Isn't the whole "mutant conflict" illogical in the Marvel Universe?

In Marvel people have powers for countless diverse reasons. Somebody like Dr.Strange and Professor Xavier aren't that different yet one is stigmatized while the other not. Same could be said for many heroes and villains, won't bother listing them all.

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Yeah racism and bigotry are stupid and illogical!!

Mutants represent racism/gays, it's not supposed to make sense. Also, Marvel citizens are the most stupid, hypocritical, and angry people in fiction

Yeah, it's pretty obvious that shitting on someone for being marginally different is sort of dumb and senseless.
And yet . . .

It's worse if you are born with powers, apparently.

Don't try to make sense of Marvel's civilians. One day, they were Inhumans biggest fans, going out of their way to smell their fart to see if they could become Inhumans themselves. Few months after, they were glad that Inhumans were dying in concentration camps. No reason was given for the change of opinion.

Are you memeing or serious? I mean from a technical sense, humans and mutants can do most of the same things via magic and technology. You would have no way of knowing if Spiderman, Thor or Captain America were mutants or not.

Also this. Marvel Civilians are worse than world War II era German civilians, if you were on fire they wouldn't piss on you to put it out.

No. Mutants are extremely notable in comics for the young age their powers manifest and their frequent inability to control those powers.

What about prodigies like Dr.Doom?

Yes and no. Dr. Strange isn't exactly a public figure, Xavier isn't outwardly a mutant.

It's the fear that one day you're going to wake up and your kid has grown eyeballs for skin and when he farts it explodes. That's why the Morlocks are kind of a better example here. Anyone can gain powers, or build a suit, but one person who snaps their bones off to use as weapons is different because they're icky.

Don't get me wrong, it is a little silly, but at least there's no "gene" that can be passed down from someone who gained their powers in a scientific accident. It's like a more extreme example of homophobia because HIV/AIDS is more prevalent among them.

I'm serious, but I feel that you misconstrue what I'm saying here
What I mean is that it's an incredibly stupid and senseless thing, but all forms of bigotry are.
I'm not trying to pretend it's a good metaphor.

Couldn't they just lie?

"I'm not a mutant, I just ate toxical waste yesterday, that's why I have two noses now!"

>Don't get me wrong, it is a little silly, but at least there's no "gene" that can be passed down from someone who gained their powers in a scientific accident
Spider-Man's daughter has powers.

Well yes some could in theory, but sometimes it's more extreme like Cyclops just suddenly having beams explode out of his face uncontrollably, causing massive destruction. Kinda hard to write that off as just a fluke.

almost all children of supers in the Marvel U have powers

How can they even tell though? is correct. Also you have people like marvel.wikia.com/wiki/Russian_(Earth-616) who are "normal" humans but have unnatural super strength.
But being bit by a radioactive spider by a fluke and suddenly being ripped is ok.

The mutant hate was so mindblowingly stupid that they created Sublime. Basically a sentient bacteria (kind of like Despotellis). Wants to evolve or takeover the earth or something, but it can't infect mutants so it infects humans and turns them into lynch mobs. Or something to that effect. This shit gives me a headache.

also the writers don't care. sometimes i'm not sure if they ever cared. These people are really fucking stupid. Why do I read comics?

Yeah, but the public doesn't know that. It doesn't fix the hysteria. Valeria Richards doesn't have powers from cosmic rays, but her brother happens to be a mutant.

Pete wasn't suddenly ripped by any means and he has a secret identity so that's not really a valid point at all user.

"I ate toxic waste yesterday, that's why now my eyes are connected to the punch dimension".

I don't see the difficulty.

That's the thing, they can't tell. I mean, Cap is pretty apparent - he was a national icon whose powers were created by an American experiment. Thor is literally a God - Asgard appears on Earth and shit.

Spidey is still hated and considered a menace in a lot of cases. I mean, if you read House of M, he pretends to be a mutant so people DON'T dislike him.

Everyone always forgets most mutants don't fight crime and they are just regular people who want to be left alone who can pry inside your mind or explode at will.

