Coraline = Kubo and the Two Strings > Paranorman > The Boxtrolls

Coraline = Kubo and the Two Strings > Paranorman > The Boxtrolls

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>Great
Coraline
>Good
Paranorman
>Meh
Kubo
Boxtrolls

Paranorman > Kubo = Caroline > Boxtrolls

The last act of Paranorman is so great to me, can't help but put it in first.

They're all pretty great

I wish Paranorman's quality was more consistent. The third act is amazing, but the ones leading up to it feel a little more cliched. Very standard stuff, and I didn't find the characters endearing enough to really get me to like it.
Now, cliched doesn't mean bad, just cliched. It's okay and fun; I enjoyed it, just not as much as something like Coraline. Kubo, on the other hand, is cliched as well; that I won't deny. I just like its setting, story and animation more than Paranorman.
All in all, the most flawless movie to me is Coraline, although Kubo gets to share a spot because I love the setting so much.

I really wanted to like Paranorman, I did, but it didn't do it for me like Coraline.
Also I think they over-reached a bit with how heavy the twist was.

Coraline>Paranorman=Boxtrolls>Kubo

After repeat viewings of all of these, I've come to appreciate Boxtrolls more for the character acting.

As beautiful as it was, Kubo made some odd writing and storytelling decisions. A little more subtlety would have gone a long way.

This, Kubo was a fucking disappointment.

fighting words

I'll fight you

Do you think Laika will ever make a real successful movie?
Will the move from children's movies to more grown-up stuff impact negatively or positively?

I think a good chunk of Coraline's charm comes from what a limited setting and casting it has.
All of the action is settled on a single house, and while there's a scene in the city, it's not very long. Because of being limited to one location, they made sure to make it an interesting looking location.
Same goes for the characters; Coraline is centered around her, while Paranorman deals with many more people and issues. None of the characters in Paranorman seem all that developed to me. Norman and Agatha are the only ones that feel deep somehow. And even then Agatha is barely in the movie and Norman gets too whiny for me at times. I know, he's going through a lot, but that's still a bit annoying.
Coraline acts like a real child does, specially one whose teenage adolescence is right around the corner. She's a bit of a brat, sarcastic and looking for attention. However, she's also pretty funny, so damn cute, and really loves her parents. All of the spotlight is on her, so there's no distracting side characters to really get in the way. There are some side characters, but those never show up unless Coraline is there, and even then, they are so cartoony and, while a bit cliched, still somewhat original that I was never bothered by them.

I don't think they will. Laika does whatever the hell it wants rather than trying to appeal to as many people as possible, so they'll probably remain cult movies. Besides, money isn't a problem for them; they're in it for the art.

>Do you think Laika will ever make a real successful movie?

No.

The mainstream is never ever going to care about claymation, no matter how many chances they're given.

Kubo was the prettiest boring movie I've seen.

Writing:
Coraline > ParaNorman > Boxtrolls > Kubo

Visuals:
Kubo > Boxtrolls = ParaNorman > Coraline

The visuals keep getting better but the writing keeps getting worse in my opinion. Hopefully the next movie changes things since there's no kid characters. They already said they wouldn't do an R-Rated film, but I wonder if they'd ever get a PG-13 rating.

You really think the mainstream cares that much if a movie is 3D or claymation? The LEGO movie was a huge success even though a lot of people thought it was stop-motion.

But it's LEGO. Everybody knows LEGO.

So you're saying that the only thing keeping Laika from making commercial hits is a lack of marketing?

While that is a factor, I also think the subjects they tackle on their movies are a bit too much for the majority of viewers.
Like all those dead children. For some reason stopmotion movies have this weird sinister overtones that make them darker than most CGI animated movies.
You can't appeal to the Disney crowd and other people who think animation is for kids with movies that show the shit Laika does in their movies.
Also, their advertisement is surprisingly lacking.

Kubo had potential but failed to live up to expectations in all but visuals and music.

