Does this shit get better?

So I've watched the first 4 episodes, which normally isn't that much except it's only 26 for both seasons.

So far... it's bad. Basically my complaints are:
1. Literally EVERYONE is an asshole except Peter himself. I cannot stress this enough. Many of the characters are basically walking stereotypes (e.g. the jocks), but even those that aren't still seem to be really awful people.
2. Peter himself is a fucking moron. He nearly blows his cover for stupid reasons at times.
3. The plot drives the characters, and not the other way around. Far more than DC shows, it often feels like I'm watching a comic book in terms of how nonsensical or unlikely shit gets, such as the ridiculous lack of communication between the characters when you'd expect it.

I do REALLY like this one aspect of it, though: Spider-Man's whole thing when he's in action. It's more fun to watch than Batman in action, and that's saying something. But it doesn't even begin to make up for the other stuff.

So, my questions: does it get better? Should I keep watching? Are those issues addressed?

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>Literally EVERYONE is an asshole except Peter himself
Aunt May is fine.

> Far more than DC shows, it often feels like I'm watching a comic book
jee, i wonder WHY that is...

> I do REALLY like this one aspect of it, though: Spider-Man's whole thing when he's in action
SSM's animation is indeen amazing.

>Aunt May is fine.
Sort of. She still suffers majorly from the communication problem I mentioned.
>i wonder WHY that is...
So... DC shows aren't based on comics, then?
>SSM's animation is indeen amazing.
I'm actually talking about the quips and just how confident he seems in that mode more than the animation, which is indeed great and adds to the experience too. Like normally I'd be really fucking annoyed at such a character, but somehow the writing makes that part work.

The Shocker episode onwards is when it picked up for me.

That's episode 4, I'm presuming. By "picks up" do you mean in terms of what I'm talking about there, or something else?

Because the plot does seem to be on track for picking up at the end of the episode, but that isn't really relevant to my complaints.

I think you'll like the Black Suit arc.

Uh... thanks? Not that I want spoilers obviously, but I have no idea when that is, much less which if any of those problems I mentioned it addresses.

>Not that I want spoilers obviously

To be fair anyone familiar with the Spider-Man mythos knows that any adaption will do the Black Suit arc at some point. So, not much of a spoiler.

I'm almost entirely unfamiliar with it beyond a few key points, as with very limited exceptions I don't really read comics. So yeah, no spoilers please.

>1. Literally EVERYONE is an asshole except Peter himself. I cannot stress this enough. Many of the characters are basically walking stereotypes (e.g. the jocks), but even those that aren't still seem to be really awful people.

THAT'S LITERALLY THE COMICS! LIKE HOLY SHIT, HOW DO YOU MISS THAT?!

As I just said, I'm basically unfamiliar with the comics. But if that's true, then that's one thing that should have been CHANGED in the show.

Doesn't know anything about spider-man and get's upset when a perfect spider-man show captures everything great about spider-man.

lol

If there was objectively bad writing in the comics as you claim, it should not be transferred to any adaptations. Pre-existing bullshit is no excuse.

1. How is everyone an asshole? People have communication problems all the time. It’s akin to real life and doesn’t make them assholes. Is this because they’re pissed at Peter? In their eyes, he was being selfish and cowardly and Peter DID mess up with the pictures.

They do take it easy on him literally the next episode. The jocks, in particular Flash, get some great development later on.

2. How, exactly? You’re not being specific.

3. Again, how, exactly?

>So far... it's bad. Basically my complaints are:
>1. Literally EVERYONE is an asshole except Peter himself. I cannot stress this enough. Many of the characters are basically walking stereotypes (e.g. the jocks), but even those that aren't still seem to be really awful people.
Sounds like spiderman to me.
>2. Peter himself is a fucking moron. He nearly blows his cover for stupid reasons at times.
He does, does he?
>3. The plot drives the characters, and not the other way around. Far more than DC shows, it often feels like I'm watching a comic book in terms of how nonsensical or unlikely shit gets, such as the ridiculous lack of communication between the characters when you'd expect it.
You need stuff to happen for you to care about the characters. Eventually, Peter will learn stuff, Liz going to open up and Brock is gonna move forward. Still, the story plot will never stop.

So I recommend stop watching it, you clearly don't like and you are defensive about your current opinion. That said, it's still the best animated comic show in the past 10 years.

>That said, it's still the best animated comic show in the past 10 years.

What is even the competition?

>ITT: people get upset that user doesn't like their mediocre show

Why did you find this mediocre?