>also the writers don't care. sometimes i'm not sure if they ever cared. These people are really fucking stupid. Why do I read comics?
It's not even that the concept is bad. It just doesn't make sense when interrelated into the rest of the marvel canon. They would have been better off forgetting the whole "mutant dna" thing completely and just have people be against usually powered beings for various reasons. Magneto could have been a nazi experiment, he didn't need to be born that way.

>Everyone is afraid of what mutants might do
>Nobody gives half a shit what Deadpool and Punisher actually do
>Somehow Spider-Man being friends with a cat burglar was an issue that needed to be fixed by editorial mandate
>Spider-Man being friends with a psychopathic mercenary is totally kosher
>people still autistically hate the hulk, but A-Bomb, She-Hulk, Red She-Hulk, both variants of Red She-Hulk, Thing, Colossus, Devil Dinosaur, Kid Kaiju's backup singers, and so on and so forth are all perfectly fine

what did marvel mean by this

>hey are just regular people who want to be left alone who can pry inside your mind or explode at will.
Dr.Strange could do that if he wanted.

Most mutants don't have such cool powers. The majority of them can only do useless things like having three faces or shit like this.

No one's gonna listen when you just blew up their school, they're gonna try to kill you.

really wishing sublime died the moment Morrison left Marvel.

>they're gonna try to kill you.
But is that because he's a "mutie" or because he blew up their school?

Sublime did it.

MU anti-mutant sentiment has more concrete scientific backing than real-world racism.

>what did marvel mean by this
"We need better editors."

has anyone ever taken Sup Forums posts about why they hate black people, changed them a little, and posted them in "Why do people hate mutants" threads?

or would that not work bc Sup Forums is so racist they'd just be like "makes sense!"

They are fans of Captain Marvel and Inhumans destroying shit, but if a kid eats a radioactive sandwich and explodes something accidentally, they suddenly have a problem?

>Timmy's mutant power is that his toenails actually grow faster than his fingernails
>better send him to a detention center

Both.
'Look at this fucking mutie blowing up our school, let's get him'

Well now you're talking about current Marvel, user.
And you and I both know nothing in current marvel has made any fucking sense for a couple years now.

It's different with mutants because the powers are:
>random
>uncontrollable
>evolutionary
Mutants are theoretically stated as the next stage in evolution, meaning that their entire existence is maybe destined to wipe humanity out.

You don't think that would pose a bigger more widespread freakout than a guy in a metal suit or a super soldier from a government program? Of course it would.

Mutants are the largest scale, most uncontrollable form of superheroes.
It's a lot different than "Oh look another guy with some science-y thing that was designed a certain way." It's literally "Tomorrow one of them might be born who could randomly wipe out a city if he has the 'power' to explode."

Yeah that's the other thing. Living WMDs who can't control their powers very well. Quite a bit different from "Oh look a guy in a costume who can stick to walls."

Oh hey it's this thread again.

But Alien Gods are not seen that way, despite being there in abundance?

That wasn’t the case originally, though. Our “freak” mutants were originally “has angel wings” and “has big feet and hands”. Nightcrawler came along later with a more freakish look, but even then he was a ladies’ man. It was only after many years before someone decided that it needed to be more random and debilitating to make the mutation bit more than just random powers. And no, Morlocks don’t count because they did that shit to themselves. Because they’re retarded

Nah.

Sentry was Marvel's most powerful and dangerous retard and he got his powers by drinking juice made by the government. A much bigger threat than the mutants, and it was made the same way as Captain America.

there's a bit of a disconnect in these threads where everyone thinks all mutants = X-Men because those are the only mutants you see.

so using a Sup Forums analogy the X-Men would be like celebrity activists who have no business talking about issues because they're not doing enough or too well off

For every dozen Timmies, Beaks, and Ugly Johns there's a Magneto or Wolverine fucking people up.

It just requires suspension of disbelief. Digging really hard at the underpinnings of this fantasy universe with obvious holes results in boring fan theories or boring stories. Yes, I'll bet if Superman were real, it would be utterly impossible to get an insurance policy on anything in Metropolis due to the daily level of property destruction. Doesn't mean that's a really great idea for a story.

