Something about the idea of a hero continuing to fight the good fight, even when it's clear they're past their prime. On one hand it's inspiring, and on the other you have a more compelling character that is having to actively work past their frailties to save the day.
Mr. Incredible >Strength in all muscle groups (punching and jumping) >Enhanced agility and reflexes. >Superhuman durability. >Danger Sense (the ability to detect when an immediate threat whether it be a villain's bomb or his wife waiting for him).
After having kids and at least a decade of actively battling supervillains, he's put on a bit of weight and let his strength likely to decline. Also he is horribly inflexible and pulled out his back while gloating.
Thankfully he spent a couple months getting back in shape (recovering a fair amount of his prior strength and endurance) and although probably not as hardy as he was previously, he still has years of combat experience and is a force to be reckoned with.
His battle with the Omnidroid while being out of the game for YEARS is a testament to his abilities. The droid had be working it's way through the majority of the hero roster getting stronger and smarter with every kill and it STILL WASN'T ENOUGH to kill Mr. Incredible. Fucking baller. youtube.com/watch?v=HTxrT2dCNLA
>fter having kids and at least a decade of actively battling supervillains Mean't to say NOT battling super-villains.
Batman in TDKR: The Last Crusade >An improved Bat arsenal >YEARS of continued combat experience with a continuously varying enemy pool. >A keen detective mind and master strategiest.
Bruce is 45 years old and has continued his vigilante crusade for a solid two decades. Because of this his body as probably at it's worst and he has to take a cocktail of pain killers (no opiates I believe).
This Batman is obviously feeling the effects of his career and it's only a matter of time before his body fails him at the worst time possible. Interestingly, I'd argue he's in better shape in TDKR at the age of 55 than he is at this point. All that time off gave his body time to heal and although he's rusty, he renewed drive and vigor pushed him back into the fray with exceptional results.
Hudson Clark
The first thing that popped in my head was Cohen the Barbarian and the Silver Horde from Discworld.
Jaxson Nelson
A bit different, but made me think of Macbeth from Gargoyles. >Once a great warrior turned king, who does what is best for his people and the first major link between humans and Gargoyles >Grows old and beaten down >Spends centuries wandering past his prime, wishing only to end his misery
I felt sad when he talks about how tired he was.
David Cox
Batfleck in the DCEU. He's either in his mid-late 40s or early 50s, and still going, and by dialog may well be the only member of the Batfamily that still is if Batgirl is an origin story and Nightwing is in Bludhaven.
It's interesting in the warehouse fight to wonder if he would have taken the hits he does even a few years ago, especially considering the 'extra armor' that Alfred implies is new is all that saves his life from the double tap in the back of the skull.
I find Batman at his best Year One to the Dick Grayson as Robin years, and then when he's aging/middle-aged. When he's post-Jason JLA Batgod, I actually find him dull and even irritating.
Mason Hall
Actually, these two are basically exactly the same for all intents and purposes. So what you said.
Logan Ortiz
>It's interesting in the warehouse fight to wonder if he would have taken the hits he does even a few years ago, especially considering the 'extra armor' that Alfred implies is new is all that saves his life from the double tap in the back of the skull. That's an interesting point that you raised. This Batman has realized that he's nowhere near as fast as he used to be but he's now developed "old man strength" (it is totally a fucking thing) and is using that to his advantage. I believe he definitely would have been much more acrobatic and moving about a decade prior. To compensate it's clear this Batman is all about using his physicality to fucking dominate his enemies in an effeciently quick manor (because he knows his endurance isn't what it used to be). Instead he using explosive hits to literally pummel faces hard enough to break through the floor. youtube.com/watch?v=qjtQGqGJFk4
Yeah, it's all but implied. They didn't need to add in the line by Alfred that the armor was something he would need to make changes to accomidate, and then have Batman take multiple headshots in that new armor (and a knife slash).
Landon Cooper
>Mr. Incredible outrunning the Omnidroid while out of shape
Well that explains Dash's super speed.
