The Amazing Spiderman movies shyed away from the source marital and tried to pander to multiple audiences

>The Amazing Spiderman movies shyed away from the source marital and tried to pander to multiple audiences
>Got criticized greatly
>Spiderman Homecoming did the exact same thing
>everyone loves it
What changed?

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the Raimi films are not the source material

>everyone loves it
You mean rotten tomatoes?The same ones that gave wonder woman a 92/91 score?Because Sup Forums and Sup Forums are not "loving it"

Because the ASM movies are bad as actual movies.

Criticism over accuracy to the source material and criticism of the actual film quality are two separate discussions.

Marvel Studios.

Homecoming had personality and charm, didn't feel like a rehash, and didn't set up a million spin-offs that will never happen, which in turn made it a more fulfilling standalone movie.

mcu disney shills

I'm not talking about he Rami movies.
Amazing Spiderman (more specifically 2) was a disaster considering that you had Sony trying to reinvent Spiderman as this cool hipster and failing to make everything more edgy in reaction to the Dark Knight movies.
Spiderman Homecoming was a bastardization of Spidermna and the supporting cast like making Flash into a an athletic manlet, and making Spiderman being an ironfag.

The ASM movies were overstuffed and had no real direction

Homecoming was good but people need to calm down about it being 94% out of 100%.

This may sound nit picky
1. So a salvage crew went from salvaging to running crazy alien weaponry, with no one on their ass
2. How the hell does a guy, with no knowledge that we know of you know just master Alien Tech by himself
3. The effects are the are pretty bad, this has bene a trend for most comic book movies
4. Vulture was okay, by MCU standards he's "great" but in reality he had one good scene with him threatening Peter
5. Maybe it was just me but I couldn't see a damn thing of the fight scene with Vulture on the Plane. It was Dark, clouds in the way, ALOT of quick cuts

Side note, if you watched even the first trailer the first hour feels like a drag because you already saw 90% of those scenes.

Again, film quality has nothing to do with accuracy.

The ASM movies could be about an OC donut steel called The Supreme Spider-Guy and they wold still be shit films in a vacuum. ASM 1 is a weak remake of the first Raimi film with all the personality stripped out and the sequel is an unqualified disaster, 2.5 hours of setup for sequels with no story to call its own.

Implying that shying away from the source material is why ASM failed

>shoddy at best supervillain motivations
>shoehorned in green goblin
>poorly designed villains
>dubstep boss battle
>Rehashing the origin story

Cmon user we both know you're not trying to start a discussion

Here's your (you) you wanted so bad buddy, don't spend it all at once

>>"Do you enjoy the Washington Monument?"
>>"I can't enjoy something made by slaves"
>>Crowd starts whooping loudly
>>Black women start crying tears of joy.
>>Black men stand up "THAT HOW IT IS! THAT HOW IT IS!"
>>Jay Z starts playing in the back of the theater
>>The smell of weed fills the room.
>>Car drives through the wall of the theater, starts bouncing

Well Raimi deviated in just as many ways, so I guess nothing changed except Spider-Man gets to play with the Avengers now.

Also I never hated ASM for deviating from either the comics or the Raimi films.

Are you a Pentacles or Coins, man?

-Existing new fanbase with Spidey already appearing in Civil War
-ASM was more interested in setting up it's cinematic universe than telling a story which everybody could see while Homecoming already exists in one so it doesn't have the problem

It was basically presented as a brazen cash grab and marketing didn't do them any favors when they focussed exploding the two movies they had into a cinematic universe before anyone in the audience ever asked for it.
It was shoddily stitched together from focus testing nonsense and corporate mandate and that just didn't amount to good movies.
Rehashing stuff we had seen a few years prior certainly did not help them, either.
Nor did spamming the least interesting villains or shoehorning in a plot about his parents.

My 15 and 16 year old sons went to see the movie last night. Both hated it. they said it was like watching a Saturday afternoon Disney channel movie. They used a lot of unflattering teenage slang to basically call it lame and corny. both said entire sections are completely boring. Both said Spiderman is okay except when he talks then his voice ruins every scene. I agree with Hollands voice. Its very annoying. I doubt I watch it because my kids are usually spot-on with their cape movie opinions.

scene was a little strange but I believe a high schooler would do and say that.
high schoolers are rebellious, the MJ character who said it was loner type academic who would talk back against a teacher
It was strange but not out of character or outside of reality, whatever
Probably just not a well-executed scene if people are complaining about it, I'd understand that

nothing you just said is true

I don't think your Wife's sons' dad would appreciate you lying about his children, user.

