Doomsday Clock

Is it really him, or are we being rused?

The artist tweeted this so I'm guessing it's really Walter.

As for how he's back, it'll probably be the ancient wish fulfillment fan theory that Manhattan zapped him into another timeline/universe.

>That opening narration
>Actually is Rorschach.
DROPPED
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I don't care what others think. BRING IT ON.

I think its a case where Manhattan rebuilt Rorschach completely, yet he's not quite the same given that Osterman sucks at relating to people, so its his interpretation

Why? It shit on everyone which is his entire thing.

Yeah, probably something like in Xenocide. I wish more stories used that plot element.

Characters can't insult the retarded right without triggering Sup Forums

>People are still going on autistic fits about that
Just grow the fuck up already you god damn puritan pussies
Watchmen was mostly a product of its time and made social commentary all of the time, why the fuck would this be any different?

>which is his entire thing.
Re-read Watchmen. His entire thing is that he gladly turns a blind eye or paints wrong doings in a defensive light whenever it's being perpetrated by a conservative. It's why he regarded Comedian as a hero and said that at least Tricky Dicky wasn't a communist. This isn't a matter of "being Sup Forums" or not, it's a matter of them not understanding the characters they're using.

You speak like you truly believe what you're saying is true
How adorable

>Watchmen was mostly a product of its time and made social commentary all of the time, why the fuck would this be any different?
Because it was aware of which characters said what. Each person represented a specific stance on issues with Dan being the every man voice of reason. They're literally using the ONE character that should never be taken seriously on issues like the ones presented. Did you even fucking read Watchmen?

I dunno, did you?

You speak like you actually read Watchmen when clearly you haven't if you think Rorschach of all people wasn't a massive fucking shitlord.

Yeah sure classical conservatism. Not this nu age bullshit that is just rich people jerking each other off. Rorschach would say they belong in the gutter with the rest of the trash.

Yes, did you?

Because that was his character.
Whether or not he was correct in his beliefs is one thing, but the topic is that this isn't accurate to the character.

But at the same time Rorschach hated the US government because, partisanship aside, he's still deeply paranoid. Like "at least Tricky Dicky wasn't a communist" implies that he actually doesn't care much for Nixon, he just dislikes the communists even more.

Dude, he straight up hated women, was hinted at hating gays, and if trend follows through probably had the same opinions of minorities as that shitty Alt-Right book that came out. Hell, he was criticized for reading conservative papers that bashed poor people. If Rorchach was around today he'd probably be watching Alex Jones religiously.

Different user just saying, Rorchach was poor so he would not have access to alex jones. but I agree.

MODS
Sup Forums IS FUCKING LEAKING AGAIN
GOD FUCKING DAMN IT
DO SOMETHING

>Like "at least Tricky Dicky wasn't a communist" implies that he actually doesn't care much for Nixon, he just dislikes the communists even more.
Oh, without a doubt, the dude /hated/ Nixon. But that communism thing was put in there for a specific reason. With all other situations Rorschach is presented with he automatically jumps to the worse conclusion, that every women is a whore, that everyone would turn on each other given the chance, yadda yadda. But when his beloved conservative viewpoint is challenged? His first response is "yeah, well, that's bad, but at least it's not as bad as /this/ thing". Which plays into how well crafted of a flawed character Rorschach was, hell, one to be sourced on how to handle them honestly.

>Implying he wouldn't break into Dan's house to watch it.

Both of you are retarded and have no idea how politics work. Rorschach's views align with paleoconservatism, similar to Pat Buchanan. Paleocons oppose feminism, oppose gay liberation, and aren't too big on anti-racism either. Rorschach's utter hatred for women in general is really the only breaking point between himself and Pat Buchanan, and that's because of his shitty upbringing.

Rorschach would almost certainly not be watching Alex Jones, he'd be reading Takimag and Unz and listening to guys like Nick J. Fuentes.

You think you're getting paid to be this retarded?

