Since we always talk about how good this show was...

Since we always talk about how good this show was, let's talk about some things you didn't like about it/things they could have done better.

Well its a dead horse at this point, but the resolution to the Firelord battle with the new bending. It was arguably teased with the lion turtles here and there, but it still felt forced.

Azula's mental breakdown: Either show the descent over the course of a season so it makes sense, or find some other way to have her lose.

I don't think the show really hot it's stride till book 2. Not to say book 1 was bad by any means, just a lot of filler.
This never really bothered me.

it was a deus ex machina to ensure the PG rating.

it hit the threshold for memorability but there was something separating it from greatness.

It's also never a good idea for a protagonist to betray long held principles without any time to show how they would effect them.

Season 3 was a shitfest -- from the nothing-burger first half to half baked second half.

Filoni and some writers left for Clone Wars and it's noticeable.

the northern air temple was garbage
aang wanted to slap their shit

So why was it that Anag, despite him being the Avatar could not fly? Why couldn't the past avatars?

I honestly thought until Snake Way that TophAang was a thing. Aang's vision of her in the swamp, and the girls' bickering during the chase I autistically thought was leading to a K-A-T love triangle.

I didn't support Zutara, but I did think they were going there.

I'm honestly glad they didn't, because the resulting mess would have made Korra look sensible and chaste.

Sokka-Suki-TyLee
Zuko-Mei-Katara
Katara-Aang-Zuko
Aang-Katara-Toph

Definitely nitpicking here, but two things that pissed me off. First how did Ozai plan to burn down the entire fucking Earth Kingdom? Assuming it's as big as Asia roughly, there is absolutely no way him a fleet of 10 airships could burn down the entire fucking continent in a few hours. And secondly about Sozin's comet as well, that's not how comets work at all. They don't actually enter the atmosphere like was shown multiple times in the finale.

needs more toph

It does piss me off that they could cut out half the episodes from season 3 and nothing of value to the plot would have been lost.

The show has failures in writing that should be studied in schools. They wrote themselves into some awful corners.

The problem is all that stemmed from previous writing failures, or it makes the earlier writing look bad because it can't deliver on the setup
>our main character is the fighting protector of this world but comes from a pacifist culture, because moral conflicts are deep
>let's develop that moral conflict further and force him in a situation where he has to choose to kill or fail his duty and have another genocide happen
>wait we're a kids cartoon, we can't have him kill
>we can't have him fail either, I mean come on
>we could find a clever way for him to "cheat" his way out of the apparent dylemma
>nevermind that, that's gay, let's hand him a way out of that moral dylemma where he sacrifices nothing and doesn't even have to work for a solution
Like how fucking bad can you be at planning a story? It defeats the entirety of Aang's main moral conflict throughout the whole show. If you can't write a satisfying conclusion to a moral conflict, don't make it that fucking important.

And then there's the whole Avatar State/chiropractor rock thing
>our main character has this cool avatar state that makes him super OP!
>wait that's kind of boring let's take it aways and maybe have a fun quest to regain it while abandonning something
>nevernind that, that's gay, let's just give it back to him last minute so that the fight looks cool

First one: Always assumed he was talking figuratively and under grandiouse terms due to how powerful he felt. Still, I also fail to see how just a few hours would be enough to actually take over a whole empire that's the size of China at its smallest.
Second: It's a magic world where people can bend the elements, suspension of disbelief takes care of that.

I didn't like the cancerous fan base

But they knew they had a PG rating from the start, they didn't have to write themselves into that dumb fucking corner. Or they could have found an actually satisfying way out of that corner. But no, they hacked it up.

They didn't have to have Aang kill Ozai, and moreover they didn't have to put Aang in a situation where it seemed like the only way out, complete with all the other characters insisting he has to do it.

Azula should've been louder, angrier, and had access to a time machine.

>Sokka-Suki-TyLee
That wasn't really a thing, though. It was just a little flirting.

