Anyone see this on Netflix yet? I honestly really liked it...

Anyone see this on Netflix yet? I honestly really liked it, it touched on everything from women in the creative to editorial to the fan culture.

I don't know why it went into a whole section about cosplay in the middle of a doc about making comics. Also they seemed to flip flop tonally between "comics have always had girls and we should stay" to "men hate us and you should never want to make them."

The skits about how terrible it was to go into a store as a woman were terrible.

I wish it had skipped the cosplay and talked about a few more historical female creators and their contributions and overall been more positive or at least cut out some of the negative feelings.

>I don't know why it went into a whole section about cosplay in the middle of a doc about making comics
Well that had to fill 70 minutes. One can only talk about Marston's wives for so long.

My honest opinion is that you should be banned for admitting to watching any such tumblr garbage.

does it just focus on women in the western comic industry or does it also talk about female mangaka

Why do women always try to get some sort of praise for the sole fact that they're women?

does she want a cookie for that? Making comics isn't special. Making a good one worth reading is.

A hold over from when they were an oppressed group in every society since the start of human history. Now they're only an oppressed group in some societies and have to play catch up.

Why do feminists constantly try to prove that "girls can be nerdy too" when there are women around the world who desperately need help from the feminists.

Speaking of documentaries on netflix, has anyone watched "Sex in the Comix"

You sound like a fucking dumbass.

What did you expect from Sup Forums

Also curious about this. I'm pretty sure I follow the works of more female mangaka than in Western comics

It seems like you were trying to say something intelligent but forgot to say something intelligent

I'm just fucking board out of my mind right now.

And I just think it's hilarious that these feminists do nothing but share some news about Malala on Facebook and Tumblr, but then spend their time raging over comic book characters not looking like them.

I wonder who keeps more women out of these hobbies, the actual terrible people in the comic stores or the media outlets who constantly parade the misogynerd thing around

It's about American comics, obviously. Americans don't tend to acknowledge that comics industries outside of their own even exist.

Let 'em have it. They have 25 years, tops, before the japs perfect robot waifus. And by then we'll all be of an average age where we'll be in our money-making prime, while they'll be begging for a slice of anything after the pussy market plummets further than WorldCom stock.

>the media outlets who constantly parade the misogynerd thing around


Comic Book Guy and Big Bang Theory are the most dominant images of comic shops in Pop Culture.

BBT is digital poison

That's a shame, I think it would be an interesting contrast but I guess that would just take away from the main subject. Now I want a documentary contrasting the history of american comics vs japanese.

I think he's asking as to why there's a feminist preoccupation with trying to get women more accepted/catered to in Niche Predominantly Male hobbies, where there are like ACTUAL issues out there.
But I suppose at the same time one could as why nerds care so much at feminists trying to break in.

In the end it's a nonissue on both fronts

...

I mean, those are the people you're gonna find blogging and saying asinine things on the internet, but to pretend there is no support for the actual issues is silly. Many of the women you're talking about do both. Plus, we're on Sup Forums man. There's no small amount of irony in that statement given the posts surrounding it focused on even more inane bullshit.

>I think he's asking as to why there's a feminist preoccupation with trying to get women more accepted/catered to in Niche Predominantly Male hobbies, where there are like ACTUAL issues out there.

Well then he's a moron, it's the grown-up version of the "Why aren't you eating your peas, there are starving children in Africa who would love them!"

You deserve a standing ovation.

IIRC, wasn't Malala Banned from unis because she's "problematic" for speaking out against radical Islam?

Will I get my furry robot waifu?

>tfw the fact that I'm female will always come before the quality of whatever content I make
>even if I made utter dogshit or something decent it wouldn't matter because they would parade it with "womyn creator!" either way

I hate these SJW/feminist types especially because sexism isn't even a problem at all for white women in first world countries. They just further the divide between the sexes and make men hate women.

No one does. That's why it's stupid. The Doc itself was made by a ton of women that make indy comics.

The problem is that they say there should be more women in big company comics when at the same time most of the women involved in making the doc are Indy comics creators that don't want to work for said big name companies.

Women make tons of comics. Just not for Marvel or DC. And that's ok.

