Why are people so obsessed with "action" shows? A show can have a sense of drama without revolving around fist fights or sword fights or whatever the hell kind of fights you somehow think are needed for entertainment.
That isn't to say I think action or fighting is bad where it's appropriate, I just don't understand the mindset that requires all media to revolve around it in order to be acceptable
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Jem had action to appeal to boys so they didn't change the channel when it came on as Sunbow and Hasbro both believed boys controlled the dial and watched what they wanted regardless of what their sister wanted to watch. Jem was one big expensive commercial to sell dolls so they needed as big of a viewer base as possible. It also happens to be a great show in its own right.
Violence is the easiest "conflict" for children and retards to understand.
Who is obsessed with action shows? Who thinks fights are needed for entertainment and drama? Who is even demanding drama? Why does this thread exist?
>implying there aren't multiple threads weekly asking why there aren't action cartoons anymore
>implying there aren't constantly threads up asking why _insert show here_ doesn't feature enough fight scenes like muh chinese cartoons
Because Sup Forums is comics and cartoons, there is a lot of crossover with the superhero comics crowd (a.k.a. "capeshit"). That genre tends to have a lot of action, so for a large segment of Sup Forumsmrades action has a certain special appeal.
But I agree with you, OP
cause slice-of-life relationship drama bullshit is boring
a little of that shit is ok, but why would I waste time listening to a bunch of fictional characters whine about contrived emotional conflict when i don't like dealing with that bullshit in real life?
if i wanted to watch a bunch of cunts complain about things that don't really matter i'd watch sex in the city
It's your preference and that's fine, but you're kind of proving my point. Somehow in your brain you associate fighting with something meaningful, when half the time it means as much nothing as anything else. Take a show like DBZ for example, it has nothing meaningful to offer and the only positive trait anyone can name are the fight scenes, and I don't know how grown adults are entertained by those either
I get that much, but like I said I'm not against action where it's appropriate, like obviously anything super hero related is going to focus on bad guy vs good guy fighting to some extent
I think, OP, that there is a difficulty articulating what qualities in a cartoon are good or enjoyable. This is why people often use generic terms like "comedy" or "action" or "slice of life". Then, the conversation becomes an argument over what genre a cartoon is attempting to achieve and whether it has achieved it well.
But when you look at examples of successful cartoons, you find that it is not usually a matter of trying for the funniest comedy or the most melodramatic drama or the most action-y action. Really, it is more a matter of achieving an entertaining and formalistically coherent plot within the fictional world of the series.
>Why are people so obsessed with "action" shows?
we have a glut of mid-tier slice of life cartoons, but action cartoons for the most part necessitate decent animation and we're sorely lacking in those.
It's more that:
1. People don't like it when a show has action and it's handled poorly: Steven Universe, OK KO. Give someone something of bad quality, it's usually worse than not having it at all.
2. People are upset that only the first thing exists because action cartoons in general are in serious decline. I can think of Voltron, Avengers, Star Wars, Spiderman, and Justice League to keep people happy for action toons. Compare that to when these same people were growing up and the action genre was bursting.
Star Vs. does what you suggest: It has magical fight scenes but often the most tense scenes are two characters in a room talking. I think of the scene with Moon arguing with Buff Frog while they play a board game as a good example. To me, it's an example of what SU should strive to be.
Gumball uses action scenes comedically very well. They're usually over the top and sometimes visually amazing, which to me, is the example of what OK KO should strive to be.
A show can have a sense of drama without revolving around fights, yes. Theoretically.
In practice, cartoon examples basically don't exist.
an addendum: most of us on Sup Forums also watch anime and we're frustrated that the western cartoon scene is so far behind
>Why are people so obsessed with "action" shows? A show can have a sense of drama without revolving around fist fights or sword fights or whatever the hell kind of fights you somehow think are needed for entertainment.
yeah but let's be honest, They don't teach this stuff in animation school(atleast in the US), they teach this in acting school, and the last place animators go is to acting courses(Atleast in the US)
This. Action shows, by nature, require them to be more animated in ways beyond slapstick and Avery-style gags.
