So, we all agree that she deserved better, right?

Seriously. Also, Spectacular Spider-Man thread.

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IF SHE BREATHE

Rude.

Yeah, Pete dropped the ball hard on that one.

Best girl was Hammerhead's driver

Yeah, fuck Pete for breaking her heart.

She was a cute mute

I blame everyone else for telling him to break it off with Liz if he wanted to be with Gwen. Like, what the fuck, Aunt May?

She also had nerves of steel, she fought Green Goblin without any hesitation.

God damn it. You're making me want to watch the show again because it was so good, but I can't reach the end again. It hurts too much.

Who was the best villain and why was it The Big Man?

Her name was Myrna.

According to Weisman she was going to be an actual character, but then cancellation.

Because the writers had to make do with someone else when Marvel wouldn't let them use Kingpin, but they somehow made it work.

Do it.

I absolutely love the show but the Liz-Peter-Gwen love triangle thing was fucked up. I mean, she kisses him on Thanksgiving without warning, apparently runs off without saying anything, spends the next month or so waiting for Peter to come talk TO HER about it instead of the other way around, and then gets mad when he goes out with someone whose upfront about their feelings. Even worst, everyone around her keeps telling her Peter the stupid one for “not knowing what he wants.” When he tries to talk to her about it, she complains how she doesn’t want to be his second choice but goes off and does THE EXACT SAME THING by dating Harry.

>hey, you know that great Halloween episode of spectacular spider-man? Wouldn't it have been better with WEREWOLVES! AND THE HULK SHOWING UP
>uhhh.....no?
>oh....too late

youtube.com/watch?v=PXDdypxBu_k

It would've been great if he snapped during the third season at everyone for telling him he's an idiot for doing what they told him to do.

"I'm the one at fault here!? I only did what you guys kept telling me to do! I felt so guilty for having feelings for Gwen while I was dating Liz because of all those times I paid more attention to Gwen than her. The only thing I did wrong was having feelings for two different people! And when I needed someone to set me straight you all told me to dump my girlfriend instead of telling me to work out my feelings!"

Do Peterfags even care about Liz Allan?

I thought everybody was still a die-hard "Peter should be married to MJ with a kid" advocate

For Spectacular, no one thinks anyone is worstgirl.

> Peterfags

Yep, it's that guy again

i remember wanting to fuck green goblin for some reason

...

They should've fucked.

Definitely

it was his narration of the midsummer nights dream episode I'm willing to bet

The more I watch it the more I wonder if Greg was setting up the Peter/Gwen relationship to fail.

I mean we know Peter would eventually end up with MJ, and it'd be a way of having him be open for that without killing Gwen.

I could see that happening.
>Season three ending with Gwen's death.
>Peter spends season four morning her while also getting closer to MJ through shared grief.
>Season four ends with them getting together.

I think Weisman said that he wanted to do a direct-to-DVD where Gwen dies.

I think what he said was along the lines that it wasn't really an option untill a direct-to-DVD movie release.

Gwen's death is a classic sure, but a love-interest dying for angst is usually considered bad or cliched writing these days.

>Gwen's death is a classic sure, but a love-interest dying for angst is usually considered bad or cliched writing these days.
It was more tragic than angst.

I like the way Liz came to like Peter though, it was cute. She comes off as some stereotypical preppy snob girl who's just there as a bit character playing a one dimensional role as part of the setting, but eventually she shows more of herself as she spends more time with Peter.

You could tell she really wanted to make to make it work but it just wasn't going to.

Honestly I find it hard to judge it objectively because it is such a classic moment.

There's definitley been instances since in media everywhere where the trope feels a lot more hackneyed.

Myrna vs Mariam when?

Alternatively, I wonder if Peter and Gwen's two way constant dishonesty would lead directly to Gwen's death.

She was such a doll. Way too good for Peter.

I reckon it would probably have been Harry in the goblin suit when Gwen dies, rather than Norman. Harry finds out that Peter is Spider-Man, and convinces himself that he's trying to steal his girl or worse, that they're been having an affair this whole time. He gets hopped up on globulum and decides to take her somewhere 'where that scum can't touch her'
Petr tracks them down, they fights. a line about how "are you going to take away my girlfriend now, like you killed my father? will you never stop until you've taken everything from me?"
a wayward bomb sends her plummeting to her death. both try to save her but accidentally get in each others way. splat.