Evan Richardson
I think it's neat that his armor appears more reinforced in the cowl than past incarnations. Bale Batman's cowl would crack from punches. This thing took multiple gunshots at near point blank range and managed to disperse the force enough to keep from knocking Batman unconscious.
Spider-Man Reign - Peter Parker. >Still clearly retains a significant degree of his prior abilities. >Amazing strength. >Sensational reflexes >Astonishing agility. >Still has access to his spider-sense (I think).
Peter is minimum 50 years old and probably much longer. I think it was established it's been 30 years since he was last Spider-Man so obviously he's seen some serious downtime and likely atrophied as a result.
Throughout the story Peter gets back to web swinging and cracking jokes like the old days and then has to contend with almost all of the main hitters from his rogues gallery. A note of interest, although a LARGE amount of time has passed it seems that many of these individuals kept themselves active during this period and would have only lost a bit of their edge. Also a few of them have been outfitted with improved versions of their gear, making them a potentially larger threat than they were before.
In spite of this, it becomes clear that even after 30 years, Peter is still an absolute monster when he decides to stop holding back. Peter has had 30 years to reflect on his past adventures, constantly wondering where it went wrong (because he has a guilt problem) and how he could have improved. And when push came to shove it became obvious just out utterly outclassed these jokers were.
Brody Walker
I never made that connection. I thought powers were just a crap shoot. Makes you wonder where Violet got hers from....
Moon Knight (Huston Run and beyond). >Excellent physical shape and endurance despite his age. >Preexisting mercenary combat experience and weapons training. >He's rich a bitch with too much time on his hands and access to some pretty obscure artifacts. >Years of combat experience taking only enemies that in some cases severely outclass him. >An inhuman tolerance to pain. Like seriously, the only thing that's going to come close to stopping him is a lethal blow. No exceptions.
A man in his late thirties, he is most likely just barely out of his prime (although with his resumed physical training this might be debatable).
What's most interesting, he's sustained injuries that for all intents and purposes should be crippling. As was mentioned during Huston's run (which was years ago so Moon Knight has likely aged a year or two), what was amazing about Moon Knight isn't the fact that he was able to pull off a 20 mile endurance test, it was that he was able to walk unassisted on his own.
I'd argue that since the beginning of this run he's probably more competent in his early 40s than he was a decade prior. See...
Moon Knight#1 by Bendis >Moon Knight manages to face off against Mr. Hyde (a villain his physical superior in every way) and manages to get away relatively unscathed.
Moon Knight #09 by Bendis >Moon Knight manages to keep COUNT FUCKING NEFARIA at bay using a combination of tactics to keep him off balance.
Moon Knight #2 by Ellis >Moon Knight faces off against a highly trained special operations snipe that was able to survive being abandoned in enemy territory.
Moon Knight #5 by Ellis >Moon Knight single handedly faces off arrangement of thugs, bruisers, and trained assassins in rapid succession while climbing up a five story building (I could be mistaken).
Moon Knight #15 >He fucking blew away the monster under the bed.
Leo Rivera
God, that whole scene really is everything I've wanted Batman to be on screen.
Isaiah Clark
Likewise. It's basically the Arkham games in live action, and what I always wanted to see growing up. It cemented BvS amongst my favorite cape movies, if the my actual favorite.
Christopher Russell
Dan Dreiberg - Watchmen >Detective training. >Martial arts training from one of the most effecient heroes in his day. >Expansive arsenal that he may/may not have been working on. >He's held on to a good bit of his previous strength and agility but it's clear he lost a step.
