I think we can all agree that Two Face and Penguin hate the Joker. After King's latest arc...

I think we can all agree that Two Face and Penguin hate the Joker. After King's latest arc, it's safe to say that Riddler hates him too. Obviously Harley loves him. Ivy hates him but won't kill him outright out of respect for Harley. What do you think Joker's relationship is like with Gorham's other villains?

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>Obviously Harley loves him

Not true since Death of the Family. She hates his guts

It's canon that they all hate him but avoid him / work with him tentatively because they're terrified of him.

>After King's latest arc, it's safe to say that Riddler hates him too.
Fuck're you talking about? Riddler started the whole war just to make Joker laugh. What a bro.

Newflash: They've always hated him, King hasn't broken new ground with that

>just to make Joker laugh. What a bro.
He started it because he didn't want Joker to rob him of the satisfaction of being the one to kill Batman.

I imagine Ras and Bane have zero tolerance for his bullshit and would kill him at the drop of a hat. Joker knows this and wisely stays out of their way.

Deadshot, Deathstroke and David Caine are indifferent to him. He generally doesn't fuck with them and they don't fuck with him. Except for if Deadshot is sleeping with Harley.

I think Croc would actually have mutual respect for Joker. He'd have no issue serving as an enforcer for him, and I imagine they are in friendly terms. Joker would be one of the few not to treat Croc like a freak for his appearance.

I think Scarecrow and Zsasz would respect the Joker quite a bit. Their interests would overlap with his a LOT. I never quite bought it how Joker killed Crane in Injustice, wouldn't it make more sense to just bring him on board? I'd like to see Scarecrow work with Joker more often. Zsasz would be happy so long as Joker gave him people to kill. Joker would be fine with watching, probably find it fascinating. Although after a while Zsasz's style might bore Joker.

Hush and Hugo Strange would work with or against the Joker depending on their current goals.

Catman, Freeze and Catwoman would be disgusted with the Joker's brutality.

Lex would alternate between frustration and contempt for him, and a strange sense of respect.

No idea about Hatter, Firefly, Clayface, Grundy or others.

I liked that Croc was his enforcer in Azzerello's Joker book. Asl at the start of the first Arkham game, Joker greets Croc and calls him "old boy", I get a sense of comradere there. Doesn't Joker stick up for Croc during a poker game in the animated series?

I like the idea of those two being bros.

the fact that you two are arguing this just shows how shit that was.
getting tired of writers changing things midway through the story because of what people say online or if they figure out the ending.

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Then all of a sudden, after the dinner party issue, Batman is working for Riddler. Why would Riddler accept him into his ranks and even get all the villains to agree to a no-killing policy if the whole point in the first place was for Riddler to kill Batman and ensure that Joker couldn't?

It really felt like we were missing an issue there.

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>loose cannon
>has no normal movies for crime like money and power
>always has ulterior motives
>hurrr 'I must be the one to kill the bat'
>lol random decision do ditch the plan and do my own thing

what's not to fucking hate from other criminal's point of view

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T.T.F.N. makes no sense because Ta Ta For Now are all one syllable words. You aren't making it any easier to say.

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This partnership was going so well up until this point. They were trolling the mayor and making prank phone calls, it was awesome.

Scarecrow should have had more tollerance for Joker's sense of humor.

That said, it's worth noting that Joker didn't kill Scarecrow after he gassed him, he just beat him with a chair.

I think it would have been cooler if instead of beating Scarecrow after being gassed, there should have been an awkward glare, -like Joker was GOING to get mad and violent, but then he bursts out laughing at himself for getting gassed, then Scarecrow joins him in laughter, holding each other up before they go make more prank calls and more science.

I think that would have been funnier and more interesting than the cliche of two villains turning against each other.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TTFN

It doesn't have to make sense to be a thing people do.

Really? It didn't get retcon by flashpoint? Harley always siding with Joker was one of the best point of her character.

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oh.

honestly IMO the only guy who could keep a leash on joker is lex, there's just something between the two of them that works, could be because all of those JL cartoons that paired them so good that I'm biased but the combo of the two of them makes me rock hard

No, it hasn't been retcon'd ever since. It is one of the traits that have been maintained from N52

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youtube.com/watch?v=q-kgrl9vKxI

almost as cringe as doom crying at 9.11

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It's weird all these times where Joker brutalizes Lex. In Emperor Joker he killed and redirected him a bunch of times too.

And yet Lex recruited him to kill Alexander Luthor at the end of Infinite Crisis, hired him to release Doomsday one time (which made zero sense to me), and I remember one scene from the 90s where Lex and Joker were walking casually down the street together smoking cigars and discussing their rivals.

