Did Miniseries REALLY "save" AT?

Stakes was ultimately pointless, didn't resolve the situation it started. The vampires were anticlimactic. Marceline's internal conflict started and (inexplicably) ended within the special.
The only reason the vampires even got out was because PB just left the goo in a bucket instead of destroying it. Which means Pb could do it again and just get rid of it. There was no explanation as to why not. It is one of the most unsatisfactory resolutions this show has had.

Islands was dull from start to finish and besides destroying Susan's character it replaced an exciting mystery with what was ultimately two different incredibly boring and cliche vaguely dystopian human societies we've seen before. Finn's backstory, while being interesting is revealed in flashbacks that are so out of place considering no one but Martin, who is absent, would know that story. Meaning it literally doesn't matter because Finn or Minerva will never know that Martin didn't just abandon them, and doesn't explain why Martin treated Finn like he did in the present. Which makes the entire story almost meaningless.
Finn's conflict with Minerva escalates and is solved almost immediately there is very little progression towards either of the two events. It just felt rushed.

Cont

Cont'd

Elements starts completely off screen as doesn't take much time explaining how it got that far, it just happens off screen, sky hooks is a great example of this, nothing happens in that episode besides explanation until they have to escape from PB which was very close to the end, or to show why PB was so much more powerful than the others. Because it doesn't take the time to build up the current situation you'd at least expect there to he some build up toward the resolution, but instead the problem is resolved by a lumpy ex machina. Besides the fact that LSP having screentime is inherently awful, it means that almost none of it actually mattered. Even the Betty situation practically solved itself.

Even if you liked these miniseries I can't see the justification for them being better than any other plotline in the series. It suffers from the same problems, they just seem to be excused here.

Good write-up

I'm too autistic to tell if this is sarcasm or not.

Also, outside of the other plotlines AT has had a lot of GOOD episodes, a lot better than the miniseries. Even in S8.

Islands and Elements are great, fag. Susan backstory is okay, stop treating your shitty subjective opinion as a fact.

When did I say it was a fact? Are you being intentionally retarded?

I didn't really care much for Stakes, but the latter two have been pretty satisfying. Are we getting more miniseries for the last season? Maybe not since it'll probably just be going around wrapping up all the loose ends almost everywhere.

>I'm too autistic.

/thread

Personally I don't think there is anything important to answer outside of "what's Finn going to do with the rest of his life?" He's not really PBs knight anymore, barely a hero. I think the last season should focus on restoring those aspects of Finn now that the moody teenager phase seems to be over.

The Mini series were made to test if AT could sustain itself of DVD sales alone

*/board

Anyone got sales numbers?

I came back to watch the stakes and it wasn't awful like seasons 5-6. The first few episodes of Islands were also pretty shit.

I'd say no and completely agree wit you.

>lol discussing cartoons on a comic and cartoon image board instead of shitposting and waifuposting? how autistic
only replying since i wanted to bump anyway

Why do you think that?

While 5-6 weren't good overall there were quite a few episodes good episodes between the two.

Sugar's Simon & Marcy and that guest animated 3d episode were the only ones that stood out to me.

I am looking forward to new episodes because of the elements mini, because jake and lich stuff, but that said re-boot was fucking king kong dracula dog-shit and islands trying to salvage that fucking shit show was a miracle on to itself

Islands > Elements > Stakes

Simon n Marcy was bad but there were quite a few good episodes
>Five More Short Graybles
>Up a Tree
>All The Little People
>Jake the Dad
>Davey
>Mystery Dungeon
>Little Dude
>Bad Little Boy
>Vault of Bones
>A glitch is a glitch
>Puhoy
>BMO Lost
Quite a few others

In season 6 there was
>Sad Face
>Food Chain
>Furniture & Meat
>Little Brother
>Thanks for the Crabapples
>Nemesis
>Joshua and Margaret Investigations
>Ghost Fly
>Jake the Brick
>Dentist
>Jermaine
>Graybles 1000+

There hasn't been an ENTIRELY bad season of AT

Not miniseries AT > Islands/Stakes >>> Elements

No, because it didn't need saving. The miniseries were all pretty solid though.