If Rorschach was an anti-fa anarchist then I'd be saying the same thing. There's literally no point in bringing back Watchmen if you didn't understand the point of Watchmen to begin with. ESPECIALLY with a character like Rorschach.

>we've reached the point where we can't talk about fucking Watchmen of all things without people screaming about Sup Forums
Goddamnit

Everyone in this thread, myself included, is absolutely and utterly retarded.

Alan Moore's point with Rorschach was "Right-wingers are bad people that you shouldn't like, ditto with Steve Ditko". Forgive me if I think that's not a point worth bringing back in a sequel.

>If Rorchach was around today he'd probably be watching Alex Jones religiously.
Watching hell, he'd be sending Jones letters about every conspiracy he comes across. Some of them might get through too.

Meanwhile, the asshole in the mask in OP's pic is talking like a CNN viewer.

Does anyone have those greentexts from the last thread bout Rorschach getting super paranoid after being called gay?

Sup Forums being in this thread would be a vast improvement because at least Sup Forums has SOME idea as to how politics works. I don't even know what the fuck is on about with Rorschach sounding like he watches CNN.

>Right-wingers are bad people that you shouldn't like, ditto with Steve Ditko
A point which was sorta surpassed by Rorschach. Rorschach ultimately is a tragic character despite his beliefs which were brought about through years of abuse at the hands of a cruel world to begin with. He was an incredibly deep and complex character and to get rid of that aspect takes away that weight he had.

I mean that the way he's being written in the preview for Doomsday Clock reads like something I'd find on CNN.
Antithetical to how he was in Watchmen.

>is on about with Rorschach sounding like he watches CNN.
I take it you haven't seen the previews for Doomsday Clock?

>I don't care what others think.
Most everyone thinks it's hype. The few that don't are mostly here and even then it's likely just to shitpost.

I don't get the CNN bit either, but do you really believe Sup Forums knows anything about anything, let alone how politics function?

Watchmen alternate ending thread? If they reveal that he was trapped in another universe without showing said universe then that means pic related is canon.

>Rorschach ultimately is a tragic character despite his beliefs which were brought about through years of abuse at the hands of a cruel world to begin with.

If you view Rorschach as even remotely sympathetic then you're diverging from Alan Moore's intent though. That's the point that I'm making, people really shouldn't give two shits about what Alan Moore has to say about Watchmen because it's obvious that his creation has more or less totally outgrown him.

I have, and I didn't see anything that was out of character for him. Care to point out something that I missed?

There's a few smart Sup Forumsacks, yeah. There's a lot of them who are actually pretty well-read, observant and intelligent. If you wanna start a thread on Hoppe or Moldbug or similar actual intellectuals, then you can usually get some decent responses from people familiar with their work.

...

>If you view Rorschach as even remotely sympathetic
I don't get this meme. Are we not supposed to find a guy who was relentlessly abused his whole life and went crazy trying to do the right thing remotely sympathetic?

Like, yeah, Rorschach is fucked up and a bigot, but he's not without humanity and he's not heartless.

This. I mean, clearly we're not supposed to agree with the guy, but we're not supposed to hate him either. If anything that scene with the dude who killed that kid was supposed to let us into his twisted mind.

Yeah, you're probably right. I shouldn't let my predisposition against their views get in the way of whether they actually have knowledge about a specific subject or not.

>The good old days weren't so good for people not like them

Why do you think Rorschach isn't referring to himself when he says "people not like them"? Rorschach sees himself as an underdog, not a member of the upper classes who he despised. And besides, on the very first page of the book he talks about how everyone is pretending everything is fine when it's not. This is him talking about how finally, the people responsible for this clusterfuck can't ignore it anymore.

No, you're supposed to hate him, according to Alan Moore. That's why a lot of people here are so ass-blasted about Rorschach making a comeback, because writers acknowledging that he's actually kind of sympathetic would be shitting all over Moore's intentions.

