What went wrong?

What went wrong?

What wrong with it?

it's right there on the cover, Mark Waid.

They sweeped Secret Empire under the rug, rather than actually address it and then dropped Steve into a bad future so far removed from reality and jumbled in its political allegory that it's effectively meaningless...

Nothing

it is not Political allegory, you fucking idiot. It is just bad future run by a evil dictator.

The evil alt-right 1% seized power and nuked the USA

But this is good.

>run by a evil dictator.
Hmmm

Yes, user, every dictator is a trump.

Samnee is leaving.

I'd be inclined to believe you if this wasn't Mark Waid, of all people. Plus aren't the villains are his OC group, Rampart? Aside from being named after a protective wall-area, they're a white supremacist group, and they took over in about 7-8 years.

I don't believe that every single thing is political, but there are too many little coincidences, and Mark Waid's definitely the type to make things a political statement.

That said, while I don't care for politics, I don't think his run so far has been bad or anything. I can see it going South, but I'll reserve judgment and keep reading.

This issue was really good. It’s a super generic story but Samnee’s art propels it into the stratosphere. Nothing in this issue could be considered remotely SJW either before you bring that up

Mark Waid. Just wait for Ta Nehisi Coates.

Why does Marvel hate Captain America?

It's fucking Captain America, arguably the most political mainstream comic character from the big two. Jack Kirby and Joe Simon got death threats from American Isolationists when they first created him, and in the 70s they had him deal with Watergate. Having politics in a Captain America comic is not only nothing new but in fact a staple of the character.

But you've somehow got a problem with this now?

‘White supremacist’ is just a generic bad guy concept, and allows the story to more easily draw parallels to real Nazis so it can be a very classic Cap style story. It’s just a generic label so he woudn’t have to delve into their ideologies; they were already shown being evil for a plethora of different reasons now, too.

These Waid/Samnee issues have basically been cartoon episodes and it’s awesome

>mfw Waid's 90s story about Captain America fighting a mad dictator version of Korvac was also about Trump

Idiot.

You do realize he has done this particular storyline quite with Cap quite a number of times right? Back before Trump was even president.

Even if Waid isn't making a Trump allegory, it's still really weak writing. Marvel USA literally just deposed a tyrannical government coup at the end of Secret Empire, and learned a valuable lesson about "Never again". But despite all that, the country falls for yet another tyrannical coup right after? What was the excuse for every hero dying? Because Steve wasn't around? Horseshit.

The funny part is literally no aspect of this book is political, it’s just an adventure story.

>‘White supremacist’ is just a generic bad guy concept
Nope. Not in current year.

Sure, I could agree with that.

The difference is back then it was relatively well-written.

>mfw Waid's 90s story about Captain America fighting a mad dictator version of Korvac was also about Trump
What a stupid fucking argument. Context changes, guy. What used to be a cigar yesterday, can be a huge cock today.

Yeah, "white supremacist" is an innocent concept (for a villain, I mean.) But with all the other things, including Mark Waid's track record, the time travel arc is very suspect. Unlike others though, I just don't think the pre-time travel stuff was political - just fun adventuring.

Because almost everything has been politically charged lately - comics, TV shows, obviously the news, the internet, memes, etc. It's exhausting. And it's even worse with Captain America because it JUST came off Secret Empire, and instead of finishing Steve's casual adventuring and downtime, we're back to heavy politics - the same politics we've been getting for a long time now.

I think they died because of nuclear bombs or some shit, even though there are tons of characters who would be able to stop them, or outright feed on them, or would be in space and avoid the attacks.

Idk why you read comics if you’re reading them for the writing. Waid’s keeping the wheels spinning but more importantly stepping back and letting Samnee make this feel premium.

A good or excellent story is always appreciated but something so simple is a breath of fresh air after so much tribulation with Cap recently, and Samnee is inspiring.

Chris Evans is a bleeding heart liberal so no the normies think cap stories should be written for them. Marvel doesn't care about anything but their movie BOs so they just do what makes the normies feel good inside.

in all honesty it really isn't a bad story, arts nice, it's just annoying that "not bad" is being treated as some watershed moment in the wake of Spencer's spergathon.

holy shit the comment before me pretty much said everything I assumed.

