Why isn't Shazam more popular?

He gets treated like a Fucking Mid-Major by DC, and frankly I'm sick of it.

DC time and time again fails to promote him even though he has one of the best superhero and origin stories along with a unique perspective that no other superhero can really boast.

I feel like the DC writers put almost no effort into his books, they give him no good villains except Black Adam who is a Top 5 overall DC villain, but that is all he gots!

He's not just a face, and he needs to start getting a push, especially if he has a movie on the way. The Rock just can't carry him. And he is NOT A FUCKING COPY OF SUPERMAN! You MotherFuckers you!

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the real question is why isnt mary marvel more popular?

Because DC worked to bury him for decades only for new nostalgic writers to bring him back anyway but now theres a whole generational gap of people who didn't know who he is so there isn't the same level of "iconic" other heroes have.

If he had a TV show in the 80s or early 90s with a toyline he could have been an A lister.

>Shazam
His name is, and will always be, Captain Marvel.
Fuck that ugly dyke.
Fuck marvel.
Billy is a more interesting and developed character as a child then she is as a full grown woman.

Why would you expect the Wizard to be popular?

>I feel like the DC writers put almost no effort into his books, they give him no good villains except Black Adam who is a Top 5 overall DC villain, but that is all he gots!
Huh? Mr. Mind, Black Adam and Sivana have been huge villains in the DCU for a long time. Marvel Jr, Mary Marvel, Black Adam, Isis and Osiris were all major characters up until Final Crisis.

And Cap hasn't had that many books but they've always put their top talent on him: Roy Thomas, Alex Ross, Jeff Smith, Jerry Ordway, Geoff Johns, Grant Morrison, there's not a single Captain Marvel work post-Crisis that didn't have a big name on it.

Probably the only weird thing is that he got a big push around the time of the Injustice fighting game, which was when the movie finally got into pre-production, and then it immediately petered out. The popular theory is that Johns and Gary Frank currently have "dibs" on him but haven't had time to actually get a project out, and they don't trust anyone else to do it.

They need to just put Jeff Parker and Doc Shaner on it and let him get big again.

I got some reasons. 1. writers focus on his "flying brick" powerset instead of his wisdom,lighting powers more. 2. he has no notable villians besides black adam and docter sivanna.

>blaming Marvel when it's DC who stopped Fawcett from making anymore Captain Marvel comics in the first place and allowing Marvel to grab the trademark

I don't understand why you're getting so upset over Carol when she didn't even exist at the time that DC lost the trademark to Marvel.

Jeff Parker seems like a good fit for most of the "just launch it already" DC books.

Captain Marvel, JSA, and Legion of Super-Heroes would all be great under him.

Isn't Parker just doing Future Quest right now? It pains me so much that he isn't being hired for more.

I wish he was doing the Terrifics instead of Lemire.

They're also all things Johns is notoriously protective of. Coincidence?!

Parker on anything usually feels like Johns at his best.
Aquaman made that really clear.

Johns's Aquaman was pretty cool, then Parker takes his place and the whole thing is instantly kicked up a notch.
Fucking absurd that they replaced him with Bunn, and so soon.

It's DCs fault for suing and killing Fawcett because they were butthurt that Billy sold more than Supes and then sitting on the name and not printing his book until the trademark ran out

Because Marvelman is better in every way.

Get out of the way faggot, real hero coming through!

>And he is NOT A FUCKING COPY OF SUPERMAN! You MotherFuckers you!
No, he pretty blatantly was intended as such. Luckly his comics had new ideas from the start and went in a fairly different direction from the start and he was basically a silver age character born in the golden age.

Nobody fucking cares anymore, Marvel.

I thought it was Miracleman

Moore's interpretation of him made for a stellar self-contained story with a clear beginning and end, but beyond that you can't do much without getting into edge-for-the-sake-of-edge trash like "look mom, no face!" Sentry/Void, who himself was just a poorman's Marvel Man handled by a worse writer.

Marvel got spooked by the Cannibal Corpse cover art scenes and wanted to distance themselves from the comic, so they changed his name.

Calm down, he's getting a DCEU movie in 2019 before other characters.