Think of Sup Forums's understanding of politics as a fan of a rival team's understanding the rules of the game.

He literally watched his mother get fucked for money then he got beaten. How the fuck could someone not feel bad for him?

That's the thing. Rorschach the human is meant to be viewed sympathetically, Rorschach the ideologue is not.

>the ancient wish fulfillment fan theory that Manhattan zapped him into another timeline/universe.
Oh my GOD, this is the dumbest fucking thing.
Seriously, Manhattan fucking left the snow splattered with blood and gore. Bit of a graphic fucking "teleport", DC you fucking faggots.

Why should I give a shit about moore's intentions? If a good story can come out of this let it

Watchmen is political as fuck you dumbfuck and people is talking about a dumb cashgrab by the brainlet known as johns.

It's the "Totalitarians preaching for the return of a rose colored Republic" part that raises flags.

It's pretty clear he's referring to race with his comment on rose color republic. Which is what Rorschach wanted to begin with, a rose colored republic....very ironically, since most his problems were caused by said republic. Like I said, a very complex, flawed character.

>Multiverse bleed.

>No, you're supposed to hate him, according to Alan Moore.
Then maybe Moore shouldn't have gone out of his way to make him so depressing and pitiable.

I hope you're not one of those people who tries way too hard to distance yourself from the fedoras who legit identify with Rorschach's politics.

Ironically, the character who Moore thought we'd all relate to and love ended up being the most boring.

People process empathy differently. Johnathan Haidt's "The Righteous Mind" talks about this, people are hardwired to think in different ways. In some people's case, the deciding factor in how sympathetic you are depends on what you do. Like, to them Rorschach's shitty backstory doesn't excuse him having a low opinion of women or killing people.

Morality isn't universal, our values vary on an individual level. This is something that Moore doesn't really seem to understand in general.

That's how I feel, user. Honestly, Alan Moore is kind of a self-righteous, self-absorbed prat and his opinions on his work are pretty irrelevant to me.

What gives you the slightest inclination that he's talking about race?

I already told you, the rose colored republic statement. It's obvious the first page is supposed to be an allegory for what's currently happening in politics, hell, I'm pretty sure Johns straight up said that it was based off it. It's not unreasonable to assume it's what he's talking about when the real world riots it's based on are very politically charged.

Also I probably more closely identify with the Comedian, though it's a VERY tenuous connection at best

Told you.

>I already told you, the rose colored republic statement.

user, what do you think "rose colored" means?

>What gives you the slightest inclination that he's talking about race?
Recognition of patterns. Every time someone has a problem with the concept of "the good old days", it's the same harping on the oppression of minorities.

Even though that doesn't fit Rorschach's character at all, and my explanation makes far more sense?

>Even though that doesn't fit Rorschach's character at all
Hence why we are complaining.

Exactly!
It reads in Rorshach's cadence, but the words are all wrong.

Because of something that is extremely improbable and unlikely?

The words are just fine.

>extremely improbable and unlikely?
user, we both know which is more likely to happen.

I think a better way to put it - given the context of Rorschach's world view - would be that morality isn't objective. Rorschach sees his as such and sees anybody violating his personal code as just as bad as the worst among us. Obviously this characterization is meant to show us how fucked the idea of randian objectivism (his character is based on the warped politics of Ditko's Mr.A) is, as well as how we could see what could turn someone towards that mode of thinking. Whether or not he is pitiable or a rolemodel or whatever is up to the reader, regardless of what Alan Moore's intention is or what he has said.

If this was Marvel I'd agree, but DC has been on a hot streak recently, and so has Johns.

Given his dialouge either it's not him or the writer is a fucking hack.

>so has Johns.
He peaked on aquaman.
He went from writing one of the top 5 comics of the new 52 to writing stuff that is
Less good.

>all this complaining about the dialogue
>thinking that DC, in this day and age, would actually have the balls to write Rorschach the way Moore has without worry of offending anyone
I'd like to give them the benefit of the doubt here and think it's more of a matter of them trying to be PC and playing it safe.

