Bunn and Hopeless.

Hopeless can also fuck right off

if they drop Ewing I'm giving up on Marvel entirely

Slott will still be on Amazing Spider-Man (and he will literally never ever ever ever ever ever leave the goddamn book).
Bendis is still Bendis
Hopeless is still Hopeless
More Inhuman Shilling
More GotG movie Synergy
More Legacy shilling
Ramos still drawing
Land still tracing
Soule


No

THIS
H
I
S

They don't have the manpower and talent to pull it off

>Will it change anything Sup Forums?
so, you are new. but like new just born yesterday

>Legacy
blackacy, clitacy, gayacy. FTFY

DR WHO IS SHIT

I think they need a real "back to basics" style approach. Take each of these characters and find what was ORIGINALLY appealing about them.

Take the original line of Marvel's new heroes that were introduced in each of their anthology titles in '62: Ant-Man & Wasp from Tales to Astonish, Thor from Journey Into Mystery, Spider-Man from Amazing Fantasy, Iron Man in Tales of Suspense, and Hulk who had his own title, plus Captain America.

There's your Avengers right there. The characters that MADE Marvel.

Great post user, I'd throw in the Fantastic Four and the best Cosmic Marvel has to offer and I'd be happy

Nothing is going to change. Its going to have the same writers, same artists, same yes men, same ass kissers, same everything. Archive this post, and mark my words: Not only will nothing change, but they will in fact DOUBLE DOWN on the politics once the taste wears off. The only way that ANY of these characters will become redeemable is when The Mouse realizes that they are hemorrhaging money in their comic division and sell off the comic rights to a company that gives a damn about a story that not only appeals to new fans but also maintaining the former, while keeping the movie rights for themselves.

tl;dr: Nothing will change, Same bullshitters.

>and sell off the comic rights to a company that gives a damn
Is this even possible tho? who would have the money to buy them?

>Will it change anything Sup Forums
No
>Will it be Marvel's Rebirth
No
>Tell me your hopes and dreams
I wish Marvel would just fucking stop

I may get some flack and be called a shill, but it seems that the only one that has enough backing in the money department would be DC, America wise at least. I would have gone for studio Trigger, but they're a smaller company and don't have as much clout. Believe you me, where their is a will their is a way; in essence all you need is good negotiators and proper lawyers who can find a middle ground to where they can both have money in their pockets and maintain a proper clientele.

Be happy it's not "Make mine Marvel, NOW!"

You know they wanted to do it.

Cap could be good or it could be unspeakably bad in terms of Marvel tripling down on SJW pandering with Steve for the sake of appealing to the pissed off cancer tumors than need to be final solutioned into a grave.

Iron Man is a clusterfuck and Bendis will kneecap any return that Tony Stark has in order to prop up his cancer tumor Riri

Spider-Man COULD change in that Marvel could fucking solve half their PR problems by bringing back the Spider-Man marriage. BUT MJ and Peter would still be written by Slott and as someone else in this thread has stated, he'll soon as die than give up control over ASM

Thor might have a grace period so long as Whor is wiped out from existence

X-Men still are in their grace period too but they have shit writers and the dogshit Teen O5 running around. So much so that I would not be shocked if Astonishing X-Men ends up outselling Blue and Gold.

Avengers is ironically the easiest to fucking fix: band the cancer turds from the book, just stack it up with only classic Avengers: Hawkeye, Scarlet Witch, Vision, Iron Man, Thor, Wasp, Captain America, Hank Pym, and She-Hulk.

Isn't DC splitting itself up into a bunch of departments, each with their own comics and canon?
They went through all that trouble destroying Wildstorm so they could integrate those characters into the DC U proper and now they're just giving up and remaking Wildstorm?
WTF?

(but at least Vertigo is coming back, YaY!)
I don't understand how any idiot can fall for that trollmeme that it's Marvel that's the one in trouble.

