What exactly is wrong with communism and/or socialism?

What exactly is wrong with communism and/or socialism?

Other urls found in this thread:

m.youtube.com/watch?v=3C-V6A8lH5Y
mises.org/system/tdf/Economic Calculation in the Socialist Commonwealth_Vol_2_3.pdf?file=1&type=document
thebalance.com/what-is-the-real-unemployment-rate-3306198
worldfinance.com/contributors/gdp-economic-wellbeing
twitter.com/NSFWRedditGif

It failed.

Oh, nothing. Don't worry about it.

national socialism is not that bad

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Humans are greedy and competitive creatures.

Marxism doesn't work unless you become authoritarian as fuck, and hold your ''citizens'' at gunpoint, like Stalin.

There isn't a 21 century Stalin

fuck trump

It can't identify and eject sociopaths.

In an "altruistic society", the sociopaths rule, because they can easily affect the language and mannerisms perfect altruism while being a sadistic overlord.

That's where the concept of useful idiot comes from. Yes, there are "good", albeit misguided, Marxists who genuinely want to help people, but they're just a toolbag for the sociopaths who take command.

The exact same principle is visible at work in SJWs. They affect being crusaders for justice when they just use it as a cloak to hide their sociopathy and extract resources. Those people will dominate any such movement.

The flow of money introduces a number into the system, and numbers are hard to fuck with. Think of the number as an iron bar on the door of insanity.

Competition with a richer and more powerful America resulting in a dependency on oil prices which then allows the opponent to manipulate them hunting the economy easily. If it wasn't for Reagan or Cold War in general, I would be living in utopia right now.

It tries to achieve full collectivism without using the right tools to do so. Socialism is at least doable with the proper tribalism (historically usually achieved through nationalism, see every example of powerful socialism, early soviet union included), but without something unifying the people other than tales of how bad the class system was a century ago you don't keep a people united.
And then come all the standard drawbacks of full collectivism; the need to replace capitalism with another distribution system which inevitably becomes very centralized and hence bureaucratic, the need to play down any differences within your collective and hence stomp on all internal cultures or memetic offshoots that aren't mainstream (which then ties into the censorship and modifying of history most socialisms end up doing), the issue of corruption that follows aforementioned bureaucratization, etc..


That's for socialism, communism itself was never worked to be an actionable concept, it's a name for an utopia that's supposed to naturally come along when the time is right.

Parasites and vermin the lot of them.

It's best to just stamp them out and annihilate them where ever they're found.

True.

First, it always degenerates into a most brutal tyranny and second, american plutocrats shit themselves in fear when workers demand something that makes them lose money.

It requires denying people basic human rights to function.

What we call simply socialism or marxism is in fact jewish national socialism. Goyim under communist rule is comparable to kikes in nazi germany, with only difference is rulers want to enslave them, not expel.

Nobody has ever tried it at all.
>all forms of communism that didn't work aren't real communism.
>all forms of communism aren't real.

It isn't social democracy.

Kek are you the president

What are you defining as communism?

It doesn't work. Literally.

>capitalism
>succeeded

Right

m.youtube.com/watch?v=3C-V6A8lH5Y

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Get this trending! Send it to relevant media! Tag #BlackLivesMatter

/r/x/pol/, we did #SpiritLARP, let's get this happening! This kills the Hillary

People in society only do hard work if it means that they will be rewarded in return. Capitalism is clearly better for that.

>Not an argument

Btw, contrary to what the american elite says, socialism is not a dictatorship (contrary to communism) and private property is endorsed. The reason why they like to confuse both terms is because socialism usually means higher tax rates for the wealthy and they absolutely hate it.

Im living in a socialist country as I speak and Im typing from my family's owned house without censorship of any kind. I can even write posters telling trash about the government and go to the national assembly's door shout garbage without being arrested.

Socialism is just like social democracy (bernie) who appeals to higher tax rates for the very wealthy.