It's like saying Pizza Hut should serve Steaks because I don't want to go to a steakhouse to get them.

If you're rich enough, then yeah probably. Let that be a goal to better your life and have financial aspirations, I guess.

>The Doc itself was made by a ton of women that make indy comics.

No it wasn't, it's a documentary from Sequart. A group that publishes books and documentaries on comics and the people who make them. Previous works include a history of the British Invasion, Claremont's X-Men, and Morrison's career.

>((((They)))) just further the divide between the sexes and make men hate women
ftfy

If that's true it's pretty fucked up. Speaking against radical islam is not islamaphobic and it's regressive not to. We need to allow left-wing and feminist muslims the chance to reform or it's going to keep getting worse. SJWs are really fucking counterproductive.

>Women make tons of comics. Just not for Marvel or DC. And that's ok.

You know there ARE women who are going to want to work for Big 2, right/ The "women are delicate flowers who only want to make indy comics and braid each other's hair" idea is silly.

Same way there are women who want to make gory, violent action and horror movies. You can argue edge cases, or maybe you can admit that maybe more male-dominated stuff has issues with girls coming into the boys' club. The "It's all on women there's no pressure again them whatsoever it's all Jew lies" is absurd.

Even if it's not the Gamergate rape troll house that thinkpieces like to pretend it is, there's still some issues there and they should be able to be addressed without a legion of lunatics screaming that the sky is falling and it's all feminism's fault.

I used to feel extremely uncomfortable walking into my local comics shop. Why? Because I was an outsider and didn't know anything about comics and figured the people inside would think I was a lame noob.

If I was female, I wonder if I'd assume it had to do with my gender and then leave and tell my friends the comics shop is a toxic environment. If I was black, I wonder if I'd assume it had to do with my race.

I guess we'll never know.

She was banned from education in her home country, and is currently at Oxford pursuing politics and economics

>Women make tons of comics. Just not for Marvel or DC. And that's ok.

Yeah, I read far more independently published comics anyway. Honestly, I'm sick of the superhero fixation in mainstream comics. I think it was Bob Burden that said "It's like if people started making comics about pilgrims and then it became weird to do comics about anything other than pilgrims."

Well that's totally different from what was suggested.

it's not you it's the employees. I used to frequent 2 different stores. The first was super cool, workers very helpful & friendly and loved talking about comics. At the 2nd they hardly talked to anyone beyond the FNM regulars. I quickly stopped going and now mostly get everything from midtown online. It's cheaper and I don't have to waste the gas driving out there anymore

Minority groups always get special treatment in current year. In any field.

Yeah I mean I just went to every comics shop in Gotham until I found the one I like the most, with the nicest people, and that's the one I go to. It's Midtown.

Correct. I was thinking of someone else who's similar. Her name escapes me atm.

>every single minority in the world has special treatment for everything

I find it hilarious how people seem to think affirmative action programs are some sort of blank check for every non-white, non-male person for their entire lives.

>But I suppose at the same time one could as why nerds care so much at feminists trying to break in.
I find it fascinating that you could ask such a question after all the threads we have about this exact subject every single day. Do you need it explained to you again how introducing feminists to comics have fundamentally altered the goal of comics, and likewise altered the ever decreasing fanbase in a severely damaging way?

>its a nonissue
It is very much an issue for the same reason I described above.

My point is, "It's just comics" in the end saying "there are real issues you could be concentrating your efforts towards" applies just as much to both camps.

Thats the dumbest analogy I've ever heard. Pilgrims aren't comparable to superheroes in the slightest because they don't represent the same things. Superheroes are many different things to different people. They're modern day myths and folklore. They're role models and sex symbols. They make us laugh and feel sympathy. What does tgischave to do with pilgrims? There's no basis for the analogy whatsoever.

Is it good? I recently watched Todd McFarlane's thing that he did for Miller Lite and it was hella good, left me wanting for more comics history stuff

Here in Australia aborigines basically do. Like free medical,schooling,scholarships.easier for them to get welfare to and they might be able to get more because they're abo.

