Stan Lee's writing

So im roughly 70 issues into Amazing Spider-man and im enjoying it, but to be honest Stan Lees wordy writing and weird mix of 40s slang and 60s slang plus his habit of over explaining things wears me out. Like I can read multiple Neal/Bob Batman stories from the same era in one sitting but I have to take a mental break between issues with Spidey. Does anyone else feel the same way?
It wasn't this bad when Ditko was the artist because you could tell Steve wasn't leaving Stan much room for word bubbles on purpose. Romita while a great artist is more of a Yes-Man than bitter Steve.

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And while im on the subject, how about the random publishing gaps in ASM? You need 3 omnis, an epic collection, like 7 Masterworks, another Omni, a bunch more epic collections plus 2 more omnis to get to issue 350, and im pretty sure theres still gaps. Plus some of those masterworks and Omnibus are pricey on the aftermarket and I think theres still a few gaps even if I got everything.
They really need to reprint the Andru & Wolfman eras again as Omnibus or TPBs, plus the Stern & McFarlane Omnis both need a new printing.

Spider-Man and Fantastic Four I always thought had the best dialog of anything Stan Lee worked on.

Im not saying its bad its just... Slow
But yeah its clear that Stan put more of himself into Spider-man & Mr. Fantastic than his other characters

That's probably why he stayed on those for like a decade, but only a few years on (most) other characters.

Come to think of it Gerry Conway said that Gwen was literally a stand in for Stans wife, and he felt this clouded Stans otherwise good judgement on what fans wanted. Which is why Stan immediately disowned her death when there was backlash, since he preferred Aunt May being the one killed.
Now of course there are still some old guys buttmad about Gwen dying but you cam make an omelette without breaking some eggs.

For old times sake?

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as long as we discuss Silver/Bronze age spidey as well you can shitpost as much as you like. Im at work for 3 more hours so I can't keep the thread bumped anyway

I already fucked it up
I really don't think Stan was as involved bon the writing end when Romitq took over.

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More so than he was from issue 25-38 when it was 100% Ditko Plotting with Stan doing only dialogue. He probably did leave Romita more wiggle room as the run went on however

I'd say he took more of a light touch and let his artists run a bit, you get better results with less work.
This may have been his true strength, in that he knew better than to fuck it up.

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Despite it's innovations, Stan Lee's writing still exists within old comic book story telling formulas. this is a problem of all comics of the era.

The industry doesn't revolutionize until the late 70s with Claremont and Epic

But I already pointed out that DC books of the time were more readable, at least Bob Haney late 60s Brave & the Bold was. Stan liked his thesaurus and his catchphrases alot

He freely admits to being corny as hell.

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Then you have more patience than I do. I can barely read 60s american comics.

>be me
>Read alot of Stan Lee stuff
>find myself absent mindedly speaking in Lee-ism's
I imagine this is how Bush's speechwriters felt

My only real major grip with the Ditko era was how Peter Parker was a bit of a massive asshole. You can really see Ditko's objectivist viewpoints seeping through to the character, because the traits that would make him look like an ubermensch in Ditko's eyes would make him look like a school shooter in the making if it were done today, and it's hard to take Peter's constant complaints about being alone and isolated seriously when half of the time it's due to his own standoffishness and refusal to apologize for or justify his own behaviour.

Though the artistry remains mostly the same for the first few issues, you can almost immediately notice the change from the Ditko to the Romita era through the simple act of Peter not being a dismissive prick towards Harry Osborn and instead trying to empathize and relate to him and his issues with his father.

He absolutely was involved as a writer on Romita's run. Romita himself has said that he "probably could have been considered a co-plotter on a few of those issues". Lee did more on Romnita Spidey than he did on Ditko Spidey.

Miller's DD is really THE moment where everything changed. Even Claremont's early work seems old fashioned compared to Miller's.

you're literally a faggot

He was a grown man trying to write a teenager. That is never not cringe (see today's YAAS and other associated ilk). His stuff with older characters tends to hold up.

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I also re-read the first 20 issues of Bendis' Ultimate Spider-Man run, and its funny to see how while Ditko's run still holds up to modern reading (if you can get over the old-timey slang, Peter being a bit of a dick, and Ditko's weird obsession with drawing hands), Bendis' ultra-decompressed narrative style is such a fucking slog to sift thtough. It takes him at least three issues with minimal action to accomplish what Ditko and Lee did with the same emotional impact in just one.

There's even an issue in Ditko's run where Lee actually *apologizes* to the reader abou how the entire story was just buildup with no action, how fucking quaint.

Well hush my mouth I suppose
This happened to me while I was watching squidbillies.

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Go to bed, Ditko.

I loved angry Ditko Pete though because he actually felt like a bullied nerd. I don't think he was supposed to stay that way I think Steve meant to develop Peter from "use my powers in showbiz instead vof fighting crooks" to being more similar to Doctor Strange & The Question. However, fans wanted Pete in college so he had to speed it up with ASM 30-33, making Pete into a Man a hit earlier than intended.
But yeah, I also got school shooter vibes. Which doesn't bode well for my pipe dream of an accurate 1960s period piece Ditko Spidey Netflix show

Stan had a vague "this many pages of action scenes" quota back then. Ditko didn't always follow it. Plus after they stop speaking Stan spent the next two years subtly dissing Steve
As for Bendis, im glad the artstyle turned me off from Ultimate way back when issue #1 came out. I'd hate myself if I had nostalgia for that shit

Yeah theres alot of plebs around here, some of em are tripfags too
I get sticking to modern for most characters but honestly Spider-man has had two really good eras: silver age up to Gwens Death, and Black Suit era. Andru era had top notch art though and its a shame he wasn't paired with better writers.
Like with other characters you can start in the 80s but with Spider-man you really do have to go through 125 issues of silver age. It gets good like 4 issues in though so its really not that bad

Marvel is honestly shit at keeping things in print and theres no excuse anymore with the Disney money
DC has Golden Age Omnibus #5 for several characters for fucks sake yet Marvel can't even keep Alex Ross's Marvels in print.

Ditko meant Harry Osborn to be a taker rather than a maker, the opposite of Peter who never had anything handed to him. Surprisingly, Stan kept with this portrayal, at least from Normans perspective, he always wished hardworking, intelligent Peter was his real son. They did melt the ice between Harry and Peter though which was good since it led to Gwen taking the boys more seriously.