What does Sup Forums think of the "cartoons are just for kids" argument?

What does Sup Forums think of the "cartoons are just for kids" argument?

youtube.com/watch?v=YxXIuVuttdg

I agree. Only a loser watches cartoons after their 13's.

They obviously are, and anyone who thinks otherwise is an actual autist. There's a reason we hide behind anonymity here (and elsewhere).

Its a stigma perpetuated by the older generations. Thankfully things are slowly changing.

>"cartoons aren't just for kids though, they're so mature and deep, bro"
>ask for an example of mature and deep cartoons
>Gravity Falls, Korra, and Steven Universe

They're changing for the worse. The younger generations are far more closed-minded about literally everything.

(And before someone says something stupid, I mean regardless of political affiliation. Once they have a certain ideology they tend to stick with it no matter what. Constructive debate is for the old.)

>ask for an example of mature and deep cartoons
>Gravity Falls, Korra, and Steven Universe
One of those is not like the others in that sense...

The younger gens don't even care about Television let alone animation. Which is leading to the change. Whether you think its good or bad is subjective.

Cartoons ARE made for children. That is the major target demographic in mind when making them, with few exceptions. That's just the reality we live in and it's okay to accept that. And it's okay to admit you like things that are made for children too, there's really nothing wrong with that either.

The real question is SHOULD cartoons only be made solely for children, or is there potential for the medium elsewhere?

Who cares? If you like it, watch it as long as you aren't bothering anyone like shitty fandoms are prone to do.

I'm not saying to put on cartoon memorabilia and wear it in public or anything like that, but I'm not about to miss out on something that I enjoy because other people think that I'm too old for it.

Have a butt.

I don't know if you're pulling those answers out of your ass, or are just listening to morons, but try Bojack Horseman or Mike Tyson Mysteries. They're not that deep (especially the latter), but they're definitely mature enough without relying on shock humor for laughs, like Family Guy, or Drawn Together.

Honestly love to watch sitcoms and live action shows, but they feel more repetitive and bland than cartoons. If someone could take a cartoon's story and just shove it into a show with real actors I would be happy...

And have it geared toward adults, too. Nick/CN/Disney live action sucks to me nowadays

the majority are made for children, but animation itself is just a medium which can be aimed at any demographic and can have any genre

I didn't say anything about traditional TV. The exact same sentiment applies even if we're talking about streaming or whatever.

Pretty grounded in reality since it seems that everyone who is noteworthy in animation nowdays seems emotionally stunted at some degree.

That's the cons of not being a normie for you

>Saberspark

I think it's an argument made by insecure people who want strangers to believe that Gravity Falls is on the same level as Stranger Things. Shit, it's not even on the same level as Twin Peaks.

Part of the problem is that most people who work in TV animation have next to no experience in writing outside of maybe their own personal shitty webcomic. I mean hell, just compare the way the Fresh Prince cried about his dad leaving him compared to how Steven cries about his mother. It's not even a contest on which one is better. One of them had the actor pull from experience, the other sounds like the voice actor is just referencing dubbed anime in terms of "how to emote". TV animators don't seem to strive to be filmmakers so much as just "fans of animation".

The other part is that even if they wanted to do interesting things, networks won't allow them. Hirsch wanted to have an episode with Mabel asking people about death when she saw a butterfly die but Disney wouldn't allow him. Which is baffling because most kids first understand death through a pet or animal, so it's not like you'd be sheltering them some heinous information.

Movie animation is pretty good, though. Films like WALL-E, Iron Giant, Roger Rabbit or Zootopia I would argue could hold a candle to even the best of them. I can't say the same thing about Gravity Falls, Steven Universe, Adventure Time to its TV live action counterparts.

The fact that most animated shows are graded on a curve, IE: Steven Universe is the best because everything else is shit, kind of proves that.

Steven Universe is so far below Gravity Falls it's not even funny. In fact, it's so far below every single show in pic related it's not even funny.

I'm not going to watch that video, OP.

What is considered an adult hobby?
Name some hobbies that only adults can have.

If it's drinking, then fuck you.

>legitimately believing that Strange Things (a show made solely to pander to hipster kids that weren't even born in the 80s with its pseudo-80s stylistic decisions) is better than Twin Peaks (a standalone creative experimental project that does not pander to anyone)
I'm tempted to say you have shit taste

Drinking, smoking, driving, and fucking.

What the hell does that have to do with it being better written compared to Gravity Falls?

Oh you're from Sup Forums and hate the popular shows there, okay.

Tbh animation is a form of entertainment that is pretty much 100% meant for kids and manchildren. Sure you occasionally get some stuff that is aimed towards adults but those are few and far between and more often than not are experimental pieces from abroad.

