No character development

>No character development
>No iconic story lines
>Just sitting around in limbo until the MCU picks them up

Why is management at Marvel so ass?

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One got a hatedom
The other got a hatedom and bad writer
The other one is a Muslim and got screw over by events.

Sam finally got a good arc in Novas.

TO have a good storyline you need to have interesting stakes for interesting characters, who have their limits and abilities and personalities tested. It’s why all the. If major storylines you usually remember, the Gwen Stacy Deaths, Killing Jokes, Demon In a Bottle- they have some form or another of suffering . If you’re not willing to hurt your characters in more ways that one, you’re not gonna write something good. Straight up combat isn’t always interesting, and even most American comics shy away from brutal comics unless it’s a crossover or are gonna kill someone.

It’s okay to have your favored character lose a limb.

Your line of logic is why we get shitty event books all the time and character death is meaningless.

Characters need to struggle to be interesting, and this includes internal struggle. Ditko Spider-Man is an amazing three year arc not because Peter got stuck under a big machine but because of how he grew and changed as a person.

Marvel Studios isnt going to touch Kamala

>Why is management at Marvel so ass
Because they've been resting on the laurels of marvel studios (which aren't even theirs). The good news is that the moose might be intervening

and America?

But no because they don't want to, is just because they have now the X-Men, and the Fantastic Four for the movies and have better kids team for tv > Runaways, Power Pack, New Mutants

Ms. Marvel becomes the independent leader of the champions.

Miles just started becoming his own superhero.

Nova just stuck in limbo.

Miles first arc with his uncle was pretty darn good.

Kamalas stories before they started throwing her all over the place were pretty good.

One of the issues is that you people expect super iconic stories from new characters while you buy every single issue of dog shit xmen, spider-man, and company.

Look how well Xmen Gold sells, yet it is god damn fucking boring as hell.

you could take /co fav writer with /co favorite artist and make a story that many people think is great... but if its miles/kamala/sam/gayMan/ect yall still won't buy it while boring Xmen story name 2892 staring the same ol shit will be praised.

Those are 3 of the worst Characters that Marvel has created. All are just new versions of better heroes, 2 are diversity hires, 1 is trying to outright replace a legend with an even more legendary name.

Seriously, you can't beat Dick Rider

Yet.

>1 is trying to outright replace a legend with an even more legendary name.
Rich came back during the last relaunch of Nova and he was treated pretty well during that period.
It's a shame it took so long, but Loveness gave him his due.

>2 are diversity hires
Wasn't Nova Mexican?

Sam was Latino but until the last relaunch it rarely came up.

kamala shit is actually totally pointless. ive heard from some middle eastern dude that some prince of saudi or uae or something like that is a hardcore manga fan who love one piece.
they dont even emphasize with that awkward islam shit. the preferences of the average muslim youth arent different from ours. plenty of them actually love those fighting games where some lewd characters fight. you can watch many of their matches on youtube. ofc they read manga, watch anime and fap to hentai. they are the same as us.

what? What are you trying to say? What is kamala shit?

This. There is the same problem over at DC. Good runs like New Super-man, Red hood and etc sell like absolute shit while people gobble up the million running batwank runs or tomasi and jurgens’ abortions. Then complain why DC doesn’t pay attention to heir lesser known characters.

>get Gage to write it
>add Finesse/Hazmat

The problem is that the people who make up the majority purchasing power are retarded "collectors"/speculators and literal mouthbreathing morons. There aren't enough people interested in purchasing floppies and discerning in taste for it to matter.

Even if every single person on Sup Forums who liked New Superman bought two copies it wouldn't change a thing. We aren't big enough, or rich enough, to compete with idiots.

I think he's trying to say that nobody want/cares about a muslim superhero, not even there and that everybody fap to anime and watch Naruto, and that's why Yoshida is in charge now, Long live the Shōgun それは西洋の愚かさで終わるでしょう!

Exactly. And people wonder why the comic industry and companies are in the state that they are.

Even though that is true, she is a good character with and without the muslim angle.

they dont read that shit. would rather fap to loli crap. same goes for muslim girls. they dont give a fuck about the dogma or the entitlement of the religion unless they are deeply indoctrinated.

