This movie killed Michael Keaton's career for nearly two decades and was responsible for the dark age of Batman movies...

>this movie killed Michael Keaton's career for nearly two decades and was responsible for the dark age of Batman movies that would last until Begins
What does Sup Forums think of it?

Other urls found in this thread:

youtube.com/watch?v=jwvNAai29_0
youtube.com/watch?v=spiVBQisujo
twitter.com/NSFWRedditImage

Best Batman film.

It sure wasn't a kids film, as 10 year old me can attest.

All I remember is thinking catwoman was hot.

At first I wondered why they didn't just use Killer Croc since this version of the Penguin's backstory is very similar to his.

Then I remembered that Tim Burton has never read a comic in his life, which explains this one and his first Batman movie, and it all made sense.

>responsible for the dark age of Batman movies that would last until Begins

>was responsible for the dark age of Batman movies

that would be joel schumacker

I loved John Glover in that

Tim just read the Killing Joke and that's it.

Schumacher was only brought on because WB got squeamish after Returns wasn't well received by parents. If Burton hadn't gone full autist, he probably would've stayed on and we never would have gotten Forever and Batman and Robin.

>Kevin Smith joked about Tim Burton stealing his ideas from a Planet of the Apes comic in his 2000 movie
>Burton got butthurt and said he never read a comic in his life, especially anything written by Smith
>"That explains Batman Returns"

The best part is that Kevin Smith is still a shit writter.

>catwoman was hot
She still is.

>Kevin Smith
>wrote a Batman that pissed himself and got high because Poison Ivy tricked him into smoking weed
>thinking he's the be all, end all authority on Batman anyway
Stones and glass houses, Kevin.

Kevin Smith is the worst parts about movies and comics without the self-awareness that usually comes with them.

I will never understand why anyone ever decided to take Kevin Smith seriously.
Not only is he a terrible filmmaker, but he also crusades against anyone who gives his films a negative review.

Actually it was responsible for the light age of Batman movies because it was too dark and they needed the series to be kid-friendly to sell toys.

Pretty sure Schumacher deciding that the franchise does not need to be anything more than a toy commercial is what killed the series.

He decided that the movie series that the whole world loved was shit and should be more like the Adam West show with more toy commercial parts added in

>GOAT Christmas atmosphere
>More of Burton's stylized Gotham

The point flew over your head. The dark age was Shumacher's movies, not because of tone but because of how absolutely shitty they were.

Exactly.
Even most normies would have prefered a third, edgy Burton Batman movie over the shitheap that was Schumacher's Batman.
The damage wrought by Batman & Robin far exceeded the family-unfriendly shit in Batman Returns, and the retarded producers who axed Burton are too delusional to admit that.

>was responsible for the dark age of Batman movies that would last until Begins
>this many people missing the point
If it wasn't for Returns, WB would have never brought Shumacher on. They replaced Burton and the series suffered for it. Returns is absolutely to blame for what followed until the Nolan movies.

Twas a joke you git

>the dark age
>Batman Forever and Batman and Robin aren't unironically great

Fucking plebs jesus. They were fantastic movies. They just show Bats in the other way he's potrayed. Either super dark and edgy, and super campy. They were great batman camp.

Basically WB decided they needed the exact polar opposite aligned autistic director.

>They replaced Burton and the series suffered for it.
You are an idiot.

It's common knowledge, retard.

Forever is entertaining. B&R isn't the worst thing ever, but it's quite lame.

Genuinly enjoy both myself. Im into camp batman as much as the "realistic" one.

>Batman Returns is so extremely gothic that it scares parents, and WB demands a more kid-friendly approach
>Batman & Robin is so kid-friendly and campy that it humiliates WB into letting the franchise rest, before going with a "gritty and grounded" reboot to redeem its reputation.
All things considered, it worked out in the end.

Wasn't Shumacher's fault. Just like it's not Whedon's fault for JL's lighter tone. It's WB who made the directors do a movie in this style, if the director refused they'd find someone else who would make the movie the way they wanted.

It's actually McDonald's fault more then anyone, they refused to make happy meal toys for Returns because parents complained it was too violent. Which is the whole reason they changed it.

it's kind of boring and doesn't really have a plot, it just throws a bunch of clumsy ones together (the plot to frame batman, the plot to make the penguin mayor, walken's plot to make an evil power plant) and none of them really stick or have much focus. the penguin is barely recognizable and may as well be an entirely new character, same with catwoman, and the bruce/selina romance has no chemistry from the leads.

the only thing i like about it is that we get to see gotham at christmas which is always cool but even that sort of feels lacking because the sets look really obviously fake and cartoony. at least the first movie seemed a bit more subdued in its gothic atmosphere.

Selina Kyle's freakout and transformation was both haunting and one of the best pieces of cinema history. Danny DeVito as Penguin was somewhat of an odd choice, but he pulled it off well.

fpbp

And why didn't Burton simply make Max Schreck, well, the Penguin?

