Obviously Agents of SHIELD is canon to Agent Carter and Inhumans and obviously the Daredevil, Jessica Jones, Luke Cage, Iron Fist, The Defenders, and The Punisher are all canon to each other, but are all the shows canon to each other or is it really just a meme? I'm sure there is more I am missing, but I listed what I could remember off the top of my head.
>Dogs of Hell appear in AoS season one, later appear in DD season two
>Judas Bullet appears in LC, later appears in AoS season four
>In season one of AoS it is said that Daisy grew up in St. Agnes Orphanage, in DD season one we learn Matt Murdock also grew up there. It's also possible that Father Lantom will appear in The Runaways having first appeared in DD season one.
>AoS season one introduces Blackout and the concept of Darkforce, Darkforce appears in AC season two, Darkforce is what will give Cloak his powers in Cloak and Dagger
>DD season two has a gang war, news ticker in AoS season three talks about it
>Daisy mentions knowing Micro in AoS season two, Micro will appear in TP season one
>Crusher Creel appears in AoS season two, Jack Murdock boxes Creel in DD season one
>The headline "Cybertek Settles" is seen in DD season two, Cybertek was introduced in AoS season one as the creators of Deathlok
>WHiH World News first appears in The Incredible Hulk, late appears in Iron Man 2, Daredevil season one, AoS seasons one through four, JJ season one, LC season one, IF season one, and Ant-Man and Civil War bonus features released online
Now I don't know about the movies, but at the very least all of the Marvel shows so far are connected meaning there are at maximum two Marvel Cinematic canon universes. One with the films and the TV shows and one with just the films.
MCU canon
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They're supposed to be canon to each other, but the movies are written without the shows in mind, and the netflix shows are probably written without any consideration to the garbage that is AoS and Inhumans outside of random ass references.
> the netflix shows are probably written without any consideration to the garbage that is AoS
AoS is far better than most of the Netflix shows.
MCU canon: movies, one-shots
non canon: marvel tv shit
Careful, some guy got massively triggered in the Inhumans thread last night at the mere thought that the shows ever make references to each other.
This. They might as well not be canon.
Very weak bait
It's all fucking canon, jesus christ.
How the fuck did people back in the 60's understand that everything Marvel published was in the Marvel universe without making constant goddamn crossovers and references, but stupid moviefags in 2017 can't?
The hospital in Doctor Strange was the one introduced in Daredevil season 2.
The movies are canon to the shows, but the shows are not canon to the movies.
why are people on this board too retarded to understand that is the right answer?
Fury and Sif were in Agents of SHIELD, how is that now proof enough that it's the same fucking universe and thus canon? Obviously, the movies don't pay attention to the shit happening in the shows and that's the way it should be. "Muh Defenders should be in Infinity War" and "CW Flash should totally be in the Justice League movie" retards can really go fuck themselves if they think actors who are worse than Gal Gadot should be in movies
*not proof enough
Then the shows are 100% canon to the films
Moviefags don't read comics.
well fucking duh. it's just that the movies shouldn't bother about the shows to the extent that they have to address (unimportant) stuff from the shows. what I'd PERSONALLY like to see is a scene in one of the movies and daredevil or spider-man jumping/swinging in the background
dude, it's simple logic
>several characters from the movies in the shows
>movies addressed in the shows
>goddamn Coulson who was in several movies is main character of Agents of SHIELD
can't get any more canon than that. I do genuinely believe that people who refuse to see this are mentally retarded
I know that, but it's the same general concept. When someone picked up Ghost Rider #1 in the 70's, they didn't go "but is this canon to the Avengers?" because they didn't mention or show the Avengers in it, they just knew it was part of the Marvel universe because it said fucking Marvel on the cover.
also
>jasper sitwell bounces around often between films and AoS until he's killed in winter soldier.
>The hydra info that was carried on over and leaked to the avengers before Age of Ultron's info.
Dr. List bounces around between AoS and films (winter soldier post-credits and AoU opening)
>Hydra weapon advancements that appeared in AoS and the "item 42" one-shot were used by hydra soldiers in Age of Ultron opening.
>The Helicarrier in reserve that Coulson had in reserve before Age of Ultron which fury used.
Here's something unrelated to this that most didn't notice:
>Sonic weapon in Incredible Hulk that the military uses against hulk is not only a stark weapon, but a weapon that War Machine uses a few times in Civil War.