It's almost as if after all the violence Joker has inflicted on Lex, and vice versa, they are able to put it aside as though it's not even personal.

What happened next? Did "letting him go" mean pushing him from a moving vehicle?

I assume the Robin is Tim?

So im the only one missing old harley? She used to scare me so much when i was a kid watching bats. Even more than the joker.

>So im the only one missing old harley?

No, you aren't.

everyone fucking misses her, fucking can't wait the fucking day when she's back in her old costume and back at jokers side

Anyone else like the idea of Joker being bros with Croc and/or Scarecrow? How about Zsasz?

Or would Joker find Zsasz boring like he found Carnage boring?

>All it took was a little acid to the face and everything you stood for got thrown out the window
>Pot calling kettle black

I miss her old costume, but I don't mind seeing her grow past Joker. Character evolution can be a good thing rather than maintaining the status quo forever. Shame they had to turn her into a Memepool knock off.

yes for crane and croc, a big no for zsasz

Why it's perfectly in character. It's a fucking joke.

To be fair, Joker was never Gorham's white knight District Attorney.

It's a different kettle of fish to see a champion of justice turn into a villian as opposed to some random schmuck who already had ties to the mob.

Joker attacks Harvey for turning against "everything you stood for." Jack Naiper, or whoever he was pre-Joker didn't really stand for anything.

Also there's the phrase "a little." Harvey had it thrown in his face, Joker was immersed in the shit.

On top of that, does Joker even remember his life prior to the chemical bath?

>On top of that, does Joker even remember his life prior to the chemical bath?
No, he basically makes up different memories to fit whatever mood he's in.

Why a big no for Zsasz?

As a henchman he'd be much more formidable than your average hired goon. His resume is written on his skin. You don't need to worry about Zsasz stealing money off you or ratting you out to the cops, because there is literally only one thing that's important to him and that's killing folks.

Granted, I don't think anyone could connect with Zsasz on a personal level. And Joker might dislike his killing style for the same reason he disliked Carnage's.

It's still hypocritical of Joker to mock Harvey for basically doing what he's always preaching everyone should do.

big difference in killing for killings sake and in killing for a laugh or shock or to destroy someone mentally

there's a reason more recent villains made a bigger impact on the mainstream than zsasz, professor pyg, hurt, batman who laugs, all batman villains are more than just hurrr random generic guy who gets a high from kills and is edgy, joker would find him boring just as most readers do

>I think Croc would actually have mutual respect for Joker.
Actually, Joker was scared shitless of Croc back in the day. I kinda miss those days when Joker was just an oportunistic asshole.

Well, Croc back in the day was a much bigger villain. He was introduced as the new biggest gang leader and now he's just a thug.

Pyg, has arguably had a bigger impact on the mainstream than Zsasz, but Hurt and the Batman who laughs certainly haven't.

I kinda like Zsasz. He's an edgelord sure, but I think he can be scary. He's pure evil in the same way Miceal Myers from Halloween is, just an empty heart full of darkness.

Has Joker ever interacted with Zsasz? Didn't they team up in the first Arkham game?

I like this look for croc, the thinking man's croc if you will, I dislike the brainless animal he's currently, gangster monster boss croc is the way to go in my opinion

He's probably still total bros with Killer Moth.

100% this

I honestly think Croc works better as a thug. That said, I can understand why someone would be scared shitless of him the first time they met him.

Most people forget that Joker and Penguin were close friends in the Silver Age. Penguin faked his death once and Joker was devastated.

Tim is the Robin, and the joke is, he won't. What happens next is the Joker basically drives Tim around Gotham killing random people. He drives over some people then this. Snags the toy car that Tim was using to cut the rope. Then just as he's about to run over a Santa, Tim quotes something from the Marx Brothers and purposely goads the Joker on who and what the quote was from.

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And by Croc as a thug, I don't mean mindless monster. I like him as an asset to other villainous organizations, I don't think he should be running the show himself. Croc should be a guy who likes to get his hands dirty.

I don't think he should have a tail. Arkham Origins was just the right level of deformity.

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What shitty wank.

Beware the Batman had the same idea for Croc. He was just a simple gang leader, not really a supervillain despite his looks, but he was surprisingly clever and opportunistic.

meant for

I disagree. I liked Croc as proto-Bane, which was how he was introduced back in the day. He was way scarier, 'cause he was brutal and ruthless but pretty smart too.

He's trying to make Harvey feel look like a bitch. You say it's hypocritical and it probably is. Doesn't bother Joker though, he's just being nasty because he doesn't like Two Face.