DeVito was a perfect choice, there aren't many short fat actors to fit that role.

How did do those things when it's better than the first one?

So she's the (old) Wasp now.

>It's actually McDonald's fault more then anyone, they refused to make happy meal toys for Returns because parents complained it was too violent. Which is the whole reason they changed it.
You're mistaken, actually.

There WAS a Happy Meal promotion for Batman Returns, I even had some of the toys from it. In fact, McDonalds was involved in the controversy, but only because the soccer moms who were butthurt about the movie's content projected that butthurt onto McDs by association.

But really, McDs stood by the Batman franchise. In fact when Batman Forever was made, most companies turned down merchandising deals because they didn't want a repeat of that shit, but McDs made these nice-ass character mugs, and they sold like hotcakes. A big part of the reason B&R was such a commercialized mess was because EVERYBODY went "Shit, we should have taken that Batman licensing deal, well THIS time we want all in!"

Michael Keaton killed Michael Keatons career by being Michael Keaton

Can confirm, I remember the B&R toys, I had one of those batmobiles

I remember having those as a kid. I use to collect all the 90's McD's Batman toys. I don't have them anymore though, no idea what happened.

Oh hey I had that Joker car.

youtube.com/watch?v=jwvNAai29_0
>this hasnt been posted yet

Yo, those mugs were the shit. I had the one in the batcave, I wonder where it got off to...

i haven't seen it in years but i remember watching it right after i first watched the first in the series and i thought it was really good albeit with a couple of odd scenes

I still have that batmobile all these years later
I keep it next to my hotwheels batmobiles

I had the die-cast one, it was the tightest shit. It's still my favorite Batmobile design to this day, the turbine is just too fucking dope.

The gothic tone of the Burton films and BTAS is my favorite kind of Batman, and I wish we'd get more of it.

Best penguin. Best catwoman-costume. Crappy weak plotline.

LMFAO have you guys tried to watch this or 89 recently? they are fucking TERRIBLE. so fucking bad. jesus fucking christ

yeah it's nothing like the epic new Marvel™ films, now playing in theaters near you! OOGA CHAKA xD

yeah watching bruce wayne hang upside down from some hack director who doesn't know anything about the source material is way better. ok.

one thing i can say is the bat plane is dope. that's it though.

but seriously when's the last time u tried watching 89 or returns? i watched 89 last year and it's laughably bad. does not hold up at all

I love it and I watch it every Christmas

Also no it didn't; he was in Jackie Brown.

It is both my favorite Batman and Christmas movie.

I feel the same way about every single MCU movie.

I have 89 and Returns on Blu-Ray, they are some of my favourite movies

My favorite comic movie of all time. It's got perfect atmosphere.

mah niggas

She pumped thc into the air he wasn't smoking.

Michelle Pfeiffer is everything in this movie.
youtube.com/watch?v=spiVBQisujo

But that's not true at all, you just have shit taste.

This. I saw it as a kid. I really liked it and still think that is how Batman must be: dark, weird, mystical freakshow with women vacuumed in lether outfits. Only this way I can percive story about night avenger who dress like a bat as something aware of itself.

Not even that guy but using the MCU to deflect the criticism of the movie does nothing to point out said flaws.

>until Begins
Oh god, I hope you don't think the Nolan trilogy was good.

best batman movie

Begins was a good movie.

All three were complete trash. If you'd ever read a comic book in your life you'd agree with me.

You're a silly man.

>durhur you've never read a comig if you disagree wif me

You don't even remember who Jimmy McCoy is, you piece of shit.

I think this movie gave me latex fetish.

>character mugs

shit nigger I think I still have one of those

Hey hey hey, lets be fair now. He got good work following Batman Returns. Jack Frost is the movie that killed his career, lets be honest.

>Selina Kyle's freakout and transformation was both haunting and one of the best pieces of cinema history

user, I... like that scene too and Pfeiffer's catwoman makes me diamonds, but you need to watch more movies, ok?

Like, lots and lots more.

Feels good man. My family jokes about it survived all this time.

I wish I had a green piece of paper to put inside so the details are better.

Riddler's cane was the mug handle.

I think my mom kept my Two-Face mug at home. I'll have to check this weekend.

This.

BTAS = GOAT
Burton Batman = unfaithful but great regardless
Nolan Batman = absolute dogshit, all three of them complete shit

People who like Nolan's Batman movies have terrible taste.

Michael Keaton kept on having starring roles every year in the 90's and did not slow down until the mid 00's where he was in his late 50s. Where is this shit coming from?

Rewatched it for my Christmas movie marathon.

It remains the weirdest fucking superhero movie ever made. The Penguin just constantly drooling black ooze. Catwoman basically trying to fuck the very air she breathed for the entire movie. Christopher Walken Walkening as hard as he could. The circus gang. The penguin funeral. The entire thing is just a studio mistakenly giving Tim Burton creative control and Tim Burton grinning incredulously then grabbing a bottle of lube.