Yeah, but you didn't address the money situation. The only one who has the money to compete with Disney is WB. Also, which would you rather have, A comic company that's is shitting on everyone now and doesn't know who should be their headliner, or a company who at least knows who their headliners are and make a cogent story with them, albeit not the greatest they still feel like characters and not mouthpieces for their identity politics, most of them at least.

I'm not really sure that you grasp the concept of this board's stated purpose.

Shouldn't you be off somewhere kicking orphans in the face or something?

I'm just saying... there are less obnoxious ways to pick fights with people who weren't bothering you in any conceivable way.

>Will it be Marvel's Rebirth?

No there will be no major creative team changes. Its going to be the same shit just another new branding.

Marvel have very clearly not understood the core reasons as to why Rebirth worked but hey we might maybe get the Fantastic 4 back so i guess thats ok.

Adding to this: get the X-Men in. Slice Angel off since the other four O5 have unique powers, add the big four All-New X-Men (Wolvie, Storm, Nightcrawler, Colossus) and maybe Shadowcat.

Slice out Ant-Man/Wasp as a solo hero concept and solely in Avengers and make Dr. Strange the other solo hero in their place.

Those iconic X-Men, the FF, the A-list solo heroes mentioned banding as the Avengers: boom. Everything else in Marvel can tie into them from there.

Marvel is going to be try to hav is cake and eating it to.

How can their be a cake without a freaking cake mix?

Brevoort is eating the mix before the cake can be made.

The Wildstorm is a vanity book for Warren Ellis, who they want to try and do more mature audience shit for them.

That said, the division shit is mainly to revive the DOA Vertigo brand since Vertigo is pretty much beyond salvation and Young Animals has fallen apart due to Gerald Way not being able to do a monthly book (Doom Patrol is going on hiatus after the first arc and there are rumors that the plans to relaunch LOTSH as a Young Animal book got vetoed hard by Johns

If your complaint about Marvel is that they don't have a headliner, wake up: that's old news.
Did you honestly think the flag guy with no superpowers and a magic Frisbee was Marvel's headliner?
In-U obvious leader, yes. Headliner, no way.
Ever since the old patriot thawed out his story's themes have all been
>"Out-of-touch icon of the past is disillusioned with the modern world"
That was never the role of "Headliner", that's political parody.
Neither was Spider-Man(jerk), Hulk(monster), Iron-Man(drunk), or even Thor(blasphemy) ever the "headliner".
The closest to that role was the original Captain Marvel.
(and FYI: now it's Carol)

Marvel just doesn't do that vision of superheroes like DC does.
The Trinity is classic shlock comic conventions: capes, symbols, mythologies.
Symbols all meaning the same basic thing: the ideal.
It's not the same kind of storytelling. It's not metaphors and allegory for DC, so they can afford to have a simple headliner role of a character that's the living solution to every problem.
Marvel's typical stories collapse in a world with that sort of character.

Marvel's baking two dozen cupcakes every six months, but will take away over half of them after you have the first bite.

Eh, I can get where you're coming from, It's just that it feels that Marvel is willing to capulate whenever trouble comes by. How many times has Captain Marvel (Danvers) had to be redone, 3, 4 times? It also doesn't know how to handle characters that were actually good. Ms. Marvel (Khan) was an actually surprisingly good book. It had all the consistency of what a good book is and yet now it's become staler than a piece of bread that's been in the back of the fridge for a month (there was one freaking issue where it feels like they just copy-n-pasted a pamphlet on the importance of voting). The bottom line is Marvel knows jack about promoting and making relateable characters anymore. How many 20 something, come from middle class burbs, probably never have to worry about cash, new heroes are there?

(and FYI: those "Jerks" are the moneymakers, and yet they are so intent on shitting and shaming them, it's gotten to the point to where it's no longer ironic)

What exactly can Marvel bring back with legacy that's appealing, really?

Their roster is out of commision legacy characters and their replacements, and giving legacy characters their mantles back doesn't mean shit. DC Rebirth is atleast redeveloping characters back in the directon of their Pre-Reboot counterparts while still blending in developments from N52. Bruce Banner coming back and being the Hulk doesn't change shit for him or the landscape.