Sup Forums has plenty of muslim posters and i actually confirmed it when i used to post there, even though they are pretty "progressive" muslims. and i personally know that many muslims like ones from somewhat secularized muslim countries like uae, saudi, kuwait, etc love fighting games. and that female coplayer who has many Sup Forumsack fans is muslim and turk.

They put themselves in this situation by appealing to manchildren instead of trying to expand their audience. If the two biggies operated the way they did in the 40's and 50's superheroes would have gone back to being a niche genre around the 80s or early 90s with a resurgence in the 10s. They refuse to meaningfully shift priorities towards books that will make money, meaning they rely on whales and tread water.

So basically the user is saying in order to improve comic sales is to turn everything into fanservice for men?????
Fuck that shit.
This is why we have frumpy looking pathetic male leads. They try to cater to waifufags and then wonder why people bitch where their husbandos are ruined.

When they also try to do something normal without pandering to a group, people boycott because it doesn’t cater to their jerkoff material.

I've read a few of Kamala, she's just like all the female teens that Marvel do, is cute like all of them, she's just like Jean in the 60's, Kitty Pride in the 80's, Squirrel Girl in the 90's or Molly in the 2000's, if you like that kind of characxters she's great for you, i don't really care but she doesn't belong to the 616 big events I think, at least not now ...

And now is replaced by Gwenpool, so I don't think she can succeed in the long term

The annoying part is that I really like Kamala and enjoyed the early issues of the run. But then with the constant islam preaching by the side characters in the book I got turned off big time. Those parts of the comic are written exactly like the graphic novels they they gave us to study from in islamic theology class when i was in middle east. Pure propaganda garbage.

She wasn't big in the events. She is in the backgrounds, fighting mooks.

Gwenpoole was a neet, While ms. marvel was a fanfiction writer.

The audience for good female protags who also matter doesn't really overlap with the kind of superhero fans who care about big events.

Most of the event comics crowd wants their girls cute/sexy. These same people hate these characters if they have flaws or disagree with other characters. Those who don't fall into that category are turned off immediately by unattractive females, so you're stuck with cute-or-sexy still. Most of the people looking for a complex female lead just aren't going to be into Marvel's 5th annual world-changing event. The best you can get with female superheroes are supporting roles in other books or minis that die fast and indie stuff. They just aren't viable with most of DC and Marvel's audience.

>One of the issues is that you people expect super iconic stories from new characters while you buy every single issue of dog shit xmen, spider-man, and company.

Gee I wonder why I buy those characters....

You’re a cancerous characterfag. Enjoy your dogshit. At least have some dignity to only support good stories with your fav character.

I kind of miss Nova and Miles interactions. I thought they would make a cool bromance kind of thing.

A simple question: If you were a writer, why would you put an effort in writing a corporate character, while you could very well create your own?

Portfolio/recognition.

I look more impressive and can get better gigs if I'm a beloved Spidey writer than as some guy who made a book nobody read. I can also still make my own work at the same time. How many people do you think would know Grant Morrison if he didn't take on Animal Man, X-Men and Batman with such zeal?

I didn't think those parts were that bad because half the time something happened right after the soapboxing that pretty much takes the wind out of its sails, and the broader point I think was that life is complicated and nobody's side is truly correct even though all sides should be respected

there's no denying that the book has a definite slant toward the muslim POV though

>Portfolio/recognition.
For that, you don't need to have a good marvel story, all you need is ANY marvel story.

Grant Morrison started in different time and age, long before Image, and creator-owned books

they should be partnering up to fight crime in each others books (or I guess just spider-man since nova can't hold an audience), but bendis definitely thinks sam is beneath miles and refuses to acknowledge him

he's such a selfish writer, I'm so glad he's gone

>Gwenpoole was a neet, While ms. marvel was a fanfiction writer.
I really think that Gwenpoole was made to replace Kamala, they gave her one of the best artist and the writer was doing great, who knows I could be wrong ...

they hate young heroes. if they grow and develop that means time passes and that means the established adult heroes will get older. Older heroes means they can't be hip cool cats like they were in the 70s. We can't have Spider-man maturing and getting his life together! Quick have somebody make a pact with NOT! Satan!