REAL question of the thread:

Why the fuck did they rename him 'Shazam'? That's the name of the wizard. Why not name him Captain Thunder, like he was in Flashpoint? I thought that was a pretty good moniker

Have you guys read Alan Moore's twilight of the superheroes? Is it available anywhere? I know Dc doesn't want anyone to read it, but I know it should be somewhere.

People don't like magic

Because they'd already been releasing all of his comics under the "Shazam" names for decades and thus it has more brand name value.

Easy question, they couldn't use Captain Marvel but Shazam was a name/word people were already familiar with and strongly associated with the character. Captain Thunder? Means nothing to the masses.

Captain Shazam would've been better though.

>Captain Thunder
thats a shitty name, it sounds like something a kid would-
wait no that actually works. I kinda like it

Or just keep calling him Captain Marvel.

Kids in the 70's had no problem with it.
My mother still remembers his name from watching the TV show that ended four decades ago.

Not enough cartoons about him nowadays. That's what gets you popularity.

I'm pretty sure "Captain Thunder" was his original name anyways, at least in the concept stage of his development. I've always kind of had a soft spot for that moniker too, just in the fact that it kinda highlights his whimsical golden age roots, and like said; I could plausibly imagine a kid thinking up that name themselves.

They probably don't want him to outshine Supes like how Wally isn't allowed to outshine Barry.

Well, that's fucking wrong since Gaiman continued the series.

I absolutely fucking love Captain Marvel. Especially in Young Justice and other incarnations where its hilariously obvious its just a kid piloting a Superman body.

That and I love how he yells "SHAZAM!" with like the echoing effect and everything. And he attacks with his transformation sequence!

>He transforms by being hit by lightning
>Sometimes he picks people up and letting them get hit instead.

Its like if Sailor Moon picked up her backdrop and beat someone with it.

I'm just waiting for the /ss/ situations he might get in.

1. hes canonically stronger than superman, and DC higher ups dont really want their main draw being shown as weaker
2. theyve been moving away from magic for a while now, and moving more onto space stuff
3. hes more important to the canon than he was before, but shows up a LOT less
4. black adam is being shown as more of an anti-hero recently so theres nobody to really stand up to him so it would require actual original content that would be interesting to draw him back in
5. theres no room for him on any of the main teams, and hes far too strong to be on a B. list team

Any good comics with this guy?
I loved his introduction in the 2011 Justice league comics and thought he was neat.

He was Captain Marvel until the new52.

the wizard is dead you apes, he's the new guardian of the rock and the name was passed to him

There's some big shit coming up and Captain Marvel will play a major role in. I'm not an insider of anything but it's gon b gud

the fact theyre bringing out a shazam movie AND a black adam movie, i believe it

His name was but DC didn't hold the trademark. So if they made toys or movies of him they could never put his name on the cover. It was changed with the New 52 because they realized with superhero movies being the new hotness they couldn't afford to market a character they didn't own the trademark to.

DC would have changed the name at that point even if Marvel hadn't had a living character called Captain Marvel in decades.

Yeah. I love Captain Marvel but this guy has the right of it; he's a kid who turns into Superman. That was the entire premise and it (quickly) spun into something to separate it from the source, especially with the angle of Billy gifting his powers to others. Add in a talking tiger, a shitheaded mad scientist that you will *never* have a problem rooting against, magical hijinx and all the classic elements leaves Shazam/Marvel/Billy standing on their own. Shit, don't they even have a bunny Marvel?

I think Captain Thunder as a moniker's nice, since like some other user said it's something a kid would come up with, but unless it's failed in the past and I don't know about it, I really kinda think that going back to the original point --he's a kid who can become Superman-- would *remain* a great way to bring in an audience even today.

>no Golden Age Shazam omnibus

>Why isn't Shazam more popular?

- He grates with the modern DC shared universe.
- Writers that want to write the character just want to recapture the nostalgic atmosphere of his classic tales.
- The 30+ year gap in his publication history from the 1940's tot he 1970s means that the character never grew or evolved outside of his golden age storytelling, making him difficult to fit into a modern shared universe because no one knows how Captain Marvel "works" in a shared universe.
- Writers that try to reinvent the character are usually rejected by fans.
- He got renamed "Shazam" and that is one of the most awful superhero names ever.
- Geoff Johns's retake on the character, which is the mandated canon version, would be perfectly charming as an ongoing, but the giant Marvel Family Power Rangers team WHO ALL LIVE IN THE SAME HOUSE is a nightmare to write and other writers don't know how to deal with them and are afraid to innovate solutions because they're Johns's baby.
- Captain Marvel Junior's classic stories were all revenge fantasies with heavily racist overtones. ALL OF THEM. WITHOUT EXCEPTION.
- Captain Marvel is in the public domain which means that management isn't really behind making the concept work without heavy revisioning so they 'own' it.
- Existing Captain Marvel fans don't want him revisioned.

