Joe Quesada defends Marvel against Twitter

Joe Quesada defends Marvel against Twitter

comicsbeat.com/frequently-asked-quesada-joe-q-takes-to-twitter-to-quiet-the-waters/

bleedingcool.com/2017/12/22/fanboy-rampage-joe-quesada-defends-marvel-cancellation-bloodbath-twitter/

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Joe taught me that selling my marriage to the devil to save an old aunt is ok.

What a horrible stupid and contrived scenario.

ayyy it's-a me, your unca Joe, gabbagool? Scaramouche!!

See this is why marvel is gonna have a difficult time coming back from all this. DC admitted they were wrong about stuff and wanted to change to suit readers' demands. Marvel just blames readers or insists everything is fine even though having to ship books LCSes didn't ask for to boost numbers is the opposite of fine.

ever since I saw his X-Men art in that fake comic book in Logan I've been dying for a Joe Q drawn X-Men book.

I'm glad he's back on twitter, no one knows how to piss off fanboys better than Joe Q.

I love how fucking stacked with retarded shit the opening paragraph in that article is.

>Marvel has had the worst PR year in comics since rival DC in 2013. This week, the company canceled a bunch of comics starring POC or LGBTQ leads.That came hot on the heels of the scandal of their new Editor-in-Chief revealing that he pretended to be a Japanese man named Akira Yoshida to write comics for Marvel and other companies. Which followed partnering with an arms manufacturer to make all ages propaganda comics at New York Comic Con. Which followed their executives getting caught telling retailers in a closed door meeting that people are sick of diversity, artists don’t move the needle, mini-series are a death knell, and a whole bunch of other salacious-headline making stuff. Which followed what felt like 2 years of nonstop Nazi stuff with Secret Empire, a super-mega-crossover event that couldn’t even beat Batman and The Flash in sales. Which coincided with an industry sales slump led by industry-leader Marvel and leading into a flatly-received Legacy reboot. And their Chairman, Ike Perlmutter, is good friends with Donald Trump and supports him financially. And Brian Michael Bendis left for DC. We probably missed a bunch of stuff too.

oh nooo! what will they do without Bendis!? also yeah my god, openly supporting national socialism in their big crossover, what were they thinking?

>Marvel just blames readers or insists everything is fine even though having to ship books LCSes didn't ask for to boost numbers is the opposite of fine.

Marvel always done that. It's just now their dirty tricks are finally catching up to them.

Bendis was their biggest writer who has been with them for almost 20 years, him leaving is a big deal.

>no one knows how to piss off fanboys better than Joe Q.

I think it would've worked in the 00's.

Not really sure it'll work now.

I read a few and he's not saying anything wrong. Books with shit sales have to get axed eventually. Maybe they shouldn't have axed them in the same month though.

I don't care about any of these "scandals".

I just want them to make good comic books and they don't do that so fuck Marvel.

>I read a few and he's not saying anything wrong.

Much as Quesada was responsible for a lot of stupid shit during his time as EIC, he's actually right about a lot of what he said on Twitter. It probably helps that some of the people he's arguing with are people like Joe Glass.

I know that's why it's going to be great.

Bendis is a has-been who has been on the outs for years. What was the last big thing he wrote for Marvel---Invincible Controversy, or the Defenders cash-in series? Guardians of Kitty Pryde? They were obviously pulling the crown out of his hands and giving it to Nick Spencer, who was all but openly ignoring whatever Bendis wanted to do with Iron Man. Secret Empire tanking obviously doesn't mean Bendis was coming back, hence his leaving for DC.

But more important, Bendis hasn't been good for years so why is it "bad for Marvel" that he's leaving? The paragraph I quoted is just a thoughtlessly thrown-together list of shit all painted to put Marvel in as bad a light as possible.

I do like how people think Marvel looks only at direct sales. Even with Joe correcting them, people will keep repeating that misinformation.

People whining that their "representation" books aren't being done out of the goodness of Marvel's hearts are laughable.

Nobody cares about those sales charts, I don't know why you think Marvel is "cheating" to do better on them. They are inaccurate charts that guess the numbers from incomplete data.

Regardless of what you think Bendis is inexplicable popular and has been a driving force behind the Marvel universe for over a decade. It's always a big deal when a guy like that leaves a company for their primary competitor. Imagine if Jim Lee left DC to draw X-men again. Also it's not exactly hard to paint Marvel in a bad light these days.

>why is it "bad for Marvel" that he's leaving?
Because he sucked but he sold.

This. Bendis has always been shit, but he was easily the biggest 'star' writer Marvel still had.

>Nobody cares about those sales charts
Never open a business.