Just a friendly reminder:
people who piss and moan about the tv/online/netflix shows being canon are operating on the same exact thinking of those that claimed Incredible Hulk wasn't canon just because of lead actor being recast. Said same people began pretending that they never believed that it wasn't when Thunderbolt Ross popped up as a major supporting role in Civil War.
It's retarded assumptions and redundant assertions based on irrelevant nitpicking like this that makes people look stupid.
Kevin Feige could pay RDJ, Evans, Hemsworth, Pratt, Brolin and Cumberbatch to appear in a whole season of every show and fuck your mother during the shoot while filming the penetration scenes with a goddamn IMAX camera, then televise the world premier of runaways with the opening scene being Feige, Iger and the Russo brothers slapping you in the face with their dicks with the word "canon" tattooed on the tips and these sort of people would still call it Non-canon during the cumshot.
back in the 60s, most comic readers were kids, kids don't need a reason for everything, they accept things as they are
when you have adult retards that think they're smart, and need an answer for every stupid question they think of, you get shit like OP, and people asking who pumps the tires on the batmobile
That's partially true, but the whole reason Marvel was such a success was because they attracted an older audience, and by the 70's you had lots of teens and college age kids buying the comics, the same kind of people who are here every day being dumbfucks arguing about whether the shows are canon to the MCU.
The fact that multiple characters have been in the movies, then the show, and then the movies and people still say it's not all canon baffles me. Now if it were the MCU comics we were debating there's be some merit since those have actually been contradicted by the movies
yeah, the comics and games that were made fell into the retard trap that the second Avengers show fell into where they tried to completely override and upend the films by taking the lead and making a whole new canon based on the existing material which would guarantee nonstop contradiction in the films.
The shows, games, comics and any other material related to the MCU should precisely follow the idea that the One-shot's did. Reference without hard interference.
Besides, the primary 3 reasons of not having megastar-crossovers that most sperglords keep whining on about not having happened are pretty damn massive reasons.
1. With the exception of the "few people on planet earth not to be fucked with on a contract" (such as Samuel L. Jackson) Taking a TV role after finding hollywood success is not just some charity thing you can do at your leisure. It's a matter of income politics. Nobody's willing to take a dip into television as Hollywood in general will start offering you less money (as tv actors are generally paid massively less-so.) Basically, it means that if you go from Avengers paycheck to just taking a cameo paycheck on ally mcbeal for a twentieth of the asking price, nobody in hollywood will bother to ask you back to star in a movie unless you offer the discounted price you just did on tv.
(again, unless you're in a position like Samuel L. Jackson.)
2. Movie scripts in production. A movie script takes far longer to get up and running than an episode of a show, so you'd face frequent contradictions if a film lead got tangled up in episodes, especially where films tend to frequently reference past events in their scripts as callbacks when the tv shows and films aren't even created in the same studios or by the same creative teams.
3.Not just worldbuilding, but holy fuck, stop ignoring the goddamn realms of habitation.Luke Cage is no more a guardian of the galaxy than Nebula should be a person apprehending bank robbers. Characters have their place and if Homecoming didn't spell it out for you enough that Stark's job isn't to catch bank robbers or rescue cats from trees, then you might have a problem. There's levels of rank/position of marvel in regards to street-level being the lowest order and cosmic being the highest order. The MCU on the whole has roughly figured all of this out.....except for iron fist, which pisses me off immensely how literally they're taking his -"title"- to reflect an ability to the limit of only his right hand.
People who are retards that overlook the last one are too stupid and ask the worst questions like "durp, how come stark/thor/steve didn't just call the avengers in the sequel films after the avengers" and completely ignore all of the context going on in the films that completely explain why such events didn't happen.
Complaints:
>Why in Iron man did stane rampage and do the stuff he did?
Pepper was a loose end/witness he needed to tie up. He didn't need or even want to go after tony again after the initial hit failed, but Pepper copying the documents pretty much guaranteed stane was going to prison for life...or even catch a death sentence if he was exposed for both the hit and double-dealing to terrorists.
>Why did abomination rampage in new york and randomly fight hulk?
Captain America:First avenger explained this. (it was supposed to be a preview/cameo of super-soldier concept anyway) Super Soldier serum amplifies the person and personality, not just strength. Observe Blonsky pre-serum, then observe him during the post-serum clash at culver university. Blonsky was a dick and craved competition. Abomination was a dick and craved competition.
>How are they communicating during battle of new york in avengers. Impossible!