I feel like despite the premise of the show being that bending is philosophical and Aang needs to learn the ways of other nations to master different bendings, he never does.

Then there's the finale Deus Ex Machina in form of energybending, because they couldn't actually resolve the moral conflict within their own confines.

>Aang needs to learn the ways of other nations to master different bendings, he never does
He sort of did with Fire Bending from the Aztec-looking dudes.

And it's kind of a many paths type thing. You can look at fury as a source or life itself as a source. Aang chose life.

Ah yes, the Aztecs who mastered the real firebending (The real firebending has never been tried) and were never heard from again.

They were trying way too hard with showing how tough Toph was. LOL YOU SEE GUYS, A GIRL CAN BE TOUGH AND BADASS JUST LIKE THE BOYS. Her toughness always felt shoehorned in IMO.

I'm fine with energybending, but Aang should have had to sacrifice something in order to use it.

Let go of Katara, maybe? But then he snaps out of it and chooses to give up that incredible power to be with her? Kind of a continuation of what he did in Crossroads of Destiny with Guru Patik.

Find something else to do with Katara in the finale that bridges the emotional gap between her and Aang between Ember Island Players and the ending.

Their conflict isn't resolved and her time with Zuko/fight with Azula isn't tied to her character arc and growth.

They could just kidnap him and threaten to kill him if the fire nation doesn't accept their demands
There still is the chance that the fire nation goes after them anyways and they have to kill him for reals but it's the best compromise

Also I was speaking about philosophy. Aang never really have those bold new ideas stuck with him, he was taught to be steadfast like earthbenders, but he never stayed steadfast, he was taught whatever it was he was taught about water, but it didn't stick either.

He remained an airebending sissy for the entire show, which of course led to the awful finale.

That's the same issue: he doesn't actually have to compromise anything he cares about. He keeps true to his duty, he keeps true to his morals, and he even keeps the girl They didn't set it up so that there was something that he could sacrifice without it being a complete downer.
Who cares about power, Aang was never about having power, and the show is done, you don't get to see how abandonning energy bending could affect him negatively.

>Since we always talk about how good this show was

Who is this "we"? Last I checked, only tumblr still defends this garbage.

Write a better ending than we got.

They were never heard from again because the series fucking ended. Barely anyone was heard from again after that point.

>They could just kidnap him and threaten to kill him if the fire nation doesn't accept their demands
Sure they could, it's stupid and inapropriate for a kids' show, but at least it's not as stupid as what we got or as inapropriate as actually killing him off.

>Iroh, a chubby old man, managed to get a Schwarzenegger body 2 months just by body weight exercises?
>The entire premise of the invasion of the Fire Nation during the eclipse made no sense. First of all letting Aang and friends travel behind enemy lines for a few months is a retarded plan. Secondly, even if the invasion was successful, so what? It's not like the Fire Nation would be defeated just by capturing one city.
>Speaking of eclipses, it's really fucking unlikely that the eclipse would travel directly over the Fire Nation capital.
>Azula going from normal to having a mental breakdown in 2 episodes was stupid.
>Building up for the past few episodes that Aang would have to kill Ozai, and then pussying out and not killing him.

The Mai/Zuko romance was barely handled, likewise Azula's break down. Season 3 wasted a lot of time on irrelevant shit. Lion Turtle could have been better handled too.

>>Azula going from normal to having a mental breakdown in 2 episodes was stupid.
I agree in general, but the explanation makes sense
>your best friends turn on you
>they used to worship you
>your already fragile ego (the beach) shattered

A lot of people praise it, but Zuko's redemption arc was lame. He switched sides and didn't really change personality-wise. He was still a dick and expected forgiveness from the whole gang without having done much of anything. Also Dante Basco's voice is annoying.