That too. And it's a problem that isn't just as simple as, "Do what anime does" because their entire method of production is so vastly different. Lack of unions (Which is why a lot of American studios abuse Canadian and New York animation studios as well), the way shows are distributed (Network will contract studios vs. studios will make a product then sell airtime to a network, all the money coming from DVD sales), pay rate (Some studios paying per drawing rather than per hour). Not to mention different culture attitudes of Japan "You should be happy to work and complaining makes you look ungrateful" vs. America "Studios NEED artists! They would be nothing without you, value your skill!".
For anyone to say that the entire country is lacking in action animators is foolhardy. Even if we were, we can outsource a good action animator like we do for nearly everything else. Yeah, overall, the artists who graduate art school here vs. art school in Japan is way lower (and that also contributes to some of the problem), but even if they were all great artists, the industry would still have a hell of a way of stifling them and their abilities.
To me there needs to be a story or something that indicates were the story is going.
Also Jem had action, murder plots, people being kidnapped, and thriller, on the side.
There is also the fact that the Japanese animation industry has its own internal issues that are damaging to its product.
Thank you. At least seomeone has a brain in this shitty strawman thread. Unless you're digging into obscure foreign animation, you will never find anything of value in animation.
I was agreeing with you up until
>Star Vs. does what you suggest
Unless OP is a total shiteater (which I have no doubts about, but let's keep an open mind) that's probably not what he meant
Only total retards can swallow the garbage that is action-oriented anime. It's some of the worst media I have ever witnessed.
>"hurr durr jem had no action or fun"
t. Kelly Thompson
I wish they rebooted Jem, but without changing a single thing to try and contemporize/modernize the show.
Just bring back the pure, unadulterated 1980s outrageousness and borderline murder. Also, the implicit lesbianism between Kimber and Stormer, but without one being a toothpick and the other being a sack of potatoes.
I mean, OP is using a girl with magical powers in his thumbnail where a lot of the drama in the show comes from relationships. Star Vs. isn't that different in ideas, just different in aesthetic. But even so, I was comparing Star to Steven in particular, since people are usually bringing up the "Steven fights are shit" as why action is dead.
SU isn't an action show though. It's a dramedy with the occasional action scene, which won't necessarily be a fight scene either. It's like the complaints that IDW Jem didn't have enough attempted murder when the Jem cartoon was primarily interpersonal drama and romance with the occasional attempted murder.
I'll be honest wth you, I was writing the Star vs. part as a tad of a passive-aggressive "fuck you" to OP.
>people like a particular type of thing which is lacking these days
>faggot OP misinterprets that as "people want everything to be that thing" and goes on a patronizing strawman rant to look smarter than he actually is
It's like I'm on Sup Forums.
>SU isn't an action show though. It's a dramedy with the occasional action scene, which won't necessarily be a fight scene either
But I thought that's what OP was referring to? "Why are people obsessed over a show needs to have action" referring in particular to people complaining how SU should have better action scenes even though the show has always been about relationship drama and character conflict. The same complaints exist with OK KO and how "the action scenes suck" even though it's a silly comedy, not trying to be Avatar.
I mention Star because that show has sucky action scenes too, but it doesn't get nearly as shat on here because at least people like the character conflict. And KO doesn't need badass action scenes, but people give it shit because a lot (not all) of the action scenes are trying to be "cool" instead of funny, which is what the action scenes in Gumball are.
I thought OP was subtley referring more to Sup Forums's recent shitposting on those two shows in particular, because it's the only time I see people, "See this clip?! Action is dead!".
>"See this clip?! Action is dead!".
Been doing that since season 1 of SU. If anything it's a combination of shitposting and sincerely held but retarded beliefs about what is and what isn't an action show.
>Thank you. At least seomeone has a brain in this shitty strawman thread. Unless you're digging into obscure foreign animation, you will never find anything of value in animation.
I appreciate the compliment, but you misread my post. There are some great cartoons, but they are overwhelmingly action-based, or at least have action as a major part of the show.
Nothing wrong with wanting more action shows. well made action cartoons use the animation medium to its greatest potential. That's why they are so expensive and aren't made anymore. That being said i wouldn't want every cartoon to be an action show just like I wouln't want every one being a sitcom comedy.