This is because people who are into comics rarely ever have good people skills. They treat the shop as their little members only clubhouse. Obviously anyone who isn't a part of the small group will not feel wanted there and will just buy online for less. Whoever opens this shit should immediately hire someone with people skills and coach them on the basics and then relay deeper info trough them to the customers. It's a job, you're not just selling comics, you're selling a positive experience with advice and ability to discuss experience from reading. People don't get this. Fucking Comicbook Guy from the Simpsons still accurately describes the attitude of your average comic store clerk 30 fucking years after being created while everything else on the show is dated and pathetically behind the times.

Ayan Hersi Ali maybe? I think I totally fucked her name up, but it most likely was her you're thinking of.

/thread

I honestly don't care about your point. I just had to call you out on your extremely dumb assertion.

Serves you right for not exporting them to Africa. Did Britain really not teach you even the basics of getting rid of unwanted elements?

>I wish it had skipped the cosplay and talked about a few more historical female creators and their contributions and overall been more positive or at least cut out some of the negative feelings.

This, I want a documentary about female creators and how they impact the comic industry, interviews with Simone, Severin, Simonson, Scott, etc...

Hopefully avoiding people like Leth and Rivera.

The stuff about Jenette Kahn and Karen Burger was pretty interesting to me. I also liked to hear from Kelly-Sue a bit, though I don't respect her very much as an artist I respected her a bit more as a person after listening to her speak about comics. I like Gail Simone both as a person and an artist and I wish I got to hear her talk about actually making comics.

Overall it's a very basic documentary. I wish they had focused on interesting topics within comics. I think it dedicates too much time to justifying why women in comics matter. I wish the doc has just assumed that and asked "What are women actually *doing* in comics?" I want to see what they're making and how they're making it and I think it's a great opportunity to set an example for other women. And yeah, dedicating almost zero time to mangaka really sucked. Many of the best comic book creators are Japanese women and we don't hear from them at all.

Why would someone make this? Who cares enough to make a documentary about specifically female comic artists? Was there really demand for this? Was it made on grant money? Is it about how women made it in the field even though they were born with the terrible handicap of having a vagina?

I didn't say superheroes shouldn't exist. I said that it's a fixation. The vast majority of mainstream comics are about superheroes, which given the artistic capability of the medium doesn't make sense. Pilgrims may not mean the same thing as superheroes, but superheroes are not the only characters that make sense to write and the fact that you don't see it's little weird that a medium with so much potential is relegated to a single genre only strengthens my point.

Honestly it's partly because they don't sell comics in grocery stores anymore. If they could get an anthology out each month I'm sure they would find a very broad readership in grocery stores and walmarts but, nobody has tried it out. Maybe Kodansha will if they take a risk on the north american comic market.

Well they're pretty much bred out so we did reasonably well.

I mean I'm not upset about it. Plenty of good small press publishers putting out good stuff all the time. But... I just can't understand that point about superheroes, like... I don't have a problem with them, but it is weird that 90% of mainstream comics are about them. You can't tell me nobody would take notice if 9 out of every 10 movies was horror. It would be weird.

As a magic player I fucking hate that those stupid womans leagues exist. They are there to tell new players they should be afraid to come to events because the big scary men will get them.

I don't really keep up with bbt but I think they have been portraying the comic store owner in a more positive light lately.

I totally agree. I think it has a lot to do with where they sell comics. They doubled-down on the collectables market in the 90s and they've never really gone back from pandering to that audience. Don't get me wrong, there are super hero comics that I love but, they're not going to escape the back shelf of game stores until they offer shit regular folks would be interested in at places they actually visit.

People like superheroes. Superheroes subsidize all the other trash comics out there.

In recent years, non superhero comics like Walking Dead and Saga are out there selling. Buy that shit.

If you don't want superheroes then buy image and the rest of that stuff.

Nobody makes anyone buy superhero comics and to try to take what a lot of people like to replace it with something very few people is communism.

Agreed. Publishers like fantagraphics, drawn and quarterly and pantheon have really been focusing on the bookstore market for the past few years which has been successful enough that they have nearly stopped publishing floppies altogether except for passion projects. I think this has been good for the medium in general and given it some legitimacy. I suspect DC and Marvel won't ever focus too much on this route given the fact the comics are just propped up to be scoured for movie storylines later (in most cases).