Was there anything good about elements?

Yeah, it was funny, lots of great character interactions, Cloudy was a fantastic episode, and it was a good set up for the endgame of the series. The transformed landscape and characters were also cool to see.

AT can not have a complex plot, everything in it is meaningless and insane, and this is the good of the show, the mystery and the creativity, trying for a complex plot makes the show look stupid because the show is stupid

I don't disagree but they clearly tried and there were a myriad of flaws in the attempt that are being ignored.

AT never tried to have a complex plot. Fans just read way too far into it and developed expectations for it.

to little to late
people have been wanting Adventure Time to get more plot heavy since season 3
now they have and the show lost all of it's steam
it's hard to think how it was the biggest thing 4 years ago and now it's completely irrelevant
just like homestuck

I think it's pretty clear that the orgalorg and finn's arm stuff and reincarnation stuff, as well as the simon and war stories were all attempts at complex storytelling that fell flat.

No one ever asked for that. No one. I've been asking for a simple adventure show since the first I remember you premier. People only really asked for satisfying resolutions AFTER the stories started. And NOW we're at a point where people complain about filler in fucking AT and anyone who does needs to shot.

It can get thematically complex, but never plot-wise. AT doesn't even have an overarching plot to speak of.

>simon and war stories
This is what I'm talking about by fan expectations. Simon and Marcy was a fantastic episode that told us all we need to know about their relationship. It was its own nice little story, and they never attempted to turn it into anything more. But for whatever reason some people expected it to be turned into a huge thing.

>now they have and the show lost all of it's steam
I can't help but feel this was easily avoidable. Like really easily avoidable, actually, they just needed to pick up an interesting plot and not dump it off after five fucking milliseconds to go back to Finn pining over romance.

Finn's Dad could have been neat as fuck but they turned that into a "let go" message and even now, we STILL don't know where he is or why he acted like a dickhead.
The Lich and Enchiridion was half neat half asspull but was too little too late for what it ended up being, especially given how big a threat the Lich was being played up as. I mean shit, we could've had multiversal adventures with Finn and Jake chasing the BillyLich but no, better resolve that shit in two episodes.
Orgalorg seemed pretty good on paper but I don't think it really worked as well as it could have done.

Also I dunno if I can really call the romance plot-heavy (and I know bitching about it is overplayed) but we really could've done without it. Every time I think of it I can remember a quote from a writer about wanting to see Finn eating dirt and I don't understand why he thought anyone wanted to see that.

We know where Martin is, he's an eternal observer space thing now.

But this is the exact opposite of what we needed. We needed less plot, not a single expanding plot.

>No one ever asked for that
where have you been?

>We needed less plot, not a single expanding plot.
That's a different argument, and I'm not agreeing or disagreeing. I'm just saying that to not fuck this up seems like it really could've been simpler.

when did you give up on Adventure Time?
I'd say probably Lemonhope

>we STILL don't know where he is or why he acted like a dickhead.
Uh do you watch the show?
He ascended to another plane of existence and was how he is because he was always a conman and getting separated from his family turned him into a legitimately awful person who was a criminal, plus it's pretty clear he took one too many knocks to the head and has mental problems because of it

They turned it into a huge thing.

They connected the two characters in a very awkward episode with a backstory that wasn't interesting for anything other than the questions it brought up. They made the Ice King into Simon. They brought his wife into the present. They made the lich come from a bomb for some reason. They connected the Ice King and Marcy this bomb. They made a bunch of zombies roam the earth. They told us Marceline met a bunch of humans while hunting vampires. They told us Finn had some magical destiny. They made Finn more than just a normal heroic boy. They introduced the elementals. They told us Finn's dad was out there. They told us he was a galactic criminal dangerous enough to trapped in a space prison. They had him escape and not come up for 2 seasons. They opened up every single question the fans want answered.