Marvel doesn't have anyone as big as Bendis to sell books. All they have left are has-beens like Waid and Slott. The rest of their roster is b and c-list. And their heavy hitters like Fraction/Hickman/Remender./Brubaker all went over to Image. So they have no one to replace Bendis with.

>Bendis is a has-been who has been on the outs for years.

Yes, quality-wise.

Saleswise it's debatable. His Civil War 2 sold badly but sold better than Secret Empire, Axis, Original Sin and even his Age of Ultron. CW2 did harm sales on other titles, so there's also that.

>But more important, Bendis hasn't been good for years so why is it "bad for Marvel" that he's leaving?

Because who are they going to replace him with? The only guy who sells well eventwise is Hickman and it's a big if on whether he's really coming back to do more stuff for Marvel. And I'm not certain anyone they have is going to sell well enough. Even Aaron (people promptly forgot about Legacy one-shot after maybe two weeks).

Bigger than Brian K. Vaughan really?

>Bigger than Brian K. Vaughan really?
>biggest 'star' writer still had
>still had
When was the last time Vaughn wrote for Marvel?

>Nobody cares about those sales charts

Then why does Marvel keep "fixing" the charts via over-shipping if no one "cares".

Clearly editorial and publishing cares very much how they are on top every month or to give the appearance that they are.

BKV is still doing work for Marvel?

I thought he'd moved on fully to masturbatory Image crap.

>Nobody cares about those sales charts,

Is this the new shill defense talking point?

What the fuck is he writing for Marvel?

different audiences.

vaughn plays to the non-cape indie crowd

bendis plays to the opposite.

My LCS doesn't care about those sales charts. They're useless. They go by what they sell and adjust accordingly. I don't see how those charts are useful to any LCS, except maybe someone opening one.

Twitter is Cancer.

Look at all these armchair marketing professionals and editors telling Marvel Comics why they failed doing exactly what they asked them to do. You can't even begin to talk to someone if they believe that they are right and can't be wrong about anything. America Chavez and Iceman couldn't cut it. It wouldn't of lasted if you put up a billboard, if you made commercials for them, if you made someone dress up as them and go into schools or whatever else. At the end, even good media sometimes gets dashed among the rocks.

>Y-you canceled my diverse comic that nobody bought, monster!!
Some fans are really stupid! just imagine if every Richard Rider fan complained because Marvel always cancels his comics.

They are a dick measuring contest used by marvel.

I guess they don't care about not selling anything Marvel either.

They sent free copies to retailers in hopes retailers would sell more copies if they had more on the shelves. Most retailers order very conservatively, just enough for pulls and maybe a shelf copy or two. Comics are non-returnable, so any copies bought and not sold is lost money. They were hoping by retailers not selling out of a title, more people would pick it up off the shelf, and this mitigated the risk to retailers to have more copies on hand.

yeah.....imagine.

That's why it's funny. It takes a lot to make Quesada look like the good guy in this situation.

Even people in the comments section of Bleeding Cool is calling out the Tweeters.

Sure they do. All-New Wolverine sells well for instance, my LCS gets 25 copies. They know they can sell 18-25 between pull lists and random buyers. Random buyers are unpredictable, sometimes they grab an issue, sometimes they don't. They don't want a pull list. Maybe they shop at other places? Who knows.

The sales chart doesn't help my LCS decide how many copies of All-New Wolverine to order.

I mean here's a quote:

"Honestly, compared to people like Dan Slott, Nick Spencer and Mark Waid, Joe Quesada was pretty reasonable and professional in his responses."

The horrifying thing is, he's right.

I'll believe it when I see it.

>defending overshipping

Marriages are antiquated legal contracts and aren’t comparable to a human life.

My LCS didn't sell many of those overshipped copies. But they were free. Shipping was reimbursed. Even if they sold one copy of a book (they did) it was more money than they would have made as they would have sold out. Diamond usually doesn't have damage replacements let alone reorder copies most of the time.

What happens to DC in 2013 again? Are they talking about that Superman statue fiasco?

Joe Q fucked up by adressing these snowflakes. I thought he was a man.

>Boo hoo my diversity books
Fuck off, if it doesn't sell it can't stay. Period.

>They were hoping by retailers not selling out of a title, more people would pick it up off the shelf, and this mitigated the risk to retailers to have more copies on hand.
I'm sure Marvel generously looking out for retailers is the exact reason and why every retailer responds to "bonus" copies with anger and frustration and why Marvel tried to convince retailers that DC allowing returns of unsold product to help them safely sell more comics is a bad thing.

i think the nu52 in general,

I wouldn't be too surprised. There were some horror stories from creators who left at that time (I remember Paul Jenkins swearing off big-two work because of it)

I can only relate my experience with my LCS. They didn't mind the free overshipped copies.