Originally they wanted bending to have a strong physical component, so bending was activated through specific movements of the body. They design team used eastern martial arts styles as inspiration for these movements. If Aang were to just fly, I can't think of any sort of movements he could do to activate his bending. It would just be like, "Hyah I'm flying!" The air scooter at least had him sit in a quasi-meditative stance to do it. Psychic bending wasnt really a thing then, either.
Plus if he didn't need his glider, they couldn't take it away from him in order to nerf him for whatever reason.

I liked his redemption arc a lot. If he had just switched sides in Crossroads of Destiny, I wouldn't have, but the way it happened was great.

>End of S2
>Looks like he's turning good
>SIKE, Azula offers him everything he's been wanting
>He accepts
>Gets everything he "ever wanted"
>It isn't what he thought it would be
pretty real shit, desu

“For what profits a man if he gains the whole world but loses his own soul”

Based on Zaheer's explanation, no Avatar should ever be able to fly since you have to "let go your earthly tether" which Avatars cannnot do since they have a duty to the earth.

Have Katara not finish the fight would have been enough. Zuko's character arc climaxes when he gives up an easy shot against Azula to tank a bolt meant for Katara. Have Zuko shoot it into the sky or something, stunning him briefly allowing Azula the opening she needs to end the fight before a wall of ice pops up to stop her. Zuko regains his footing but tells Katara he doesnt need help, and finishes the fight. Have Azula fail at lightning bending as her mental state continues to deteriorate like how Zuko failed at it during training. Azula is too weak to escape and is captured, completely broken by the defeat she barely tries to resist.

It's hard for it to not be stpid because you have to work with some of their parameters, like the first attack/plan failing after wasting half a season on it.
Anyway you don't write that stupid moral dylemma in the first place, it's never implied Aang has to kill Ozai to stop him, or only birelfy before moving on to other solutions. Instead Aang learns from past Avatars that there's a legendary technique that he could learn to take away someone's bending. He goes on a quest, defeats someone, learns something, possibly has to compromise something, yadda yadda energy bending. Rest plays out pretty much like in the show.

Also he never lost the Avatar State in this version because they clearly had no idea where they were going with that.

The villains were all godawful. Yes, Azulafags. Stop thinking with your dicks. She was terrible

i wonder what gonna happen if zuko attacked azula

They were kinda secret. And Aang and Zuko knew they wanted to be kept secret. They weren't going to give them away.

Any time he defended someone or something he acted like an earthbender. Airbenders evade and retreat. Aang stood his ground.

Azula was always fucking unstable. When we first meet her she's threatening to kill a dude. Her only sycophantic friends betraying her just pushed her over the edge she had been peering over since she was introduced. It wasn't portrayed perfectly but you're not looking at it very fairly.

You're right, she was an awful villain. Aang is also an awful villain

Only showing the big war meeting later was a terrible mistake though.
Zuko was disillusioned before, but one can assume that the meeting was where he realized the necessity of actively opposing his father and joining the Avatar. 3 years earlier, when he had interrupted the war meeting, his sympathy was for young fire nation soldiers, people like himself. By deciding to join the Avatar and stop his father in the second meeting, he showed his desire to protect the people he had met in the Earth Kingdom. That scene being inserted into chronological order would have added urgency to the second half of the season, gave a reason for his sudden decision to leave, and demonstrated the growth of his character.

But no, we had to have the meeting shown later, so the writers could contrive a way for team Avatar to kick into "finale mode".

This.
Azula's Lightningbending should have gone wrong and defeated herself, after they foreshadowed how bad it is to do it incorrectly for seasons.

Who's the artist? It's on the tip of my tongue.

MrPotatoParty

Why do I love her so much?

>Like how fucking bad can you be at planning a story? It defeats the entirety of Aang's main moral conflict throughout the whole show. If you can't write a satisfying conclusion to a moral conflict, don't make it that fucking important.
Honestly, I just figured they had planned up into season 3 to have Aang kill him then Nick said no.

thats what I always assumed happened. Wouldnt suprise me if it was initially OKed but then someone on the board got cold feet and told them to change it

>black hair
>red lipstick
>crazy

What's not to like?