I can't tell you who wrote Future's End, X-Men Gold or several years of recent Action Comics/Superman/Tec/etc.

I can tell you Nick Spencer wrote Superior Foes, Chris Hastings wrote Gwenpool, and Gene Yang writes MSN.

It matters, and it's good practice.

>spiderfag thinks peter is the only character who got fucked over
Get over it cunt. It was a shit ship anyway.

>MSN
New Superman, my bad.

He isn't the only person to get fucked over like that but his retcon was the most egregious

Congratulations, you belong to1% of people who give a fuck

>that female coplayer who has many Sup Forumsack fans is muslim and turk
that's a man

degenerate and delicious

>Ask why you should try
>It's better for getting work and recognition
>No it's not!
>People remember standouts more
>b-but barely anyone does!

If I get 101% sales compared to 100%, that's still a big deal. And 1% of cape readers giving enough of a shit to pick up my book is like a 20% sales increase at minimum.

I gave you a good reason, now stop crying about getting an answer you didn't want.

Lemire wrote a shitty x-book, and was a meh big two writer, I doubt it affected his indie career

None of which you write can be proved empirically, you're talking about theory. You mentioned spencer, and when I think of spencer, I think of secret empire. And it was a BAD marvel book. He previously wrote inoffensive superior foes, but it wasn't extraordinary. He certainly didn't become more famous because of that book. Again, why would you try to excel in corporation property, if you can spend that amount of energy in your own creation? It doesn't mean that you have to write a bad marvel book, but it doesn't have to be legendary either

I said writing a good book helps, not that writing a bad one hurts. Consumers are weird like that, where you REALLY need to piss em off to make a potential sale decide it's better to stay away.

Yeah, but again, don't expect any creator to top Days of Future Past, Born Again, Death of Gwen Stacy, and so on. At best, their work will be okay, but nothing that will become legendary, or classic

i didnt mean that. im just saying no muslims read kamala crap because its very pointless, preachy and boring, and they enjoy geek stuff in the same way as us. they enjoy manga and probably normal superhero movies, love those exciting battles and melodramas regardless of characters races and nationalities, watch anime and american sitcoms, make memes, play fightans in international events along with westerners and often win, and sometimes fap to those lewd cute fighters. im sure muslim female nerds also watch anime and some consume yaoi shit. ive also heard on Sup Forums that in some MENA country, i forget the name but iirc Tunisia or Algeria, scanlation manga has been a thing and nearly everyone in school has read it.

why do you see them as some special aliens? i dont think you are a zealous sjw activist but sound similar to those sjws who treat japanese like uncivilized subhumans who dont get western modern progressive values. anyway, muslim youths in general arent like that either. most of them are the same as us. there're other problems with such a globalization though.

Grant Morrison started during the heyday of creator-owned comics, Image was founded towards the end and was simply the most popular and profitable, namely because almost everyone involved was a massive star due to their work on Marvel comics.

You seem to be mixing up "remembered" with "good." There was plenty better in 2017, but it isn't "iconic" enough to carry forward the same way, much like how we still remember Bob Jane's shittacular traces compared to some of the great cover art that slips by unnoticed every month.

Character development requires characters to do mistakes, learn from experience and sometimes be wrong about something. And we can't have that with minority characters because Miles represents every black person everywhere and suggesting Miles would have any flaws would suggest black people have flaws and thats racist.

So far only Kamala has managed to have actual character development, because the writer in her own book is not a retard.

Because you're fat.
And a cancerous characterfag

Kamala's first run was good.

>Good runs like [...] Red hood
>Jason a lesser known character
u havin a laf?

Fucking this, it's why post-OMD Spider-Man seems more artificial than before. The moment I read Brevoort claim that youth was the actual theme of Spider-Man and not responsibility I knew they were gonna get fucked bad and loudly deny it.

Funy you say that because if a comic does have lewd shit it won’t get published in any middle eastern or muslim country. Do you really think they covered up the female heroes for Feminist shit? No you fool. They did it to pass the censorship laws.
Now cry more.

This is what's wrong with Marvel Antos, Rivera, Waid, and Visaggio. Get rid of them and Marvel will improve.