I know right? How many times have we had this tired discussion now? Honestly should just start screencapping responses.

Mutant hate isn't just from powers but the myriad complications from their genetics and community. There have been people like Magneto who literally called themselves part of a brotherhood of EVIL. MUTANTS. There have been a range of mutant related apocalypse events everyone else just had to put up with, and no real measures after were established.
There are a range of ways to detect the x gene.

The X-men take in mutants but they barely police them, cunts like Quire can get up to mind probing mischief if they like and get a slap on the wrist at worst.

Whataboutism towards Spider-Men or Hulks doesn't help because they're often viewed as contemptible as mutants when they cause trouble and begin spreading.

Technology is not remotely the same as having an x-gene.
Stephen Strange learned magic under strict conditions and tutelage, if and when he or many other magicians like Doom fuck up it typically comes down on them. As said with Quire and Phoenix and Wanda and whoever else, when a mutant loses control the typical implied response is "what the fuck are you going to do about it?" as things are swept under the rug, there's no real authority that sits over them, no order in their ranks.

Many failings in Marvel are forgotten or forgiven for the convenience of future stories, but overall the persistent paranoia around mutants is reasonable. There just no limit on anything about them.

>Nobody gives half a shit what Deadpool and Punisher actually do
They are not received well in the superpowered community, only those who know them personally tolerate their behavior and barely at that.

Pre Crisis Superman probably fixed all the property damage himself.

>Isn't racism illogical?
Yes.

Did Morrison introduce the debilitating mutations that have basically no positives, or did someone before him do it first?

Why do people in-universe like the Fantastic Four and Captain America when they are friends with people like Namor, a notorious terrorist?

I know it had popped up before that, but I can’t recall it being as emphasized. Beak obviously being the stand-out, but I know there was this awful plot line about a crippled mutant whining about how the X-Men were all beautiful with great powers. Might have been him, but I know it was around that run

He was right, though.

More often than not, X-Men stories are focused on relationship drama. The X-Men are a bunch of attractive people that only worry about who is fucking who. They don't have jobs and live in a big mansion. They never had to worried about paying a bill.

"We are oppressed!". Gimme a break.

Nah, that wasn't Morrison. I vaguely remember that but I think it was earlier indeed.

>Why do people in-universe like the Fantastic Four
They keep their head down in their literal ivory tower.
>Captain America
Fought in a war for the people. While with the Avengers he and they operated with a conduct of culpability for their actions.

This isn't complex. 616 is a contrived, tangled ball of plot strings, but all the strings have beginnings that provide context for how they end up.

Depends which of them. Nightcrawler was chased from his village with literal pitchforks and torches. Beast has issues too but he did that shit to himself.
Then you had Blob and Toad who, not so coincidentally were bad guys.

He’s not right, because everyone in the Marvel universe is fucking beautiful unless the plot requires them to be ugly. It rings hollow when someone chooses out Cyke for being a buff dude when 1) he’s worked for that bod 2) his powers are an uncontrollable threat to entire blocks 3) you can pick a bystander out of any crowd and he’ll look just as good. Nightcrawler and Beast getting literally all the pussy also ruins the super model argument. That’s because this is a comic book universe and attempting to apply logic to it in-story falls apart with any scrutiny. I think a better take on this is Emma occasionally bringing up that she’s had extensive plastic surgery to look like she does.

>I think a better take on this is Emma occasionally bringing up that she’s had extensive plastic surgery to look like she does.
Also Morrison. His run has issues but I like that he brought up that aspect of mutants.

They still are a bunch of people whose major concern is "who is fucking who" that don't have to worry about paying bills and some of them have never had a job to begin with.

A very good life for "oppressed" people.

Some one getting powers through science or magic is different than being a member of a new species that threatens to replace you

Why? What difference does it make?