I've never seen the Marvel characters being redone as giving up on who they were, although there have been examples of that with minor characters like the D-List villains.
Take Hulk, originally he was a gray monster by night that Doc Banner suffered through like a were-superhero, then they had him be a founding Avenger and be a team player, then they had him wandering the wilds as a fugitive doing good where he could...
And they started reimagining him: Gray Hulk mobster, Smart Hulk, Banner separated from Hulk, remerged and back to basics Hulk, Alien-Planet Warrior Hulk, Worldbreaker Hulk, etc... etc...
The thing is, if you go back and read the original stories, the original Hulk has only grown past the storytelling limitations of his original concept over all these years.
He's still the same character, they still held true to a Hulk worldview where the original character concept was valid.
They never erased his past, only added to the canon.
So I don't see those "redone"s as scrapping them, only having them grow up.
Though I do understand why someone would like Gray Mobster Hulk (Mr.Fixit) better than Worldbreaker Hulk and say that's destroying the character.

Wolverine.
Mr. Fantastic.
Invisible Woman.
Cyclops.
Professor X.
Banner.

The thing is that soo much of Marvel's past is dead and gone ( or Hydra-fied ) that the question of what exactly the "legacy" of their existence would be is now rather relevant.
Sup Forums's talking a lot of shit about how bad the new generation is compared to simpler times, but what was the legacy that's been left behind?
If nothing else, the question should be thrown around between the remaining characters.
Maybe it'll change them the same way some of those deaths drastically changed who was left behind.

That's kind of the point. You either have good development or bad development. Good development is having a character like Scarlet Witch and have her evolve beyond just a piece of eye candy with some magic energy blasts with brother/daddy issues into someone who has an understanding in the importance of the chaotic dark arts. Bad Character development is when you have someone like Black Cat turn villain vendetta on Petey one something he didn't even do, not even getting a word in edgewise, scraping any camaraderie that the two characters had, and any leeway that she may have given him despite all the bad that she has done.

the real harbringer of modern marvel was Civil War
its a culimation of everything wrong with Marvel today
>characters acting out of character for the story to work
>characters acting plain stupid for the story to work
>almost no editorial oversight
>hero vs hero bs
>focusing on pushing new characters trough the most obnoxious ways possible
>an event that focused more on marketting and shock factor than good writing
and thats aside from the fact that it spawned OMD

>I haven't read any Marvel Comics before 2010 yet I am qualified to talk about them

Uh huh.

>Soule

The terrible thing about this is that Soule at DC was pretty good, and in the case of Swamp Thing, really great. What is Marvel doing to their writers to make them so mediocre?

>Marvel runs on a "seasonal" model now

That's a lie they tell you to justify gimmick relaunches. If they were really seasonal their books would have something to suggest it on the covers

FYI, I actually hate Wanda going god-powered and suddenly being all about the witchcraft in the aftermath.
Why would she trust magic after everything it's put her through? She single-handedly damned an entire species because she was mad at her daddy, but magic itself gets a free pass despite the rules playing keep-away with her twins and facilitating her greatest sin???
But of course without that she wouldn't have had all this recent character development.
And speaking of character development, Black Cat returning to her criminal roots after having established a personal relationship with Pete makes her a more rounded-out villain, even if it utterly destroys her whole reformed villain turned hero arc her character is still being developed into more than what she was before.
She works better as the villainess with the hidden heart of gold instead of sidekick street-level superhero #34 in Spidey's background cast.

I'm ready for it, bring on the death of retail marvel.

>Will it change anything?
Did they get new writers? New editors? New artists? No? Then no.

Still the same writers and editorial staff, so no.

they don't MAKE them that way, they've got a racist "talent" cscout who's pushing an agenda, and thinks virtue singalling = sales because the shock value from outrage was doing well until the steep drop off.