>says the mouthbreather on his computer paying for internet access

They suck, which is why they were never tried.

The consolidation of power in government, the oppressive regimes, the lack of freedom of expression and ideas.

Because it is primarily an economic system pretending to be a political system.

My life belongs to me, no one else. My labor is the result of me spending my life doing something. Whatever that something is. Communism demands of me the results of my labor, which is my life.

No thanks. Not interested.

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Time, tbfh. It's too early for that shit. We're not there yet as far as our mental and technological development is concerned. The ideas of communism and socialism are way ahead of the current mental evolution of a human being.

It's a good ideology, but that's all it is, an ideology. Socialism will probably never happen until maybe generations later when people get fed up with capitalism and the 20th century anti-commie propaganda is no longer relevant.

I really enjoy reading Marx and learning about sociology in school, but I find it silly to become and socialist and hope for a revolution. Capitalism has within our instinct at this point, so of course an immediate change isn't going to be successful. In fact I think it's a waste of time trying to be a leftist in a capitalist country. You're not optimizing the political system that's dedicated to the right.

It doesn't work.

Look at Cuba and Venezuela. In doctors have to illegally drive cabs and sell stolen newspapers to make ends me and in Venezuela they have riots over a shortage of toilet paper and energy conserving brown-outs...

I wouldn't say capitalism is good but there really isn't any other option.

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You're right m8. And dont forget our 700% inflation.

Too many rules that have no basis in morality

Stifles originality and productivity. Takes the competitive drive out of people, consolidating power into a few corrupt hands. They're both a hindrance to the advancement of humanity.

Any socialist/communist lease doesn't actually beleive in the system. It is just a much better method of controlling a population. Either that or they are a puppet

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People become lazy when they have no real incentives to work.

The Soviet Union started ok and after a few decades nobody wanted to work anymore and they just pretended to work.

Suboptimal system.

Capitalism sustains itself because rich people spend a lot of income maintaining their resources (land, labour, capital, skills base). Communism failed and will always fails because it doesn't.

Humanity should strive for a Communist society, everyone would be equal, and everyone would be happy. I always find it funny when the poorfags here talk about capitalism like it's the holy grail. And then you have poorfags that have a few expensive possesions and think they're hot shit. Either way ur all scum and fuck u

It sucks

>Venezuela
Maybe at North Korea?
Regarding Cuba, it's hard to be successful being permamently under sanctions for decades.
Lets conduct a thought experiment - what would happen if the whole world imposed sanctions on the US?

communism isn't "wrong".
The thing is that marxism is not a complete ideology. it's just an idea "wouldn't it be cool if everyone owned everything there is".
Like a concept of democracy, it's not inherently bad.
But we also have to come up with HOW to implement this idea, and it's notoriously hard in case of communism.

The main problem is that it neglects personal interests and relies on cooperation for the sake of "everyone"s good while humans tend to work harder when it's for their own sake.

I agree it's something humanity SHOULD strive, but honestly we can't. We're all greedy self-centered jerks because we've stuck with capitalism with so long. Any first steps into communism/socialism will end in disaster because we have no idea how to do it properly despite the theory being on paper.

Communism simply is the lie that Socialists tell the plebs they will one day have, that one day labour will self organise, and the state can step aside.

>The state will step aside

Now does anyone really believe this? Socialism only happens under an authoritarian state that crushes individual identity, the family unit, and the middle classes and enforces socialist laws that are contrary to all human nature.

Socialism is designed for the simpletons/sheep/goyim who want their lives structured and handed to them by the state and told what to think and do while rules over by an infallible (((elite))).

International socialism has been the goal from the beginning, and with the EU, and the decline of America it is very nearly a reality.