Nothing, she's absolutely perfect

the first half season 3 could have been stronger I guess? The Painted Lady was kind of meh. ATLA is my favorite cartoon so its a little hard for me to nitpick.

They shouldn't have reveal Blue Spirit's identity that soon.

The blind earth bending bitch is trash.

Momo.

Season One villains are pretty dope.

When he's Usagi Yojimbi is his one good use, and for that I'm pretty much okay with the character.

didn't they already conquer the Earth Kingdom more or less? they occupied all the major cities (save Omashu, which was recently freed & Ba Sing Se, which only was taken back that day)
granted, I have no idea what trying to burn the earth was supposed to accomplish, considering they were doing it right on the edge of the country

Can you provide an example of a good villain from a work that has a timeframe similar to Avatar, then?

one problem I always had was how apparently Katara went from not knowing shit to waterbending master in what was probably a month
hell, the entire battle against Pakku was arguably horrible because she's never been shown to do half that good

I'd argue that if they played more with the full moon being what gives her the edge in her fights, then I'd buy it, but the only time that's really happened were her first win against Zuko & that one time in the Southern Raiders episode

but somehow she's skilled enough to take Azula at the top of her game in their first one-on-one, even though she'd arguably be able to beat her handily with some lightning. even that fight in the finale was pretty poorly handled, to be honest

the only explanation I've ever heard is that she's a prodigy, just like Azula, but I have a hard time buying that even that would give her any edge against someone who has trained since childhood with the best teachers. hell, even Sokka, who was given a similar "prodigy" title & training regiment, wasn't portrayed as that OP with the sword
dude mostly relied on being the most resourceful member of the party, something that was basically established since early season 1

I would have liked if the show took place over a longer period of time. A lot of people mention it's kind of dumb that Katara can master water so quickly, even with her being a prodigy. The same could be said for Aang even though he didn't technically master all the elements. Having the show take place over 2 or 3 years would have made it a bit more realistic.

The dumbest part of Katara being a prodigy is that she still only has less than a year's worth of experience doing real waterbending. We are expected to believe she can beat someone who has been firebending at a master level for most of her life, even taking her mental state into account and the fact she's technically younger than Katara, Azula is actually a far more trained and experienced bender. They are not on the same level at all.

>things you didn't like about it/things they could have done better.
well here goes
>the in universe timeline is too short making everyone feel even more like special snowflake by how absurdly fast they learn new bending (I am looking at you Katara) and making the world feel small becouse of how fast theu can travel between locations
>too much grillpowah ( Azula as a villain gets a pass here ) the best example once again Katara and all that bullshit she pulls in the north and the last agni kai - on the other hand males are either old, evil, weak or incompetent
>what the fuck was wrong with whoever came up with the idea of how the last agni kai would play out? because as a result both Zuko and Azula were robbed of the proper endings to their character arcs - also once again a water tribe girl self insert
>bloodbending
and last but not least
>Iroh teaching Zuko firebending wrong as a joke

>didn't they already conquer the Earth Kingdom more or less?
Not according to the CK2 mod

Considering the rumors about how the writers first thought of her as a boy, then changed the character into a tomboyish girl at the last second, I can see where you're getting that.

Jesus we arent talking korra, we are talking regular airbender.

read what I said again
all the major cities with all the political figures were already conquered

They were trying to capture the firelord, the city would be a bonus.

I liked Zhao

it peaked at season 2 also

>Since we always talk about how good this show was
you know what the worst thing was?
it was always obvious that AtLA has it's flaws but we all hoped that with the next show they will iron it out removing the bad things and enchanting the good ones

but with korra those fags just had to decided to do the exact opposite

Firebending having a kinetic rather than burning effect for some reason.

Without the turtle or having Katara fall in love with Aang, the show could have further underscored the personal sacrifice and spiritual burden of being the Buddha/Christ-like savior that it kept hinting at throughout the series. The canon ending isn't bad, it's just a bit of a missed opportunity to do something really memorable and unprecedented.