Characters were barely/poorly developed

Just keep watching. Only faggots drop shows.

How do you like Agents of SHIT?

LOL it's clear you haven't seen the new Spider-Man cartoon. You want to see characters with barely/poorly developed, dumbass? Watch the new one

That's not an argument nor a defense for The Spectacularly Mediocre Spider-Man

The thing is... the plot is very interesting, which is why I didn't mention it in the first post. It's almost entirely characterization that is really at issue here

Yep, good luck convincing anyone else though

Spectacular is pretty tame compared to other versions actually.

Never watched; never cared.

1. Basically all the school characters are SO terrible I would say it's too late for character development there. Not just the jocks, but the girls too.
2. The whole phone thing is getting ludicrous, but an even better (or worse?) example is that spider web he put under his table in his room to hold the tube he decided against drinking. One of the most idiotic moves I've ever seen in any cartoon.
3. I didn't say communication "problems", I said LACK of communication. In your excellent example, Peter didn't even TRY to explain his situation. Any reasonable person would have at least talked to his friends and told them he HAD to help his aunt pay the bills. And given that his boss was firing him, he should have flat out called her out to her face and said that she wasn't even paying him yet expected him to be 100% committed to his work instead of his own basic fucking needs. Even just from a purely practical perspective - if he doesn't do it and his aunt ends up not paying for something important, how is he going to be in any decent shape to come to work?
Again, this is what ANY reasonable person in this situation would have done.

And these are just the limited examples that I remembered after watching these 4 episodes once. There were far more from each of those.

Honestly if you don't like melodrama tropes Spider-man might not be for you.
Which is fine, but it really is central to the spirit of the stories.

You can do melodrama without making the characters assholes and idiots.

Sounds like you hate Spider-Man because that's classic Spidey.

The first few episodes had a higher budget than later episodes so what do you think?

What does the budget have to do with writing quality?

People who aren't you LIKE the "pre-existing bullshit". I don't know where you got this "objectively bad" thing from.

>I don't know where you got this "objectively bad" thing from.
tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BadWritingIndex

But the characters are assholes. That's who they are. It's being done on purpose.

You just don't like it and that's fine. Watch something else.

>uses tvtropes for actual writing tips

Oh dear. This thread is much more tragic than I thought it was.

>the autists at "please don't adblock our site, we need to get paid for our autism" thinking they can judge whether writing is bad or good
kek
Spider-Man became one of the most popular and iconic heroes he is because of the aspects you don't like. That's fine, no one thing can/should appeal to everyone, but to call it bad is ridiculous.

Complaining about TV Tropes is like complaining about Wikipedia. Both are far more reliable than the alternatives.

But in all seriousness though, TVT just codifies what is already fucking obvious. Don't write shit characters, that's objectively bad writing.

A "shit" character is a point of contention.

>Complaining about TV Tropes is like complaining about Wikipedia. Both are far more reliable than the alternatives.

I sincerely doubt I'm the only person who will read this thread and immediately decide that the fact that you believe this is a reason to bail.

Show is a meme. Only reason Sup Forums likes it because is due to nostalgia and being under ten when it came out.

Multiple ones, however, are not. At least in the same show.

Have to disagree. I've enjoyed a lot of shows where all the characters are assholes.

Maybe you're an asshole yourself?

Not a big loss. You people are generally idiots anyways.

90s Spider-Man is a meme.

>Literally EVERYONE is an asshole except Peter himself. I cannot stress this enough.
>everyone but the main character is an asshole

so just real life then?

>So... DC shows aren't based on comics, then?
Why the fuck are you watching the show at all if you find comic books inherently distasteful? You also don't know what the fuck you're talking about, DC's cartoons are comic book-y more often than not.

>I don't really read comics. So yeah, no spoilers please.
Then don't watch shows based off of comics.

I've watched and enjoyed a number of DC shows ostensibly based on comics. So please fuck off.

So I've decided to keep watching at least season 1 because it's not that long. A few things I forgot to mention in the OP... the bad:
4. What is with the high number of supervillain freaks, or whatever they're called as a group? It's like there's a new one almost every single episode, and they obviously have no time to be characterized really, let alone developed.
And the good:
1. I still probably like Spider-Man's antics the most about this show, but there's a bit more...
2. The plot actually seems to be continuous in every episode, a rarity amongst cartoons. (Even many supposedly non-episodic ones.) Also seems interesting so far, though that's obviously difficult to judge before seeing the whole show, or at least season.
3. I do like the theme song, though it's far from my favorite.
4. The animation continues to be fucking great.
And a minor personal quibble:
I don't like that Spider-Man has to use some (poorly-explained) gadget to shoot webbing.
It makes his powers seem... technological, which in another show might actually be better but really doesn't seem to fit well with this one.