I haven't seen the other two but Coraline definitely tops Kubo by a healthy chunk

This sounds about right. Overall Kubo is still on top in my personal list, just because the visuals were so stunning and rarely do I really notice great visuals and effects on my first viewing, but I kept being amazed throughout the film.

Paranorman having better visuals than Coraline?
I beg to differ; the other world and the character designs are amazing. ParaNorman didn't really strike me that much visually speaking; while it all looked great at the same time it was just a regular town. That final confrontation between Norman and Agatha did look gorgeous, though.

Coraline was pretty gud, its pretty freaky and I watched it when I was a teenager.

Agreed. The reveal blew me away and made a 7 into a 10.

I have not seen Paranorman or the Box Trolls, but Coraline is better than Kubo.

Kubo wins out on being impressive from an animation stand-point (in terms of how technically intricate a lot of what they were doing had to be), but Coraline had way better pacing and characters. A lot of the action in Kubo just felt very unengaging to me, especially the villain(s).

The action scenes in Kubo really left an impact on me. I might just be uncultured, but I never knew stopmotion animation was capable of creating combat sequences like the ones we saw in Kubo. I thought they all carried a lot of impact to them and were all in all just amazing.

Paranorman = Coraline > Kubo > Boxtrolls

I give Kubo a lot of points for its visuals, but the one thing I was hoping for was that the writing would be free from all the 21st century sarcastic dialog that seems to infect most kids' movies nowadays. I just wanted every speaking line to sound genuine, with no sarcastic quips or half-hearted humor. While I still enjoyed it, I was sorely disappointed.

Boxtrolls is a lethal combination of dumb and ugly.

Didn't they also do Corpse Bride?

Agreed. ParaNorman had the best script, easily.
Kubo was great but a little cliche, too fast and anticlimactic, though I like the sad end. Coraline has great concept and visuals but has some very obvious clunkiness in the dialogue and pacing and even occasionally the animation. Boxtrolls was a nice pseudo-British Pythons-esque quirky thing but it’s not on the same level emotionally or conceptually as the rest.

Really, only four movies? It feels like there should be more.

I know they worked on Corpse Bride.

They did all the animation for Corpse Bride, but it was work-for-hire, so it’s not a part of their official filmography.
Same as how Sony animated Storks but it’s a WB Animation movie

>Coraline has great concept and visuals but has some very obvious clunkiness in the dialogue and pacing and even occasionally the animation
Would you mind pointing out some examples of this? I'm not trying to be a dick, I just think the movie was nearly flawless and I'd like to contrast our views.
I do remember seeing some clunkiness in the animation, but it went by so quickly it never really bothered me.

Cartoon Saloon’s next movie The Breadwinner officially got slapped with a PG-13, and considering they’re LAIKA’s closest Western contemporary they should now feel free to step it up.

>ParaNorman had the best script, easily.
Really? I thought it was as cliched as Kubo, except for the third act. And even with that, it's cast of characters are all stereotypes.
Not that that is bad, I'm just pointing out that on those terms, Kubo and ParaNorman are pretty alike. I just happen to like Kubo's cliches more. Might be because I'm not American; I dunno.

The part where she has to collect the ghost children’s eyes and they’re whispering her encouragement like “only two more left” felt like a fucking video game.
There’s also generally just moments of tangible cheap and awkward that permeate throughout (scenes either going too slow or too fast, dialogue being stilted and unnatural). There’s also a general start-stop-start again nature to the structure involved relating to the “crossing into the other world” plot mechanism that to be fair it does inherent from the book but it means the plot arc and rising/falling action is not as smooth as a “perfect” screenplay by a professional screenwriter would be.
Don’t get me wrong, I like the movie (prior to its release, 12 year old me as a a big Nightmare Before Christmas and TMBG fan was positively obsessed) and you could maybe make the case that its pecular qualities add to its uneasy atmosphere but their other movies are a lot more polished.
Haven’t seen it in a couple years though, meant to pop in the Blu-ray around Halloween but it slipped my mind. It is time for me to watch it again

Sorry, let me clarify, because I agree with your statement.