>The real question is SHOULD cartoons only be made solely for children
You just posted a fantastic example of why it shouldn't, animation allows for extreme stylization and unique storytelling that simply cannot be done with live action, when pushed to it's full potential it can be a great medium.

Unfortunately not a whole lot of people push it to its full potential, a few movie makers here and there, a decent handful of music videos, but that's really about it.

I hate the taste of alcohol, I hate cigarettes, I hate driving (car ownership sucks ass unless you have a job that pays you an actual fucking living wadge so you can afford the insurance), and I don't think either of us have ever done any fucking.

Being an adult should be about doing what you actually have fun doing in your down time, not intentionally making yourself miserable to fit in with a crowd you don't actually hang out with.

This whole conversation is retarded. Cartoons aren't inherently for a certain age group. "Cartoon" isn't even a genre, its another way of referring to the medium of animation. Say "cartoons are not/just for kids" is like saying "live action is not/just for kids" when obviously there are live action shows created exclusively for both kids and adults.

>should
There's that word there again. Feels over reals.
Newsflash, opinions are like assholes and all that.

Is there a rule that says a visual medium cannot be exclusively targeted at a certain age group?

Looney Tunes were played before movies. Adults saw them

Who cares?

>Name some hobbies that only adults can have
>Drinking, smoking, driving, and fucking

My god, dubsman. Are you completely deluded, to believe that only "adults" enjoy drinking, smoking, driving, and fucking? When was the last time you went outside?

Yes, and?

We're both on Sup Forums, that means we're both spending our downtime on something that we enjoy?

Or are you one of those I-only-come-here-to-get-mad types?

The cartoons are just for kids argument is dumb as hell. I don't even really understand the mindset behind it.
Adults make cartoons, the target audience is determined beforehand, but people outside of the target audience can still watch the cartoon.

Anyone who regularly posts on this board should. Given the current state of the animation industry, Sup Forums may become just for comics soon.

It's just that mainstream Hollywood movies are primitive enough thematically and sometimes bad enough in execution for cartoons to be able to compete.
For example, Force Awakens attempted to do a story about a small-time minion freeing himself from his evil overlord's control and going ahead to live his own life. Then the horse show tried to do a similar story. And I won't lie, I actually think the horse show version makes more sense because literally all of Fin's supposed development in FA happens off-screen, as the movie ss too busy with fanservice to bother, while the cartoon's 20-minute format allows it to focus on, you know, the story.

I would say mediums don't inherently determine who creations in there medium are for. Those are decisions that have to be made by thinking people. Paint doesn't dictate who paintings are made for, the painter does and so on.

Why would you need one? What would be some other examples of visual mediums targeted at certain age groups?

honestly I blame disney, everytime theres a new push for more mature movies ,they come along and market the fuck out of everything. If they had left pixar alone and, there would be great competition between the studios and mature movies with broader demographs. It doesn't help that their fanbase fucking sucks and worship the fucking company, because its "their childhood"

the oscar for best animated always goes to disney stopping any progressive studio from getting attention

it does't help that they're remakeing all of their films in live action as if to say, you don't need to watch the cartoons anymore, this is for adults.

This. Cartoons are for kids.

Animation is a medium, not a genre. Fuck anyone who thinks animation must exist only for a single age demographic.

Why do I feel like this thread was made by the Trix Rabbit?

>If they had left pixar alone and

What?

No becuase they dont have blod

>I don't even really understand the mindset behind it
>the target audience is determined beforehand

The target audience majority of the time being kids so...

The mindset of such people I've observed tends to go thus:

>Cartoons are for kids
>But there are adult cartoons
>But those cartoons are actually meant for kids, and are responsible for turning them into immoral atheists and liberals

Generally the cartoons in mind in this case are like Family Guy. Amusingly and frustratingly, though, I've heard middle-aged housewives drone on about how shit like Family Guy and King of the Hill are equally abhorrent and disgusting, despite having seen both, because in the end they're both animated, and KotH acknowledges stuff like sex, which is of course an evil and diabolical thing which we should pretend does not exist.

bump

>TV animators don't seem to strive to be filmmakers so much as just "fans of animation".

This. It's frustrating to work with a bunch of weeaboos whose only knowledge if cinematography is a basic sitcom establishing shot.

If they honestly wanted to learn how to do properly well framed cuts with good editing they should at least watch satoshi kon, since he proved you can do that sorta stuff really well in animation. But half of these fuckers have never even seen the basics if film making, or even the basics of good cartooning, but they all think they're re inventing the fucking wheel.