I like this iteration of the Joker. He's got more character than the current edgelord Joker. He's a guy who can be tricked like this and goaded about comedies. I imagine this Joker to be a huge fan Marx Brothers, Three Stooges and probably Eddie Murphy and Jerry Seinfeld. He'd probably avoid killing the comedy greats if he had the opportunity. And yet he'll still run people down and laugh about it. A character like this is just so much more fun than the current bleached serial killer Joker.

I doubt current Joker would be tricked like this.

>death of the family
>retconned by flashpoint
How would it get retconned by something that happened before it did?

So neither of you read the last issue of the arc.

>Doesn't bother Joker though, he's just being nasty because he doesn't like Two Face.
I just find it weird Joker would dislike Two-Face at all. What happened to Harvey is what Joker tried to do to Gordon in the Killing Joke and what he's been trying to do to Batman for years. Is it because Harvey snapped too easily? Took the fun out of the joke, as it were?

Granted, I haven't read any of early Croc. But wouldn't that role be redundant now if Bane fills it better?

I'm not saying that Croc should be a mindless monster, I fact I hate the way he was portrayed in Hush.

But I think he fits well as the muscle in someone else's gang. I think the primitiveness of his disease would prevent him from aiming too high. He should be higher in the chain of command than your average thug, but I don't think he should be the one with his finger on the button that threatens all of Gotham in the way we've seen Joker, Bane and even Scarecrow doing.

I really do like the idea of him working with Joker. I like the way Azerello portrayed the respect between the two.

there are really pants big enough for him?

>if Bane fills it better
But Bane really doesn't. He fucking sucks nowadays. I think Croc would be a nice rival for someone like Black Mask, for instance.

I read it. Still doesn't make much sense that Riddler would CLAIM to want Batman dead (even if it is just a prank bro), then Batman would work for Riddler and nobody questions this. Riddler claimed that he needed to kill Batman at the dinner, then next thing you know Batman is wearing a green question mark armband and helping wage war on the Joker to.... secure his own death at the hands of the Riddler?

The fact that the entire thing was a massive ruse to make Joker laugh doesn't mean it suddenly makes sense.

Croc's kind of stuck on the Skwad now, but I'd like to see a story that really explores how the gangs operate in Gotham. How much does Black Mask own? Or Penguin? Or the regular mobsters like Falcone?

Part of me wants a story where it's about Killer Croc's life, and him slowly degrading, until he's hinted to gain the willpower to get back to his crime boss ways.

There was bad blood between them already. Joker beat Harvey up in front of his wife in TLH, and as DA, Harvey may have even cockblocked some of Joker's plans, threw his men in jail or whatever.

After the acid burn, Harvey was a rival gangster so they probably fought over turf. They probably fought over the TV remote in Arkham too.

Too much bad blood over the years and to top it all off, Dent doesn't have a sense of humor either.

And now here he is in a cage with a gun pointed at Joker, pleading like a bitch saying that he has the "right" to be involved in Batman's death, as though Joker owes it to him.

Of course Joker is going to rub salt in his face and mock him.

He shops at 4U Discount Pants Warehouse, same place Bane and Darkseid get their pants/shorts.

>Dent doesn't have a sense of humor either.
I never thought about it, but I think you may have hit the nail on the head. Harvey may have snapped, but he hasn't really cut loose the way Joker has since he's still clinging to his coin. To Joker, Two-Face is a guy doing a doing stand-up and embarrassing himself because he doesn't really know how to tell a joke.

King's Bane sucks, yeah. Bane Conquest is good though, and I thought Bane was pretty decent during the New52.

I guess the thing with Croc is that part of his whole character (or at least my understanding of it), is that he's suffering from a condition that is slowly eating away at his mind as well as his body. How can he stay top dog when his base urges are getting harder and harder to control? Who would WANT to work for him?

I like his tragic backstory and that he gravitated towards crime because guys like Black Mask and Joker accept him for his muscle.

But like I said, my only exposure to Croc has been BTAS, the Arkham games and some of the more recent comic. I don't know what he was like in the early years as a hardcore gangster boss.

I just don't think there's anything WRONG with him being the ultimate henchman.

I can imagine him after a heist sharing cigars and booze with his fellow thugs and just basking in the fact that he's with people who accept him for who he is. I don't think he needs to be top dog. I think he should crave acceptance and only be able to find it amongst criminals.

I do like his rivalry with Bane.

The problem with this is that you'd have to quit with the "destroy Gotham" plans for a while, and DC doesn't seem to want that at all.

>Shame they had to turn her into a Memepool knock off.

Well Palmiotti and Conner are goners starting next Is January (December being their last month in the book) so maybe we'll start seeing Harley in another direction

>honestly IMO the only guy who could keep a leash on joker is lex,
Well yeah, a mortal human who deliberately tries to harm Superman, isn't going to fear whatever Joker can do.