It's in the same universe as GI Joe/Transformers
as bad as western cartoons are , anime is in a far worse state and would rather watch SU or any other circle-jerk show that 4 chan despises than watch any non jojo anime in the past 4 years.
''Not action' doesn't mean slice of life relationship drama. It can mean horror, mysteries etc
>Not to mention different culture attitudes of Japan "You should be happy to work and complaining makes you look ungrateful" vs. America "Studios NEED artists! They would be nothing without you, value your skill!".
Are you COMPLETELY sure you didn't get the countries backwards there? The "Japanese" attitude in particular fits the America I know infinitely more...
THIS
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Care to back up your statement with specific points? Because your opinion is... uncommon.
How can horror be non action? I can see a case for mystery with non violent crime,but even then there would be a chase at the end
Did you not fucking read
This. Historically, American dramatic cartoons, i.e., cartoons that took themselves seriously and didn't joke around constantly, were action/adventure/superhero shows, which were generally full of violence. The problem now is there's almost no shows that take themselves seriously.
America definitely lures younger artists with the pristine of, "Wouldn't you LOVE to work at a big place like Disney?" but I've seen the push for the attitude of, "It's the artists who are valuable, not the studios!" over the last decade or so.
>Don't wait for a studio, make your own stuff. You don't need to work at a studio.
>Go indie, being independent is the best world an artist can be in, you won't have your hard work stolen by a big company.
>Don't kill yourself over your work. Make sure to care for your health and don't work yourself to death just to draw.
>Know your worth, studios will trick you into thinking you need them, but they need you!
This is something I've noticed people across the board from recent college graduates to old-school veterans preaching to people. If Americans didn't have this attitude, we wouldn't have animation unions to begin with. CartoonBrew did a whole cover about how Titmouse in NY pays their artists less than Titmouse in California and how unfair it is, even though both studios pay their artists way more than most non lead animators in an anime studio. There was also the wage-fixing scandal with the major animated film studios. Even though most of the employees get paid really well, employees didn't like finding out they could be making more and filed a lawsuit.
Meanwhile, Japan is still trying to get basic animation guilds going that America accomplished back the 30's - 40's.
There are different types of horror, 'psychological horror' is more slow paced for instance. The Babadook was a horror movie with little in the way of action. Other examples include Oculus, The Exorcism of Emily Rose, The Awakening, Silent Hill and for tv examples the first season of American Horror Story fits as well. Action set pieces are used sparingly for key scenes if used at all (The Awakening doesn't have anything like this).
Slasher horror movies are more action oriented by contrast.
As for mystery: I don't consider a singular chase sequence at the conclusion to warrant an 'Action' genre tag. Lots of mystery and true crime shows focus on investigative methods in near totality. If you don't watch or read much in these genres you might be unaware of what the pacing of this media is like. I think House is a good example of a mystery show without conventional action sequences.
You say this but reference a show that had the bad guys trying to murder the good guys in nearly every episode and the pilot had their house blown up
Slasher movies are chase-oriented, only works that shoot for deconstruction are action-oriented.
Somehow in your brain you associate fighting over first world issue drama as meaningful. Violence is cut and dry, it's why it works so well, you can dice out the details but it's a hero saving others from a threat. Get into that heroes marriage and enjoy everyone having their own opinion on that shit. That's can get fucking retarded fast and even boring, because everyone has their own compass of who was right and wrong and that shit drives them into anger/disagreement more than "Superman vs Goku" thread. It's what leads to it becoming boring, someone is only going to care so much about stupid shit because we -all- have our own goddamn drama. It's why there was that running gag that the only people that watch soap operas in the 90s was 60 something year old people who had nothing going on anymore, hell even now most people that eat up bullshit drama like cheating spouses, bad friendships and what not because they don't have anything going on irl. That's why fighting takes center stage most people can not get into gun fights that end in expositions,people can not fight giant robots with heat vision. That's why it takes over the market, because fuck Stacy having to fight Sara for Jonny's love, Fuck Mark dealing with his cheating wife and fuck all of kid coming to terms his dads a bad person. That shit is fine peppered in but when it takes center stage I might as well just look around my life and neighborhood for good entertainment.
I can't look at Jem anymore without thinking about Jiz.
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