>1. So a salvage crew went from salvaging to running crazy alien weaponry, with no one on their ass
>2. How the hell does a guy, with no knowledge that we know of you know just master Alien Tech by himself
this and a couple of other small things is what drags it down from that 94% for me

I usually roll with pentacles just because Rider Waite was my first deck. I always thought the two are synonymous. Is there any significance to the verbage used? Wands vs staves etc

What did they think of BvS then?

>What changed?

The former was made purely so Sony could hold onto the rights and had no care for telling a decent story be particularly creative in mind. The latter was made, begrudgingly, because the former was a critical disappointment and was, mostly, put into the hands of people who actually did care about telling a decent story and be creative with the character.

...

>not realizing that comic book movie criticism can be basically boiled down to favoritism at this point
Marvel Studios can do no wrong.

this

The Tinker has always been crazy smart at developing tech though, and considering he had nearly a decade to learn about how to apply alien tech to human tech I wasn't too bothered by this. And not long after Damage Control ducked everyone out of their jobs the Hydra incident happened, Vulture made a big deal about staying under the radar, given everything that was happening in the world it's not so unbelievable that they were able to remain cautiously hidden.

People who complain about that line are insecure white cucks

Movie got 92% from this alone

youtube.com/watch?v=Br1qIyKWFp0

Thats like saying red paint smells like blue paint. The difference is one wasn't produced by the people who think they can kickstart a Spider-Man universe without Spider-Man. It has nothing to do with anything else, anyone can rewrite a story but better.

this

I have never read a spider man comic in my life, and they provided none of this backstory, so to me it looked like a random salvage crew stole alien tech and was able to build crazy gadget seemingly out of nothing, which felt really goofy and weird.

I think most people would over look Tinker, he's not exactly the most compelling of characters, and they never made an effort to make sure you knew who he was. Still, super glad they tossed him in the mix, he's what made Vulture's entire crew possible.

>1. They kept it low key up until peter found it. According to the movie there was still alien tech being moved around so it's not hard to believe that they could run it where there are possibly numerous other people running it too.

>2. Guy was goofing around with it during the intro. It's totally possible he would learned it a bit more after 8 years. And the fact he was the tinkerer.

>3. yeah

>4. agree

>5. there was alot more happening there than what the trailer showed.

Is Sup Forums nothing but newfags and contrarian dipshits at this point? Homecoming was a good movie even without the mcu brand name you faggots keep screeching about or the capeshit formula. ASM1&2 weren't. Just fucking leave it at that, go do something else.


>I have never read a spider man comic in my life

Here it is.

I do have this epic reaction image though

Mouse PR

It was a well executed quip, Sup Forums is just going Sup Forums about it

In capeshit if a character is good with technology they are unbelievably amazing at technology. Didn't you see the fat Lego kid hacking Tony Stark's Spiderman suit in a single afternoon?

I do like how that scene was mostly played for laughs and wasn't a huge defining character trait.

Do they think Civil War is the best Marvel movie?

That's not how RT scores work. The 94% means 94% of reviewers thought it was a good movie. The actual score is something like 7.7/10.

As if Sup Forums and Sup Forumss opinion on anything matters.

Trying to explain how RT scoring works to people huh? You're a brave one.

>94% out of 100%.
>drags it down from that 94% for me

dummies

>ges buried under rubble
>starts to cry

hahaha gay! Who writes this shit?

Homecoming:

>"You know what? Let's use some of the stable of characters that never get used. People have seen enough Harry Osborn and Gwen Stacy. How about Ned Leeds? Let's keep this street level, no sky lasers this time, he's just a kid. Also, we have the option to use Iron Man, we're going to do that, no argument. Let's address the elephant in the room, New York should not be filled with 99% white people. People will like this or hate this, just so long as it's not a Spiderman story people have seen on the screen already, no Green Goblin."

Amazing Spiderman:

>What if we replaced nerdy Peter with a cool high school guy stereotype? Let's replace his personality with a stereotypical hero's journey type. Let's let him have 'female character die to further his character development' moment, no one's tired of that. I know, that's supposed to happen years down the line when you're comfortable, but it doesn't change the narrative if this happens second movie, right? You know who we should make the villian? Green Goblin, I'm pretty sure a few years is enough time for people to be ready for a fresh take, but not too different, we don't want to confuse audiences. Let's give this character who has never had a destiny, maybe was created as a critique on destiny characters, some other character's destiny story arc! Let's do the exact same Uncle Ben death. No changes. How about if Peter had some other character's weird Paren't mystery? Even though Peter's parent's have always been dead and that's an important detail, what if they were alive?

