Was Kill the Alligator and Run the first legitimately horrible episode of The Simpsons?

Was Kill the Alligator and Run the first legitimately horrible episode of The Simpsons?

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I'd go with Trash of the Titans or When You Dish Upon A Star

>Trash of the Titans
Winner

I rememner liking that episode back in the day

Was it really that bad?

I don't know, the narrative of early Simpsons being so good compared to the later stuff is so prevalent that I think people ignore how bad season 1 could be. Some Enchanted Evening for example

>Trash of the Titans
Not when The Principal and the Pauper happened 20 episodes before it.

While weak, I still find early Simpsons comfy (even first seasons). I can't stand zombie era episodes

Trash of the Titans is a decent episode.

When You Dish Upon a Star is mediocre but not horrible.

Kill the Alligator and Run is offensively horrible and the beginning of Zombie Simpsons.

>set outside of Springfield
>lazy drug/alcohol jokes
>unfunny shoe-horned celebrity cameos
>Homer is a violent retard instead of a lovable buffoon
>lazy script that writes them into a corner so they use an unexplained asspull to end the show (lol the alligator was alive anyway lol)

It was the first episode to commit so many of the common Zombie Simpsons sins and that is why it is remembered as being the first genuinely terrible Simpsons show.

Not to mention the plot goes in all kinds of directions and has no real cohesion.

Did it even have a concurrent B Plot in that episode?

>Homer gets hooked on magazine quizzes and takes the life expectancy quiz
>He fears early death and steadily loses his mind
>He gets sent to Florida, and things get worse from there
All that the rest of the family did was get dragged along for the ride.

I actually liked this episode, what was the problem with it other than the lame plot?

Oh I see

It took a while for things to fall into place and heat up. A lot of show are like that.

textbook zombie simpsons episode that has like exactly one good gag

youtube.com/watch?v=oRFeszd52QY

There was only one good joke that entire episode. I remember watching it and being thoroughly unimpressed. That was S11 or 12, right? About the time I stopped watching The Simpons.

The "why does that only happen when no one's looking?" joke was kinda funny too.

Saddlesore Galactica aired before this, IIRC

I always saw Scully era as having good jokes, just really bad plots and characterisations.

People think of it as being the beginning of the end because it has all the hallmarks of a shit simpsons episode
>Field trip
>Unnecessary celeb cameos
>Meandering plot
>Entire cast stuck with Homer's a-plot
>Inoffensive humor
>Stupid conclusion

Even if one or two jokes are borderline funny, the entire structure is a mess.

A good example of this is Homer Simpson in: Kidney Trouble.
>funny segment with the ghost town
>funny lines throughout the episode
>but a clusterfuck of a plot
>hibbert is clearly no longer a good doctor, for some reason they don't make the surgeon doctor nick
>grandpa dies, then he agrees to donate his kidney, somehow winds up in a fucking ghost ship, then returns and chickens out again until a funny gag where moleman runs him over
It's like they took Schwartzwelder's script and did not change a word, even though it needed rewriting badly.

Yep. KTAAR is infamous because it essentially ticks every box on what people hate about zombie simpsons.

Its really funny with Swartzwelder. Classic era, his episodes were among the best in the series, but he also wrote some of the worst of scully era and early jean era.

Never liked Season 1 and most people I've met agree it wasn't great but Simpsons was still finding its footing then.

that episode wasn't horrible, it was bad in concept, but it had alot of funny gags

Still better than anything in season 9 and after

I'd prefer to watch season 9, personally.

Armin Tamzarian had a dumb plot, but I wouldn't call it horrible.

First episode I saw and didn't even laugh once was Bart vs Lisa vs The Third Grade. It was painfully bland and unfunny. Everything from S11 up until then was well below the S4-S10 golden era, but at least I could laugh once or more an episode.

KTAAR does suck though. Once they reach Florida, it's almost non-stop crap. The intro was pretty funny, Homer made a good quizmaster. Pretty much any "world trip" episode that wasn't Australia or Japan sucked. Brazil, Britain, Canada, Africa, all painfully bad episodes.

Difference is that the problems of the first two seasons was due to them not having figured out what direction they want to do with the show yet. Where as modern seasons are bad because they don't care enough to actually quality control the show anymore.

I hear that the last few years of The Simpsons isn't total dogshit like most Season 11+ but is now just boring and filled with Family Guy style cut-away gags and references to things for an easy attempt at a laugh.

I'm going through for the first time, and just finished season 8. I'm surprised how much it feels like its already slipped

Somebody posted this earlier, I like that

I miss when Simpsons did J&R/Mirkin era cutaway gags.

When You Dish Upon A Star gets my vote, if simply for being the first painfully cringey episode and also for starting the decade long trend of "The Simpsons Meet _____" episodes.

The only thing I thought was funny was that Kid Rock just kind drops out of the sky when he shows up.

>Last Temptation of Krusty featured Jay Leno and other celebrity comedians
>Burns, Baby Burns is The Simpsons Meet Rodney Dangerfield
>The Springfield Files is The Simpsons Meet the two main X-Files cast members
Don't try to pretend that episode started it, it was happening long before that point.

Don't forget Krusty Gets Cancelled, which literally has bart and lisa travelling to celebrity mansions to ask them in person to appear on Krusty's special.