Morrison went too hard on it, threw in a bunch of fucking ugly mutants and pretended like that’s always been a thing

Your argument is retarded since it applies to the Avengers and FF too, as they don’t have jobs. The X-Men are oppressed because no one is trying to blow up busses full of Young Avengers

>They don't have jobs and live in a big mansion.

I never really thought about this.Stark Enterprises is probably the 3rd biggest economy on Earth, Peter was a CEO for 12 minutes, and Xavier inherited that big estate, but you'd think the money would've run down considering he has 400 wayward teens living in that mansion and has to pay property taxes, food, jet fuel., power, cyborgs, holograms, and whatever Internet package lets you hook up your brain to every mutant in the world

>Your argument is retarded since it applies to the Avengers and FF too, as they don’t have jobs.
I know that. The Avengers and the Fantastic Four are extremely privileged people, too. They are the 0,01%.

Super scientists, man, don’t have to pay for shit. Although I think it’s mentioned post-Decimation the X-Men were being funded by Emma’s rapidly depleting fortune.

Ultron literally wants to replace all of humanity with cyborgs but people are more concerned with that time his creator hit his wife, so continuing the human race clearly isn't really that high up on anyone's priority list

>Morrison went too hard on it, threw in a bunch of fucking ugly mutants and pretended like that’s always been a thing
I mean... Beast went feral in the Lee/Kirby run. Blob's first appearance is literally X-Men vol. 1 #3. They weren't always prevalent (which I'm pretty sure is lampshaded before and during his run), but they've been there essentially forever.

Cap has a pension, Thor is a prince of Asgard and his pubes are probably worth more than gold, Iron Man is Iron Man. Carol probably has a gubmint check coming too but she also lives in a station that is presumably funded by World governments, or just Wakanda

Popular fan theory around here is that he uses his telepathy to cheat on the stock market. Xavier's a lying asshole after all.

I’ll give you guys like Blob and Toad, but Beast did that shit to himself. And Nightcrawler was living proof that it’s not all bad, since the chicks loved him

How does change the fact that they are privileged as fuck?

Look at the Justice League. All of them, excluding Batman, have day jobs.

>threw in a bunch of fucking ugly mutants and pretended like that’s always been a thing
Did you miss the whole "mutant baby boom" plot?
More mutants in general = more ugly mutants

>Isn't the whole "mutant conflict" illogical in the Marvel Universe?
A lot of things are illogical in comic book Universes.
The idea that Marvel and DC comic Earth's don't have a thriving interstellar space program, with either Universe's 5th smartest guy perfectly capable of building spacecraft, is pretty illogical.

Both of them play at the "Earth isn't ready for intergalactic diplomacy" despite hostile and non-hostile aliens using the planet for a truckstop/invasion kick-off point on a weekly basis.

Didn't Nightcrawler get lynched to death twice?

>Superman
Has a day job
>Wonder Woman
Bitch, what? Her day job is being Wonder Woman.
>Flash
CSI Guy
>Jess
Waitress for all of 3 issues
>The other 5 Lanterns
Unemployed
>Aquaman
See Wonder Woman
>Cyborg
See Aquaman

??????????

Mutants = Jews
both are the chosen people that everyone hates for no reason but existing (and being the bestest)

>Beast did that shit to himself
Sure sure, but he was still chased pretty hauntingly for looking like an ugly grey/blue ape, honestly if you haven't read the orginal issues of that, I think it's one of the best done "I'm a monster and people hate me" of the time despite how many times Lee used that trope (and there's not a lot of his and Jack's X-Men that qualifies as their best work). So yeah it's because Hank is a dipshit, but ultimately that aspect of persecution of the ugly hero was present even as early as then.
Nightcrawler, yeah, ultimately, mutant chicks liked him, as someone said earlier he's one of the good guys in a cape comic. Even Beak has a hot wife.

Also when Morrison brought that to the forefront he had the forsight of doing in parralel with mutant becoming public and ultimately trendy, fetishized.

>Wonder Woman
She is an ambassador.

>Hal Jordan
Pilot

>Martian Manhunter
Detective

>Aquaman
A king. He is privileged too, I concur.