A man of 40 years old (if his wiki is to be believed, Dan hasn't been a hero for about two decades. He's got a paunch and probably doesn't have near the upper body strength he used to, when push came to shove he was able to leap back into action with relatively little difficulty. >I know some hate this scene and find it needless (which I largely agree), but it still is a good display that Nite Owl is still someone not to be taken lightly. >Also Nite Owl throws out way more kicks than expected which means he's probably kept some degree of his prior flexibility. youtube.com/watch?v=ooLZrYuIMwg
Some might say him being manhandled by Ozymandias at the end indicates he's not the hero he used to be, I instead see this as a testament to just how much better Ozymandias was than him. Ozymandias is not a contender for this thread because he is most certainly not out of his prime (or at least the loss is negligible). Remember, he was still fast/coordinated enough to catch a fucking bullet. youtube.com/watch?v=G3CYN7_Aa7E youtube.com/watch?v=NEJLOd8EN6k
Aaron Peterson
Huh, I never really looked at the grenade scene properly. People give him 'murderBats' shit for it, but if he hadn't done that, that grenade could have killed everyone in the room. He potentially saved their lives.
Daniel King
Missed something. He was born in 1945 and the Keene Act was passed in 1977. So he was 32 when he quit so he's only been inactive for 8 years. Probably explains why he was so easily able to slip back into the role. He wasn't quite over the hill so to speak.
Also that grin sums up the character nicely. He lives for this.
Robert Butler
I don't think Macbeth was past his physical prime.
Oliver Anderson
Any word, any word at all, anything, anything at all mentioning the new movie in any capacity as told by the official announcements.
And also- an "Incredible Prequel" in their golden age would be as incredible as it is unlikely to happen.
Josiah Barnes
I think the original Nite Owl and Comedian are both the best examples.
That gangs gets the drop on an old man, retired for decades, and he still handles himself admirably. I'm not sure out of costume, in a confined space, and so outnumbered even Nite Owl 2, Spectre, or Rorsch would have done better.
As for Comedian, you just have his opening and last fight, and frankly he does better than either of the two younger heroes at any point in the final confrontation. The coffee trick and his knifework would have probably worked against a none-metahuman.
Isaac Cook
>one decent action scene made the movie your favorite
Aiden Sanders
>As for Comedian, you just have his opening and last fight >The coffee trick and his knifework would have probably worked against a none-metahuman.
h-have you only seen the movie? Ozy is not a meta-human, that's just Zack Snyder exaggerating everything
Also we don't really see Comedian put up a fight in the comics. Not canon
Mason Ortiz
>I think the original Nite Owl and Comedian are both the best examples. You bring up a good. Point, in both instances they were ambushed an immediately thrown off their guard. It's also interesting that the Blake probably had the best shot at taking on Adrian and he was WELL past his prime. He managed to take on Adrian one on one and did FAR better than Nite Owl, Rorschach, and Silk Spectre working against him. It looks like Adrian is definitely having to work for this kill than literally fighting Rorschach with his back turned and Rorschach is not your average brawler. youtube.com/watch?v=gSTXNzT-ZgM
I maintain if it was Adrian against Comedian even just 10 years prior at the end of the Vietnam War (his appearance with John in the Bar), he would have wiped the floor with him.
Liam Nguyen
>I maintain if it was Adrian against Comedian even just 10 years prior at the end of the Vietnam War (his appearance with John in the Bar), he would have wiped the floor with him.
You also must not have read the comic. In it, it was confirmed that the Comedian and Adrian did have a confrontation previously in which the Comedian wiped the floor with him. I think at the end when he fights Rorschach and Nite Owl he even mentions how he trained specifically to be able to kill the Comedian as a result.
Adam Bennett
>stop liking what I don't like! REEEEEEEEEE
I said cemented. I already liked the film a great deal, for various off topic reasons, and then it gave me the best Batman fight scene on film.
Sadly, yeah, it's something I've never gotten around to picking up. However, movie-verse Ozy at least is clearly a meta. He can catch a fucking bullet.
Thomas Long
>Also we don't really see Comedian put up a fight in the comics. Not canon Headcanon he didn't go down easy. Also it was mentioned in the Watchmen comic that Blake had bested Ozymandias earlier in his career but the Before Watchmen series made had him win by cheating (him him still fighting Ozy on equal footing for an extended period of time which is something neither Rorschach of Nite Owl could do).