Way to contribute with your utmost level of insight.
You are surely the world's finest detective to have sleuthed that out...
You've made mother and father Wayne proud, Bruce.

If you think allowing open expressions of racism is the secret ingredient that makes DC better, why don't you post some pic examples of your delusion ... evidence in regards to DC Comics being so overtly and intentionally racist?
And while you're at it, what exactly could a talent scout possibly do to erase racism in a writer and turn them into a big bad scary Social Justice Warrior????

( I'm thinking this is all in your sick little head )

This.

DC's current structure is such a breath of fresh air from Marvels chaos.

>"Fresh"
... and here I thought the whole 52 thing had gone rotten by now.
I didn't realize that it was an example of a "fresh" idea.

The reason House of M happened was because the X team writers were really prissy about transferring Wanda to the Avengers team, so they decided to shit on her from so up high that they assumed she would be irredeemable, yet the Avengers team cleaned her off the best that they could and made her interesting. Also I wouldn't call Black Cat a background character as more of a tertiary character who more or less knew in the back of her mind that she would probably get caught, just did it for the thrill. Also Felicia isn't the only one Slott shat on: MJ, Gwen, Felicia, all of these were characters that were created before slott's medelling who actually had good chemistry with peter and i'm not even kidding, he hate's the possibility of him finding happiness with another. In his mind he is made just to fall, and if he had it his way he would have be an eternal highschooler because it's "Good marketing sense". The only reason we got Renew your vows, was because people complained enough that OMD was complete tripe and wanted to see a timeline where actually thought it out and decided not to get mephestoed.

There is no stability, a book/hero can't go for half a year without being canceled, getting side tracked by a huge event tie in, or getting replaced by a legacy hero for headlines.

There's too many books, and each one feels like a stealth mini or gets quickly relaunched and completely overhauled with the previous run ignored by the new writer with no repercussions because Marvel editors don't give a shit.

No nothing will change just like a relapsing alcoholic or drug user they always promise to get clean and, in like a few weeks they'll be right back right where they started.

Marvel has always been shit

It's amazing how many of these characters are race/gender pallette swaps of the same brand.
5-6 Spiderman/Women
3 Hulks
2 Caps (Nazi Cap and Diversity Cap)
2 Wolverines
2 Iron Man's
2 Hawkeyes

In the time between Marvel Vs Capcom 3 and Infinite Marvel have made more lazy copy pasta characters than Capcom, no mean feat.

I think we need a black lesbian Doctor Doom, a teenage Doctor Doom, a Transexual Kang.

Fresh as in feeling refreshed as you wash off the cow shit that's been stuck to your face.

> Squirrel Girl is up there.

A joke character is up there, yet Wanda and others are not.

They do this for the movies. You know that, right?

Your numbers are wrong. You didn't get even one count right.

And the black lesbian is Storm,
the teenaged thing has been done before with a less infamous Iron-Man,
and the transsexuals are all over in the X-Men books, I count nine so far.

No kid,
I've been watching them do that since before the Burton Batman movie.
It has nothing to do with movies.

From Disassembled onwards they have followed a pattern of events with "shock" twists that almost always result in character assassination.

7 Spider-Women, 6 Spider-Men (? more or less)
3 She-Hulks, 4 Hulks (some currently depowered)
1 current Captain America, 5 different ones over the years
4 Wolverines, because we all know he's still alive in there
3 Iron-Mans, because Tony's in a coma, he's not dead
2 Hawkeyes if you don't include the evil brother

And let's not forget those Dark Avengers from Dark Reign: another Wolverine, Hawkeye, Spider-Man, and Iron-(Patriot)-Man to add to the lists.

Those " "shock" twists" are setting up longer character arcs.
They follow patterns that repeat every time there's one of these " "shock" twists", for instance: in the X-Men books Emma Frost recently went crazy. She didn't go crazy overnight. There's at least half a dozen stories over the past two decades where she's pushed into a state of madness by a plot twist.
In Spider-Man the plot twists keep distancing Pete from his supporting cast.
In Thor all the stories revolve around questioning the value of having gods at all.
Daredevil keeps damning himself.