Yes, the actual animation and visuals of Kubo were fantastic, and the action scenes/fights were more beautiful and impressive than those of Coraline.

I meant I found them lackluster from a narrative standpoint; none of the characters in the film really stood out to me in the way that even supporting characters like Mr. Bobinsky or the Keith David Cat did in Coraline, especially the villains. They all just felt really flat and I didn't care about the conflict.

Kubo was awful. I mean, good on the animation team for performing such artistic feats, but I didn't find the story memorable or compelling. It was predictable and safe. But I'm an adult so who cares what I think?

Did the target audience like it?

And I'm this guy: I feel the same way about Corpse Bride that I do about Kubo. Visually engaging and technically impressive but suffers overall from flat characters that didn't get me engaged in the narrative. I actually found most of the musical numbers bland or even outright grating, as well.

As far as my experience with stop-animation variants (that come to mind).

The Nightmare Before Christmas: 8/10
Coraline: 7.5/10
Kubo: 6/10
Corpse Bridge: 5/10

>Corpse Bridge
I kinda wanna watch THAT movie. It sounds metal as fuck.

They’re 80s movie trope characters, yes, but it’s got some satire to it, it felt like that connection was deliberate. They all have small twists on the formula and most importantly the dialogue was good and natural (all the modern-PG-pushing minor swears and references to sex and violence were so refreshing in a modern kids movie) and characters likable.
The script was almost 20 years old and it felt the most personal of any of their movies to me, like the writers actually had something to say. The anti-bullying message was actually well-done and different from how it normally is.

Kubo’s message about coping with death was also done well, it’s just the chosen one/hero’s journey/rebirth fantasy stuff has been done a billion times lately. That didn’t really bother me though, in reality I liked everything about that movie except the journey should have been longer and the death of Monkey and Beetle should have been done in a more climactic, earned way

It did feel a bit videogamey, but to be fair she's literally playing an exploration game with the Other Mother. I think that gets a pass.

I honestly found the pacing to be great. Some scenes might fly by a bit to quickly, but I think that has more to do with the scene not having much to tell than with the writing. Like the dinner scene in the real world; it's just there to set a contrast to the Other World.
On the dialogue... I can't really say much because the last two times I watched the film it was dubbed because I was showing it to friends who don't speak English.
I believe that for the most part, lest I am forgetting something, the dialogue felt very natural. To me, it was like watching real life, at least when we were being shown the Jones family. Wybie and Coraline's interactions were pretty great too; they did act and talk like children. Maybe you could make a case for the neighbors; those are more unrealistic, but they are supposed to be weird so it's not really a problem.
As for the "crossing into the other world plot mechanism", I can't really say much. It is how it's supposed to be; throw the bait, pull back, throw the bait, pull back, throw the bait and then catch the prey. I can't really envision a way to show this that doesn't involve that particular mechanic.

Would it be a bridge that corpses cross or a bridge made out of corpses?

I was thinking a bridge constructed from the living dead, but maybe it would also be used by corpses.
Maybe becoming part of the bridge is how the undead society deals with troublemakers since they're impossible to kill.

Why not both?

Maybe it would be a Viking-aesthetic parallel to those Day of the Dead movies, with a metal soundtrack. It's a bridge made of corpses that the newly dead have to cross in order to prove their worthiness to enter the valiant afterlife. Some kind of Loki-analogue or Hel-analogue fuckery ensues and the Corpse Bridge gets messed up.

Well, that's a fair point. I can see why Beetle wouldn't resonate well with people, or even the mother. Kubo is also more flat than Coraline. Mainly because Kubo is being carried by the supporting characters; Coraline is a much more independent character who moves on her own during the entire film. Seeing a 11 year old girl having such a steel hard set of balls is great.
I still liked Kubo's characters enough for me to care; that sequence of Kubo's mother explaining with origami how she met Hanzo gives me chills every single time, no matter how many times I watch it.
Regarding your post here I'd rate them as
>The Nightmare Before Christmas: 8
>Coraline: 9,5 (if I were a bit more certain I'd give it a 10)
>Kubo: 8
>Corpse Bride: Didn't see.