Why people get hyped for this cashgrab? Watchmen sequel is dumb idea

Could just be a copy of the mugshot they took when they arrested him in watchmen and John’s is purposely using it

Let's not lie, I think what we're all really anticipating from this is how he's going to handle Batman and his cast.

>we live in a timeline where Batman will have to stop Rorschach from killing the Joker
I'm not sure how this makes me feel.

Either way it's garbage, because either he's out of character or it makes no sense that whoever it is has the same inner dialogue/journal style as Rorschach.

>If you view Rorschach as even remotely sympathetic then you're diverging from Alan Moore's intent though
Not at all. You seem to think that Alan Moore holds the same absolutist views Ditko himself has. He certainly doesn't dislike Ditko, despite disliking many of his political ideas, and he never dislikes any of his characters, no matter how vile and overall shitty they are. He writes everybody with the same care and humanity. That's what makes him so much better than most writers. He actually treats them all as people. No matter how left wing you are, there's no way you don't feel something about Owl's and Rorschach friendship for instance.
So yeah, Alan Moore's intent wasn't for kids to go out to play they were Rorschach but he certainly didn't want you to feel glad when he died or anything of the sort either.

That would set ruse to kill.

3 reasons, everyone who thinks Watchmen ruined comics can't wait to see Batman Superman put them in their place and deconstruct the Watchmen, which they kinda did in Kingdom Come but that more about the type of characters Watchmen Influenced and not the book itself.

#2 this is the next part of DC Rebirth, getting everyone one step further removed from the New 52

#3 Watchmen are actually still popular, and people just want to see the characters, and after a decade of Alan Moore bashing by the collective internet, no one cares he isn't involved.

>#3 Watchmen are actually still popular, and people just want to see the characters, and after a decade of Alan Moore bashing by the collective internet, no one cares he isn't involved.
This. I grew up reading Watchmen and wishing for more stories about that world and those characters so the idea of them finally coming into the DCU is exciting. It doesn't ruin the original comic for me; that still exists and if need be we can all pretend Rebirth isn't canon if it ends up blowing. Until then, I just want to have fun.

Looks like it's probably the mugshot when he was beaten and taken in during the Watchmen comic.

Who cares? It's going to be shit regardless. Johns has a fraction of the talent Moore has (or had depending on your view) so I doubt he'll do any of the characters justice. Merging the Watchmen universe with mainline DC was a profoundly stupid idea to begin with.

\Thats just his mugshot from when he got arrested.

Look at the bruises.

I just can't see Rorschach liking Trump who is so damn much like Ozymandias outwardly it hurts. I mean with being all about his ego, his hair, his fancy brand, and all that shit. The weird thing about conservatism at this very specific point in time is how much it's just a Cult of Personality about Trump and about hedonistic excess all of a sudden, plus suddenly defending Russia a lot. Even glorifying Russia. It's suddenly not typical conservativism but some worship of reality tv show personalities and a few super-wealthy friends who are proud of wasting their wealth and glitz and debauchery and shit at least on a certain level. It's pretty weird. I don't feel like it's really conservative at all all of a sudden when you look at the circle that's replaced people very rapidly.

well Rorschach is from a pre 9-11 world, conservative values have wildly shifted since the 80's and he's a portrayal of that worldview, he's more about McCarthyism/anti-hippie/anti-gay but he was also an anarchist, he had no respect for the system, where as now the system is propped up to near fanatical levels

Honestly I think Ozymandias has more in common Zuckerberg or even Hillary Clinton. Not that Trump isn't far worse than either of them. Because he is. I make the connection because I always saw Ozymandias as a neoliberal. But yeah, I can't see Rorschach liking Trump either, I think he would've voted for Gary Johnson.

