Why was Ren & Stimpy "Adult Party Cartoon" so bad?

Why was Ren & Stimpy "Adult Party Cartoon" so bad?

>Pushes the boundaries of a kids show
It's really good.
>Pushes the boundaries of an adult show
It's really bad.

Because pushing the boundaries on a kid's show takes talent and creativity to avoid the censors.

Pushing the boundaries on an adult show just for the sake of pushing boundaries means there's nothing else the show can offer besides crude shock humor.

It was full of pandering to those who liked the toilet humor of the original series. Also, the selection of music was shit. Games was way better in that regard...

I haven't seen it but from what i heard its revolting because it thinks grossness without any comedic setting or writing automatically makes it funny. As much as peoole shit on mr pickles, that show at least uses some writing to try to make the events funny, sometimes at least.

Its something called subtlety. When you're putting adult stuff in a kids cartoon you have to disguise it and that takes some amount of creativity.

APC didn't try. It just put all the raunchy stuff front and center and the ENTIRE focus on the show was around those elements.

>On Spike TV as a debut programming show for the network
>let alone on Spike TV

Well boys, we got ourselves an open and shut case.

fpbp
this is also why Family Guy got worse as the seasons went on, the censors where pretty hard on them but lax off when they hit Simpsons level in sales.
Basically. The plots can usually be summarized as "they stumble on tits"

It's funny in a kids show because the writers have to present the humor in a subtle way as to not alert the censors. Without that, it just became a serious of increasingly unfunny sex jokes.

I mean, what's funnier:

>Flash: "I'm the fastest man alive"
>Hawgirl: "Maybe that's why you can't get a date"

vs.

>Flash: "I'm the fastest man alive"
>Hawkgirl: "Well maybe that's why your dick goes soft so quick"

Ren & Stimpy should've never gone to Nick in the first place; it would've done better on MTV alongside Beavis and Butthead, with less censorship but without overdoing the adult content.

How did South Park become a hit if it was nothing but gross jokes and adult content?

Trey and Matt were smart enough to keep the humor varied through broadening the scope of it to parodying pop-culture and current events. They also at least try to cycle jokes in and out to ensure they don't become stale. They stopped killing Kenny off when they realized it wasn't funny anymore, they stopped having Stan throw up whenever Wendy talked to him because it wasn't funny anymore, etc. Not saying they did that for everything, but it's what's kept (or at least used to keep) the humor fresh for awhile.

John K. doesn't believe in writers. He thinks cartoons should only be made by cartoonists.

Because they make a story to it and the shock shit is secondary. Barbra Streisand was a major antagonist in the first season, they had an episode implying swearing to much brings the end of days, they made a lord of the rings parody based on the boys trying to get rid of a porn video they were mistakenly given.
That's why it took so long for it to decline was they actually put stories to it unlike John Kricfalusi 03 shit which could be summarized as "tits and masturbation for 23 minutes!"

>John K. doesn't believe in writers. He thinks cartoons should only be made by cartoonists.
Why doesnt he work on steven universe then? He and the crew would get along fine with those views.

I was never a fan of gremlin-esque characters inexplicably paired up with sex objects. Not sure why this fetish exists. John K is a fine artist who should never take a directorial role. He needs someone to reign him and set his obsessive drive on a more efficient track.

It got a ton of credit early on for social satire alongside the gross-out humor and was also got in on the ground floor.

Entirely different format and humor style. Both shows had something working for them beneath the surface of gross-out humor, slapstick etc. For Ren and Stimpy it was its detailed visual humor, particularly its maniacal caricatures and overall unhinged tone. For South Park it was just clever writing and dialogue, and its outrageous satire of current events and politics.

I really wanna fuck that redhead.

Technically he's right, but it a utopian kind of way. Yeah it would be nice if the actual cartoonists think of great stuff 100 percent of the time, but as the Simpsons have shown you need some form of writing to make a coherent story.

South Park's humor has a lot more to it than the adult nature of the content, Adult Party Cartoon and many other adult cartoons do not.

