Would Sauron make a good foe to anyone in either the DC or Marvel universe?

Would Sauron make a good foe to anyone in either the DC or Marvel universe?

In a fight the Justice League could probably take him. I know he is supposed to be a fallen angel, but he didn't really do much, he's more of a schemer.

First age and before shapeshifting unkillable Sauron would be good.

Third age Sauron is more like an evil genius schemer. He would not be too amazing in a fight against superhumans.

He would be a good Dr Strange villain since he is much more of a thinker and plotter than the typical Dr Strange villain that usually just outpowers him.

any time he actually has to fight he gets fucked up.

The Lantern Cores wouldn't be safe.

Put in him a world that ONLY has the Batfamily and make a story about Batman figuring out how to Stealth a ring of power into enemy territory with an army on his tail and that corrupts your soul, and it could be a pretty entertaining story.

Like usually I don't like BatGod, but I think that would be pretty fun.

I always thought he was a pretty cool X-Men villain.

To pic related, he would be perfect.

A reminder that Sauron lost a fight to a dog.

It was a pretty big dog.

I wonder if Batman would be arrogant enough to try and use the Ring?

For Sauron

Yes, but I'm having trouble thinking of who would be an appropriate nemesis. Justice League/Avenger level seems fair. Sauron never struck me as a cosmic threat.

He would. And get corrupted pretty damn fast like last time he had powers.

Fucking Hawkman.

LOTR's idea of magic and power can be a little nebulous. It's not like having attacks or spells, though spells are sometimes used. It's more metaphysical and spiritual. Powerful beings in LOTR like Sauron or Galadriel are generally just able to work their will on the world, in ways that are never entirely laid out.

>FOOL
Still slightly disappointed that Shadow Of Mordor wasn't a Third Age story about Morgoth attempting to return, but I have a little hope for the Netflix series.

It's more like a series of Skills rather than magic itself. We just don't understand it because the writers of the stories don't understand them. Bilbo and Frodo have no idea how this thinks work, therefore they are called magic.

Morgoth's return is essentially LOTR version of Ragnarok though. There'd be nothing left to tell after that.

I said trying.

It'd be a great fucking game though. Also Middle Earth after Sauron's defeat is pretty uncharted territory, the only reason Tolkien didn't end up writing his sequel is because he couldn't think up an adequate villain.

have the Demon Knights face him.

Also a lot of the cool shit people like about Middle-Earth goes away after the War of the Ring. The elves all leave, all the Istari leave, the ents are pretty much all gone. The hobbits and the dwarves are still around but they largely keep to themselves.

True. Which I blame on Tolkien's weird obsession with the glorification of Old over New

Didn't he start writing a sequel, but never finished it though?

I think the Mirkwood Elves stuck around, and I'm pretty sure the Orcs didn't just drop dead.

Don't know about the rest of you, but I'd love to see the Justice League fight a Balrog, or at the very least Wonder Woman

It's just a giant monster though, the kind superheroes fight every other week.

I don't think Sauron could control them. Definitely not without the Ring.

So did Odin

>the only reason Tolkien didn't end up writing his sequel is because he couldn't think up an adequate villain.
No, he stopped because it was just too depressing and wouldn't have made a great story

>The hobbits and the dwarves are still around
They too fade away into myth and legend pretty quickly

If the balrog in Moria had defeated Gandalf it would have slaughtered the Fellowship and then taken the Ring for itself, and with the Ring it probably would have been able to defeat and replace Sauron. Balrogs are Maia spirits, and Sauron is a Maia too. They're close enough in strength that the Ring would have made up the difference.

Smaug could probably have used the Ring, too, assuming he found a way to tap its power. Of course at the time Gandalf didn't know the ring Bilbo had found was THE Ring. But if Smaug had gotten it he might have been able to use it, since Tolkien's dragons are spiritually powerful, also.

Didn't the Orcs just slowly die out without any greater being uniting them?