This implies high-tech communication is impossible with hidden earpiece when the films have don it prior. People were too conditioned to see fbi obvious-as hell earpieces and forgot shield/stark's tech exist. Furthermore, stark's hacking device on the helicarrier was roughly half the size of a dime. This complaint was so stupid that they beat people over the head with the hidden earpiece in Iron Man 3 during the climax, which resulted in pepper killing Killian. Also note that Thor and Hulk were the only characters without earpieces as they didn't prep on the helicarrier,, only cap, stark, hawkeye and widow did as they had access.
>Why didn't Stark call Rhodes during the invasion for back-up?
Even though a comic tried to address it, it never needed addressing. At the time, there was no time where the call was warranted by anybody until the invasion started and went on over 15 minutes or so considering stark's arsenal alone, on stark's property. It would be like a platoon of navy seals picking a fight with batman.... in the batcave or on wayne manor. The comic implied that stark contacted Rhodes...who was on the other side of the world at the time...and by time he got there, the fight was over.
>Why didn't stark call the avengers in IM3?
Why should he have? Alert "the mandarin" to his being alive after the attack on his home...while stark was vulnerable to another helicopter attack? His knowledge isn't the audience's knowledge. Stark needed to lay low to investigate incognito.
Neflix is really intent on ignoring anything AoS-related. Sure, they mention same places, things and organisations. But the whole Inhuman thing is ignored.
>Why didn't thor call the avengers in Dark world?
How? And with what Time limit he had, bothering to do so would be a gargantuan waste. Malekith would have won and thor would only have a fraction of the information he needed. At what point could he have elected to contact them if he knew how?
>Why didn't cap contact the av
He's smarter than you if he knew better than to let himself get tracked. It's like "hydra infestation" and "shield compromised" means nothing to you. Oh, yeah, call avengers for what reason and at what point without absolutely getting himself caught? Of course they'd be tracking Stark, Barton and Banner for communication. They'd triangulate on steve and insight/rumlow/winter soldier/rocket the shit out of him.
See, if you use the slightest bit of common sense, you'd realize that most of the answers to your questions were right in front of you. It's almost amazing that people still forget how insane Ronan was portrayed considering his first act in the film displayed his fanatacism to be so extreme that he executes captured xandarians by personally bashing in their heads with a sledgehammer and literally bathing in their blood.
The only reason he and Malekith get a bad rap is because Thanos and Loki suck up screentime that should have been reserved to flesh out their character development.
I love threads like this.
There's so much evidence to say it's all canon when really the only argument to say it's not is "where was X during Y".
Which is like saying "where was I during the Coronation of the King of Denmark? You're not in the same universe."
Just because two individuals in a universe don't appear at the same place at the same time doesn't mean they don't exist in the same canon. But that and a Joss "I work for DC now" Whedon quote is all the non canon crowd have to go on.
How the hell did Thanos eat up screen time in GOTG? He was in two minor scenes that were likewise dedicated to establishing aspects of Ronan's character.
And it goes back to the fact that comic readers have never had a problem understanding this shit. They don't ask "where was Thor when Iron Man was fighting Ultimo?" because the answer is obviously "he was busy doing Thor shit and heroes wouldn't be superheroes if they had to call their buddies every time a villain showed up". It's not like Thor is just chilling on the fucking couch when he's not in a movie, he has his own shit going on.
> "Muh Defenders should be in Infinity War"
All I want is a little cameo of Matt(in suit), Danny, Luke, and Jessica fighting off rank and file soldiers/minions. When the inevitable "Everything's going to shit" scene occurs. That's all I'm asking for.
>the garbage that is AoS
shit taste confirmed
Frankly even if Thor was just chilling on a couch during IM3 or whatever, that's as good as excuse as any for him to not rock up. Ultimately there doesn't need to be justifications for these things. It's a big world and a bigger galaxy.
Yeah, it'd be different if Thor was laid out unconscious on live TV. Then I'd be wondering why no one else showed up. Tony was probably at home get drunk watching Thor kick ass
I'm not hating on Thanos, I actually liked his main scene, but I'm still just telling it like it is.
Basically, The fact that Thanos Boss'd at Ronan in the first scene in question was designed to establish Thanos as a serious threat with a massive "Holy Shit" moment, but it works too well for Thanos and pretty much robs Ronan of his thunder and completely destroyed his weight.
The second scene, even though Ronan gets a power boost, that's still a scene where he's dealing with Thanos and not directly engaging in the film's progress. Hell, Quill's first personal interaction with Ronan was the dance-off and even then, Ronan isn't played up further than his initial motive of Xandarian extinction from his first few lines. What can be derived of the aspects of his character is limited and while the movie is paced very well, it's difficult to remember his lines except the ones spoken when Thanos is a subject or present.