But that's fucking wrong. Most of the best cartoons ever made, were made by actual cartoonist who understood the medium. You can keep your sitcom trash.

why didn't John K just make a porno?
there's never been a western hentai animated production to my knowledge, it's always just sexual content wrapped up in the pretense of a movie to try and validate it or it's amateur loops online.

maybe it just wasn't that funny

Ren Seeks Help was bretty gud.

The closest thing I can think of is The Sick Sad World of El Super Beasto encouraging the audience to jack off to the movie

I havent seen that film in years, i liked how it had captain spaulding in one scene

>I'M THE PITCHER YOU'RE THE CATCHER

One and done.

It's depressing how the majority of "adult" cartoons tend to be more immature than a show for literal children.

John K. is also a notorious perfectionist, while the crewniverse are known to be lazy as shit. He would cause a ridiculous amount of drama in the span of a few days.

>John thinking artists should have all the power
>When the Spike R&S was so poorly written by him and his assistants that not even Billy West wanted to come back
Pottery

You know what - I fucked that up. It was Ren's VA that refused to reprise his role.

Billy West Voiced both Ren and Stimpy. Though there were time Ren was played by John himself

Because as a kids cartoon, Ren & Stimpy had to keep some limitation in its gross and "disturbing" visuals to fit in some jokes.
Adult Party Cartoon Ren & Stimpy no longer had to since it could get away with just being violent or gross. And it's easier to do that than it is to write and properly time jokes.

Anything that is branded as "mature" is often anything but. The actual word for that should be "offensive", which is what it oftens comes down to. Kids are bad at handling offensive material because their frame of reference is narrow and their judgement is often poor. People that have lived longer should, in theory, be better at it, and it's the only reason why ostensibly offensive material is limited to mature audiences.

The reasons for doing similar things on Ren & Stimpy and SU are opposite to each other though.
John K had the positions he had on writers in tacroons because he was it as a visual medium first, because animation did not offer much in terms of narration than other forms of writing didn't already have at the time.
The lack of reference and models in Ren & Stimpy was a deliberate choice to kep the designs maleable. That way every scene can adapt the design depending on what effect is being created. That turned out to work very well for the type of visual humor the series was going for (and if you want an example of what Ren & Stimpy would look like with more visual consistency and models, go watch Shnookums & Meat, you'll quickly see how and why it doesn't work)
SU is inconsistent because honestly, it looks like nobody in the production team wants to have any form of hierarchy or constrain. That's why no references are kept, why the events are completely inconsistent and the continuity of who can do what basically doesn't exist.

To put it another way : John K makes a music group, they don't use sheets and written composition because it's an improv group and everyone in it is already well trained, that's why they were picked in the first place.
The crewniverse makes a music band and they don't write any composition because "it limits our creativity, man", but even then they end up making three-chords songs with intro/verse/chorus/verse/chorus/solo/chorus.

That's because contrary to popular beliefe, you can talk about adult topics while being completely immature.
Seriously, adult cartoons so often look like their definition of "adult" is that of a teenager who just can"t wait to no longer have to hide his pack of cigarettes and delete the porn from his browser history because that's what it means to be an adult, right?

because it looked like his hands were in her nipples

bump

Because SU is mostly made by bad cartoonists and people one or zero steps above tumblr artist.
There would be a workplace massacre within two weeks of John working there

what do boobs feel like?

and please don't say "bags of sand" because that answer is overrated and explains nothing

Depends

>the selection of music was shit
How? R&S always used stock and classical music.

You can't deny the girls in those episodes were sexy and cute.

Grab a handful of your own ass. Kind of like that but with a nipple.

Adult Party Cartoon was too repetitive. To begin with, they didn't bothered to use tracks from Ole Georg Music.

Depends honestly. Slightly warm, soft but pressing your fingers further makes it so they feel somewhat firm. Skin is more often than not smooth, so gliding your fingers on it feels nice. Lactating breasts on the other hand feel heftier. It's not as soft as before since with all the milk in it. Nipples REALLY increase in size. Also breastmilk tastes... disappointing.

No, you got it right the first time, Ren's original VA was John K himself

Bag of oatmeal, actually.