Returnables? They have never bothered. You lose money on those. Either they want you to return the books or stripped covers for partial credit. You also pay shipping on top of that. My LCS has said it's not worth losing money like that.

the problem is retailers eat the costs of the "free books" getting shipped to them through diamond

I mean even guys like Perez were publicly unhappy with it, shit was a dumpster fire.

I'd have said 2012 AND 2013

2012 had Before Watchmen, also Gail Simone getting fired by e-mail
2013 had JH Williams situation, issue with the lenticulars (they got allocated and so weren't able to fill all orders), New Lobo design, the Kevin Maguire situation, and I think there was a situation with the Outhousers but I can't remember.

Paul Jenkins knew what he was doing. The Finch Batbook was a fucking clusterfuck from day one. That is like staying on the 90s X-books and not expecting to get raped in the ass by editorial and favorite artist of the moment.

They didn't. The free books were a second line on the invoice showing $0 cost (under what the store ordered). Yes, they had to pay shipping. They received a shipping credit on a later invoice for those free books. So it cost them nothing.

You could argue that the free books took extra time for the LCS to process, but they could have just thrown them out while sorting their order if they wanted.

Perez's situation was basically Superman editorial (the guy before Berganza) was run by a Harras groupie who helped screw Waid on Captain America back in the 90s and had burned though eight creative teams on Superman/Action even before Nu52..

New 52 in general.

Creative teams changed left and right after just 1 arc, Simone was kicked off Batgirl and put back on only because readers demanded it, Lobdell and other 90s cronies ruined like a dozen books, people wanted Wally back (and the real Tim, Cassie, Kon, Starfire, Supermarriage, etc), Dick wasn't blue, they had like 2 or 3 female writers total, etc.

2011-2014 was a legit terrible time for DC PR and they didn't get their shit together in both PR AND sales wise until Rebirth since DCYOu was a sales flop.

>Lobdell and other 90s cronies ruined like a dozen books
In a recent interview Lobdell confirmed that he was editorial's lackey, so the blame's on them.
>>I will say that, traditionally, in the past, readers of RHATO and Red Hood/Arsenal can notice where stories were set-up and set-up and set-up, only to have the conclusion of the story go careening off the tracks. I can say that there have been many times where I’ve started a story and someone from upstairs decreed that a particular plot thread had to be dropped, or a whole other plot thread needed to be added, or an entire story arc had to be gutted in the middle of the story. Those times have been very frustrating for me—but as a professional writer of some thirty years, I’ve always felt that part of the profession means that I need to turn in the story the editor/publisher wants and not always the story I want to write, or begin, or end.

>Similarly, when an editor says “you need more narration here to explain what is going on” or “we would prefer you write third-person omnipresent because so many of our books are written first-person” or “we want you to use thought balloons on this title, but not thought balloons on that title,” then that is what I do, because that is what I’m asked to do.
They haven't been pulling this on him with Rebirth Outlaws, and what do you know, people like it.

How does he have the time to tweet that much

>Which followed partnering with an arms manufacturer to make all ages propaganda comics at New York Comic Con

Wait, what the fuck?

BKV isn't at Marvel anymore. Also, it's arguable that he's bigger than Bendis. Bendis has more mainstream appeal. For some fucking reason.

Who knew the day would come when Joey Q would become the hero in this tale of woe? I remember the rage threads we used to have where we accused him of being a Skrull.

i've seen him tweet like "Waiting for the plane to take off, quick ama" so i assume it's when he's like waiting for the subway and shit

They still had Liefield on books

It was actually one editor who gave all his books to Liefeld to write. To no surprise even Harras showed the guy the door.

That's why I said cronies.

Liefield's a legend, his 80's run on Hawk and Dove was the most popular the duo had ever been, it wasn't dumb to try pick up some nostalgia dollars.

Honestly, you could argue from 2011 to 2013 when they did Flashpoint as the lead up to Nu52.

>2012 had Before Watchmen, also Gail Simone getting fired by e-mail

Good times. I like Gail, but not enough to buy any of those New 52 books.

>2013 had JH Williams situation [...] the Kevin Maguire situation

I don't remember these. What happened? Was the JH Williams thing when he tried to marry off Batwoman to someone but DC pulled the plug on that?

>Retarded shit
Or how we used to call it, "Things that really happened".

It is absolutely dumb to use an artist who everybody uses as an example as to why the 90s were an awful time.