Overall though, my opinion on the series remains basically unchanged. It's just not good.

>I don't like that Spider-Man has to use some (poorly-explained) gadget to shoot webbing.
Sup Forums needs to fucking leave.

>I don't like that Spider-Man has to use some (poorly-explained) gadget to shoot webbing.

There's your problem. This is either bait or you don't know good Spidey when it bites you on the arm.

>inb4 blog
Fuck off, I don't care. I gotta put this shit down before I forget and have no proof of this BS.

1. So Mr. Osborn (forget his first name) openly shows himself to the supervillains he creates? That's just about as dumb as some of the shit Peter does.
2. Speaking of Peter, that subplot with asking the older girl out is TERRIBLE. I'm glad it's over, but that doesn't wipe away the cringe. (Also newsflash: guys like YOUNGER girls.)
3. Just about the entire ending of episode 6 is bullshit. Again, plot drives the characters - first with the cops, and then MJ comes in and says a line that seems planted by the screenwriter.
And what the FUCK is with the pacing of that?
4. Actually fuck this shit, it's all poorly paced, and it all has lines that would be great in other shows but seem artificially planted and thus cringeworthy here.
5. and if Spidey's fighting baddies with actual powers I *expect* him to be superpowered himself. He's not Batman, after all. Plus what the fuck did the spider bite even do then? Make him extra sensitive to getting attacked? Useful, but seems really lame in a world like that one.

It seems like you’re nitpicking for the sake of it, but a lot of the things you mention are conventional comic book misunderstandings or core Spider-Man values distilled into one big love letter to Stan and Steve. So honestly, it just sounds like this isn’t for you, mate.

But hey, I’ll bite. Considering you’re so knowledgeable about what makes a good tv show, what would YOU change to make this a “good show?”

The ONLY "nitpick" so far is about the gadget, which I specifically mentioned was just a personal preference. Everything else is a MAJOR flaw.
>Considering you’re so knowledgeable about what makes a good tv show, what would YOU change to make this a “good show?”
Um, NOT do the things I'm talking about ITT?
But really I might write up something on that after I'm done with this show (whether I drop it or finish watching it).

>Plus what the fuck did the spider bite even do then?
Give him the proportionate speed and strength of a spider, for one. Where'd you think that bookworm got his strength and acrobatic skill from?

Yeah, whatever. I don't have speed radar handy, especially one that works in a cartoon universe.
Give me something not requiring measurement.

>So Mr. Osborn (forget his first name) openly shows himself to the supervillains he creates?

He didn't. He, Hammerhead, and Doc Ock were behind a screen watching the process. Hammerhead only communicated to them via a speaker system.

>What is with the high number of supervillain freaks, or whatever they're called as a group? It's like there's a new one almost every single episode
......user, this is a cartoon based on a comic book. You are aware of that, right? Why not just ask why Spiderman and his villains wear brightly colored spandex rather than military tier combat gear if you're going to go full retard about this.

For the thousandth fucking time, I'm comparing it TO OTHER CARTOONS BASED ON COMICS.

The school characters get better.

Some of the villains like Sandman get further developed in Season 2. Season 1 just sets the villains up.

nah you fuck off secondary faggot

>I'm comparing it TO OTHER CARTOONS BASED ON COMICS
>implying justice league, teen titans, avengers emh, batman tas, static shock, batman beyond, and literally every other comic book cartoon out there didn't have a 'villain of the episode' format
wat?

>ignoring the strength, speed, agility and ability to climb walls
Are you fucking retarded dude?

Okay, one more thing to add to the "good" pile: the choreography and general creativity of the fight scenes. It's amazing compared to so many other shows. (Though obviously without the great animation it would mean very little.)

Also episode 7 seems a bit of a step up with the introduction of GG and SOME of the characters being less dickish (the bonding between the news guy and his son was great, even if it seriously strained credibility in terms of seeming almost OOC). But a new problem has been introduced: gamechangers with zero explanation, which I assume will be explained later but are still terrible writing. I'm referring to Harry's transformation having ZERO context, and of course to the literal blank canvas that is called MJ. (The other school characters also continue to be about as terrible as ever.)

If an episode has to be rewatched to properly enjoy it, it's not well-written.