Basically, all the stuff Amazing contributed was either 'the exact same thing the Tobey movies did' or 'we took parts of this beloved character and overwrote them with focus group approved character archetypes and stereotypes. Homecoming isn't perfect, but at least it's trying.

>replacing Peter with Steve Urkel is a good thing

Said no one, because only a moron would compare this Peter to Steve Urkel?

You're right, he's more like Steven Universe.

/thread

Ned isn't Ned from the comics though, literally everything about him is different. Don't act like they're drawing from the source material when they make Ned an obese Asian hacker high schooler. Meanwhile, ASM nailed Gwen and Captain Stacey, they're almost straight from Stan's stories.

And even though Uncle Ben was a rehash, but at least he exists. In the MCU I don't think he's even a character, Peter never brings up his lessons and May is ready to hop on Tony's dick.

>Peter mentions how he doesn't want to stress May out after everything that's happened to her recently
>May tells Peter that she doesn't like or trust Tony while they are at dinner
Really rotates the wheel

She's just tsundere for Uncle Tony.

>Kevin Feige is too scared to even mention Ben's name
>MCU babies eat up vague references

Feige is a smart guy user. He just doesn't want to scare the little kids watching Iron Man 4. My nephew, age 5 was able to watch the movie because of his smart decision.

The first bit actually seems to happen a lot in the MCU; two examples I can think of at the moment are the Judas Bullets and the Tesseract weapon from Slingshot.

Do we HONESTLY need to dedicate any amount of time to that though? Spider-Man's origin story is just as well known as Batman's, you can stand in a crowd of people, throw a rock in any direction and whoever it hit would probably be able to sum up their origins. As much as I don't want to bring up Martha I feel like the only reason why we had to see the Wayne's killed again was so that line at the end wouldn't feel anymore out of place. What would having them mention Ben's name or the fact that he was killed have brought to the movie that the general audience can't already figure out?

Why didn't Pete have to register? Did I miss something in Avengers 2.5?

Because he's not an Avenger. Also because nobody gives a shit about him because he's useless without Uncle Tony.

One minor problem I had with Homecoming is that it felt like Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. in the sense that they wouldn't stop shoving MCU references in your face in order to insist that, yes, this is set in the same universe. I understand Marvel and Sony want to celebrate their partnership but it was a bit obnoxious at times.

>implying anyone was watching the movie for Spiderboy
People only came to see for the references.

fucking this lol

I was just there for spiderkid

>What changed?
Execution.
Sup Forums's too autistic to understand that ideas aren't good or bad, their implementation is what matters. Movie threads seem to double down on this particular brand autism.

t. Holland.

Sup Forums and Sup Forums are filled with racist misognists. Their opinions are irrelevant

>Again, film quality has nothing to do with accuracy.
This is false. A capeshit adaptation is what it is. It adapts from a capeshit source material. It doesn't spontaneously exist from a vacuum. Because of this, you HAVE to take into account how well it adapts its source material. At least to some degree. It's a balance of judging the adaptation as a film on its own merits, but also ackmowledging how successfully it adapts from the source.

>1. So a salvage crew went from salvaging to running crazy alien weaponry, with no one on their ass
They explain how.
No big public displays, no code names, no masks. As soon as First Shocker starts blowing cars up to show off the guns he gets chewed out, booted, and killed for drawing attention onto the crew.

>What changed?
the logo

Please return to tumblr.

It wasn't "standalone" for sure. Everything is something caused by the avengers and feels like prepared to do the sequel.

>B-but it's FUN, do you hate FUN? Stop being a mad virgin and laugh more :^)

>Because Sup Forums and Sup Forums are not "loving it"
yes we are or do you not actually pay attention to what's going on around here

the only people who don't love this movie are either DC shitposters who wouldn't know a good movie if their life depended on it and people who haven't seen it

I felt that creating a cinematic universe (like Nolan did with 3 movies) is easier than nerf the character so Avengers can look "cool&awesome"

Nolan's movies are not a "cinematic universe". They're a single series with a setting used only in that series.