It's a thing, look for it in the books you read.

Why are there two Peters and who's the woman between half mask Peter and Venom?

Regular Peter and Renew Your Vows Peter.

Also I assume that's Jessica Jones.

geoff johns summed it up basically, too much pessimism and not enough escapism to enjoy the books. glad he fixed DC, marvel needs to deal with their x-men/spiderman/inhumans/sjw bullshit.

mitigating events fatigue won't help if the same group of writers and editors are still onboard.

>pre-Legacy
Female!Thor punches non-woke sexist in the face with a tampon for mansplaining unsolicited opinions on Israel
>post-Legacy
Male!Thor punches non-woke sexist in the face with a tampon for mansplaining unsolicited opinions on Israel

Pretty much how it's gonna go

I hope that marvel burns

Would you believe the entire reasoning for Hardy going completely villainous overnight is because Slott said something to the effect of "Spider-Man shouldn't be friends with bad guys?"

You know, despite the fact that he's worked with anti-heroes and villains countless times in the past, even ones that are always out for his blood like Venom.

Johns didn't fix DC. Sure, they're not a movie synergy-centric SJW pandering amateur mess like Marvel is right now, but they still have a slew of their own problems that make their comics pretty bad across the board.

Johns fixed Green Lantern. That's about it.

>DC, after all these decades, finally wins for good.
I doubt it. Marvel still has a lot of tricks up its sleeves, not to mention the pure media attention and good will Marvel Studio has gotten them. Worst case, Marvel will cry to big daddy Disney about getting bullied
I want DC not be the underdog for once, but it's like rooting for Android in the Phone Wars. The general public will always be on the side of the "popular" one

>Hopeless is still hopeless
ftfy

As long as Gwenpoole and Ms. Marvel stay untouched, I'll be fine.

I always knew DC fans were fucking hipsters but this post confirms it.

>cap, thor, iron man, etc. are restored
>diversity characters get their own comics before ultimately dying off
>captain marvel gets her 5 relaunch in the last 5 years
>f4 makes their return
>marvel will try to exploit something other than events and relaunches for a couple of years
>most comics will suck because the writers are still mostly shit

I just hope this forced diversity cancer dies and genuinely good characters can stick around.

>cap, thor, iron man, etc. are restored
>still get shitty writing and hamfisted sjw plots
That's what's gonna happen.

If the new xmen is prove of anything then nothing will change at all.

Isn't Legacy just another name for X-Men vol. 2? I am confus

Exactly. Marvel still hasn't addressed their biggest problem: shit writers and editors. They seem to be fixing some of the other problems... hopefully.

>Will it change anything Sup Forums? Will it be Marvel's Rebirth?
Nope
>Tell me your hopes and dreams
Bendis, Quesada, & Spencer all drop over dead and someone who actually gives a shit about storytelling is put in charge.

>Bendis, Quesada, & Spencer all drop over dead and Marvel hires more minority webcomic creators in their place

Your blaming X writers for house of M?Bendis the main avengers writer was the one who wrote her as a psychotic mess in that story as a follow up to his previous shitting on her in Dissassembled.X writers pretty much just went with it and made as much drama as they could from it till Children's crusade could solve Wanda's in inconsistency

Fuck you.

They could bring back the whole Illuminati. Pretty much everyone of them died/is dead and could be some kind of undercover team to fight the really big enemies. Yes, there are the Ultimates and it is *partly* a okay comic, but the characters are just so dump and expendable.

I´d like to see Prof X, Black Bolt, Strange, Namor, Black Panther and Stark back in action, WITHOUT Bendis, who is retconning the shit out of the Beyonder.

Nothing is going to change as long as they have the same writers and editors.

They want to cash in on DC's rebirth without actually doing anything that made that work. DC was willing to admit it made some mistakes, Marvel isn't.