For free thinkers, the intelligentsia, people who care about culture, ethnicity and traditional values it very definitely is the greatest threat that western civilization has or will ever face.

mises.org/system/tdf/Economic Calculation in the Socialist Commonwealth_Vol_2_3.pdf?file=1&type=document

TL;DR it causes a resource misallocation because central planning can't replace thousands of individuals engaging in voluntary exchange (doing the planning for themselves)

it's good in premise, but it always anded up in "dividing equally for all, but guys who do the dividing get more" sort of meme. which effectively ends in bureocrat/party members rule. part of human nature is wanting to get ahead and be better, capitalism offers it naturally, in communism/socialism people who want to do that will have no other choice but to corrupt the system, and they will.
t. ex commie country

>It's confrontational with differing systems, notably capitalism,

You have that backwards or perhaps 'that is true of all systems'.

>and numbers are hard to fuck with.
thebalance.com/what-is-the-real-unemployment-rate-3306198

Not Nationalist enough for Sup Forums's liking.

>sees number
>knows it's bullshit
>explains why
Thanks for proving my point, dipwad. Why is everyone on this site so retarded?

that real communism, pipe dream no 1

>I agree it's something humanity SHOULD strive

I agree that communism only sounds good in theory, i am somewhat hungover and i just woke up so thats why i am cheeky. I do like capitalism to an extent, but i think having socialist healthcare/education isn't all that bad. People in nordic countries can get their college/uni education without going thousands of dollars in debt. Sure it's paid for by taxes, but at least you have an educated populace with jobs good enough to keep the economy going. Capitalism is part of the reason why politicians are bringing in so many immigrants. People in the west are generally more poor, so they bring in thousands of people a year from across the globe to keep the economy going.

Except the number that policy is argued on is the 'fucked with' number. And then there is the sacred cow that is GDP.

worldfinance.com/contributors/gdp-economic-wellbeing

>The main problem is that it neglects personal interests and relies on cooperation for the sake of "everyone"s good while humans tend to work harder when it's for their own sake.

That's interesting, because when I volunteer for a community I tend to work way harder than I do in my job because I enjoy the well-being of others. Why is that? Is it just a preference thing?

>The main problem is that it neglects personal interests and relies on cooperation for the sake of "everyone"s good while humans tend to work harder when it's for their own sake.

In the short term that's true; but 'for the good of everyone(which includes the self)' is a longer term position. That's where the struggle is created, because people have trouble connecting how an action that doesn't benefit them now might benefit them later. We have that same problem in capitalism, look at the national research budget (including NASA) compared with other obligations. Just look politics; how often does a politician make a convincing plan to achieve something that might not be completed in their term or maybe not even this decade? Almost never.

Its the equivalent of being a 35 years old neet that lives with your parents

If you have to ask, you're too retarded to understand

Hillary might win

Well, if everyone was like you communism would probably work.
But here we are.
(to answer your question: there ARE people motivated by other things than greed\personal gain. It's just they are negligible minority)

>What exactly is wrong with communism and/or socialism?
It's incredibly simple.

When you reward based on need, we race to become the most needy.

When you reward based on ability, we race to become the most able.

[END OF THREAD]

Both are sanctions so it really hard to tell either those shit happen because communism or sanctions.

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What the fuck part of [END OF THREAD] do you not understand? It's over. We're done here. Go outside and enjoy your sweet freedom.

>Go outside and enjoy your sweet freedom.

I'll try, but I can't enjoy it unless I'm rich.

There's nothing wrong with communism, leaf. It just hasn't been tried yet in its proper form.

And it never will be because it's such a foreign concept to our capitalist instinct.

Human nature.

We're greedy shits. If you offered me the promise of a meager living for the rest of my life with 0 chance to improve it. And a 50/50 shot at opulence or poverty with the chance to improve, i'd probably take the 50/50.

I shitposted. You're being serious.
You're first in line to to the oven.

In their autistic rage against the realities of scarcity, socialists hurt precisely the people they want to help.

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the good thing about it is income equality(never seen in practise though) which should stop (((people))) from influencing the media or other social constructs in a negative light such as education, health care,etc.

ha ha. faggot. they should put you in a KZ