Christ, Rebecca is such a fucking plebe it's not even funny.

because you know mr pickels are great for kids

Real talk, if you ever looked at the demographics ratings for edgy adult shows like south park and family guy, the overwhelming majority of their viewership has been kids and teenagers.

I think only kids really gravitate towards that stuff since they're in the "I wanna be an adult" phase of their life.

>I don't know if you're pulling those answers out of your ass, or are just listening to morons

That was what I say in the preview picture for the video

At least when I watch Steven Universe I don't feel like the 1 dimensional characters are trying to skull fuck me through the screen.

What about anime?

>Younger people are more close-minded about literally everything
[Citation needed]

>McGucket a 1-dimensional character
Hoo boy, it's rare for an user to reveal they've watched so few episodes of a show they hate on.

>oh he used to be a good boy but then he went crazy and became the most annoying piece of shit character you've ever seen oh how tragic good thing you watched a season and a half to find out

a single creator who is given the opportunity to create a show for adults and just happens to want to use animation to do it can change the way the west sees cartoons, but creators who want to make shows for adults and adult networks are turned off by animation because they know everyone has the retarded idea that animation is a medium that's only for kids. animation should be respected and appreciated by adults as much as any other art form since animated shows and movies have the capacity to be just as meaningful and explore the same mature topics as live action shows and movies do. the average person isn't turned off by cgi in movies even though it is technically animation because they haven't learned to associate that kind of animation with kids, 2d animation is different because companies like disney have taught them from a young age that cartoons are only for kids because they only ever made movies targeted towards that demographic

There is a story behind this. Isn't it?

>I think it's an argument made by insecure people who want strangers to believe that Gravity Falls is on the same level as Stranger Things.

Look I like Stranger Things (not as much as GF though) but you act like it's this amazing show lightyears ahead of Gravity Falls. You really think that the gap in quality is so big that someone has to be insecure to think that Gravity Falls is better? Especially since it's not like Stranger Things is even an "adult" show. It's a family show. It wouldn't be inappropriate to air it on Nickelodeon.

>Part of the problem is that most people who work in TV animation have next to no experience in writing outside of maybe their own personal shitty webcomic.

You just pulled that out of your ass.

> I mean hell, just compare the way the Fresh Prince cried about his dad leaving him compared to how Steven cries about his mother. It's not even a contest on which one is better. One of them had the actor pull from experience, the other sounds like the voice actor is just referencing dubbed anime in terms of "how to emote".
First of all, the whole "Will Smith's daddy didn't love him so he did this scene from the heart" thing is a myth. He has a great relationship with his dad. Second of all, now you're comparing actors, not writers.

>Name some hobbies that only adults can have.

Watching mature shows for mature adults.

Like The Big Bang Theory.

> Zootopia
Sorry bitch, your argument is invalid putting that crap a "gid iximpli"

Who gives a fuck. Watch what you wanna watch. It only matters if you give a shit about what other people think.

To quote a moral from tmnt, a CARTOON. "let they're insults flow like a river over stone".

I agree with you, there's plenty of good cartoons around but whenever it feels like they're about to cross into the realm of being great it never happens because they're held back by censors and aren't allowed to go indepth into things and it's a shame because cartoons are a medium that allows creators to be limitless with what they can show, physically on screen, I mean. I think there needs to be more cartoons around like HBO Spawn personally, and yeah, I know there's a lot of adult orientated anime but anime and manga usually isn't as realistic and gritty in the same way that western media is as a whole (including comics and TV).

But one thing;
>Gravity Falls is on the same level as Stranger Things

Stranger Things is literal garbage that could be so much better for nearly the exact same reasons that most kids cartoons are shit. Their constant need to be tropey and stick with archetypal characters (most of which are pretty much directly copy-and-pasted from Freaks and Geeks) and stick within the lines of 80s tropes to keep nostalgiafags watching ruins the show completely and it's why the best thing about the show is Eleven, the one somewhat original concept they have going. Stranger Things is just as watered down and neutered as most cartoons are and their shitty monsters make the show about as good as your average early episode of Supernatural. Gravity Falls is much more original than Stranger Things and it doesn't rely on nostalgiabait either.

Other countries like france and japan have a steady market of adult oriented animated content thats pretty great.

its just autists like people on Sup Forums and christian house wives that keep give it the reputation that its solely for children.

>hurr durr just do a bunch of '''''hobbies""" you don't like that center around completely drowning out your emotions and are a thinly veiled form of self destruction instead of watching cartoons like you want to bro, at least insecure depressed adults who hate themselves will think you're cool then; it's normal bro!!

God I'm glad I'm in an age where adults watching cartoons and actually being yourself past the age of 13 is acceptable and am 18 now instead of being 18 twenty or so years ago.