That's the one. Hell, even being trans or gay means nothing if you speak ANY concern of radical Islam. It seems LGBT rights take a back seat when Islam is a concern.

In my initial post on this subject I stated quite clearly that I read independently published comics over mainstream superhero stuff.

>People like superheroes. Superheroes subsidize all the other trash comics out there.

Only those published by the big companies. There are a lot of small press publishers who publish outside of the superhero genre. And I guess Kafka must also be trash because he didn't write about people who wear tights and fight crime.

>In recent years, non superhero comics like Walking Dead and Saga are out there selling. Buy that shit.

The Walking Dead and Saga aren't really my thing.

>If you don't want superheroes then buy image and the rest of that stuff.

I'll buy whatever the fuck I want.

>Nobody makes anyone buy superhero comics and to try to take what a lot of people like to replace it with something very few people is communism.

This is one of the dumbest comments I've ever read. It has it all. Dismisses my opinion by stating that I'm trying to tell other people what to like when I never said anything remotely like that. And you call me a communist. Beautiful.

Nothing about your post negates any of what I said and if you think it did you need to develop better reading comprehension. The fact remains that superheroes make up the majority of the mainstream comic market. I don't care much for most superhero stories. It's strange that a medium with so many possibilities has limited itself to a single genre. That's it. You can dismiss what I've said all day long but it doesn't make it not true.

I like cartoonists like Daniel Clowes, Charles Burns, Noah Van Sciver, Benjamin Marrah, Crumb, Emil Ferris, blah blah blah etc. Just for the record. And I'm fine if other people don't care for it. Your lecturing me about what I should and should buy seems like pure projection on your part.

I disagree with banning anybody from speaking at universities but I do disagree with her on a few things. i think she's pretty much spot on with her points about islam, but her support of U.S. imperialism is troubling and counterproductive to say the least. I also think the regressives who unquestionably defend islam are pretty clearly a minority. Most progressives are pretty good about calling islam on it's bullshit while also saying we shouldn't fucking discriminate because of it.

>The "women are delicate flowers who only want to make indy comics and braid each other's hair" idea is silly.

When did he say anything of the sort? It's just a fact that more often than not, women who want to work on comics professionally are more interested in getting their personal projects out in the world than working on iconic characters. Sure, there are plenty of exceptions, but they're not publishing webcomics because THE MAN won't let them write Batman.

The whole "there's not enough women at DC/Marvel" argument is just obfuscating the problem of their relatively small talent pool and attempting to patch it in the most half-assed way possible, as you can see with Marvel.

Well, there are plenty of small press publishers putting female cartoonists stuff out there, not just web comics. It is true that most female cartoonists don't really seem to be interested in superhero stuff, but that applies to men too. There's a burgeoning market for creator owned content that's more interesting for people who don't care to be working on already existing characters or superheroes or whatever. However, saying that the comics industry is mostly a boy's club is at least partly true. I don't think the solution is to force more female creators into it, but rather give female creators the credit they already deserve, which a lot of people paying attention already do.

Nobody cares about your opinion, yo. Much as just want to read Spiffy comics fuck all that shut you talking about.

There's a lot of superhero comics because the shit sells. Nothing else needs to be said. Go read Paper Girls or something, and quit bitchin'

Do your work with a pseudonym.

It's what i do to avoid being judged as a white male.

>There's a lot of superhero comics because the shit sells. Nothing else needs to be said.

Even if I concede this point (which I do) it doesn't change the fact that comics are a medium with infinite possibilities whose main focus continues to be superheroes. Whether they do it because they sell or not wasn't and isn't the point. We're talking about a medium that is of course inextricable linked to it's market, you can explain how and why superheroes became the focus of it. That's not the point I was making.

From an outsider's perspective think about the concept of caped crusaders and stories about them, but also how many other kinds of stories can be told in the same medium and you will get my point. Just because something is the way it is doesn't make it impossible to reflect on it or alternative possibilities.

Oh boohoo. The big bad feminazis really have a gun to your head huh?

OP here, yeah the Jenette Kahn and Karen Burger and their help in creating the british boom and Vertigo was easily my favorite part, along with the Elfquest Creator