It's dark. It's off-putting. It's fetishistic. And to its credit, I'm gonna remember it in ten years in a way I won't remember Age of Ultron or BvS.

>they didn't just use Killer Croc since this version of the Penguin's backstory is very similar to his
The "freak gets thrown out by parents and lives in the underworld of society" backstory is extremely common as it is. It's borderline a fairytale cliche.

>If it wasn't for Returns, WB would have never brought Shumacher on. They replaced Burton and the series suffered for it
Burton resigned of his own volition. WB was still willing to keep him on board even after Batman Returns caused controversy, and as this poster showed, it wasn't the movie's fault or McDonalds. It was butthurt soccer moms and social groups who chose to be offended at a movie kids were having a good time with.
Burton said that WB asked him to tone it down for the sequel, and he refused because he didn't want to go through the same shit he went while making Batman 89, and so he departed on agreeable terms (Burton even produced the third movie).
And the idea that it "killed" Michael Keaton's career is ridiculous.

Stop being assblasted that not as many people hate Batman Returns like you do and take your bullshit rumors to Sup Forums.

the schumacher films are actually enjoyable (not good but enjoyable) in retrospect

I love it

In early drafts of the movie Max Shreck was supposed to be Harvey Dent, thus setting the stage for his scarring in the finale. Waters and Burton probably scrapped this idea because the movie had already enough characters as it was, and Harvey Dent is not supposed to be a bad guy before he becomes Two-Face.
Then he was supposed to be Penguin's brother, and then they scrapped that too. So he just became an OC.

The "unlikable powerful businessman who controls Gotham and represents a more realistic criminal" is an interchangeable part of a lot of Batman adaptations. Max Shreck is essentially a stand-in for characters like Rupert Thorne, or Carmine Falcone.
Characters who The Penguin emulates but can't be because he is an outcast and freak (always has been even before the movie) who can't blend in like they can.

Nope OP, that was McDonalds.

>reee why is Penguin so gross Penguin would never call himself a freak and act like one

>reeee why is Penguin acting like an actual penguin this isn't realistic and close to the comics at all! He was always a perfectly normal character!

>reeeee why is Penguin trying to attack Batman physically and use violence Penguin would never do something like that he's supposed to be a Lex Luthor-tier genius who never loses his cool

>why is Penguin eating raw fish and being gross this does not represent the character at all he would never do that!

>why is Penguin being so violent and murderous he is supposed to be silly and friendly, he would never try to kill children or destroy the city

you could argue for this, but this is immediately hindered by the fact that Tim Burton had only read 1 or 2 comics in his life time, and he certainly didn't read any comics obscurities

Oh, and by the way, all of these panels are from comics published way before Batman Returns. No, they are not odd examples taken out of context. Pìck up any Penguin story from before or after the Silver Age/Burgess Meredith era and you'll see similar recurring trends of sadism, gross behavior and general "freakishness".

I'm not saying Batman Returns Penguin was a totally faithful adaptation to the comics and I'm not saying you can't be allowed to dislike it (I have my own problems with it).
But don't even try to pull that "REEE HE DOESN'T ACT ANYTHING LIKE HOW THE CHARACTER IS SUPPOSED TO" argument. It is demonstrably wrong and used mostly by normies who don't even care about the character.

>this is immediately hindered by the fact that Tim Burton had only read 1 or 2 comics in his life time
Tim Burton was not the only person who wrote this movie. He didn't even write most of it. He himself admitted it.
This movie was written by Daniel Waters, a.k.a someone who does read comics and even said The Dark Knight Returns was a big inspiration for the movie. And it was also ghost-written by Wesley Strick, who, again, knew more about the source material than Burton did.

And I'll also point out that Danny DeVito agreed to the role because he was actually a big fan of the comics and Adam West show and he had fairly good ideas about how Penguin was like that he brought into his portrayal.

as already said, fpbp

You much really be an intellectual with incredibly refined tastes to know better than the rest of the world that nearly unanimously agrees that The Dark Knight was fantastic.

Such confidence that those highly praised movies are actually completely terrible. You must be much smarter than everyone else.

>He decided that the movie series that the whole world loved was shit and should be more like the Adam West
Well, its not quite like that, more he thought batman and comics were intentionally campy. In 2005 or so he read some of Miller's batman stuff and apologised saying he realised why people were so upset.

considering the first movie had clear illusions to the original black mask comic, i doubt the writer didnt know his stuff

man, you're totally right, same reason i love the Age of Ultron, Hobbit saga and Star Wars Episode 52.

Shit though man, Night of the Hunter, Peeping Tom, Blues Brothers are all just such shitty fucking movies though, god damn.

Totes for reals!

I dont agree entirely with the cunt, but mass appeal means shit in terms of quality you little fag

OUR CITY'S MOVER AND SHAKER MAX SHRECK