The difference is most of those contained either minor cameos or had the voice actor playing an actual character. When You Dish started the OH MY GOD IT'S ____ and then Homer is friends with them until the end style of episode.

By far this episode.

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>When You Dish Upon A Star
I actually enjoyed this episode. And it had some decent moments like:
>You killed Ron Howard!

>implying making Rodney Mr's Burn's heir was a character and not just Rodney being Rodney
Splitting hairs user. Hell, look at Homer at the Bat, they just used it as an excuse to see how many baseball celebs they could get on the show.

Was season 10 the start of the end?

Rodney was the rare exception usually you had stuff like Danny DeVito playing Herb. Also I'd say the other difference is how common it became in later seasons. When Homer at the Bat aired it was a novelty to have one like that at some point between Scully and Jean it just became one celeb guest voice after another.

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Homer saying "More hash browns, sugar?" is still my favorite joke of the episode.

I'd say Season 10 was the first season where the vast majority of it was mediocre. It does have a few gems, though, like Mayored To The Mob and Wild Barts Can't Be Broken.

A lot of the episodes that I see people bringing up ITT at least have a few things I remember laughing at
>Quizmaster Homer

>"Can you drive?"
>"Not well."

>Homer, we're out of vodka!

>Joe C has been dead for 18 years

no, you're thinking of The Otto Show, but you don't have the cultural references to get why it's so incredibly offensively bad

I mean the 60 seconds of dead air at the end might give it away but it's not like there's no good jokes in it, it's just... shit

and this episode is the same

He is being Rodney, but it's no different from him playing himself in his other roles. The other thing is that Homer doesn't go "OH MY GOD, YOU'RE RODNEY DANGERFIELD!!!" Or words to that effect. It's a very thin line.

Up to that point? Sure, it's definitely one of the worst of anything from Season 1-11. I don't know how it stacks up against bad episodes from later seasons though.

>First episode I saw and didn't even laugh once was Bart vs Lisa vs The Third Grade. It was painfully bland and unfunny
I hated that episode, I really did. Bart and Lisa were just so completely unlikable for the entire episode, you wanted to punch them.
>Pretty much any "world trip" episode that wasn't Australia or Japan sucked. Brazil, Britain, Canada, Africa, all painfully bad episodes.
Nah, the Japan episode sucked too. I did like Brazil though, it had some good moments.

I liked the
>show us your tits!
>later!
and then it had a few sexy girls in it, but other than that I don't remember anything good about it. But I also don't remember being outright bored as I am with new Simpsons. Everything to do with the rock stars sucked ass though.

Ditto.

Japan had a few laughs. Like the paper walls. I don't even remember Canada and Africa.

Dont be sad. It's Carinval!

Oh that episode. I always skip it when you get to Florida.

I used to consider season 8 the last really good season but looking back, it does show some warning signs. It's when the show really started taking steps into becoming the "Homer gets into wacky situations guest starring the rest of the family" show.

>Trash of the Titans

Why?

When You Dish Upon A Star gets it for me, holy shit that episode is devoid of humor.

Oakley and Weinstein themselves acknowledged that they thought the quality of the writing was getting slack by the end of Season 8.

whip guy saves the day. I liked the piano one too

GUY INCOGNITO?!

Season 1 excluded?

It shows some warning signs (same with 9) but the thing is that when compared to much later seasons they still feel better crafted even if it wasn't as good as before.

Why do people only talk about which episode supposedly started the decline? I wish there was more discussion about the various sins of awful episodes post Season 12. The discussion always defaults to Lisa Goes Gaga being the worst episode ever.

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Because they want to pinpoint where all the problems started.

In truth if those were the worst episodes and they recovered significantly, I think they'd just be considered fan-hated episodes. But seeing such a massive decline in the show over the last 20 years means people want to look back and wonder where it all went wrong.

For me seasons 1-9 is the classic era. If it wasn't for When You Dish Upon a Star, Monty can't buy me love, Kidney Trouble, Sunday cruddy sunday, and probably Make Room for Lisa, I would probably consider season 10 part of the classic era as well.

Has there actually been a Good Simpsons episode with A celebrity guest star ?
I don't mean that they were just cameos saying a one liner, but that they were actually apart of the story.

Pic related maybe the only exception ?

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I saw The beginning of Season 9 is when it stopped being good. I like season 9 alright, but 2-8 is the sweet spot

Krusty Gets Kancelled

The one with Rodney Dangerfield?

Lisa the Vegatarian was pretty good and Paul McCartney was a rathe important character. Much less of a cameo than say Aerosmith in Flaming Moe

TPATP wouldn't have been so bad if it ended with an "all just a dream," or if they actually had the balls to break the status quo. Ending it with the real Skinner (a previously MIA vet) tied to a train and the town pretending nothing happened just left a bad taste in everyone's mouth.

Did you make this because Kid Rock got inducted into the Hall of Fame?

does kelsey grammer count as sideshow bob?

Oakly and Weinstein handled Swartzwelder's scripts the best. Homer's Enemy had that right balance of crazy gags while staying in that realism. Homer the Smithers would have a dumb joke here and there, but prevents Homer from being this fucking retard at his job. He is really trying to be a good assistant until he punches Burns.

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