I think its a shame no adaptations ever explore Betty Brant as a potential love interest

Only if they felt like dragging on the Harry/Gwen/Peter conflict on for 3 more seasons and a DTD movie.

Not to mention it'd leave Norman with nothing much to when he got back since Harry's stolen his thunder.

Didn't the 70's series have her as a love interest?

The 60's cartoon and the 80's cartoon (the one before Amazing Friends) has her as a sort of love interest.

But I think it's because after Peter married MJ, MJ became the default love interest for him.

I don't think she was in the 70's show.

I'll never get this tedency to want to make Harry the new Norman.

Kind of undermines the point of his character arc in the comics.

Right, sorry I meant the 60's. Mixed up my decades.

I think Gwen is worst girl.

>Marvel wouldn't let them use Kingpin

I always figured this was the case.

I love how hungry everyone was for Pete's cock in this show.

If I remember correctly, Greg said MJ would be the main girl if they actually got to make Season 3.

>show gets cancelled earlier than expected
>still gets a GOAT ending

Don't want to spoil it for the people who still haven't watched this masterpiece

>Don't want to spoil it for the people who still haven't watched this masterpiece
You are either retarded or just pretending, aren't you.

Best Spectacular girl and best version of Liz.

It should be called "Bitches love Spiderman"

I get the feeling Liz is the kinda girl you could talk into doing anal and she woulda ended up liking it. Truly she was best girl.

If we lived in a more enlightened society this show woulda ended in a spider-harem

So, Gwen, Liz, MJ, and Felicia?

OP here. Peter's my favorite superhero and, as you can tell from the thread subject, I think he really messed up here. So, yeah. I care.

Sally Avril was probably the only character who never got any development and stayed as a shallow self-absorbed bitch for the whole show.

Kingpin types are always great when done right, i.e. when they are not just shadowy masterminds to be revealed in last 2 episodes.
Counter question, who was the worst villain?
Yeah, no. Nobody made him openly lust for Gwen as he did during Gangland. For fuck's sake, he could have at least say a proper goodbye to Liz. Everything related to love triangle in season 2 is on him.

But since we live in the worst timeline it didn't even get to end.

We all agree this was one of the best Norman adaptations right?

...

Weisman pretty much confirmed that this was the plan.

...

It's hard to tell
>Greg: All I can say - or rather all I FEEL like saying - is that we had (pipe-dream) plans to do five 13-episode seasons that would have taken us through Peter's graduation from High School. After that, our hope was to do a series of Direct to DVD movies that would continue the story into Peter's college years and beyond.

>Q: I heard that you have a 5 season plan and ideas for the DTVs too. If that's the case, does that mean you definitely know (and have no doubt whatsoever in your mind) when, if ever, you will attempt storylines like The Death of Gwen Stacy, The Death of Captain George Stacy or The Clone Saga?
>Greg: The phrase "no doubt whatsoever in [my] mind" gives me pause.

>So we can all agree that this was one of the best Norman adaptations right?

You better fuckin believe it was

Flash Thompson getting pissed off about it was hilarious

J.J's son actually did turn into a werewolf in the comics. It even got foreshadowed in the show.

I just wish he had more fights.

Except they already did the beast-man villain concept with Kraven, so it seems like they had to give JJ's son something totally new.

>Except they already did the beast-man villain concept with Kraven
You mean like with Vulture?
Oh wait no you mean like with Doc Ock.
Oh wait no you mean like with Rhino.
Oh wait no you're just wrong about your rationale.

I liked the whole "every character on the show is a preexisting character from the comics" idea, but part of me wishes they stuck to the comics canon and only included people that Peter canonically knew in high school for the first few seasons. They could've just done what Homecoming did and made up some new characters to fill in the blanks of Peter's social life. Now it seems like they fired a lot of their guns prematurely, almost.

As in literal beast-man/furry, not just dressed up like one.

I mean, who is there to compete with? The only other really good one that comes to mind is Raimi movie Norman.

Wasn't it Spectacular that really solidified the 'Spider-man in highscool' trend?

That said I really wouldn't mind seing a Spidey story that was more faithful to the comics.
Maybe one season in highschool, two or three in College before moving on to adult Peter.

Heck, maybe even set it in the 60's and make it a period piece.

Norman's relationship with Harry was honestly creepy.
Felt a bit too real for a kids show, even with all the Goblin stuff.

>Wasn't it Spectacular that really solidified the 'Spider-man in highscool' trend?