Goddamn you autistic fuck. Donmt take it literally you know exactly what I meant.
Tell me why his comic sells like absolute dogshit.

Peter was such a fucking awful person in high school, it's great.

>Tomasi and jurgens
Oh, it's you again.

>Good runs like New Super-man, Red hood and etc sell like absolute shit while people gobble up the million running batwank runs or tomasi and jurgens’ abortions
Without the latter, the former wouldn't exist. Also, I don't think it' DC's fault if people prefer the same old crap.

Dude, Jurgens has been boring trash since the 90's. That's not a controversial opinion.

When did I ever put the blame on DC? The fandumb demands it they provide. Itms honestly not the companies’ faults.

No, it's your hateboner.

>trying to expand their audience
Shut up, tumblr.

>DC and Atlas did well on romance and comedy books in the 50s
>Anyone who suggests they should try different genres again is LE TUMBLR BOOGIEMAN

I hate plebs so much.

Because you’re a sheep.

>got screw over by events.
Why do kamalafags keep telling this lie when her book hasn't done a tie in chapter in over a year? She went to shit on her own and her sells didn't drop until that dumb ass voting chapter. Willow killed the book trying to get political.

DC tried again with the New52; they made some war comics. It failed.

Sam's first run was incredibly fun. It reminded me of Spidey in a good way, but the BIG CHANGING sEVENTS fucked up the story's pace.

Miles right now can either get better or crash and burn now that Bendis is gone.

Kamala got ruined since CW 2.0 and her comic hasn't been able to recover but she like Miles gets pushed a lot so she won't be going anywhere.

Sam is the one that is treated like shit mainly because his comics have sold like shit, Nova is such a niche property and the only time it sold decently was when DnA were writing it. The one thing that keeps him around is Jeph Loeb. He had potential but his stories, aside from Loveness' Nova and Duggan's run, haven't been that great.

>Market a line-wide superhero reboot
>throw in a few war books
>don't actually promote them
>don't even try to get them into wider distribution models
>fail

Well that settles it, only superheroes can sell.
Please ignore all those romance and comedy import hook comics beating out 90% of our catalogue in sales every year.

Kid Nova was good with Rich

Sam is honestly the only half-way decent one. Give him to a competent writer and they could do something cool with him.

The whole thing started off with an event.

>import hook comics
And then there's that. In the 50s there was no competence from comics from other countries.

marvel needs to stop with the events. they only make things worse than they already are.

Sounds like Zoloman needs to get to the Marvel Universe and teach these new heroes someb”lessons”.

No thanks. Keep your shit villain over at his containment retconned flash series.

At least DC has villains.

And that’s the problem with so many of these new heroes at Marvel, they barely have any struggles in the first place. Like Kamala’s biggest struggle has been not being able to date Bruno due to her religion but she in no way tried to confront that or her family and just accepts it for how it has because Wilson doesn’t have any courage to go in this direction.

The insulting part is that her struggle doesn't matter anymore since they are forcing Red Dagger to be a thing.

Marvel has been shit under Alonso, I mean this almost got approved

newsarama.com/38009-star-lord-sailor-moon-the-guardians-of-the-galaxy-gender-bent-magical-girl-high-school-drama-comic-that-marvel-almost-did.html

How the fuck is Red Hood better than Tomasi’s Superman run? Stop repeating the same type of shit WallyGropius

Because Mikes, Sam, and Kamala have such great villains themselves right?

That URL has given me AIDS. Great.

That was Bruno's struggle. Kamala came down with a case of "too late" once he started dating Mike but that was largely minor; the real issue is the rift between the two as a result of CWII.

Becky is a legit great villain for Kamala; her only issue is the crappy bubble suit.

Eh. She's not the worst but I don't know if I would go as far as "good character".

Agree to disagree user, her authoritarian streak is slightly interesting but she’s largely incredibly bland.

Of all the fucking cosmic characters to make into a Magical girl, Star-Lord is the worst.

>They have to be COMPETENT too
Oh the HUMANITY! How could DC have EVER managed?! Clearly there's no room for anything else!

It says a lot that the best issue of either volumes of Kamala's series is the one where she didn't show up and it focused largely on Zoe.

This.
Kamala was a mistake. Zoe should've been Ms. Marvel.