>Was the JH Williams thing when he tried to marry off Batwoman to someone but DC pulled the plug on that?
Yes.
They had like one or two issues left and were annoyed they allowed her to get engaged in the first place.

liefeld rocks and it's fine they used him on dumb 90s books.

but it actually shows the flaw of nu52, it was mostly old 90s guys Harras knew

DC cited the no-marriage rule despite having no such thing previously and Williams/Blackman having told editorial long before that this was the conclusion of their run.

Doesn't help that you had Arthur and Mera being still married.

OH SHIT YOU'RE RIGHT i had forgotten about that.

>Nobody cares about those sales charts
You do realize comics are a bussiness, right?

i think they kicked Maguire off a book, maybe JL3K? and it was not done nicely

>Wait, what the fuck?
They announced and then cancelled a recruitment ad for Northrup-Grumman
archive.is/L9I71

Right right. Thanks for reminding me. Man. That was dumb.

Fuck that still annoys me. Higgins Deathstroke was... okay, better than Liefeld and Daniel's runs at least, and he wanted a crossover with his Nightwing book. Then they just yanked him off after 8 issues.

And speaking of HIggins, I kinda felt bad for the poor guy because he tons of ideas for his Nightwing book but crossovers and events literally just kept destroying it so he had to keep changing what he did.

archive that shit or summarize it because I´m not giving either site a click nigga

>Honestly, you could argue from 2011 to 2013 when they did Flashpoint as the lead up to Nu52.

If I was doing that I'd have taken it to maybe 2010 since that was when journalists were dogpiling DC over Brightest Day bringing back White Superheroes and Ryan Choi being killed and people taking shots at JMS' Superman.

Just fucking look at the inferiority of the art on the left. Unbelievable.

Basically a bunch of people got mad at Marvel for cancelling their diversity books and Quesada politely and professionally told them that they're a business and after taking all factors into account the books canceled were not profitable.

>Shipping was reimbursed
I call bullshit.

Ha-ha.
Ha.

Brightest Day was entirely Geoff Johns and I think the astroturf outrage was more due to how successful Blackest Night was despite all the fan journos hating it.

>Paul Jenkins swearing off big-two work
And this is bad because...

cancelling these books still won´t increase sales, just reduce loses.
if they want to increase sales they need to apologize to their fans for basically pandering exclusively to sjws for the last 4 years and more or less telling white men that they are all racist, sexist, nazis that should all die

>as a professional writer of some thirty years, I’ve always felt that part of the profession means that I need to turn in the story the editor/publisher wants and not always the story I want to write, or begin, or end.
>>Similarly, when an editor says “you need more narration here to explain what is going on” or “we would prefer you write third-person omnipresent because so many of our books are written first-person” or “we want you to use thought balloons on this title, but not thought balloons on that title,” then that is what I do, because that is what I’m asked to do.
This is what a pro is like.

Oh no! Are you saying that Marvel, a business, is interested in making money, and not pushing your cancerous ideology at the expense of their bottom line? Color me absolutely shocked.

It's fun to search for "readcomiconline/readcomicsonline" on Twitter because it's all the type of blue hair pansexual MLM girl they are trying to pander to going "read it here sweetie uwu"

>b-b-b-but dc cancels books too!

Marvel will never apologize, it's not their nature. They can still get back on top by replacing all the bad titles with ones that have good art with writing that appeals to Wednesday Warriors.

I have to give Quesada credit. He kept cool in front of the shrieking banshees as they kept crying "but muh diversity!" even as he explained over and over and over again that at the end of the day those titles just didn't make enough to keep the lights on.

Does that beta want to become a DChad?

>eliminated the diverse and readable titles
If they were readable they've have sold.

It isn't. And I'm impressed that he has held that stance for five years now. He has a lot of Boom! and Aftershock stuff instead.

he said as much in that it's basically the same as angry X-fans or Spidey-fans or what have you. He knows how to deal with insane fans

>because you prioritize profit
But I thought diversity sold more. I thought old white nerds were a dying market and it made no sense to pander to them. I thought wider audiences were the future and they wanted diverse characters. What happened?
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAH

The no marriage rule was only was only in Batbooks, because they thought it hurt the Batman brand if anyone in Gotham wasn't miserable.

I'm not going to defend the idea, I'm just saying it didn't apply across DC as a whole. The whole Superman thing is similar to Spider-Man in the sense that a lot of writers like the Clark/Lois/Superman love triangle; but obviously Arthur and Mera were going strong as a couple throughout New 52.

>Like Luke Skywalker in Star Wars: The Last Jedi
Is this supposed to be praise?

Too bad he is a faggot who should die in fire

>The no marriage rule was only was only in Batbooks, because they thought it hurt the Batman brand if anyone in Gotham wasn't miserable.

lol, based King throwing that away