Outside of comics, maybe. But Marvel itself also wanted to push it as seen with the success of Ultimate Spider-Man and how Marvel Age/Marvel Adventures Spider-Man was high school Spider-Man.

Arguably the thinking for rolling back to high school Spider-Man happened before Quesada took over; people wanted to get rid of the marriage because they felt it "aged" Peter, and Byrne said that at one point they considered making Peter's life fucked to the point where he wishes he could roll back the clock, and then the Shaper of Worlds would appear and change things so that it was basically high school Peter again with his cast deaged. But then within a second or so they realized that would be a terrible idea. So Marvel definitely had it in mind to make Spider-Man a high school kid again.

I think it's just because they want to get to the popular villains and characters while still doing High School Spider-Man. It's the same thing with all other iterations of High School Spider-Man in the last 17 years.

Marvel Adventures did this too, but the weird thing is that for most of the run they mainly stuck to the Ditko era supporting cast (Aunt May, JJJ, Flash, Betty, Liz) but introduced in Venom, Hobgoblin, Black Cat, and others that came long after Peter left high school. Gwen didn't get introduced till Tobin started writing it and Mary Jane never appeared so she may as well have not existed in that universe.

Isn't that why it was so good though?

I don't think those are the same thing, user.

And here we have the designated complete Dumbass of the thread

She really did. Sadly, everyone wanted to torpedo her ship, right down to MJ going and giving Gwen makeover.

Okay what about a show where it uses Spectacular's version of Liz and a Betty Brant (who's maybe two or three years older than Peter) as love interests for the first season, then everything's up for grabs in subsequent seasons?

The whole idea was to reverse enginner the original hundred issue high school era run but with every modern advancement made since the 60s.

So they took Gwen and Eddie and developed high school era versions of them that would develop into the familar ones.

Still it seems weird that Peter would be constantly running into the same people in college that he knew in high school. Besides, they were already going down roads like Gwen/Peter and Harry's drug addiction, which wouldn't happen until they all adults. When Peter finally got to college, what would be left?

Mattie Franklin and Jill Stacy?

Definitley.

Thinking about it, it's suprising how rare it is for child abuse to be given much focus in kids shows given how relevant it'd be to the audience.
It's usually either implied for side-character angst but never dealt with, big bad demonic parent turning up to end the world, or maybe focused on a one off character.

Spectacular's pretty rare for having it be shown acros series and be central to the ongoing story.

No idea why. Her and Peter were cute together.

Jill doesn't really work unless you kill Gwen first.

Yeah but this is assuming Weisman stuck with his plan to kill Gwen during the college years.

The series was something of a love letter to the early Lee/Ditko issues. For that reason, MJ and Gwen were a given as love interests, and for the reason, Liz wasn't.

Liz was the girl that treated Peter like crap until she realized he was hot, but by then it was too late. He had moved on to Betty. Sure, the two fought over him a lot, but Peter never took her seriously.

This version of Liz, however, ended up being a more lovable character. We ended up caring more about her and her relationship with Peter. Problem is she was never intended to win from the start.

I mean, I can understand her never really having a chance in the long run. But I feel like there's a big difference between that and having a good portion of the rest of the cast actively attempting to mess up your relationship while your life goes downhill due your brother becoming a super villain. Like they went a little bit too far with it.

Ohhhhhh. Right.

Yeah, it's really weird that Liz ended up likable in this but they didn't decide to go forward with that relationship.

Incidentally how do all Lizs rank? I say

Spectacular Liz > Homecoming Liz > Spider-Man Loves Mary Jane Liz > 616 Liz > Chapter One Liz

Sounds like a pretty accurate ranking to me.

Was this show really cancelled on a cliffhanger? Or is that just fandom exaggeration?

An exaggeration, mostly. The three major story-arcs (Tombstone, Green Goblin, and Venom) were tied up neatly, but a few teases for new plots were kept in just in case Season 3 got made.

Unlike other Spider-Man shows (90s series, Unlimited), this actually finished the story arc. It did however set up and introduce a bunch of stuff that went unresolved because there was no continuation (Harry emotionally manipulating Gwen so she won't dump him, Black Cat being angry with Spider-Man, Norman surviving, etc).

Those were teases, not cliffhangers.

...

I mean, the Norman one was kind of cliffhangery. Since it was the very last scene of the show.

You just did.

Norman has a very bad habit of not dying when he's supposed to, so not really. If anything, he ended the show on a memorable note as he fled to fight another day.