Maybe I'm just not as close to 80s cliches as I should be; I admit I'm form a different generation. I like them, I just don't think they make for very compelling characters. And even by cliches, these ones didn't really do it for me.
The language was a welcome addition, by the way.

Maybe this is just personal, but I don't really connect to bullying stories because I was never a subject of bullying myself. Revenge stories; that's something I can get behind, though. Agatha's revenge was pretty metal, and I can see how it connects to bullying, but it wasn't enough.
On the other hand, coping with death is a topic I find more interesting, as well as the hero's journey over 80s movies. Maybe it all comes down to personal taste over an objective view.

Would Laika lose face if they resorted to making an anthro film?

I'm just waiting for them to try 2D. it can be exprerimental 2d if they want, but 2D nonethelss,I will watch it.

No, but Wes Anderson’s got the market cornered
>Maybe it all comes down to personal taste over an objective view.
I would think so, as the Stranger Things phenomenon shows there’s definitely still a market for the kind of stuff ParaNorman’s riffing on

A lot of what they shot is composite work. Minimal physical sets w/green screen to add the rest via computers.

I'm not saying it's not impressive, it's just not genuinely hand-crafted stop animation like Brothers Quay or Nightmare Before Christmas. Heck, even Coraline used practical stop motion effects more than Kubo.

Even the skeleton is rigged up to several computers that feed it information frame-by-frame on how it is supposed to pose. They could have animated it solely with a computer but rendering realistic lighting and textures would have taken months. Hm.

Paranorman is overall meh. Scooby doo with a worse gang. It starts with "Its okay to be different" message, goes to zombies and then back to the message.

Kubo's meet is in the second act. Should've been episodic, so they had the wrong story for a movie.

Boxtrolls had interesting ideas. It could've been great with a little bit more to it. Most of the movie took place on that one square.

Coraline is great. Scenes, characters, stages. Paranorman lacked characters, Kubo lacked scenes and Boxtrolls lacked stages.

Kubo’s boat fight scene is more memorable than any individual moment in Coraline, other than maybe the Other Father Song

Nah, not really.

I may just be a brainlet but was I the only one not expecting the bug to be the father in Kubo? I wasn't sure but I had my suspicions with the monkey.
Either way I'd rate the series
Coraline = Paranorman > Box trolls > Kubo.
As I said before, I maybe just a brainlet but Kubo just wasn't very entertaining.

I always get a little sad going through these threads, because I actually really loved The Boxtrolls. It's probably tied with Coraline for my #1. Mr. Snatcher is easily the most entertaining and fun villain in their lineup, just beating out the Other Mother. I'm also a sucker for worlds with their own societies and rules, with the Boxtrolls really goes all out on.

I haven't checked out the Boxtrolls; I'll have to give it a watch later and see if what you're saying is true.

Please do. I keep hearing people bring up how ugly the movie is, but I feel like that argument is shallow, because the "ugliness" is entirely by design. The movie is beautiful from a technical perspective, and the characters are very well designed- it just so happens that they're designed to be ugly. Because of that, it felt like Laika was invested in creating fun and engaging characters rather than pure spectacle.

I consider myself someone who can appreciate ugliness, so perhaps it'll turn into one of my favorite Laika movies. Fingers crossed.

same here, Boxtrolls has fucking great character designs and is also the funniest Laika movie, also the little costumes are gorgeous

I want to love and make Coraline happy.

my fellow brainlet, i got caught pretty off guard by that reveal too

Same, but also with Norman

Coraline>Paranorman>Kubo>Boxtrolls

I wonder if Coraline and Norman would get along.

No, Norman would say "Ha ha, your face!" and then they'd kill each other.

Can Coraline taken on Norman? He's a tough bastard.