I didn't forget. I just didn't know if you considered the Before Watchmen comic canon or not. You are definitely correct in the comic stating outright (which makes me happy) that Comedian bested Ozy but I don't remember him saying he specifically went out of his way to counter it. I could still definitely see it because that's just part of his character. Learn, adapt, and plan for the future.
Adrian Ward
>no one posted this 20 years in the cubes, plebs.
Camden Wright
...you do realise that vastly more people saw the film than read the comics, right? And its not so unusual for its take on the characters to be considered the definitive one because of it?
And we aren't even arguing that. is movie scenes, and so we went on to talk movies. Stow your autism.
Hudson Gutierrez
>I just didn't know if you considered the Before Watchmen comic canon or not.
I never read Before Watchmen, it was mentioned in the Watchmen comic somewhere. I'm like 95% sure there's a line from Ozy somewhere about how after losing to the comedian once he had to make sure it could never happen again or something similar. Also worth noting though, the Comedian was still on government black ops so I don't think he was ever fully retired like the others.
He caught a bullet in the comic but his hand was all bloody and shit from it
Isaiah Baker
...
Thomas Richardson
=(
Thomas Wood
I think, that was a big part of appeal for many of the classic JSA members, Flash and GL in particular. They started out superheroing bck in WWII or something. They have a full head of grey hair (or should) and they still kick all kinds of ass.
Carson James
Rex Tyler as Hourman is an absolute G. Here's one of my first exposures to the character.
Kevin Young
...
Nicholas Bailey
Last page. That last panel makes it.
Juan Rivera
Don't forget radioactive semen.
Nolan Ramirez
that was really one of the best scenes
Hudson Gomez
He says multiple times that he was. He was already aged when he was doomed to walk the earth forever.
Easton Murphy
My big worry is that they will over saturate it with superheroes in an Avengers fashion, and it'll stop being a story and become a big toy commercial. Pixar has shown for years now that they stopped giving a shit about anything that isn't marketable.
Aiden Young
Shit movie. Bt the brutality Batman shows off is really fucking cool and a breath of fresh air imo.
Adam Roberts
Iron Man - MCU >Genius level intellect. >Richer than he has any right to be. >Issues relating to his ego and unresolved issues with his father.
This version of Stark is at least a good decade older than his 616 counterpart and clearly shows it. He's still in reasonable shape and his active lifestyle keeps him constantly improving his armor but he's definitely not is as spry as his younger counterpart. Ultimate Tony was also probably a more youthful version.
Nathaniel Roberts
This trope is pretty solid. I think Kotetsu, at least at the end of the series, shows what makes it great. I always see Sup Forums nut all over One Punch Man or JoJo, but I never see anyone talking about the greatest Sup Forums anime.
Austin Gomez
I really didn't like how he was handled in the movie. It completely undermined the sheer ridiculousness of a man in his 40s putting on tights he wore 30 pounds ago in a completely different era. He had his skill, yeah, but definitely was past his prime.
The whole point of the guy was that he's struggling to relive his glory days, and Snyder made him a backflipping superhuman in a sleek Batman outfit.
Joshua Perez
I loved the scene in the movie that emulated this.
Michael Morris
Fucking cars.
Elijah Anderson
Makes sense. When you think about it, super speed like Dash's is just a specialized form of super strength.
As for Violet, who knows, maybe she has a grandparent with similar powers.
Jack Baker
Superman Beyond - DCAU >Faster than a speeding bullet. >More powerful than a locamotive. >Able to leap tall buildings in a single bound. >Can fly. >Heat vision. >Freeze Breath/Super Breath
DCAU Superman is a tricky character. He's had all of the experience of STAS plus his experiences in JL and JLU. He's been at least a decade or two since we last saw him. His white streaks in his air is an indication he's not as young as he once was. THat said, he's still Superman so it is unlikely we ever see the full extent of his powers (kinda see it in the Batman Beyond episode). Also, since he was mind controlled in the episode it's unlikely that Starro would intuitively know how to use his abilities to their fullest extent (Supes is pretty creative when he needs to be).