You are just retarded dude, we don't care about your retarded reviews.

Not even remotely to this extent. It is not close.
I somehow thought the wall-climbing thing came from the webbing? It's not explained well.
As for the others, as I implied in it's hard to actually tell if they're even there.
Please refer to post number >Fuck off, I don't care. I gotta put this shit down before I forget and have no proof of this BS.

Nigger do you not know how spiders work? They don't need webs to stick to shit retard, that's you being retarded, not poor explanation.
>It's hard to tell he has Super strength when he's kicking the shit out of guys that are flinging around cars

>What is with the high number of supervillain freaks, or whatever they're called as a group?

Part of the plot is about Norman creating supervillains for Tombstone to distract Spider-Man from his smaller crimes. The escalation of crime in New York is one of the recurring themes in the series.

>do you not know how spiders work?
I probably don't. But that shouldn't be required knowledge for a fucking cartoon.
>It's hard to tell he has Super strength when he's kicking the shit out of guys that are flinging around cars
Except he doesn't. Every time he faces more than an ordinary crook he gets beaten in a purely physical fight, and resorts to cleverness.
(At least so far.)

>Not even remotely to this extent
Please, elaborate. Tell me how even one of these other shows introducing a villain of the day in their early episodes is any different than this show doing that in its early episodes.

>but that doesn't wipe away the cringe
It's almost as if characters are established so they can be developed and grow as people.
>says a line that seems planted by the screenwriter.
Well, that's not wrong.

>Every time he faces more than an ordinary crook he gets beaten in a purely physical fight, and resorts to cleverness.
The sheer strength and speed necessary to dodge the shit that he does and actually swing on webs without ripping his arms out of their sockets is indicative that he is much much more than an average guy.

I think most of the strength feats are in Season 2, mind you. He picks up a gold bar easily and has his "If this be my destiny" moment where he lifts a giant fucking safe off himself.

Spidey is strong as fuck. And as you say, he still relies on cleverness. That's why he creates his own webbing, because he chooses the motif himself and designs something to work for it. It is a detail in his premise that expands and justifies his character beyond just saying "he's smart"

I'm fairly convinced you're trolling now. Not because you think the show is bad for XYZ reason, but rather because you're hating on a SUPERHERO CARTOON for not explaining a GADGET, whose inclusion or exclusion, is enough to drive more passionate fans wild. You're trying to get a rise.

But in the off-chance that you're not, I'd like to share some stuff about the plot.

You're watching a Greg Weisman cartoon. What that means is that the direction of the plot, and the inclusion of details such as dates and character machinations, are all painstakingly planned and mapped out. Weisman is known for crafting "mastermind villains" with extravagant set-ups, and the Green Goblin in this series, is no exception.

You also may come to appreciate the wordplay and Shakespeare allusions that Weisman loves sprinkling onto his works.

As far as new supervillains, Spectacular Spider-man (and most superhero shows for that matter) need to be "Monster of the Week" shows to establish the villains that will be recurring ad nauseum in later episodes.

You see him flinging cars, desks, steel beams, pulling shit apart with his webbing, picking up full grown men with one hand, what more do you want?

>Not even remotely to this extent
For real nigger? Static Shock has like 4 recurring villains and is otherwise villains of the week. Batman Beyond literally kills off most of its villains, I don't think there's a single one that has more than 3 episodes, and the number of 1 hit wonders is off the charts. Justice League the original really only had the Luthor and the New Gods as recurring villains (Vandal Savage I think gets 2 episodes). Spectacular Spider-Man has more recurring enemies than any of these.

Maybe you just don't like the show at art isn't objective.

*and art

Art may be subjective but a good chunk of his complaints are objectively false

>it often feels like I'm watching a comic book

3/10 bait
would sage, but any discussion of Spec. Spider-Man is welcome in my book, cause its the best Spider-Man show, ever.

Shit, is that actually shown at some point? Like where they can't see them? But regardless, I'm assuming the voices are still recognizable...
As I said in it's too little, too late.
Doesn't do much for my frustration now, though
Comics were a mistake. Remember that, user.
Yes, that was one of the major plot points that was explained early on. Thanks for the recap...
I'd have to really do a careful comparison, but for now I'll put it this way: they don't focus on the backstory nearly as much at the beginning, and more importantly they give them real traits beyond just their actual fucking superpowers!
>THAT FUCKING CHART THOUGH
I have no words. Other than "autism defined".
>It's almost as if characters are established so they can be developed and grow as people.
Making a character retarded to get rid of the cringe later is not proper character development, it's hack writing defined.
>Well, that's not wrong.
Haha, you know what I mean. It makes little sense in-universe, and is just annoying as fuck.
I'm not trolling, other than the occasional point made tongue-in-cheek.