So, 2/7 of the League doesn't have to work, while 100% of the Avengers don't have jobs.

Shut up Kitty.

Hal hasn't had an Earth job in forever, friend, Carol fired his ass a billion years ago. AFAIK this has not been retconned by Rebirth

Wonder Woman's job is to go around with Steve doing Wonder Woman things. There is no such character as "Martian Manhunter". There are Manhunters but I don't think those have shown up in anything since Red Lanterns

I always thought it was odd that in Beasts original Avengers run he was fucking multiple women at the same time and even gets stopped and swarmed by horny women when just walking around.

Is it because hes blue and doesn't wear a shirt?

>Hal hasn't had an Earth job in forever, friend, Carol fired his ass a billion years ago.
Hal doesn't live an expensive lifestyle on Earth. None of the Avengers have jobs and they all spend more money than Hal used to spent when he had a job.

Wonder Woman is Themyscira's ambassador.

>There is no such character as "Martian Manhunter".
Marvel/casualfag here, fucking really?
Did they literally not introduce him at all in Rebirth? Or any Martians?

Fame? Pheromones? Furries?

>There is no such character as "Martian Manhunter"
I really hope this is a shitpost

Charisma, hero, ripped bod, intelligent, and is a bit taboo. That’s a winning combo. Kurt had it even better with the phallic tail, accent, and swashbuckling attitude

They live in the same universe as hostile aliens. If you know superpowered aliens and gods exist you're not going to discriminate so heavily against humans who sometimes develop powers you praise in other beings or even people who got them from experiments.

Mutants were at one point theorized to be the next step in human evolution, destined to usurp humanity from its rightful place at the top of the food chain on top of that older superhumans like the (original) human torch and Captain America were always thought to be one-off oddities. The mutants on the other hand are always near and people you know could actually be a mutant and be hiding it that weird kid at school who always keeps to himself could all of a sudden manifest fire powers and go full columbine in your school.

Yes. It doesn't make sense that the same people who celebrate Spider-Man and the Fantastic Four also hate the X-Men. I mean, what's the fucking difference? That some were in some freak accident that gave them powers and others were born with it? The average Marvel citizen wouldn't even know how their heroes got them!

That reminds me, Marvels! handled that really well. Such an excellent book.

>I threw a rock at a mutant child because other people were doing it!
Wow. Amazing, simply amazing.

That actually works on Marvel citizens until some asshole uses a mutant detector on you and launches the Sentinels.

he's been hanging out with Hawk and Dove

Never been in a mob? Things get stupid real quick

You say that like people never act this retarded irl.
Not to say that Marvels handles it perfectly, it takes one road out of many to explain away the discrimination.

That moment when people go crazy and start attacking anyone they SUSPECT to be a mutant sums up the attitude some people had towards mutants.
Yes it was.

Look, I'm no hero, but I would NOT throw rocks at children because retards were doing it. I know better than this.

The girl isn’t a child to them, that’s the point. It was a mutie. They dehumanized her and the main character only pulled back because he was in...WW II at nazi camps, I think?

i think that was used in marvel before, but i cant remember in which comic.

An Avenger doesn’t commit crime. A typical mutant civilian might. If they do, the people go “gas the muties!”. Just common sense.

>The girl isn’t a child to them, that’s the point. It was a mutie.
The entire story is about the Marvel civilians and the protagonist amazed at Marvel heroes. They see the Fantastic Four, Namor, Spider-Man, Hulk, Captain America and all they had to say was how amazing all of them were, even though they don't know much about their origin or how they got their powers.

Then he sees a fucking child in the street and tries to kill her because she is different and he doesn't know the origin of her difference?

Oh man, it’s almost like that’s included to highlight exactly how hypocritical and dumb that is. Almost like...the main character realizes that himself! You HAVE read this, right user? Because your second paragraph doesn’t describe something that happens in the story.

It’s like the difference between seeing black war veterans and then seeing a little nigger boy. A Sup Forumslack would pay respects and then throw rocks at the boy.

>An Avenger doesn’t commit crime.