They're more than that, they're basically like corrupted angels or whatever, and were Morgoth's terrifying personal guard. They're walking, burning magical death incarnate. Gandalf got lucky, and died after killing one. So yeah, its a fair matchup
Debatable, they only appeared to listen to Morgoth, who makes Sauron look like a bitch

That would work perfectly with the Orc Army mechanic in Shadow of Mordor.

Well alright, it was a 2 part reason

Fun fact, he named himself after the Tolkien sauron

Nerd

>Balrogs are Maia spirits
Maiar. Maia is singular, maiar is plural.

Actually no, the lived on until modern times. All of mankinds nastier inventions had some Orcish involvement.

>They're more than that, they're basically like corrupted angels or whatever, and were Morgoth's terrifying personal guard. They're walking, burning magical death incarnate. Gandalf got lucky, and died after killing one. So yeah, its a fair matchup
Ok, so they are magic fire monsters, which is still pretty average for superhero enemies.

You're a nerd for knowing about such a lame villain

>tfw you will never kill a balrog by ramming the spike on your helmet into its guts.

It depends?
If we go movie wise, his magic is kind of vague and not really that physically powerful except for the fact that you cannot actually kill him.
Book wise his powerlevel sort of varies wildly, but his magic is definitely a whole force to be reckoned with for any cape.

Nuffin to see 'ere 'Umie

Well Superman is vulnerable to magic, and depending on how strong/old the magic is it can be complicating for the Justice League. Balrogs were First Age nightmares that people just hoped remained buried forever. All I'm saying is it would be entertaining to see Wonder Woman fight one

Dr Fate would fuck them up.

>depending on how strong/old the magic
That's the problem, "magic" in LotR doesn't necessarily translate well out of the setting

Actually they are more like fallen angels that crafted bodies for themselves out of smoke, and then the middle earth version of Lucifer gave them some of his power to add fire to their smoke bodies.

They can only be harmed by items of power or badasses that gain metaphysical might by simply being heroes.

That means they would be awesome guys to fight against, but certain heroes would be kinda sol.

...

Would he? A bunch of Balrogs kicked the piss out of giant interdimensional shadow spider moster hopped up on god tier relics and ready to devour all of existence.

That seems well within range of Fate.

Yeah I get the feeling the movies really undersold how fucking terrifying Balrogs really are

Like in the part where everybody shit their pants and ran away when one got close?

In Tolkien's work, making something perfect with a lot of craftsmanship and effort could imbued it with otherworldly properties. If you spent a decade forging a sword from the best materials, crafting only by starlight, and your intent was to craft something beautiful that would capture the starlight, you might end up with a blade that glows in the dark and has an edge as sharp as the moon's edge, or something like that.

Tolkien was all about the differences between hard work and using your power compared to the dangers of giving up your power to gain allies and cutting corners.

Tolkien was all about creation, sub creation and corruption,
"Leaf by Nigger" kind of goes into that.

Shit
Leaf by Niggle

Okay that was funny

You uh.... got something on your mind, user?

Just my copy of the Tolkien Reader.

That made me chuckle.

He was also about enabling other people with your power and knowledge being a good thing while empowering other people by giving them some of your power as a bad thing.

If you notice, all of his good characters will craft things for people, give them knowledge, or using their power to summon something to carry them or etc.

The bad people always give give a bit of themselves to their followers to make them more badass, but it always bites them in the butt. Morgoth went from Lucifer tier to giant made of cuttable meat and breakable bones due to that. The One Ring is the epitome of this when Sauron literally gave the majority of his essence to craft it and is destroyed by it.

He's already a part of DC via Darkseid.
They both represent this unassailable force that seeks to control and dominate the masses with an army, supernatural powers, and items that give them the ability to brainwash others (the One Ring, the Anti-Life Equation), which forces a group of heroes to band together to stop such a great evil.

Completely different characters in my mind. Darkseid is his own guy, Sauron is kind of like the last general from his administration, and is basically trying to salvage some kind of victory.

Sauron was like the spy master and enforcer for the middle-earth's version of Darkseid.

I think so. Sauron has a lot of qualities that make for a good comics villain:

Distinct visual aesthic is always a plus.

Its easy to 'kill' Sauron and bring him back from the dead time and time again, which is handy.

And he is a villain who benefits from prep time. Sauron is more of an artificer than a sorcerer. He makes himself stronger and carries out his plans by forging cool shit.

Make his Ringwraiths be villains and heroes that he has corrupted with his power, which start off as generic fill-ins but over time tends to collect B and C listers in need of a home, editorially speaking. Sauron can only exert absolute control over up to 9 Nazgul at a time, and absolute control is the only kind he tolerates, but he is more than willing to take any opportunity he sees to 'trade up' a defeated or otherwise weak Nazgul for a new and more obviously powerful or useful minion, if he gets the chance to bring them under his power.

Hell if you wanted to bend the rules a little, you could have some Nazgul be killed in certain fights, but their rings survive, and Sauron is able to retrieve them and offer them to new hosts to get back up to nine. Kind of like a version of Apocalypse's Horsemen.

Is it just me or does he look short and fat in this pic? I always thought this shot was unflattering for him.

>Kind of like a version of Apocalypse's Horsemen.

I was thinking that, except less voluntary. Sauron got his 9 by tricking them into accepting powerful that corrupted them into his service. Getting heroes to accept powerful tools from a mysterious stranger might not be easy, but villains generally are less scrupulous.

In the modern world, he might not even be restricted to what we would consider magical artifacts. He could start working his power into things that appear more overtly technological, like building a set of 'super armor' for someone that does the same thing as the rings. For heroes, its probably more underhanded. Imagine, for example, Sauron doing the usual 'capture the hero, monologue, get defeated by the hero' routine, but the real goal was to enchant Batman's utility belt to slowly dominate him over time.

Speaking of heroes, Sauron's all-seeing eye is going to make secret identities a pain in the ass to keep.

Yeah, he could. If he had to go all out, he could wipe the floor with a Valar.

Strange could probably go further than Fate, guy could go Avatar of Eternity and mess with all the Balrogs AND Sauron.

In this comparison Sauron is basically a Steppenwolf type but more evil genius/coniving, yes?

Green Lantern jumps out at me because of the ring motif. Maybe have him fuck with the various corps' rings as part of some master plan.

>One Lantern Ring to rule them all
Neato

Sauron would be combo of Granny Goodness and Glorious Godfrey. She was in charge of propaganda and conditioning. He was in charge of subterfuge and infiltration. Maybe even a little Desaad in there as well as the doting schemer.

Never read Green Lantern comics but GLTAS made it seem like the orange ring was inspired by Sauron's ring and Larfleeze was basically Gollum.

if he has the ring, yes.

The orange light is avarice, and so potent that Larfleeze is the only one to possess it. Having more than one would obviously mean sharing the light. In fact The Guardians knew this and quarantined Larfleeze and the orange light to an off limits space sector.

Pretty much. Also Sauron is perfectly fine waiting a few centuries/millenia to get a plan in motion.

His race's year is equivalent to 800-something of our years.
I could see a ring giving someone huge amounts of pull in the mortal world, but their nights belong to Sauron as a wraith. We don't know who the rings are until they are killed off, but almost always they are a well known individual.
Strange pre-Bendis era nerfing to being a stage magician could probably find a way to kill the Balrogs and etc, but I think Fate is a bit low tier.

Morgoth in his prime was on Lucifer/Dormammu/Elder God levels of crazy powerful. He existed before existence, would roam the void to try to find out the secret of that universe's God so he could create true life.

Well if an ordinary mortal with only a shard of his sword could screw Sauron I don't like his chances when some super powered meta beings figure out the key to defeating him is go for the ring on his finger

It wasn't a regular sword, it was magic, and the guy got off the luckiest shot in the history of Middle Earth

Sword was a divine artifact created for the true king to wield, the man was a powerful mortal king in a universe where having royal blood literally makes you more powerful, also he had elf blood and was probably 200 years old, and Sauron had newly forged his ring and didn't realize he should watch out for his ring getting removed.

I'd say a Lord of the Ring story using Batman heroes and villains would be damn entertaining. I would read the hell out of that. Tim Drake as Frodo. Bruce as Aragon. Nightwing as Gandalf. The Joker as Gollum.

penguin as gollum. Joker as mouth of sauron

>newly forged his ring
That ring was already thousands of years old by the time that fight happened.

He had ideas about after Aragorn's reign their were cults worshiping Sauron and other things. Decided against it because he thought it was depressing.

He did regret not expanding on Orcs and goblins. He wanted to write a story about an orc overcoming the nature Morgoth inflicted on them.

Oh, a LotR where Joker uses the Mad Hatter's tech to make rings that brainwash their wearer? Maybe make it so that they also give them lots of special skills and modify their metabolism so that an average house mom becomes a crazy strong sniper, or an accountant becomes a martial arts master that with near superhuman strength.

Maybe have Joker make "the one ring" that has his entire being in it, so that his real body is in a vegetative state, but he can become himself in whichever body his ring is on.

Batman's quest is to find Joker's ring, put it back on his body, and then send him off to Arkham.

One of them would be.

You know what, I know that, and I have read the sims a few times, but that damn movie keeps getting stuck in my head, where they show him forging it on mount doom right while the armies are attacking.

That said, it still stands that the man wasn't some random mook, the sword wasn't a normal broken shard, and while it was lucky as hell it wasn't a complete deus ex machina.

They are more described as basically a void bathed in fire and shadow. A black hole that crafts a body and sucks the light from the area around it because they were basically lesser angels of the goddess/ angel who guided the sun. They might not actually have wings either, the wings were descriptive metaphors for how big they got.

No, just old. He was in the 90s x-men cartoon.

Eventually he would, if it was anywhere in the Batcave. Then again, there's probably a machine in the Batcave that can destroy it.

Unlikely. Sauron was Melkor's 2nd-in-command. Balrog likely would have just joined up with Sauron to conquer Middle Earth and then try to break Melkor out of the void in Valinor.

Dragon's are also creations of Melkor and the reason they like gold is because of if I remember that Melkor put influence in gold. Smaug might have just joined up because Sauron feels like Melkor.

>Sauron never struck me as a cosmic threat.
He is a cosmic being, though. He's no Dormamu, but he knows enough to gather power and eventually be a problem. I could see Thanos making it his mission to corner and destroy Sauron.

She was the priomordial personification of hunger. She eventually ate herself into nothing before giving birth to Shelob.

>banshee
kek

Even when Morgoth was in the world, there were beings who could kick his ass. Hell, an elf lord once told him to fuck off, and he damn well had to.

He also has Maia blood from Melian.

I can imagine humans using them as labor.

They can cast shit, and have hella mana bars. They inflict fear especially. It's not something any core JL member but the Flash could solo.

Sauron is in the same Omniverse user. The WB Omniverse. He is one of the Properties. The Properties can be controlled and brought through the Omniverse into the multiverse if one uses the IP Talismans, which are currently locked away in the Vault of the 5th Dimension.

Sauron is one of the Four Horseman of the Cancellation, including Agent Smith and Lord Voldermort who are assembled by the one who's controlling the Talismans. Of course this makes no sense to those in the comics, all the they know is these bad mother fuckers from somewhere else are invading.

But if you truly, truly want to destroy the Superman or DC's heroes... You gotta get their books CANCELLED. And that's... that's just want he's going to do. After the 5th dimension falls and Looney Toons are martyred on the hypercubes... The Corporation's other successful properties and franchises are next.

Don't say you weren't warned. Mxyzptlk showed up in the Fortress of Solitude bruised, beaten, missing an arm and begging for it to stop. Just to fucking stop. Someone's gotta stop him. Bat-Mite dies in Alfred's arms. Ambush Bug was called back into the Bug Guard, but they too couldn't stop them...

Believe me man, comparing power levels with Tolkienverse and anything else is a complete headache.

NOLDOR BLOOD IS ON YOUR HANDS

Yeah, like I give a fuck.

>Sauron
>Agent Smith
>Voldermort
Who's the fourth?