I am quite familiar with Greg Weisman's work. To the point that I actually had a bit of a theory about his writing style that this series seems to be confirming.

And I don't really appreciate the wordplay and referential quips in this show, which is unusual as I usually find that kind of stuff to be great. But here it's REALLY forced 99% of the time.

You can do MOTW better. Not like this, though.

>I have no words. Other than "autism defined".
I made it to spare you these fucking threads. Every month we have one with the exact same shit.

>Making a character retarded to get rid of the cringe later is not proper character development, it's hack writing defined.
So should a character have been perfect from the getgo and not make mistakes in areas they have no experience? A character should do things right the first time? How do you have a plot, then?

>it often feels like I'm watching a comic book
Bleh! I know it's bait but it still pisses me off. Considering how many adaptations absolutely butcher the source material they're based off from, nailing the style and feel of the original should be the highest form of praise.

>You can do MOTW better. Not like this, though.
Don't backpedal, you said not to this extent, not "not at this level of quality". You're full of shit man. There's like 10 enemies total in this show and all of them recur save 1 I think.

ITT idiots

OP is clearly a troll, I have never watched that Spider-Man show (the only one I never got a chance to see, actually) so I'm not saying this as a fanboy, but it's obvious OP is baiting you idiots

We've repeatedly called him out on it and no one is getting mad, so he just looks like a retard.

>they don't focus on the backstory nearly as much at the beginning, and more importantly they give them real traits beyond just their actual fucking superpowers!
So what you're saying is, you've never actually watched any of these shows. Villains rarely get major backstory revealed in their premiere episodes unless they're one-off villains that never reappear in the series again. By not blowing the villain's load all at once the writers leave something about the characters to explore later down the line when they inevitably get brought back for a rematch.

>Implying we aren't all in here just shitposting for fun
November always seems to be a slow month for cartoons, and it really shows on Sup Forums. Heck, even W.H.I.T.C.H fag is getting more attention than usual from anons

>So should a character have been perfect from the getgo and not make mistakes in areas they have no experience? A character should do things right the first time? How do you have a plot, then?
That's not what I'm saying at all, stop stretching my statements.
Making mistakes isn't the same thing as being utterly retarded. Even more so if it's OOC.
>nailing the style and feel of the original should be the highest form of praise.
Of course! But that does not apply for nailing the writing failures of the original!
I'm not backpedaling whatsoever. In this case quantity and quality are inextricably linked.
And I'm currently talking about the first part of season 1 only, as I have yet to see the rest.
I think you misunderstood my post. That's what I'm arguing FOR, and what this show does not seem to do much.
Fags like you are why Sup Forums is failing as a board.

>But that does not apply for nailing the writing failures of the original!
This coming from someone who never read the source material in the first place. If you don't like typical Spiderman tropes, why watch a Spiderman cartoon? The dude's entire mythos is built upon his struggle to balance his superhero responsibility with his regular life and how this often causes mishaps and misunderstandings.

>Fags like you are why Sup Forums is failing as a board
Dunno, shitposting 24/7 is working out pretty well for Sup Forums. They've usually got at least 3-4 console war threads going up daily, and their board is thriving. Meanwhile Sup Forums is a relative ghost town.

Episode 8: the writing went exactly the WRONG way with MJ's character. Fucking shit.

Otherwise mostly plot like episode 7, so at least not much character bullshit to suffer through. (Other than rushed and barely explained relationshit where it seems like everyone is cheating on everyone else...)

That has nothing to do with the other characters being utter assholes, let alone idiots
Unless we're talking serious hack writing...

This thread has the stench of WITCH faggotry all over it.

Oh look, it's you! Still seeing me everywhere, eh?
How can I be getting more attention this month if I barely started posting about it last month?

Cut the crap, dude. You wouldn't have responded if you weren't already in this thread.

I follow lots of threads. Gotta keep track of things.

You'd have known that if you weren't a newfag...

WITCHfag is the guy posting this dumbass review. He did it with his other top five favorite shows or whatever the fuck.
Fuck off my dude. You know nothing about comics or how to write a character properly.

>WITCHfag is the guy posting this dumbass review. He did it with his other top five favorite shows or whatever the fuck.
Oh yeah? Where's the evidence, faggot?

Doubt you can even USE the fucking archives.