I have seen all of them but Boxtrolls, and I need to ask. Do they kill anyone or have the characters interact with someone who's dead in this movie to?

Pixar’s next movie is comprised of a cast of 90% skeletons.

I haven't seen Kubo or Boxtrolls but Paranorman deserves to be higher

>tfw the music during the confrontation with Aggie will never be released
It hurts

The first 25 minutes of Kubo are pure kino and by far the best thing Laika has ever done. The opening scene and title drop give me fucking chills every time. Too bad the rest of the movie isn't as amazing. Still good of course, but after that incredible start it's hard not to wish for something more.

Paranorman > Coraline > Kubo > Boxtrolls

Coraline > Kubo =Paranorman > Boxtrolls

Is there anything known about their next film? It's supposed to come out next year, so I'd expect them to have said SOMETHING by now. I seem to recall they announced Kubo pretty long before it actually came out.

Sounds cool.

>but has some very obvious clunkiness in the dialogue and pacing

Well it is based on a Neil Gaiman book.

Just that it would deal with more adult themes and no child protagonists (so far).

>more adult themes
OH BOY

Even if their movies aren't exactly consistent, you know you're gonna get killer soundtracks

youtube.com/watch?v=gxs2vS2gJ-c
youtube.com/watch?v=SOHoxz8zFqc
youtube.com/watch?v=Zn7S34jWS5Y

>those tracks
God tier taste.

>weird sinister overtones
Are we talking about most stop motion movies having sinister overtones or the stop motion process inherently creating more sinister movies?

Mainly the former, although the latter is definitely involved somehow.

I find it weird that despite not being remotely profitable we've been having a Golden Age of claymation animation thanks to the likes of Laika, Wes Anderson and Aardman Animations.

Well, Laika has the perk of being allowed to do whatever it wants because it's financed by Taiwanese children working their hands off in factories making shoes.

Haven't seen Boxtrolls, so feel free to fill those blanks

Main lead
Coraline > Norman > Kubo

Supporting cast
Coraline > Kubo > Norman

Main Villain
Norman > Coraline > Kubo

Secondary villain(s)
Kubo > Norman > Coraline

I rather liked it.

But I'm not the target audience, so who knows?

I liked Norman more than Coraline as a character personally, but other than that you seem to be on the money. Boxtrolls was kinda meh in those areas, with the exception of the villain, he was quite entertaining. I'd put him above the moon king from Kubo.

Coraline = ParaNorman > Kubo >>> The Boxtrolls

Fixed it for yah OP

>Kubo

Straight garbage. The twist with his parents is dumb and the mom's sisters are totally wasted.

I like the boxtrolls a lot.

But it feels more like an episode of a boxtrolls tv show than an actual movie, know what I mean?

Also the plot, certain elements of it, are incredible cliche. And there's certainly not much of a twist regarding the trolls actually being good. It's obvious from the get-go. So that was unexciting.

But still, I think it's more consistent than kubo or paranorman, so it ranks 2nd for me next to coraline

I want to hot glue coraline, worship the other mother and take lewd photos of the two naked dolls together

>tfw even if I got rich tomorrow it would still be too late for the auction

something that bugs me about coraline is they never explained why coraline didn't fall for the sewing buttons things but the other kids did

I mean, the implication is probably she's a stubborn little bitch, but they could have acknowledge it better

R u retarded

>Do they kill anyone

Yes

That's a genuinely interesting question: what do kids actually think of Laika movies? I saw Coraline when it was released (I was 11) and I liked it, but it creeped me the fuck out, and I didn't come to really appreciate it until later.

Anyone have a similar experience?

Maybe it's because she was the first non-retard that the Other Mother found.

I gave an 8 year old (who to be fair likes Star Wars and Ghibli movies) Kubo on Blu-ray as a gift and he loved it

Coraline > Paranorman >>>> Boxtrolls = Kubo

Kubo has great visuals, but that's basically it. Boxtrolls has a better story, even if not spectacular.

i wont tell,but it was disappointing. as if laika lost edge in this one.