Movie Cap is a libertarian though, very firm gun owner’s rights style attitude towards the accords in CW

if you think that you must have thought Ben Affleck was actually playing Cheney rather than batman because it's about as thin as can be in CW.

Sure but he’s near that ideology on the spectrum despite it not being a 1:1 allegory. Tony want to be cucked by the government.

>in the 70s they had him deal with Watergate
The balls they had to have their Nixon stand-in commit suicide while the Watergate investigation was still ongoing during the original Secret Empire

If you cant aknowledge that this story is a response by the avowedly progressive Waid to our current political milieu and the "creeping threat of fascism under Trump", then you're either intellectually dishonest or an abject rube.

I'm not making a value judgement here, I'm not evaluating quality. I'm just calling a spade a spade.

Good comics are 50% art, 50% story.

Aku flung him into the future where his evil was raw.

You think everything is a trump allegory.

There's not a direct allegorical representation of Trump as a character, although King Baby is an apt aspersion. But with the reactionary govt which serves only the oligarchs, extreme marginalization of already marginalized people, dissolution of the press, the female led resistance, etc the parallels to progressive criticism of the current POTUS are clear. And it's only reinforced by Waid's own stated positions. Maintaining that there is zero contemporary political influence to the arc is laughably unconvincing.

No.

>Jack Kirby
Fucking superb charracter designs who just leap outt of the canvas I could read a Kirby adaptation of an IKEA guide to how assemble a table and it would be better than Cap Falcon's run
>Simon
Knew that it would date and lose the impact for his political edge if he made Cap reference by name or to relate directly to the political climate, so he and Kirby created super villains that embodied the problem and issues they had instead the lame shit we get these days:

Compare and contrast:
Old School Red Skull vs. Cobra Society on Captain Falcon.

Skull is a timeless, fantastic character that transcends nazism, while the other was a a hamfisted manner to unite different and often times conflicting right wing political views into the same character (He is an ancap libertarian but he also wants fascist big government)

Here's the difference in essence:
Cap was about ideas and ideals, who happened to be political. Who was saying what was not important - The very same Watergate situation you are talking about did not directly dealt with Nixon, nor it played up exactly.

Captain Falcon run was filled with soapbox moments that changed characters to suit the author's point (Rage being the most simple to grasp example but U.S. Agent is a valid one too) - This isn't about ideas and ideals and characters dealing with them as part of a narrative, it's the author one step from telling you what he thinks is right and wrong with expy made with old characters that will exist prior and after his own view.

That said, current Cap was doing pretty ok, but after Secret Empire I think rethreading a similar idea is going to be shit, just like Secret Empire was.

Subjective, i feel the art contributes more to the telling of the story and it’s impact

According to the guy that runs my LCS it also got some Nixon supporters angry at Marvel.

i'm still mad King Baby isn't some z-lister Waid found.

my only big complaint

He eas going to sign the accords and he mentions he was OK with a form of superhuman oversight but he was iffy about some stuff included in the accords that Tony didn't care to answer him.

It was that and the way Wanda and Bucky were treated that made him not want to sign.

i wish someone would storytime civil war, i really don't want to buy it

We don't know who he is, unless they revealed that and I missed it.

I'm not arguing that FalCap wasn't good, or that secret Empire wasn't good. I enjoyed the HydraCap mainbook even if it was one of the MOST decompressed comic books I've ever read (but the Hydra Cap issues of Civil War II were by far the best part of Civil War II which was otherwise a complete dumpster fire).

What I'm arguing is that whinging about Captain America being political is incredibly retarded as the character from his fucking inception has been political. I completely agree that badly written stories suck, and that Captain America has recently been burdened with bad writers, but I don't have a problem with those bad writers being political in Captain Amierca, I have a problem with those bad writers being bad writers.

It's like the problem with America by Gabby Rivera. The problem isn't that America is gay, or brown, or pseudo Hispanic, the problem is that Gabby is an atrocious writer.

Sorry, I meant "was good" (as in both Secret Empire and FalCap were pretty fucking bad).