I think the main problem with APC was that the episodes were TOO DAMN LONG. Too much padding. Some of them were even TWO-PARTERS for Christsakes.They should have been 10 or 11 minutes each, with the occasional fake commercial or other segments like the original show.

>John K on SU
Oh boy

this

take this scene from the animaniacs - the characters are jumping around in the car, and a woman with her kid walk by. the kid is interested in what's happening but the mom hurries him away, looking disturbed
this joke works on two levels; one that kids can laugh at
>haha theyre being so weird and obnoxious that mom must be annoyed
and one with the innuendo that adults can enjoy
>the mom probably thinks theyre fucking in the car
if you can push boundaries in a way that's clever and doesn't alienate (or flat out disturb) the kids watching, that takes a lot of creativity and can be really funny
but with adult party cartoon there are no boundaries to work around. the primary audience is adults, so there's no need to be clever. having ren grope someones tits or go murder a bunch of people in itself is not funny or "boundary pushing"

They are adult for the sake of being adult, not because them being adult is needed to tell the story. If you want to watch an adult movie done right, watch Felidae.

But didnt Hentai started with lolicon?

>breastmilk tastes... disappointing.
n-no!

Softer than expected.

South Park had nuance and they never did shock humor just for the sake of doing so, it was always wrapped around the plot.

John was at his point where he only cared about how the show looked and moved, but his standards of art deteriorated a lot. He thinks every drawing needs to be a key frame, and straight up inbetweens are not allowed. It's a crazy bastardization of Rod Scribner and he has gotten even worse with it.

I read the Sick Little Monkeys book about him, and apparently he thought APC was amazing and was gonna BTFO South Park and Family Guy and be as popular as the original R&S. He genuinely thought it was great.

>I was never a fan of gremlin-esque characters inexplicably paired up with sex objects.

It's not even revolting it's just boring. Adult Party may have worked if it aired in 96 or 97 when adult oriented cartoons on television were still a relatively new thing but instead it aired long after you can just bank on the novelty of your cartoon being filled with tits, violence, and swearing.

>Why was Ren & Stimpy "Adult Party Cartoon" so bad?
George Lucas Syndrome

i.e. sometimes a work is successful DESPITE its creator, not because of him.

It wasn't just shock humor. The much faster production cycle of an episode compare to typical animation allowed them to commentate on current events to remain relevant.

The voice acting was rather shitty too, the lack of Billy West was noticeable and Ren also sounded "off", maybe John forgot how to do the voice properly in the decade or whatever since the original show.

He actually damage controlled this by saying that the original joke was supposed to be that they were actually playing baseball. But that's a lie and he really just thought talking about buttsex and following it up with buttsex was funny

Frankly, I'd like to see it reversed just once, if only for the novelty. A goblin-y cartoon lady paired with an extremely fuckable dude.

>John K working for SU
>Not even 6 hours later, and half of the crewniverse are crying and Rebecca Sugar is hiding the corner having a panic attack

>5 years later the episode's not even done and he decides that it's shit and needs to be revised from scratch

Water balloons. Just grab a bag of balloons and fill them up with warm water. You now have an artificial set of breasts which you can play with.
I had to feel my own boobs just to give you an accurate answer. For science of course.
You're welcome.

>Why doesnt he work on steven universe then?

I want this just for how much of a shit show it'd be.

Or, you know, the Simpsons succeeded in spite of Matt Groening rather than because of him.

>I read the Sick Little Monkeys book about him, and apparently he thought APC was amazing and was gonna BTFO South Park and Family Guy and be as popular as the original R&S. He genuinely thought it was great.

APC did have better animation and art than those shows though.

Definitely., but the legit thought APC was going to be huge. He looked at all the kissing shit-filled rat asses, eating snot, buttsex, jokes that drag on forever and Bakshi taking a shit and said "I'm gonna be considered a cartoon god after this!"

John is still far more alpha than Alex Hershey Bar.

hi tranny

Well it tastes just like your regular baby formula milk. It's extremely bland.
>Tranny
>Lactating
What?

R&S was shit.
John K is shit.
Animation in general is shit.

Fuck everything.

John K is a hack.

trannies can lactate

t. tranny