The writers have attempted to connect things and explain backstories that never needed to be explained. And all expectations for this show stemmed from that. It'd be ridiculously ignorant of this show's progression to think viewers (widely) have asked this show to do anything beyond satisfactorily answer questions it brought up. What part of what they expect is unreasonable?

>Simon n Marcy
Fucking what?

Apart from it had some of the best designs of the show.

There was literally no one who asked about Simon and Marcy's backstory before I Remember You.

No one who asked about why the Bomb made the lich until after they showed the Lich come from the bomb.

No one asked why Finn's dad was in the prison until they showed Finn's dad in the prison.

No one who asked about Finn's reincarnation biz until they showed Finn's incarnations

Because these weren't dynamics that existed until the show itself brought them up.

When you bring up things that are odd people expect explanations

Debatable. All of that.

But it had one of the worst endings imaginable. There can be no other way to describe what was essentially a deus ex machina solving the problem of the entire miniseries requiring nothing of Finn, the Ice King or Betty.

The Betty problem was resolved by Ice King in seconds in an incredibly boring/disappointing way.

season 3 season 4 whatever dude
Holly Jolly Secrets was season 3 though
and season 2 had the Lich King 2 parter

At the very least you can't say that Elements wasn't the most visually interesting thing AT has done so far.
And Finn came up with the entire idea, LSP wouldn't have done anything without his suggestions. Saving the day is moreso on him than her.

You went way off topic, but okay.

>that wasn't interesting for anything other than the questions it brought up.
It brought up that Simon and Marcy knew each other, and then detailed their past relationship in Simon and Marcy.
>They brought his wife into the present.
Yeah, and now they're dealing with that plot thread.
>They told us Finn had some magical destiny. They made Finn more than just a normal heroic boy.
No, you missed the point. Reincarnation isn't unique to Finn, anyone could've taken up the Comet's offer, as did his dad. He is just a normal heroic boy.
>They opened up every single question the fans want answered.
And they've answered them, or are answering them now.

>What part of what they expect is unreasonable?
When they want the show to have a linear overarching storyline, because that's not what Adventure Time is about, and it never was.

>No one who asked about why the Bomb made the lich until after they showed the Lich come from the bomb.
people always questioned the apocalyptic stuff since the beginning it's in the fucking opening. people wondered what caused the apocalypse.
>No one asked why Finn's dad was in the prison until they showed Finn's dad in the prison.
people always wondered who finn's human parents were
>No one who asked about Finn's reincarnation biz until they showed Finn's incarnations
people always wondered who that ghost that eventually became Shoko
>Because these weren't dynamics that existed until the show itself brought them up.
true but people wanted adventure time to have plots when it became clear that the show had more going on with it than just candy people
>When you bring up things that are odd people expect explanations
well duh

The Lich was just an evil dude and based in what was normal for the show at that point hebcould be accepted purely as "a really powerful evil guy" The show never brought attention to his origins until later so there was no point in wondering about his origins until later.

But I was speaking specifically about the simon and marcy backstory. Not just Simon.

But yes, hjs did bring up questions about the Ice King's Origins that people would obviously have questions about.

But what are the questions that are unreasonable to want answered?

I'll just add that if you answer every little thing about the world, that takes away from the charm of it in my opinion. It's for the best that they leave some things ambiguous, like the origin of the mushroom war etc.

This entire post has the trend of the writers taking things that would be completely acceptable not to answer and expanding on them in ways that make more questions than they answer.

Wondering who his parents are is a different question from
>Why is Martin a galactic criminal, why does he treat finn like that,
>how did the human society get so authoritarian that people needed a black market of gadgets being traded for exit from the island, etc.

>Shoko
Fake ghost trick turns out to be real is such a common trope. No one ever expects a real answer.

>the show had more going on with it than just candy people
Just having a world with more to it isn't an obligation to show certain elements of it that are more confusing than what we knew before

I don't disagree that they've started trying to wrap up some of these things. But the problem is they've been sitting on the backburner for years as new problems were introduced. This is something that is frustrating to viewers, and when you take so long to reference it, it gets tedious, people stop expecting answers.

But some of the answers have been downright boring. Like elements with LSP.