Not their fault, but Iroh probably had a bigger role in season 3.

Yue's VA sucked.

Zuko's character going from lonely wolf to friendly emokid was weird
Azula's party episode was just silly

To be fair, the last minute return of Aangs Avatar state was a fucking excellent moment. Watching Ozai go on the defensive was the most satisfying thing I've ever watched.

>but somehow she's skilled enough to take Azula at the top of her game

Azula isn't much older, she could even be the same age as Katara. She's the younger sister of Zuko. They've both received training from masters. How is it farfetched they're evenly matched?

Lmao, I wouldn't want to fuck Azula and I think she was a great villain, albeit a little bit Mary Sueish, but since her friends abandoned her eventually and she went crazy at the end, it's ok. So please, go ahead and explain in detail why do you think she was bad, or are you just a shitposter?

Honestly I was more annoyed about the chakra getting unblocked by banging it against a rock.
Maybe instead, when Ozai shoots lightning at him, Aang goes against Zuko's warning and lets it pass through his chest rather than kill Ozai with it. It exits through his back and unblocks the chakra

Iunno, I feel Katara's power in her duel with Pakku was due to emotional fuel, similar to the ice breaking in the first episode. Although I guess her newfound moves were kinda bs, like the slicing ice sheet move, when did she learn that.

I can give Azula's breakdown a pass, for someone who's shown to be unstable before and whose whole image is held by her control over the people around her, for her only friends to betray her, a rapid mental decline seems natural.
I guess the final sibling fight could have been handled better albeit. Zuko robbed somewhat/another mary sue Katara moment. On my first watch of the ep, I was certain the lightning would blow up in her face, seemed so obvious, but I guess not.

Katara getting sad for bending blood felt weird as hell. That shit is useful as fuck.

because one's basically been trained since she could walk while the other got maybe a month at the most

#MakeKorraBi

Oh no, she decided to do continue this comic along 2 other ones, didn't she?

This show gets criticized here as much as it gets praised and its been that way for years but the its really just:

>The first season is...okay
>The second is great
>The third stumbles towards the end
>Ozai is a really lame villain
>Lion turtle
>Katara sucks
>Toph is underdevloped
>Zuko is pretty much the only well-written character in the show

Overall its highly praised due to be something unlike anything Nick has done before and the amount of work put into it shows but the writing is just not at that same level of quality.

Slade

>criticized here as much as it gets praised

eh could say the same about any show/media in general, its much more interesting to discuss criticisms.

The biggest problem with ATLA is the PG rating. Most, if not all of, the other problems stem from that.

I don't buy that. I don't buy that they somehow thought they could show the MC in a kids cartoon kill the villain in cold blood. At the very best they could have hoped for a Disney villain death where Ozai is killed by his own hubris or something. I mean we're talking about a show that couldn't even confirm Jet's off screen death.
And considering they again also failed to deliver on the lost avatar state plotline despite no similar issue, I don't give them the benefit of the doubt.

They should have had Katara not fully forgive Zuko till the finale. After the Southern Raiders she stops being openly but doesn't quite trust him yet and after the battle she finally forgives him so his "sacrifice" actually means something rather than just being dramatic. I also thought it was kinda dumb that she completely forgave and trusted him after one mission that do nothing to prove his intentions were actually genuine.

Season one mostly sucks

>Azula's mental breakdown
Don't remind me this. It fuckin broke my heart

*being openly hostile

Did Toph really need any development? She knows what she's about. Her only character flaw was what, being arrogant?

It had way too much fucking filler which made binging and rewatching it a pain. The series would have benefited greatly if the episode count for each season was sliced in half. As dissapointing as Korra was, it was still a more tightly paced show by comparison.

>let's talk about some things you didn't like
Aang. I'm probably a part of the minority, but I didn't really like him, or found him that interesting...

Nice fanfiction, faggot.