Only somewhat similarly, Malekith isn't exactly hosed over like Ronan for scale of threat, but he does make the poorest show of threat by getting his ass kicked by Frigga and not having enough gravitas in any of his lines or any identifiable fighting style outside of using his minions to fight for him. The use of black hole grenades were more intimidating than him and the motive was without empathy or conviction while Hiddleston (for the third time) acted circles around Hemsworth, and by popular demand no less.
I love how all the naysayers in this thread can be summed up with
>yeah, but if you ignore all that they totally aren't connected
Hemsworth isn't a good actor, just a pretty face.
Marvel doesn't care about their villains.
Thor 2 was a garbage movie.
>it works too well for Thanos and pretty much robs Ronan of his thunder and completely destroyed his weight
I disagree, because Ronan destroys Drax later on in the movie before he even gets the stone. It simply establishes that Ronan, a big deal, is working for an even bigger deal, who is then absent for practically the rest of the movie. It doesn't even really say that much about Thanos because Ronan kills his goon and Thanos just lets him off with a warning.
>The second scene, even though Ronan gets a power boost, that's still a scene where he's dealing with Thanos and not directly engaging in the film's progress
I don't see how. He's got the stone now, juices himself up, and tells his boss to go fuck himself, immediately after he and Nebula push the protagonists' shit in. That's directly engaging in the film's progress even if Thanos is present. And once again, Thanos just fusses at Ronan and lets him go.
>Hell, Quill's first personal interaction with Ronan was the dance-off
I'm pretty sure that was the point.
>Ronan isn't played up further than his initial motive of Xandarian extinction from his first few lines
He doesn't need to be.
>What can be derived of the aspects of his character is limited and while the movie is paced very well, it's difficult to remember his lines except the ones spoken when Thanos is a subject or present
He's a limited character. The movie isn't really about him, and that's fine IMO. While you're not specifically saying this, I want to say that I disagree with the notion that all cape movies need to revolve around the villain and their connection to the heroes. GOTG was more about the protagonists and their various inter and intrapersonal conflicts, rather than the struggle against Ronan specifically.
I fully agree with you on Malekith though, because almost every facet of that conflict was supposed to be personal, and none of it really connected.
Joss "shit talk my brother Jed's show (AoS) because I'm such a bitter person" Whedon shouldn't be taken seriously.
And AoS is as canon as the movies, its only non canon of you ignore all of the references to the rest of the MCU
No. Marvel cares about their villains. They just had a few uninformed directors while the writers have a preference to focus on title characters more than villains.
To say they don't care is pretty harsh considering that they only fumbled the 2.5 times (Malekith, Ronan and half of mandarin due to killian being partly un-threatening and suffering from early JC-Riddlerosis.) across 16 movies.
It's not that the villains are bad, it's just that they're not overly bombastic or chewing on the scenery (....except for Ego.) and since DC makes a habit out of theatricality in villains, it's hard to make a meme out of any villain in the MCU except Ego and Stane.
youtube.com
was meant for
also:
I like the fact that we can observe different things have slight differences in views and not be assholes to one another.
I consent to this argument.
Also the villains always die. That's actually a Hollywood thing, since clueless executives think thick monkeyskull audiences won't like the movie if the villain doesn't get killed.
Not being a dick, but I kinda want to be pedantic about the first sentence just for the fun of it.... and so I can have an excuse to test trivial knowledge:
Class A1 (returning at a villainous capacity): Loki, Winter Soldier,
A2 (Imprisoned/repelled): Vulture, Shocker 2, Abomination, Dormammu, Batroc.
Class B (Returned damaged): Rumlow, Klaue
Class C (ineffectual, yet still alive and re-appears.): Justin Hammer
Class D (Zero final confirmation): Red Skull
Type A (legit dead *?unless production update returns): Stane, Vanko, Laufey, Killian, Malekith, Kurse, Pierce, Ronan, Ultron(?), Yellowjacket, Kaecillius(?) Ego,
Sort A (Ex-hero): Mordo.
Sort B (imprisoned, but holy fuck, pray he doesn't get out.): Zemo.
Thanos: Thanos.
>How the fuck did people back in the 60's understand that everything Marvel published was in the Marvel universe without making constant goddamn crossovers and references
Stan Lee actually made sure to have goddamn crossovers and references all of the time.