Also, Finn is a reincarnation of the comet in one of it's older forms.

I disagree, I think a glitch is a glitch holds that title.

Also, it's more so that there was no build up to this. No hints. No call back to previously in the show. It wasn't difficult to do, or at least the show didn't portray it well enough to make it seem like it was.

It wasn't a clever solution.

>I think a glitch is a glitch holds that title.
Fair enough, thought I thought Food Chain was better than Glitch and Elements better than both.

And it's a bit of a stretch, but there are small bits and pieces of stuff from the rest of the show that make the ending more believable.
In LSP's first episode she bites Jake and it's shown that Lumpy people can turn others Lumpy, and that's just a thing that the show never talked about again, but it makes a bit more sense with this because it's like when that happens the lumps are taking over the other elemtns composing those people's forms.
And there's the fact that Lumpy Space is a different dimension entirely, not connected to Ooo itself, so them being the anti-elemental and LSP being immune is made more believable.

It isn't much, but they connected the new shit pretty decently imo.

The bite thing was explained as vampire rules. And Lumpy space is not unique in being another dimension based on Prismo and Lich stuff we've seen. I don't think any of that properly justifies this. Nor the way it happened in the episode. It was just kind of realized and then done.

>The bite thing was explained as vampire rules.
Werewolf rules actually, but even then it makes no sense. Lumpy space people aren't werewolves or vampires, and Elements did help explain this a bit more.
And Lumpy Space isn't the only place out there, there's also shit like the Crystal Dimension, but it works by showing that they're foreign to Ooo and since they're foreign and made up of different shit they aren't affected by the stuff and was able to change it.

It doesn't totally work, and I agree that the resolution was mostly just "Oh shit it's the last episode well hit the back to normal button" but I think it's a little better than what you're saying.

My point wasn't that it makes no sense. Just that it's completely out of nowhere.

I stopped watching adventure time on the episode where PB is reborn as a little girl, how far am I from catching up?

]
Not a great episode
But there's only been like 3 seasons since then, so it wouldn't take long to catch up.

At this point like, literally 170 or so episodes have aired. They are only 11 minutes a pop, but that's still a lot of fucking stuff dude. You've been off the train for like 7 years.

>only 3 seasons
You say that as if those seasons haven't all been larger than the old 26 episode seasons the show used to do, and it's actually been 5 or 6 depending on which season we're on now. That guy has a lot to go through, like 30 hours of content or some shit.

>30 hours
That's less than 2 days.

And good chunks of 5/6/7 are skippable.

Are you gonna watch them all in a fuckin marathon man? It's a lot of content.
If you're gonna just chop the show up I don't see the point in bothering to catch up, people who are into AT for the plot are those that are the least satisfied by it.

Yeah, but you can also cut out the plot episodes and just watch the good episodes where they have actual adventures instead of emo drama or orgalorg nonsense.

Also, yes you can marathon it, but also it takes less than a week to not marathon, you can watch 2 hours a day for 5 days and have only 20 hours left than watch 10 hours each day on the weekend and be done.

Or if you have more spare time on weekdays you can watch more then.

Or hell 2 weeks isn't that long to split it up either.

Nah, the problem is that you are one of those autistic, no imagination, 'can't fill in the blanks and connect the dots' little shits that ruined contemporary media with their wiki-riddled 'deep lore' bullshit demands.

Protip: not every single minor character's bathroom habits need to be explicitly addressed in order to make a satisfying story.

>just watch the good episodes
All 5 of them past season 4?

But seriously that seems dumb to me but whatever, people enjoy the show different ways.

I think a lot of the butthurt is because of watching through the years. I marathoned the whole thing in a week or so and really enjoyed it. I wonder though, if that's just because I got all the plot stuff all at once. I never had to wait for an answer to anything and could just keep going. idk I just feel like I really enjoyed the show and had a ton of fun with it but here are all these people shitting on it now. Maybe since I didn't have to marinate on it for 8 years I'm not as mad?

Butthurts not an accurate word

Well, yes, there are years between first seeing Martin and then him leaving with the comet. Even longer between that and finding out why he left Finn.