It's a chicken-and-the-egg problem. No one knows how to start changing the character, so no one does it.

>Armageddon has arrived

I would love to buy a print version of the Monster Society of Evil arc.

It has failed in the past, twice: before DC had the rights to Captain Marvel they actually had a Captain Marvel standin named Willie Fawcett AKA Captain Thunder, this was actually what the Flashpoint version was based on and parts of it were carried over into New 52 Shazam.

Then in the early 80's they were planning on changing Captain Marvel's name to Captain Thunder.

The biggest problem is that Captain Thunder a really generic name that is similar to a multitude of pulp characters and film serial characters and even DC characters like Johnny Thunder, but it's probably too generic to trademark, if it's even available as a trademark. I'm sure every possible variation of "Captain ____" has been trademarked or attempted to be trademarked at this point.

So you have a problem here of whether you should put the character's actual name on the cover but that you still don't own the trademark to, or to put a word that isn't the character's name but that you DO own the trademark to and that at least has some name recognition value with the Shazam/Isis show that was popular in the 70's.

Ultimately DC decided to compromise and change his name to Shazam, thereby making his name something you CAN trademark. This is actually a very good business decision in an age where movies, toys, merchandise etc. is more important than the comics themselves, it's just bad for fans of the character and his history.

Because his name is Captain Marvel.

I remember as a kid I really wanted to see her on the Young Justice team since World without Grownups but she was never used like that. DC prefers using her as sexual prey.

He is simply overshadowed by Supes.

He can never be the hero he is destined to be while on Earth (1? A? Prime? I dont even know anymore). Put Captain Marvel back on his own earth as that earth's premiere superhero

Not to mention he's supposed to be a big part of the magic side of the DCU yet gets relegated to just "Thunderbolt using superstrong hero" very frequently

Jeff Smith's miniseries is GOAT tier

Same here

>he has one of the best superhero and origin stories along with a unique perspective that no other superhero can really boast.
And he is NOT A FUCKING COPY OF SUPERMAN!

(YOU)
(YOU)
(YOU)

>Captain Marvel Junior's classic stories were all revenge fantasies with heavily racist overtones. ALL OF THEM. WITHOUT EXCEPTION.
How bad are they? Also Captain Marvel Jr. is a terrible name

archive.org/stream/TwilightOfTheSuperheroes/TwilightOfTheSuperheroes_djvu.txt
>It had all started with little Billy Batson and his problem. There he was, unwilling to give
up being human, still spending a lot of time in a child's body. The unfortunate thing was
that though little Billy's body didn't age, his mind did. Trapped in a child's body but
afflicted with adult needs, Billy went quietly... well, bats, I suppose. A lot of the problems
were sexual. Physically, Billy was not capable of normal sex and thus pretty soon began

>Captain Marvel is in the public domain

so how does that work? can i write and draw stories about him, but can't call him shazam?

>archive.org/stream/TwilightOfTheSuperheroes/TwilightOfTheSuperheroes_djvu.txt

?

Not enough kids wanted to self insert as a superhero I guess. They wanted to read about Superheroes, not read about being a Superhero.

Ok, so I havent read something of Shazam ever; Can someone recommend me something? Preferibly recent and with Adam

You can't use the names "Captain Marvel" or "Shazam" on the cover and DC will still probably sue you. You'd also have to hew close to the 40s designs that are PD

Multiversity: Thunderworld and pic related

That's what Jr was for anyway. Nobody wants to magically transform into their dad.

Well for starters you put a picture of Captain marvel and not Shazam.

This.
When a character disappears for a generation it's gonna cause problems.

The funny thing is he is only shazam on earth-0
Everywhere else he is still called captain marvel.