True. I just know some people are saying a Rorschach suddenly transported to now would be fascist/alt-right, which generally doesn't sit quite right. He obviously had a lot of views that were nuts (Moore portrayed them as such) and that Moore found reprehensible, but for example, the Trump crowd now is very "anti-leak" and sort of about supporting the establishment and the system no matter what it does, and guarding the oligarchy at all costs because what's most important is protecting the wealthy and preserving their "version" of reality which would seem to dictate the vigilantes were scum because the cops didn't like them and that once Ozy amassed a fortune Rorschach should have shut the fuck up and did whatever he said because obviously he had more money and therefore knew much better what to do than Rorschach. That's more the Zeitgeist of right now than the 80s when the original story was set, as you said.

Are you telling me Rorschach is an anarcho-capitalist?

Not necessarily depending on how you define terms, but he was intended to be a Randian objectivist character. A lot of similarities.

That's a pretty accurate dissemination of the American right's current climate.

>Honestly I think Ozymandias has more in common Zuckerberg or even Hillary Clinton. Not that Trump isn't far worse than either of them.

The hard thing about Ozymandias is he might actually care on some level, though that's up to interpretation. A lot of people have read him as really being all about his ego and nothing else with the "I did it!" crap, that "winning" was what mattered not preventing Armageddon, except for self-preservation purposes maybe. If it's the latter and he's all ego, I don't see much difference between Zuckerberg, Ozy, H. Clinton (or B. Clinton), and Trump because really all they care about is themselves and how they are perceived. They don't have any real principles, moral, standards, ideologies, or anything like that. A lot of politicians are like that because the arena is about marketing yourself as a brand all the time, and that's who rises to the top.

That's why if you think Ozy cares or has goals for the world, it's hard to think of analogous real world politicans, or many other public figures, because it's really rare they have any causes or ideals (or principles), or care about anyone but themselves.

to me Ozy outside of the "possible homo" stuff is more like DJT with his bomb being Twitter and outrageous statements designed to distract.

instead of dealing with problems or discussing issues in a real tangible manner something the World's Smartest Man with a sizeable wealth and influence should be able to do Ozy decides to distract people from their problems by giving people something else to hate.

>Is it really him

Like I said before, it's Ozymandias, hiding in plain sight. At the end of watchmen he had just killed his entire network, and he's now lost nearly all his resources. If he wants to stay in the game, what better guise is there for a wanted supergenius than the masked hero that took him down, whose death is unknown to the world?

My point that rump is far worse was on policy not personality. Disregard for the climate, constitution, and most of all "the forgotten man" the guy he stood up for during the election whose now going to get fucked harder than anybody except people getting droned in the middle east.

There are policies that I think Trump is objectively worse on, but personality. Caring? I agree with your assessment that all those clowns care is how many votes they can get and how much money they can raise.

There are similarities in personality, but policy-wise I just don't see it.

I don't think Rorschach would take too kindly to literal communists marching in the streets. He would deal with antifa way before doing anything with Trump.

It could be one of The Jokers or a Batman from another universe, if there are more Jokers running around why not another Bruce Wayne?

>bring back Doc Manhattan
>bring back Ozy
>bring back the ginger
>will probably brink back Nite-Owl and Silk
>no sign of best boy coming back

Come on! Did they forget where the damn smiley pin actually came from?

>The hard thing about Ozymandias is he might actually care on some level, though that's up to interpretation

He doesn't really. He's just trying to relive his Alexander the Great/Ozymandias fetish. He's a goddamn chuuni.

I’d love to see him meet Vic Szasz.

I didn't say Rorschach would necessarily attack Trump, it's just really, really hard for me to imagine him supporting Trump for some reason. He seems to go against a lot of basic things Rorschach really values. Trump's whole self actually seems to really go against a lot of traditional core conservative values. I mean to a flagrant degree. It's really been strange for me to witness.

Yeah by the time he got killed, his face was completely fine. Either Manhattan got lonely and recreate Rorschach but only have his memory to right before he got out of prison or this is a huge troll.