But also because a lot of the plot points are just boring and unsatisfactory. Most of the answers are incredibly dull and would have been better left unanswered.

Episodes like Finn the Human and Jake the Dog end up not actually mattering and even when the implications of the episode are brought up again it still pretty much doesn't matter, and there are many examples of this throughout the series.

Some character arcs are just annoying. Some character arcs leave the characters less interesting than they were prior. The overall tone of the show changes dramatically.

It's probably more of a case of you having lowered standards of quality.

Maybe I shouldn't have said butthurt because that implies that I'm making fun of or are in some way being a dick. I just meant it as an easy way to say dissatisfied fans of the past. Let's not start name calling or saying that I or anyone else has 'low standards of quality' because that's just shorthand for 'your a dummy and I'm superior' or at least, that's what it feels like you're saying. I would like to ask you what plot points were boring, and which character arcs were annoying? Keeping in mind that I watched everything at once so if I didn't like a particular thing (that was pretty rare) I only had to wait ten minutes.
We are probably not going to agree in the end, but I'd like to hear your opinion regardless.

Nope. Adventure Time was and will always be garbage, and all their "mini-series" is a vain attempt to capture what SU and other shows now has dominated.

Also Finn is still a cuck.

>because that's just shorthand for 'your a dummy and I'm superior'
I didn't mean that at all, just that some people are more willing to accept faults and enjoy something despite them than others.

>What plot points were boring
>The Simon and Marcy backstory
Besides adding almost nothing to the character it was nothing but a kind of cliche zombie apocalypse story, which when compared to the rest of the show seems tame in comparison, in fact it's the way the show started off, they zombies were even similar visually, it felt like nothing came of the episodes surrounding it, besides the years between then and the most recent special, which just had Betty sent to Mars because Ice King kicked a thing. It was a lot of build up to nothing. Nothing about the world changed because of this, nothing about Ice King changed because of this. Prior to the episode I remember you, Marcelline never seemed to be hung up about this, the show didn't continue to build up Marceline and Ice King's relationship beyond more than like 3 episodes so it was hard to feel like it was really even important to the characters in-world so it didn't end up becoming important as a viewer.
There are too many others to write about every single one.

>which character arcs were annoying
I could talk about the common one as far as the Finn arc, but something I think is ignored is
>Cinnamon Bun
The character was used as a comedy tool for a lot of the series, and he did this relatively well, such as in the episode where FnJ had to deliver the pastries for Bubblegum and sent him with "fake" ones as a distraction. Having that incompetent character accomplish what FnJ didn't made it seem funnier and less dire that they messed up
For character development to work, it has to be built up over time, but more importantly it should come as a welcome change to the viewers. Cinnabuns arc was neither of those things, it happened almost immediately despite none of his concerns being displayed prior to the ep

1

2

because the change happens so fast it seems to have cinnabun acting out of character a process that is instant, instead of growing as a person, a process that takes time. He's shown being incredibly moronic but almost immediately gains level of competence never displayed before in his transition to the fire kingdom and in later episodes. His connection to FP seemed incredibly forced, simply for the sake of being rid of her character, and there were much better ways of going about that.

Cinnabun past that point isn't anymore likable, funny, or charming past that point, maybe even less so, going from a somewhat of a comic relief (if it can even be called that in a comedy cartoon), to somewhat of an asshole, or at least kind of rude or unpleasant guy.

It's not an upgrade in any way.

adventure time was done before stakes came out. stakes WAS kind of pointless, but it is a cartoon.

REGARDLESS, it had a lot of great moments

file erased [i am drunk]
oops this is islands but still....

my opinion stands.

it was mostly for girls, but it had its moments, mostly jake though.

>His connection to FP seemed incredibly forced, simply for the sake of being rid of her character, and there were much better ways of going about that.

i agree with that, but to me it seemed like more of a comedy thing. maybe i have a weird sense of humor.

fack
too distracted.


this one image proves islands is worthy.

>not a great episdoe
eat shit