But I thought everyone that wears a mask and had capabilities had to register. Again I could be wrong I watched it once and forgot damn near everything that happened in it. Also how was this below Avengers pay grade when it's a masked super going about. Why did Tony still have automated suits when the Ultron event happened?
Overall this movie was pretty ok, but some nitpicky stuff adds up for me.

their opinions aren't irrelevant because of that. no one cares what they have to say because they're all shitposters and contrarians. everyone who posts here is, even you and me.

how did they shy away from the source material again?

Because it's very true to what the core of Spider-man is

Every fucking adaptation changes things. All the cartoons did. Even critically lauded stuff like BTAS did.

>doesn't include himself in the everything despite supposedly having a great relationship with his uncle as a surrogate father
Fascinating.

One day they'll learn, right? Right?

>Because Sup Forums and Sup Forums are not "loving it"

Sup Forums and Sup Forums "not loving" something is actually a promising recommendation. Still not going to see this though, the MCU will get no more money from me.

>very true to what the core of Spider-man is

Yeah, black MJ with unwashed hair making deadpan comments about slaves building the Washington monument is straight out of the classic comics.

I think the movie made the right choice avoiding the origin and Uncle Ben, but that's such an important part of Peter's character that it did feel a bit awkward to me without it. I'd like for the sequel to at least mention Ben a bit, even though we don't need to rehash his death in full or pull a Spidey 3.

Mary Jane Watson was aware of social matters in her earlier comics and came from a disadvantaged home

her hair is fine

but even if those things weren't true she's hardly the first major character to be heavily changed from one media to the next and be accepted by the general public

You can't bring everything from comics to movies, games, etc. so people just bring the "basic" stuff. In Homecoming they don't bring basic stuff, they SHIT on the basic stuff and change some other things that are not used so often

you can absolutely feel Ben's influence in this movie, both in how overprotective May is and in the scene where Toomes tells Peter to walk away and Peter knows full well that he can't

they just don't make a big deal out of it because it makes no sense for characters to go "as you know" to each other about that shit

>accepted by the general public
what's the difference between a racist and someone too afraid to speak their mind?

what "basic stuff" do they shit on? Besides Mary Jane Watson and Flash Thompson's "white purity"?

Yeah, that's fair.

>The Amazing Spiderman movies shyed away from the source material
It didn't tho. It was the most accurate by using homages and montages.

In my humble opinion, TASM series is not objectively bad.

They are well structured movies, and even with the supposed "executive meddling with the script", the director and cretive team did a good job showing their style. I like Marc Webb's "music clip" style of action and editing. The characters were fresh, the acting was good, the universe was coherent, etc.

Peopel bash the movies as if it's shit or not well done. The movies didn't have too many villains, and every other criticism we see around here is plain wrong. It's just that people didn't like the movies and try to reason why by bashing technical aspects of it.

The reason why they didn't like it is because it's a bad Spider-man story.

Yes, the best aspects of Spider-man, and what defines the character, is his struggle to live a normal life anf be spider-man at the same time. Although Raimi's movies were huge cringey technical garbage with ilogical plot points and useless characters that didn't act like human beings, the story managed to reach that core aspect of Peter trying to still have friends and a normal life whilst dealing with street level crime. That's spider-man.

TASM seres tried to adapt a greater story arch. An uninteresting story arch, with boring plot points, boring twist, and it stole the time from seein ANYTHING from Peter's social life. Not a coincidence that the first movie was better perceived, since it had more moments like that, and not a coincidence that the romance was praised either. Those were objectively good adapted moments from what people wanted to see. All the rest was still well done, but it was not what people wanted to see. Honestly, who cares about Peter's parents and some kind of Oscorp paranoia, we want to see how this guy stops some bullies and still don't miss the train.

So there you go, OP.

>they just don't make a big deal out of it
Dude, they ignored it. They just put a Tony Stark line in his mind to give him strenght. This is not correct

>no Ben
>Flash is a pathetic bully
>Spiderman being reliant on the suit and an Ironfag
>Ned Leeds is just Ganke

they shit on spider sense

being racist?

I mean did you people feel this way when Liz Allen became hispanic in Spectacular? When Nick Fury became black? Korath? The same arguments happened with Heimdall, I know that, and this is the exact same fucking thing

they just chose not to focus on it due to other adaptations relying too much on it. He still has it.

the forced perception is the problem. that we have to have these changes or else you're racist.

You should get to know some people and read some comics