While he could probably stop any of the villains in his rogues gallery (Parasite, Livewire, Toyman), I'm much less certain about whether or not he could still go toe to toe with DCAU Darkseid.
Carter Cruz
The Punisher - Punisher Max (Aaron). >Military training in hand to hand combat and weapons. >Experienced tactician and strategist. >Excellent physical shape despite age. >30 Years of continued combat experience shaping him into someone that probably has a plan for ever occasion.
Considering that this version of The Punisher has been active for at least 30 years, and assuming he went into the military and only spent two years there before heading back home (which is incredible doubtful), this Frank is definitely in his early-mid fifties.
His body has taken a beating over the years with blunt force trauma and bullet wounds being the most likely candidates, but he's still a hardy bastard that can take more than his fair share of punishment and keep coming. I consider him a different beast entirerly from the 616 iteration and is more of a force of nature than a character looking for purpose. He may be old, but he's certainly not going to let that stop him from carrying out his mission.
Colton Stewart
Very interesting thread. Now I would like to read a series about a group of retired heroes putting back on the cape because this generation sucked. Like a less depressing Kingdom Come
Jackson Watson
On the topic of heroes considered past their prime, Old Man Logan is a worthy candidate. This particular issue doesn't really do much to show Logan in action but still a good comic.
Liam Clark
Bump
Angel Evans
BUMP!
Xavier Cruz
Logan - Earth 807128 >Adamantium reinforced skeleton. >Years of combat experience fighting supervillains. >Official Samurai training which included swordsman, horseback riding, and archer (unless I'm just imagining things. Could be very very wrong). >Decreased healing factor. Although greatly diminished in speed, it still seems that Wolverine can survive fatal injuries that would kill most individuals.
This Wolverine is probably the most guilt ridden of the bunch. Having been tricked into murdering his fellow X-Men, he attempted to kill himself by having a train sever his head but even that didn't work. He led the remainder of his life attempting to distance himself from his former life.
Then the villains took over and the world went to shit. And the Hulk's gang killed his family and children even when Logan was about to fulfill his part of the deal. This triggered the poor guy to go on a murderious rampage and slaughter the Hulk's entire family tree. Although not anywhere near as strong/fast as he was in his X-Men days, Logan still have more combat experience than most people have literally lived and has the willpower and drive to push himself far past the normal limitations expected from him.
Xavier Scott
Thomas Wayne - Batman (Earth -2) >Detective skills. >Expert marksman. >Trained martial artist. >Medical knowledge. >Miraclo assisted abilities which imbue him with super strength, durability, stamina, agility, night vision, and apparently aquatic adaptation. >These powers last for an hour, after which the body needs 24 hours to recover before another use.
Thomas Wayne on Earth 2 managed to survive being shot and instead went into hiding. After learning of his son's death facing off against Darkseid, he decided to adopt his mantle of Batman, albeit with a drastically different modus operandi than his son's (specifically lethal force).
Also this Batman has access to Miraclo, which acts as a 1 hour super serum that allows him to basically be a heartier, better, faster, and stronger Batman than can literally shrug off a headshot like no big deal. What I'm not completely certain about is just how long his body can last at his age while repeatedly using Miraclo (which is supposedly addictive).
Isaac Hall
>Batman gets so sick of the Asian dude who wont stay down he gives him Bat-aids
Dylan Cooper
Just wanted to say this thread is incredibly interesting and a lot better than most threads I've seen in a long time. Bump.
Dylan Gray
I absolutely loved that the JSA had numerous different age groups and that the older guys actively mentored the younger heroes.
You had the OGs and their war stories, the veterans and their coping with life, the youngsters and their trials by fire, and all of them offering myriad different perspectives on things.
It was pretty much perfect.
Carson Martinez
I really like Superman Beyond for the whole "aging and depressed but still packing a punch" Superman
Carson Jenkins
Did they ever make comic books of The Incredibles? And if so, where can I acquire them?