He was more popular than superman until DC sued his publisher

DC didn't stop Fawcett you dumb wikifag, Fawcett went down on its own at the same time the rest of the Golden age died
Captain thunder was his alternative name since the 70's. Captain marvel fans would had accepted it, Shazam on the other hand is the choice of lawyers and wb's bitchboy.

Good point. Now that we've got that figured out: Why isn't Shazam more popular?

>so how does that work? can i write and draw stories about him,
You can do that now because of fair use. Even if you used Shazam, you could get away with it. The only problem is that you couldn't make money off of the names, for obvious reasons.

Because copyright bullshit.

i would absolutely be okay with making shazam black if shaq played adult billy

Yes, they couldn't, they couldn't just put him as the name of the book. Fuck off Johnsfag

What are the new names for Mary Marvel and Marvel Jr?

I remember Marvel Jr. calling himself King Shazam in the nu52 but everything else was barely expanded upon. We haven't seen the Shazam family since their debut story

>DC didn't stop Fawcett you dumb wikifag, Fawcett went down on its own at the same time the rest of the Golden age died
DC literally sued Fawcett and stopped them from publishing Captain Marvel comics, you ignorant fuck. Brush up on your history.

>We haven't seen the Shazam family since their debut story
And it's bullshit I liked that family

this DC knows he'd be more popular than Supes if he has given more exposure so the do their best to keep him out of the limelight

That's Kazam, ya idjit

Not Shazam, those are captain marvel stories.

Didio said the comic con they were still finding the correct team for Shazam and that he's a priority

English is clearly not your first language, or you're too lazy to even read the post. Either way, fuck off.

No, DC never accomplished that and Captain marvel was published until 1953, DC sued in 41, captain marvel was never more popular, it got a few great months (when the serial came out) and that's it. DC managed to bully Fawcett, but it was dumb business decisions and the collapse of the Golden age market what killed fawcett, feel free to continue to be a wikifag.

DC can make movies and toys with the name captain marvel. Also reminder that DC almost lists its name to a fucking shoe company.

That's Kazam. For the record there's only one story about billy as Shazam and its that garbage called curse of Shazam.

Isn't Black Adam hella stronger than Shazam?

>So if they made toys or movies of him they could never put his name on the cover
The key part is "on the cover".

This is not even a debatable fact since Marvel is making a movie literally called "Captain Marvel" so they clearly own the trademark.

>No, DC never accomplished that and Captain marvel was published until 1953, DC sued in 41
Yeah, they sued in '41 and then there was barely any progress in the case until the 50s when DC won and Fawcett was forced to pay them as well as stop publishing Captain Marvel comics. This is literally history. There are books that talk all about this. Why the fuck are you trying to argue this and dismiss it with "WIKIFAGS!"?

in that case, Sup Forums should put out a 'shazam' comic.

/lit/ published a novel
Sup Forums got trump elected

this is Sup Forumss time to shine!

Because kids suck. Little children should be massacred.

Don't be an edgelord

He is a old property that they let set for too long. Kind of like the thread stated it skipped a generation. The only Shazam I have ever read is (pic related, Shazam #1 Feb 1973). To me he is just another supercape in a sea of supercapes so other than nostalgia the character will have a hard time getting popular in the modern market.

Isn't Shazam a copy of Supreme?

>- Captain Marvel Junior's classic stories were all revenge fantasies with heavily racist overtones. ALL OF THEM. WITHOUT EXCEPTION.


Ayy, it was war time. Why wouldn't they depict the Japanese as the slanty eyed bucktooth barbarians the public thought they were? Everyone was doing it.

Kazaam vs. Steel when?

>Why isn't Shazam more popular?
Marketing and the writers who would write him well either don't want to or are busy with other things.

You basically have a Mahou Shoujo with a boy and that shit writes himself.

Same shit with Amethyst. You have TWO magical children in the DC Universe running around and they don't really get used well save for a cartoon or a good story here or there.

>Mahou Shoujo with a boy
Mahou Shounen.

listen, I know said genre exists, but really we all know it better from sailor moon.

WB can make a movie named captain marvel, or toys, but dc can't publish comics.

>DC prefers using her as sexual prey.

Uh, really? Examples, please, in picture form? There is something about Mary Marvel, especially her classic look, that gets my motor going.

>accepting Nu52 bullshit

Mary Marvel seems like an incredibly moral person, that does not do things like engage in premarital sex or give blowjobs.

I kind of trust her.