I imagine it's a very delicate balance, with a few clearly defined territory's that CLEARLY belong to a certain gangster, and the edges of the territory get blurry and that's where the fighting happens.

Iceberg Lounge belongs to Penguin and nobody questions that or dares challenge him over it. The docks however? Constantly changing hands, constant drive-by shootings and infighting.

I'd imagine Falcone's turf would be the safest for civilians to live on. He's work most closely with the cops. He'd involve himself with Batman the least, he'd be more worried about Maroni.

Penguin would be mostly concerned about Black Mask and Batman.

I imagine that Falcone deals mostly in drugs, Pengin deals in weapons, and Black Mask in extortion and money laundering.

I'd imagine that whenever Ras Al-Gul is in town, everyone knows to stay low and not make fucking waves. I love how Falcone shat himself in Begins when Scarecrow mentioned that Ras was coming.

I'd rather have a series about the villains in Arkham working with each other and doing shit while they're inmates.

>I think we can all agree that Two Face and Penguin hate the Joker
Which doesn't really stop them from teaming up occasionally and forming Batman's "Unholy Trio"

Harvey usually hates everyone including himself (both of them) so that's not surprising. Joker in particular loves tormenting him.
Oswald and The Joker's relationship kind of flip flops. Sometimes they are friends, sometimes they are enemies, sometimes both, etc. But usually Oswald plays the middle man and voice of reason in these kinds of team-ups (or at least tries to)

This just feels wrong, after years of seeing Harleys affections go ignored or returned with outright hostility

Joker and penguin used to be bros

And the villains hated how Joker treated Harley.

Yup.
Their friendship/rivalry was pretty fun to watch back then.

>After King's latest arc, it's safe to say that Riddler hates him too
These two have hated each other for way longer than that

Old school mob no longer exist in gotham, falcon is supposed to be dead

The whole point behind Riddler and Joker's schticks is that they create convoluted plans to make some grand point or show how clever they are. That's all they really got. The Joker isn't even that insane; he can say he's an agent of chaos, but he plans things to the hilt as well. Even in that Robin comic, Joker was both working off the fly and had some plans in place to fuck with Tim (like purposely putting a toy car in the car seat to give him false hope). There are actual guys in the Batman universe that are insane, and their plans fall apart pretty quickly. Pic related.

Joker doesn't like Two-Face because he's a diametrically opposed ideology. Even when evil, Harvey believes in a sense of justice and order, even if he has to impose it through his twisted perspective. Joker finds this charade sickening.

As for Penguin, Joker probably respects the guy for being a solid businessman who can actually think ahead and not get cowed by Joker's rep. He doesn't think the Penguin's his equal, but there's no real point to killing the guy.

Well that Joker isn't the normal Joker, he's like that because of constant electroshocks therapy that left him in an state of "goodness", he wasn't evil as much as he was harmless.

Its weird that one of the things that unites the Rogues gallery against Joker is how he treats Harley.

Whoops. Second answer was for

Because is a moron casual who thinks Elseworlds are canonical with the main universe

>that time Snyder portrayed Harvey as if he was completely and utterly incapable of making any decisions that didn't have two outcomes
>that time Snyder completely forgot Harvey's intelligence and lawyer background to reduce him to a petulant shmuck easily swayed by the Joker's fakedeep bullshit
>that time Snyder had Two-Face willing and impotently accept defeat from Joker's points without even flipping a coin as if he wasn't a dangerous and unstable man who makes wild decisions on a coin toss even at the cost of his own life
>that time Snyder castrated Harvey's character so he could once again depict the Joker as an all-knowing, all-powerful master villain who can crush everyone with just a few words, regardless of whether or not it makes sense for the other characters
God I fucking hate this so much.

This is what got me. Joker said there were a lot of outcomes with the gun, but Harvey had one decision to make.

>Pull the trigger
>Not pull the trigger

Why fucking not use the coin?

No, she concluded she loved him but after rebirth Harley/Joker is gonna get changes since this time she didn't have a thing with Deadshot instead It was Rick Flag so whatever happened in that arc will be recounted

There isn't evidence of Harley/deadshot so this aspect will be a change

Probably user is confused cause in his opinion Harley didn't hate Joker in N52

Comic where a crazy plan Joker hatched up backfires, where he places a bomb in Penguin, Harvey, Edward and a fourth guy if they get 50 feet away from him, so he just decides to go camping trip with them along for the ride when?

In Knightfall, Scarecrow discovered to his sorrow that his fear gas didn't work on the Joker.
oh cool, someome posted it: