What the fuck, so Dream of the Endless is basically the evilest comicbook character ever, right?

What the fuck, so Dream of the Endless is basically the evilest comicbook character ever, right?
I've had those stuck in false awakening / paralysis dreams before, and a few minutes is bad enough, but this mostly innocent guy was sentenced to years of that shit nonstop while in a coma.

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yes, also Nada in hell for 10,000 years

There's a reason he's very high on the "Suffering/DidTheyDeserveIt" chart that I wish I saved.

Yeah, that's kinda the lesson Dream learns in the end: being an arrogant, self-righteous asshole has consequences

Have you read the whole thing? Because the fact that he's a spiteful, proud dickhead is a plot point.

>this mostly innocent guy
what stop him from freeing him? He had many a times he could have tried to free him, he knew it was wrong but did nothing. He is far from innocent and it kills me to see "doing nothing" as a sign of good nature.

Probably... you know... the probability of Dream doing what he actually went and did.

so then a vicious cycle of club and cage them because they might club and cage you? The flaw in his case was his family started the mess, they made the first move against him, he at no point try to absolve it, and even if motivation was fear of what would happen then he has revived the cowards reward.

He would have let him out if Dream had bothered to actually talk to him. You don't unlock things that might eat you.

Especially when they do end up eating you.

Buy the ticket, take the ride. By doing something, he might have avoided incurring Dream's wrath by freeing him. By doing nothing, he guaranteed it.

again, if fear is the sole reasoning then a cowards reward he did earn.

good god you sound like the type that would take no risks and ruin his life being a chicken shit and never living life.

>so then a vicious cycle of club and cage them because they might club and cage you?
That really summarizes what has happen to politics and people's opinions of late.

Fucking with gods directly will end with some horrifying consequences.

Go pet a lion if you feel like taking risks.

Dream is not a man. Dream deserved being trapped. Dream could have found a way to release himself if he'd stepped down from his pride and mollified a man's fear just a bit.

He and his constituents deserved it. They messed with the natural order

>captured and held hostage
>strip of all clothing and possessions
>left cold and naked for what feels like eons
>shock there be such a reckoning

Kid, have you ever suffered solitary condiment for a couple of days? It's hell, consider how long dream was lock up and how he was lockup.

If you take a lion for a pet, don't be surprised if it breaks out of its cage one day and mauls you.

Now you are changing the narrative. This isn't about Dream's incompetence, this is about Dream punishing his captor and what his captors did.

Way to throw the in the towel.

I got you covered, user.

to take your metaphor if my family had some immortal lion that was lock away under where I lived for centuries and I caught wind of it, you bet your ass I'm doing something to get that out of my life.

Gee, it sounds terrible!

that chart has some serious flaws. Colonel H. Stinkmeaner suffered a lot. His whole personality was built of bitterness.

>Stinkmeaner
>Gaz
>Arthur
>Garfield
>0 suffering

They need to be at least in the 30 mark. Gaz is pissed at something 24/7

he also starved without perishing. Think what a hunger lasting that long would feel like on you?

If you find your dad's lion in your basement, I doubt you'd unlock the cage and let it out. Especially where it could eat you.

>changing the narrative
Your 'narrative' is that he deserved what he got out of cosmic justice.

Alex did not capture him. Alex only kept him in the cage out of perfectly reasonable fear. Alex did not deserve that.

>Gil at 15x85
This image is out of date, he needs to be way higher on the X-axis.

The Endless are gods, they don't really operate on the same moral wavelength as humans.

I mean, Dream allows a man to be completely consumed by his own delusions purely for the sake of satisfying a bet with Despair, Desire will casually ruin the lives of mortals out of his/her own amusement, Delirium drives a police officer hopelessly insane for the sole crime of bothering her when she was in a bad mood, etc.

At the risk of sounding like an idiot newfag, who are top left and top right? They look only vaguely familiar.

The protagonists of Where the Wind Blows, a comic which details their slow and agonizing death from fallout and radiation poisoning after Britain gets nuked, and Chris-chan, who's got a whole wiki dedicated to how he's completely ruined his life through his own actions.

>Your 'narrative' is that he deserved what he got out of cosmic justice.
he did
>Alex did not capture him.
correct
>Alex only kept him in the cage
And that was wrong, it was awful, he let one to suffer.
>out of perfectly reasonable fear.
That was past fear and it was cowardice. Fear is taking cation when learning new things, fear is arming yourself when facing challenges. This however? It's full blown milksop, it's what keeps evil in the world, it's what leads to the wrath of angry beings you left to suffer because you were to scared to do what needed to be done.
>Alex did not deserve that.
Yes he did, he brought all that on himself, he had the opportunity to make right evils going on under him but he had no spine for it and had to pay the piper for his renunciation of responsibility.

>top left
Elderly couple who died a slow death from radiation poisoning:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/When_the_Wind_Blows_(1986_film)
>top right
Chris-chan (self-portrait):
sonichu.com/cwcki/CWCville

>If you find your dad's lion in your basement, I doubt you'd unlock the cage and let it out. Especially where it could eat you.
Nice projection kid but unlike you I'm not going to let disaster build up in my life and cry I "dindu nuffin" has my world crashes around me, I'm going to get that lion out of my life because I know things will only get worse not better if I just let a predator live under me.

>If you find your dad's lion in your basement, I doubt you'd unlock the cage and let it out. Especially where it could eat you.
Well if my options are "Let it out on the risk that it might eat me", or "Just leave it down there and hope to god it doesn't escape and I can outlive it", I'd rather take the risk that allows me a full night's sleep.

>Nice projection kid but unlike you I'm not going to let disaster build up in my life and cry I "dindu nuffin" has my world crashes around me, I'm going to get that lion out of my life because I know things will only get worse not better if I just let a predator live under me.
I think we stopped talking about the actual comic book some time ago.

Good luck with whatever things you are avoiding out of weakness, user.

The irony is that Burgess would have been fine if he wasn't such a weenie about his security measures.

Not even the Endless can follow you past the corners of the world. They might be able to condemn you to hell, but they aren't going to hound your soul for eternity.

Well the three big personality traits (and flaws) that dream has are:

>He's totally devoted to his duty to the Dreaming
>He's got issues in regards to demonstrating empathy to others
>He can be stunningly vindictive and cruel when crossed.

This is demonstrated by the fact that all three of these traits set off a domino effect which results in his death, at the hands of a woman he brushed off and slighted in a one-off story arc written near the start of the series.

What did Frank Grimes do (Top row center)? Lose his temper?

The chart just shows how much suffering a character received in relation to how much they deserved. It just means the amount of suffering was disproportionate to how my much they deserved it. So happens it's characters who are failing to be good.

I mean no, I wouldn't just walk up and open the cage, but you bet your ass I'd free that thing.

How the fuck is Jesse Custer at a higher level of "Deserved it" than "suffering"?
How is Clarissa not a "no deserving"

>The MC of a story about a guy who hates himself so much he finds an elaborate way to circumvent the cosmic laws keeping him from killing himself is an asshole
IMAGINE MOY SHOWCK

Atop all this, the group were intent on doing it to Dream's sister originally. I imagine the indignation he suffered and the thought of it happening to his siblings was reason enough to make an example of them for anyone who'd dare think of retrying an act against the Endless.

I mean... Jesse is kind of a huge tool.

Op probably only got to that page when he made the thread.

>Jesse is right next to Dobson and The Comedian
I have no fucking idea how that could have happened. Unless they maybe confused Jesse for Cassidy.

Aww man i forgot he didn't talk

Dreams own fault he was stuck in there.

This.
Maybe punishment is better than garunteed punishment

>He would have let him out if Dream had bothered to actually talk to him.
why are you so certain of this? After all the claim is he be punished no matter what if he didn't free him. For all we know if he talk to him he would have double downed everything and made sure he never escape.

Eeyore deserved it for being a whiny little shit.

I see what you did there.
But maybe that was intentional on the authors part to encourage comparison

That "mostly innocent" guy had the ability to free Dream from sitting naked in a glass box for a few more decades, and instead chose to keep him prisoner in his basement.

Clarissa doesn't deserve it at all but spiderman and morel don't deserve it at all even less.

Aldo clarissa is kind of moody.

>Just Fuck My Shit Up Union

This is making me imagine Brandon Fraser as those characters.

*don't deserve it all even more
You know what I meant anyway

Where do the cast of Funky Winkerbean fall?

I've never seen Moral Orel, but Pete was like two more spiderless weeks away from being a school shooter and he's done some pretty shitty things since as well. Like, letting Ben's eventual killer go free, that was just instant karma. Clarissa is a six year old who gets raped all the time.

True, there are no guarantees that he would have.

But there are also no guarantees that Dream would have let by-gones be by-gones if he had let him out.

Look at Dream, and tell me that he wouldn't have fucked up Burgess immediately if he had let him go.

>oxymadias suffering that high
He won though. It most likely fell apart soon after but that's just going of fantheories still.

Why do you support Burgess so strongly

>Look at Dream, and tell me that he wouldn't have fucked up Burgess immediately if he had let him go.
Possibly. Dr. Destiny stole his jewel, used it to murder a diner full of people, and tried to kill him with it and use it to drive the world insane, and not only did Morpheus not punish him for it, he dropped him off back in Arkham while wishing him a happy life.

>Look at Dream, and tell me that he wouldn't have fucked up Burgess immediately if he had let him go.
Have we read the same series?

>but that's just going off fan theories

... common sense, some pretty heavy-handed implicating...

That's not fan theories, that's how it ended.

Not him, but the comic did repeatedly demonstrate that the guy was willing to go new testament on people who he perceived to have slighted him, betrayed him, or otherwise just pissed him off, down to abandoning his immortal son to eternal life as nothing but a dismembered head. Most of the series was about him realizing how his actions actually affect other people, and one of the signs of how "Daniel" has changed as the new Dream was his willingness to let go of these grudges and allow those who Morpheus had punished to live out the rest of their lives in peace.

>Aww man i forgot he didn't talk
>Dreams own fault he was stuck in there.
It's even worse than that because like Death points out afterwards Dream could have easily just contacted her or basically any of the other Endless and they would have gotten him out before he had to spend a single day there.
Also that witch character implies towards the end that Dream didn't need to respect magical boundaries like with her spell to protect Lyta. Meaning he might have only stayed "trapped" out of some autistic belief that he should "follow the rules" and behave as though the magic trapped him there when really he was powerful enough to bypass it.

Still didn't happen in the comic as much as anybody with a brain knows it would.1
Wait bubastis died. That's some sugfering I suppose.

>Also that witch character implies towards the end that Dream didn't need to respect magical boundaries like with her spell to protect Lyta. Meaning he might have only stayed "trapped" out of some autistic belief that he should "follow the rules" and behave as though the magic trapped him there when really he was powerful enough to bypass it.
Holy shit. I never thought of that before

that was because dream figured it was the gem doing it rather than him

He got called a retard by the closest thing to a God and left wondering if what he did actually mattered in the long run.

Why do you have such a thing for ironic punishments? Is that you, Stardust?

>mostly innocent
He fucked with the natural order after his father and that had dire consequences
Also I'd get a little revenge too after being imprisoned for decades

He knew that dream had a Long history of being a dick.

>Dream allowed a man to basically Tell the local SA that they aren't going to touch any of these jews in his Empire

Northon was the hero the US never wanted.

It's indeed a thing, and something you can also interpret from Destruction.
Dream has the thickest, largest stick up his ass in the multiverse.
Dream is the power of creation, so he feels like he has to follow strict rules to keep a coherent chaos of meaning. But that comes with the price of any inherently static system: it can't change and it forces you to take not the best choices in situations you wouldn't expect.
Or you can think of Dream as an author who as to learn to let his own characters act and grow naturally, out of his direct control.

>solitary confinement
>suffered
Just leave me with enough food, working showers and vidya and I can keep it up for months.

>solitary confinement
>enough food, working showers and vidya and
That's not how it works

Try decades you stupid retard

consider also that he's been there to see the universe come into being from some unimaginable chaos or whatever it was before it was the universe. if we hold the belief - as dream would - that the power of creation is the power of story, then it could be that the rest of the universe in truth shares a similar relationship with the rules. perhaps the power that makes atoms, for example, behave as they do is that dream has convinced them to. and so he would know exactly how much it takes to get them to question that belief and, in a short time, probably scramble the whole universe... if he doesn't hold an example.

and so destruction, when he's telling dream "you don't need to be like that", is saying "give me the universe", just because, as he sees it, change is inevitable. of course, he's not wrong either.

Spider-man personally pissed of God via selling his greatest gift to him to the devil. He totally fucked up his ranking on that chart ever since OMD.